*** Official Clevo P65xSA/SE/SG / Sager NP8650/51/52 Owner´s Lounge ***

Right, but if you've already tapped out your budget and don't have an extra $100 for that IPS screen, you're out of luck.

 

you're right but don't freak out, I mean you can wait (if you donn't get a ips screen ofc) one month and then install one no ? It's an extra 76 (just checked ) you'll be able to buy that later when you can, i mean it's not like you're stuck with a crappy TN forever (hello p150/p170sm owners ^^ !)

Plus you'll be able to choose a panel that fits you : nice contrast, nice luminosity, nice color fidelity : that's what i did ^^ !

If pcspecialist are selling p650sg that cheap it's because of the tn panel i think but that suits me perfectly since I'm changing that

 

From everything I've been reading the 1920x1080 matte panel is an AHVA panel, why would Sager swap these out with TN panels?

 

Scan UK have both 17" Inch and 15" models (3XS Graphite LG1720/1520). Cheapest UK prices so far with 2 Year warranty. However they only offer i7 4710HQ CPU, everything else is fully customisable.

 

Where do you see that? I had previously thought I had seen that Sager would use IPS panels, but I'm having trouble tracking it down.

 

Quote Originally Posted by mySN.de View Post
QFHD panel is the Sharp LQ156D1JX01B - see Clevo P651SE (Schenker XMG P505) Barebones Notebook Review - NotebookCheck.net Reviews for more information and their thoughts.

FHD panel is the AUO B156HAN01.2 - B156HAN01.2 Datasheet download - Panelook.com

http://www.panelook.com/B156HAN01.2_AUO_15.6_LCM_parameter_19049.html

 

Unfortunately, mySN is a system builder, not a Sager reseller, so they can choose their own screens, and it doesn't tell us what Sager will be using.

 

I meant in the "thin and light" category.

 

It was the MFC's decision apparently, since if it was the soldered, then gigabyte would also have a max of 4gb in their soldered version however they're able to pop in 8, which still boggles me why sager would lower their specs.

The 8258 also supports the 970/980M as well for those requiring a bit more than the 8268

 

Ya makes me kinda mad still so let's stop bringing this up ;P grrrr

 

Good find, their price wins is a winner for UK buyers, just a shame that it's preorder for early December. Annoyingly I want it late November at the latest with all the new releases coming out.

EDIT: Can get the machine with a 1 TB 7200rpm HDD, 8GB RAM and a 980M for £1300 in thin form factor. That's brilliant pricing.

Think I'm going to preorder this (even though it's predicted for early December). The Laptop also comes with 'NVIDIA Pick Your Path Game Bundle - Featuring Assassins Creed Unity, FarCry 4 and The Crew', saving me purchasing these 3 games (all of which I would have!)

 

Its the main reason I'm on the fence between the p35x and this...you're not the only one pissed on their decision.

 

What do you mean by "a bit more than the 8268"? They're essentially the same machine just different styling. But either way, Clevo better bump the vRAM on the P650 otherwise they will lose a lot of customers to MSI and Gigabyte. What I also like about the Gigabyte is that it uses mSATA. I know M.2 is the "up and coming" thing, but so far there aren't any M.2 drives that take advantage of the extra speed and their capacities are less than mSATA as well as more expensive.

 

The 8258 holds additional drives, that and there were 2 other small variants I was informed of when talking the differences out with an XoticPC tech.

 

It all depends on how much space they allocated for VRAM on the mainboard. The MXM cards have room for 8GB, so that is an option with any GPU you put on an MXM card (limitations of the GPU notwithstanding). In the case of a soldered GPU, the GPU and the support chips are all on the system board. Gigabyte was obviously going for broke on their system. Clevo is usually more about maximum bang for the buck. So I suppose they thought that 4GB would be enough for all but the hardest of the hard core gamers, which would be opting for more hard core gaming systems anyway.

From a marketing standpoint, it seems like a good decision. Of course, I guess that depends on how much additional complexity and cost it would have added to the system. But honestly, 3-4GB of VRAM is enough for most gamers looking for high "bang for the buck" type systems. The ones that want more are usually the kind of people who buy Alienware or other flashy systems with lots of bling, or will tolerate the bulkier Clevo models to get the higher spec'd system.

The ones like LunaP and tfast500 that may cost Clevo sales are likely a tiny minority that make up only a fraction of a percent.

 

I brought two notebooks from them and so far no issues (except they changed faulty ram under warranty). Tip: If you have a question about notebook or need help with a product fault, go directly to their forum. It'll give you fast response from CS.

