*** The Official MSI GT75 Owners and Discussions Lounge ***

Seems Msi would prevent more RMA. Only reason for this is lowering their costs. Anyway, use Bloat for overclocking is the lazy mans work. @Phoenix

 

Well, it does save the customers from the delay and loss of time with their laptops by avoiding RMA... although it's probably not so much failure as failure to reach 4.2ghz for many CPU's.

I reached 4.5ghz using DGC + XTU + removing power limits by increasing values in XTU.

The trick with DGC @ 4.2ghz + XTU setting to 4.5ghz should still work even with DGC limited to 4.1ghz, so you can still use / try using both.

And, that was without adding voltage! 4.5ghz with no added voltage, and a small -15mV undervolt, the 7820hk is amazing

 

Hmscott, the reason why you don't have to add voltage is because your chip is "VID Boosting" under load. I PM'd Raja (the asus guy) and he told me what was happening. It's like a perverted form of loadline calibration. While this is intended for the 'average joe' user to just set an offset and forget it, this puts EXTREME stress on the VRM's.

Have you noticed your VID jumps around like crazy by like 100mv? Also power draw from the CPU isn't being reported accurately.

from @sirgeorge

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...owners-and-discussions-lounge.794968/page-785

 

As you can see... MSI is pushing out SCAM on their web site!! @Phoenix Damn, nice move. @Donald@HIDevolution

Could also be because MSI got a lots of complains from owners that couldn't manage to run 4.2GHz due ****y chips or overheating. Several reasons MSI changed their bloatware. Not one reason for the change, bruh Could also be because of Intel's advices when they changed chipset from CM238 → HM175 for all models. That said, OEM's cooperate as you know with Intel. None will never ever know the reason.

Btw. You say -15mV undervolt. What is default max load voltage for @4.5GHz ?

 

Need multimeter to know max load voltage. MSIbook does not have vcore sensor, so vdroop is unknown also. VID only shows target voltage, but this is assuming there is no vdroop. But it would be next to impossible to find the voltage read points without soldering a wire to them as they are probably blocked by the CPU heatsink.

Also @hmscott
Please don't write the VID for 4.5 ghz if you are using AC/DC=Auto (default MSI setting). As I mentioned above, the VID is not reported correctly. VID shows for me as 1.14v only, yet has more power draw (less watts reported but more heat) than 1.21v (!!) manual setting and makes the VRMs' shut down (and 1.216v has LESS heat but MORE watts shown, and doesn't shut down at all).

If you want to know the true VID At 4.5 ghz that is actually reported correctly (what the CPU actually wants to use by default), use manual AC/DC=0.01 (1) However this *WILL* cause a BSOD unless you use a positive offset at least +75mv.

 

I asked what it show with @4.5GHz in bench load from factory. Assume @hmscott play safe with Auto settings. Stock 7820hk should run with +-1.148 in load all 4 cores ? Lower?

 

Do you mean VID?
VID is not vcore.
vcore is "VID target" + whatever the CPU receives after vdroop. The MSIbook doesn't have a vcore sensor.

Let me explain, @Papusan
Auto settings for my MSIbook:

Adaptive (Default).
4.5 ghz
ICCMax: 200A, PL1, PL2=200W
AC/DC loadline=Auto msi default (0=zero)=auto

Idle VID: 1.0875v-1.2v --fluctuates wildly.
Prime 95 (AVX disabled, FMA3 disabled), 100% stable, temps are very high, power draw 85W?!?!, VID = 1.12v, fluctuates by 0.05v<--- stable system, but fluctuating VID.
Prime 95 (AVX enabled, FMA3 enabled), temps are off the charts even though watts shown is lower than below (see below), VID=1.14v <-- (VRMs shut down in 15 seconds). --system shut off. No error, VRM shutdown. CPU temp wont even get to 85C. watts show as 95W only).

Manual vcore: 1182mv
AC DC loadline= 1 (lowest value)
idle VID: 1.179v
AVX load VID=1.216v
idle changes from 1.179v-1.216v exactly (this is very strange).

Prime95 AVX and FMA3 Disabled: : VID=1.174v (100% stable not even 0.01v change)
Prime95 AVX and FMA3 enabledd : VID=1.216v 100% stable not even 0.01v change.
Power draw: 100W-115W, temps 88/86/90/86 after 5 minutes. No shutdown at all.

See?
VID is higher, power draw is "reported" higher, temps are lower and no VRM shutdown...

Without vcore monitoring, there is no way to know the actual core voltage being used... because even with 0.01 AC/DC, the VID is accurate, but there is VDROOP...which we can't measure (The VID won't show this)..

 

I know all this, bruh. I have even posted info for an ignorant and little technical knowledge person in this thread. You have probaly seen it before Yoo remember he who claimed 5.2GHs is easy task for 7820hk and it could run stable? This with 1.250 or was it 1.260v ?

I only ask for numbers, bruh. VID or Vcore doesn't matter. You can't even be sure MSI have changed this for HM175 chipset.

 

@Papusan ok fair enough.

 

@Papusan @hmscott @Falkentyne

Woha woha guys guys come on it's go way offtrack...the above discussion doesn't clear my head...you all forget the line am "Newbie"

Right now I want to over clock my Cpu and Gpu with stable setting like my previous dragon center "4.2 Ghz" is enough for me.

I have Intel XTU for Cpu....I dont know is it ok to install Afterburner to overclock GPU because i read somewhere it does conflict with dragon center...I even plan to uninstall the current dragon center...to install AB......

I think instead of dragon center "XTU for Cpu and Afterburner for GPU"....is it ok...

share some stable over clocking profile for core I7-7820HK and GTX-1080 (both are re pasted with IC Diamond "last time i overclocked my cpu/gpu with "Old Dragon Center" both are stay quite cool around "65-75")


Right now am in really confused state......Shed some lights guys !!!

 

For a small donation you can request Svet for the modded BIOS/vBIOS here: https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?board=51.0

 

@Papusan @hmscott @Falkentyne @Phoenix

In past two days I have tried to overclock my laptop and succeed 90 percent only.

I started my Overclocking in xtu taking @Phoenix profile as a reference and tried the same setting for my i7-7820hk and it worked well and CPU temp were 60c to 70c occasionally it spiked 75c but it's stable and with stand every test I throwed at it "Cinebench, prime, xtu stress, even Aida 64 stress test"

And I played CPU intensive games like Gta 5 around 3 hr and also some of Cpu intensive application from my work it still withstand perfectly and temp was too good only around 68 C (Fan speed :Auto).

Until it tested with "Aida 64->Benchmark->CPU Hash" and suddenly got crashed. And then it automatically rebooted and tested again with same setting and it crashed again. I thought something not compatible with my system and it took another day to find the solution for my problem and I found two solutions

(with @Phoenix profile it crashed immediately)

1) Increase the core voltage offset -100mv to -60mv



2) Another leave the core voltage -100mv and increase the ring ration default 3.6 Ghz to 3.9 GHz



And I tested with those setting it withstand most of the time,but it still crashed 1 or 2 times out of 30 times.What do i do and why my overclock doesnt handle CPU Hash benchmark testing



and also my Package TDP goes around 54W is that ok,because my CPU TDP 45W i dont know both are same or not .

Guys give any solution,you guys are pro here and let me know what did i miss !!!

 

It is possible MSI has done something in firmware to limit the amount of power that the motherboard will allow the CPU to use, and if you exceed it then it crashes.

 

@marrty @Mr. Fox

Please explain what you mean by crashed.
Explain what happened.
Don't just say "crashed"
Crashed means nothing. It could mean "oh, you got an 'Illegal operation error", a "prime 95 thread errored out", "Blue screen of death", "black screen" "purple screen full of swimming pink elephants with vertical lines swimming throughout the entire monitor"

or "the computer instantly just shut off" (like the power was removed), the POWER LED and GPU LED "shut off" (like the computer was powered off and unplugged), and then just turned back on after.

We can't help you unless you explain exactly what you saw.
Also where is the result of your CPU hash?

At 4.4 ghz I get 5050 MB/S.

If you have trouble with English, please make a video of it.
Just trying to help.

If the system "rebooted", please explain exactly what you saw. Did chasis LED (Power) lights/GPU lights go out, etc. Maybe make a video of it, it's easier.

 

Aye, aye, cap'n. You're correct. Crash can mean many things, and more often than not the term is used incorrectly.

 

You have increased all power limits... Why did you think CPU's TDP is still 45W ? Even with stock clocks will 6820/7820hk pass default TDP.

 

It just rebooted automatically... suddenly power off (all led are off) without any error message and then turn on.I it worked perfectly stable in every other test and task but it cashed only in CPU HASH test.Not on every time randomly like i mentioned before(But if i didnt follow my 2 so called solution it cashed every time i ran that test.)