I already asked them about offering better CPU and waiting for the answer.

 

I'm not sure why you keep bringing MXM cards into this when we're clearly talking about 2 15" models both using soldered GPUs. Come next year I doubt anyone will be saying this much. Again my only retort is the reasoning behind such w/o the option for more, if Gigabyte can do it in a slimmer form factor, there's nothing saying Clevo can't. tfast500 and I aren't the only small % of your people that are against this there are many people that feel the same way, however we're not attempting to start a revolution either. I just find it a waste they would make such a poor decision, the battery alone was enough.

Like I said in the main thread, if I'm spending 3k+ on a laptop I expect it to perform well for the next few years, without having to worry about compromising within the first year due to new end game play. Sure 3-4 gb works right now for a large amount of games, however people often eat their words a year later, and w/ the rapid development of games, and other issues, I can easily see 6gb Being the sweet spot for next year, seeing as we're already getting close to it with some games.

There is nothing wrong w/ looking for something that will last for its money's worth.

As for maximizing bang for the buck I'd say they missed that shot. As already stated its a sexy model, just some poor ( possibly rushed decisions) this time around IMO.

Don't forget only a fraction of a percent of gamers also purchase clevo's given MSI/Gigabyte/Alienware etc, so that % you talk of turns into a slightly bigger chunk.

Point of the matter is, they made this static vs an option, in which for the type of industry/crowd they're aimed at is a poor decision in my view.

If you can't tell I'm a HUGE Clevo fan, and have been w/ them since 2000... which is exactly why I'm so frustrated w/ this lol....

 

I disagree. See my post above.

I totally agree with that, and said so a while back (pages 32 & 35, post # 313 & 343), and people jumped all over me for it. LOL. My last response on the subject was at post 349, and I actually got a like on that one.

 

Because if you want a *Clevo* with 8GB, that's what you'll have to buy. Otherwise you spend more for another brand.

The only games using more than that are a few poor ports of console games. Original PC games will likely continue to run fine on 4GB, since that's all that's available in the GTX 980 desktop video cards (and hopefully the poor ports will be patched to fix their crappy code).

You seem seriously fixated on 6-8GB VRAM, even though the more powerful desktop cards only have 3-4GB in them. The hardest of the hard core gamers game on desktops, and with the exception of the freakishly expensive Titan cards, the desktop cards have 4GB of VRAM. Game makers are not going to lose that market segment any time soon.

Then you should be building a desktop gaming rig.

Can't really make it an option on a soldered system. Too many skews. Look how many dealers are offering all the CPU options, none. No one wants to stock a dozen different system boards because the odd potential customer may want a different configuration. It's bad business. Especially when there are cheaper models with interchangeable parts that can be configured to meet those needs. You're not being realistic here.

Clevo made a bad decision, in your opinion. Considering the excitement level in this thread, I'd say you are wrong. Most people are highly anticipating these new models. For what it's worth, I'm not sold on this model either, but I can see why so many others are excited about it. I do believe that if you go with another brand, solely due to the VRAM, you are going to be in a very small percentage group of users.

 

Forgot to respond to this:

Yes, and I very much doubt anyone buys an Alienware over a Clevo simply because it has more VRAM.

Sure, a LOT of people will choose the Gigabyte P35X over the Clevo P651, and they will do so because it is even thinner and lighter, has an optical drive, uses cheaper mSATA SSD drives, and probably a dozen other reasons I can't think of right now.

The point being, you seem overly fixated on VRAM, and VRAM alone. There are loads of reasons people will choose to buy another model or another brand. People who do it solely for the VRAM are going to be the exception.

 

Since you may not know ( or choose not to ) there is a button at the bottom right of each post called "Edit" please use that in the future to help keep threads from being cluttered. I notice you exhibit this habit in many threads, however if this isn't part of the forum rules then to each their own I guess.

You seem to have quite an issue with anyone containing an opinion or concern other than you're own lol I was merely stating on my disappointment in hopes of change, but clearly that offended you as you're pulling out your own personal logic. I've said what I've had to say, and you've exaggerated what you felt you needed to exaggerate on. I would rather not respond further given the empty remarks you've made. You're very knowledgeable in many areas, however speculation isn't something you can pull facts from alone. If you feel I may be scaring people away that's one thing but if you're acting on it then you're definitely hiding something.

I think you should re read the thread a bit more before making false statements, had you done so you would notice my other gripes however you seem to only want to focus on the one main disappointment that many ( which you chose to cover up ) share. That and learn to relax, regardless of what happens in life you shouldn't use others to take things out on, or belittle vs your own beliefs, since we both have varying opinions which is understandable since this IS a forum, however to undermine things as if you feel you have facts is way more offensive than anything else. Please try to be open minded a bit more.

The only point here is that you seem overly fixated on anyone who has an opinion different from yours. At least the avatar makes sense lol. Have fun with your doubts though!

To sum up my side its a great laptop, and no I have not officially decided between this and the p35x, I am merely having decision issues based on the varying factors.

To everyone else my apologies for upsetting the thread like this.

 

I apologize, as apparently I've come off as some kind of arrogant jerk. That was not my intention. I was simply trying to point out that you are worrying far too much about the VRAM (or lack thereof). It's clear that you like this system, and I think you should get it.

Much of what I said was intended to be humorous, but reading it again, I can see how it could have been taken another way. Sorry.

 

No worries, I apologize as well I was having a pretty rough day as well, and must've re-edited my post multiple times after re reading it. I do like to get my point out too at times as I never want confusion either on how I"m coming off.

The main cons to me were the 4 cell battery 60whr, lowering the vRAM and now I forgot the 3rd. If this was a year ago I would not hesitate to purchase this over the gigabyte since I certainly trust clevo,however given the rapid change in games, requirements I've seen I fear that in a year or 2 I wouldn't be able to hold my ground w/ newer games, and since MMO's are my biggest time killer (when not working or testing theories) I want to fully immerse myself in them.

I'm aware that 4gb is fine for now, as last year 3gb was the norm, however its interesting that for about 4-5 years we were good on 1-2 gb's then it boomed to 3+ especially when people started getting into higher resolution/surround, which was understandable, however then came the use of SLI for achieving max settings in games, after which mods, expansions, higher resolution, better textures, sloppy programmers, etc, it just started jumping up.

In my desktop I have 3 titans, however I do make use of them, given my setup and all, however I"m sure I could have managed w/ a 4gb card at times. It's more the security feeling that you're good for a while vs knowing that you're @ the pinnacle of what is currently being used, but then worrying about later on. I've no clue what turn of events will happen, so in any way possible , and given the price at which both systems run, if I can get another year out of it, then to me that's worth it.

the P651 however supports 32gb of ram which is another + for me, though I don't see an option for a 3k screen as opposed to a 4k, which from what I've seen increases the power req's for the battery thus lessening it further than that of a 1080p/3k. It's frustrating because I have no way of testing these babies given their high end specs, unless I was back in Japan where I could go down to my local Yodobashi and have a good chance of seeing the model there.

So for me its Screen size, memory, vram, battery life

P651 has the Mem, and 1080p/4k options (POSSIBLY could find a 3k variant if I searched enough)
P-35x has the vRam, screen and battery options that make me feel better about my purchase, but lacks the RAM however according to a Gigabyte rep it supposedly CAN support 32gb ram utilizing the 1x16gb sticks however this was from a vendor vs the direct mfc so IF I were to get it I would test it on my own accord and report back to the community.

The only in between to either I've found is the 8258/8268 which I don't mind bulky to much however I like the fact that the new models have thunderbolt/usb3 as opposed to the p-15x's usb 3.0/2.0 (can't recall if it has TB)

I returned my w230SS a few weeks ago and now have the credited amount sitting in my cart, while I did love the design and response of the laptop, it had some issues/didn't meet up to all my expectations which I figured. I'm currently using an m11x for portability ( can't game for crap w/ it since its an R2) and mostly for checking mail/school work and watching videos if I"m stuck when not using my desktop since the 7338 was supposed to replace that but after running my games and all I knew that with the feeling and all of what I wanted that since I was already spending close to 3k why not get something to go farther.

So that's my dilemna, however I am looking into the possibility of a 6/8 cell battery for the p651 IF rumors prove true for a certain vendor.


Blah..

 

Why can't we replace the panel in p150sm?

Liked your post because Clannad

 

My "desktop" gaming system is still a 3+ year-old i5-2500 with a 2 year-old 660Ti 2GiB GDDR5. I've run a lot of high-end titles at it at 1080p with FXAA and even MSAAx8 in many cases.

So I'm not really worried about what the 970m 3GiB is going to "limit" me to. I'm not going to run at resolutions beyond 1080p, unless the title is older and has no issues at 4K. 1080p is good enough, 4K nice where it's an option.

I'll probably upgrade my notebook again in 2-3 years when it does become such.

 

ok now girls, behave and make up

concerning msata vs. m.2 drives: its true that the available drives arent worth buying at the moment, since they dont max out the pcie 4x interface and especially dont beat 4k performance of available 2.5" highend drives. but this was also the case when msata was first out! it just takes a bit of time for faster drives to come out and the new tech to be adopted by enough users that ssd manufacturers will put more time and effort developing *really* fast m.2 pcie drives. in any case, the m.2 ports are one of the main reasons i chose to order the p651sg, since u can be sure that sometime soon m.2 ssds will be available thatll mop the floor with any 2.5" drives when it comes to speed this is what i call future-proof until then, ill stick to my beloved 850 pro 1tb
other reasons that convinced me even though cpu/gpu are soldered are the 4k display, the comparably thin form factor, the sexy/sleek design and the incredible amount of storage u can squeeze into this thing

to anyone who would rather choose mxm gpus over soldered i can only suggest to wait juuuust a tad longer for the P7x0ZM series to come out! itll be worth it and surely will offer all the new and upcoming goodies such as m.2/4k display etc. plus desktop cpu and mxm gpu, of course....

 

You guys seem to forget that you have two Sata ports why need a msata ? YOU have 2*hard drive + upgradability toward new m2 when they will come. Amd the gigabyte is tempting but 2100Euros for +4gb vram!!!

 

Ah I"m aware that's perfectly fine for 1080p, however since I couldn't find a 1440p variant, which I use 1440p in surround @ home for some games I was looking @ The 3k for the p35x since its almost 1600p which isn't that far off from 1440 anyways and feels like w/ the 980 I might actually be able to use it as such while not having to worry about upping as many settings as I would w/ 1080p such as SSAA.

If I was to just contend w/ the 1080p then yeah, I could easily see the clevo being a more valid choice in that realm, though honestly I think its the battery that's bothering me the most, and ofc I'm scared of the 35x since again I've never gone beyond the grounds of clevo. In the end it just comes down to getting the best I can get between the 2 lol. Which you have to agree is a tough choice.

I"m curious on this p7x0zm though is that 17" or multiple variants.

 

1440p does require a bit of a kick for buffer, I fully admit. And dropping down to 720p, even with lots of AA turned on, is not always desirable, as at least 1080p looks quite a bit better than 720p. So I understand your point on 1440p, and 1080p not really being an option.

 

So, what some are saying is ...

- M.2 at least meets, if not greatly exceeds mSATA and 2.5" SATA, in performance
- M.2 is future-proof, at least in the near-term, unlike mSATA and 2.5" SATA, which are "stuck"
- M.2 devices really don't cost anything more than mSATA or 2.5" SATA versions
- M.2 is a little bit smaller than mSATA, and a lot smaller than 2.5" SATA form-factor

So ... what's the problem here? That's what I don't understand with several.

I ordered a 512GB m550 mSATA for now with my P650SE. Performance and price is really no different than the m550 in mSATA or 2.5" SATA forms. The sheer random access read and throughput does wonders over spindle already. Everyone should have at least one, even if just 40GB for Intel Smart Response Technology (SRT) under Windows, or dmcache under Linux.

Yes, I want NVEe (via PCIe) and not just AHCI (via SATA). But I can wait. As you noted ...

Fabs already have the technology out there. The semiconductor industry developed it years ago. But the commodity pricing is not there yet because it hasn't reached the volumes and economies of scale to make it viable.

I.e., only the big fabs, usually on their own brand (e.g., Samsung), have made the efforts. And they are just the early ones at commodity pricing (and that's still 2x typical M.2/mSATA). In the near future, as TSMC and other fabs start releasing such ICs in high volumes, perfecting their processes, you'll see more.

 

Yeah, so I'm REALLY torn between a 3k display and a 1080p, with the w230SS the 1080p was gorgeous and I could see things super clear, and that was a 13" so was thinking w/ a 2.5" difference the 3k would be SLIGHTLY similar for work space, and would be nice for gaming...its amazing how 1 piece of hardware ( be it a screen, gpu etc) can be a decision factor, though I'm curious if the p651 has a 3k option that's compatible w/ it though given the 4gb I'm curious if it could handle it just as well?


Which I just noticed you also opted for the 4k display on yours. You and Ningyo are both VERY brave and I respect that, hoping good things come w/ that

 

I have already ordered mine from PC Specialist. I went for the 970m with 1080p screen. My question to all you experts out there is should I upgrade to the 3k screen. I am a casual to moderate hard core gamer but do like to play my games on ultra settings. Will I be able to play the latest titles if I buy the laptop with a 3k screen on ultra settings or will I need to down scale?

 

1080p, 3k, 4k personal preference.

Personally I'm opting for 1080p. I've dealt with the scaling issues with Windows and it's annoying at best. Some games for some reason you have to reduce desktop resolution to 1080p if you want to play at 1080p. I personally would love the additional screen real estate a 3k or 4k screen offers, but only for desktop work. Until they can make it seamlessly switch to lower res and/or have more than adequate GPU performance for games at that native res, I'm staying away.

 

P750ZM 15" and P770ZM 17"

 

Some people have been mentioning the Gigabyte P35w v3 or P35X v3 as a replacement to the Clevo. I can only give my personal opinion on the gigabytes as I did own a p34w for a month before it went wrong and I sent it back for a refund. I found the gigabytes not that well made. The chassis is completely made of plastic whereas the Clevo is made from aluminium. The track pad buttons on the P34w were abysmal. After a months use they were indented under the chassis rather than being level with it and the keyboard flex was terrible to. Only my opinion but I would much rather have a laptop built out of aluminium rather than plastic, it's much more sturdy and helps with reducing the heat inside the laptop.

 

Being a regular reader of this forum this is pretty much my exact opinion. I was seriously looking at the p35 series back when it came out and the quality issues were just terrible. The chassis was arriving to the customer in a perfect condition box bent to the point that it would not even sit on a table without wobbling. I mean they can say they improved the design that's great, but I don't believe they have changed that drastically in a matter of a year.

 

Yes that is exactly what happened to mine. It was bent out of shape on arrival as well so when you put it on the desk it wobbled. Some slight diagonal pressure bent it back in to shape but for a brand new laptop this is terrible.

 

This was addressed pretty heavily back when it was happening. To recap it was a shipping issue rather than design issue. With the modular bay for the ODD it didn't have enough structural support in the center while in shipping. So when stacked on pallets for mass shipment caused the laptop to bend. Wouldn't damage the box as they are somewhat pliable, but did bend the metal. This was addressed with additional foam support in the center in manufacturer packaging, and since that point no additional issues.

 

Funny, the P35 was what got me kicked off on my search for a new laptop, and yet now it's pretty much last on my list for systems I would ever consider getting.

They said that, but I still don't believe them. And even so, if it needs that much protection while shipping, it's gonna need more protection than my backpack can give it, which makes it a design issue anyway.

 

delete - double post

 

I'll leave this here. Just started watching it.

Sager NP8651 / Clevo P650SE First Look GTX 970m by HTwingnut

 

Should I get the SG or wait until Maxwell processors are refreshed onto all brands? I've been without a laptop for a good 2 months and over, but at this point I believe I can wait if it means a better experience and longevity for future uses. What do you guys suggest?

 

Believe it or not, it's the case. I personally handled the issue here in our facility and we didn't receive a single bent unit. I even went so far as to try and bend one myself since Gigabyte was offering to replace any bent units, I put a considerable amount of weight on the center, more than any laptop would experience in real usage, and didn't perceive a bend whatsoever. It was an isolated issue but one that got publicized pretty heavily online. Gigabyte responded swiftly, fixed the cause in shipping, didn't hear of a single issue once addressed.

 

I see that the fan opening on the backside is still slightly off from the GPU fan. Is this true ? I thought they would fix it on the final release ?

 

I noticed the same...maybe still a pre-production model?

 

You're just going to keep waiting and waiting. If you need one now, get it. The 900Ms are way above the 800Ms. I doubt the "longevity" will really be affected compared this batch to the refresh.

Yeah seriously, what is up with that? That is a make or break deal for me. Any resellers care to chime in?

 

Yeah it is really strange, as we have pictures of one with the vents in the right locations. I am guessing its still a pre-production model being passed around from reviewer to reviewer. Just a guess though.

 

I think it is an pre-production. This is a picture from the backside that looks alright to me.. Does it.?

Would be strange, 2/3 days before the ETA from most resellers reviewing a pre-production model.. Or not.?

----------------------------------

http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo-reviews-owners-lounges/764705-sager-np8651-clevo-p650se-gtx-970m-first-look.html#post9824752

Well I've had the laptop for about an hour and made this quick video and also here to post my initial impressions and will post a handful of benchmarks over the next couple of days to tide people over, until I can get the full review complete.

So it is a pre-production model

 

I'm missing something - how are you coming to that conclusion?

I really hope it's a pre-production model, and that the actual system will have the IPS screen, not the TN screen he reports.

 

No, it's a first off production model.