 

After I posted that message and then only I came to know TDP means "Thermal Design Power" not an wattage.

 

READ!!

 

Tested with stock clocks, or stock voltage but oc'd? Put up Hwinfo and read what happen in real time.

 

Thank you for the video.

Looks like VRM shutdown.

WHY ARE YOU RUNNING ON IGPU????


However I am not sure because you said you ran a prime95 small FFT FMA3 (AVX) test and it did not shutdown. Just reached 95C instead. But VRM shutdown shows the same thing. Prime95 small FFT should trigger VRM overload if the VID goes too high, not CPU hash.

Please downclock the CPU to x39 (default multiplier) and try this test again please. Report back.

Then, if x39 works, go back to x42 and REMOVE THE UNDERVOLT and try the test again.

Also why did it take 30 seconds for you to boot into windows???
I get into windows in LESS than 10 seconds...But i am not using the fall update, too......

I'll ask again
why are you using the iGPU?????

Use Nvidia GPU please. Maybe do this first before doing x39 test and before doing x42 without undervolt test......

 

I

I did use Nvdia GPU only.

 

Why is your GPU light off?
Does GT75VR not have a GPU light for dedicated GPU?........? Or did MSI move it somewhere?

On GT73VR, GPU light is on the "MUX" button below power LED light...

 

It doesn't visible clearly on that video it still there only !!!

 

Oh it's different now.
On GT73 it is a LED strip (usually several LEDs with a diffuser strip) the length of the button, so the light is the same size as the button length.
On GT75 it's just a LED with a hole. Ok thank you.

 

It's the same strange reboot that I have exept mines are completly random.

 

random?
Idle? Load? games? what exactly are you doing right before it happens? What are the CPU Temps before it happens?

 

I do not know what msi is thinking. 7820hk like a 6820hk performance. We are required to overclock manually

 

The target is lowest possible RMA numbers.
See also...

 

Yes random, IDLE, while gaming, watching youtube, etc etc
My temps are completly normal

 

Wow I do not know
Do you have thermal pads on the MOSFETS (the black squares right above the chokes? The choke are large grey squares), that are covered by the CPU heatsink?

 

Yes I have. I gave up weeks ago about this laptop, no under warrantly anymore cuz I changed the thermal past so the retailer won't take it back. Could'nt use it once since I received it a month ago, that's a shame.

 

There is some damage to the laptop. I don't know where. Someone would have to look at it for you. Sudden shutoff and reboot (not just reboot, but shutoff and reboot) is because of Voltage/VRM problem (overheat or overcurrent).

 

I should send it back to MSI but there's no repair center near my location, I live in Indian Ocean and the closest one according to MSI is in Poland.. Just imagine how much i'm gonna pay just to send it...

 

oh like that's the reason. thanks .
this seems to apply to all msi laptop series
who installed the dragon center
either on cpu or gpu

 

Is SpeedFan compatible with GT75VR?
Looking to set manual fan profiles for CPU/GPU now that I've uninstalled Dragon Center.

Thanks!

 

Try Msi Silent Option !!! Perfectly working for me !!!

https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=255972.0

Install SkyLake Version !!!

 

Thanks!! I'll try this today when I'm back home.

To all GTX1080 laptop owners: I'm testing undervolt/overclock with MSI AB. A screenshot of Freq/Voltage curve from experts, to be used as reference, would be great if anyone has done it. Thanks!!

 

Excited to be receiving my GT75VR soon. Just had HIDEvolution send over the benchmark results and awaiting shipment. Not sure if the temps and benchmark results are good considering I went with the OC option, along with re-pasting.

Can someone more experienced give comments on the temperature and benchmark results?

 

The 4.2ghz and -100mV are "safe" daily driver settings. You might get more undervolt, I think I saw as much as -150mV under stock, -125 at 4.2ghz, and -40mV @ 4.5ghz (all 4 cores).

The scores, IDK off hand, look'em up on their respective sites.

Looks like the same temps I was seeing on stock paste...maybe a tad lower on idle, like 2-3 degree's, but that could be a matter of ambient temps affecting readings too.

Congratulations on your new laptop!!

 

Thanks @hmscott . I'm surprised the temps are similar to stock paste, given I opted for the best therma paste option they had with Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut on CPU, Gelid GC Extreme on GPU, and Fujipoly Extreme Thermal Pads on heat sensitive surfaces. I heard that these therma paste combinations could lower temps up to 5-10 degrees

 

That's why I suggest asking for before/after benchmark runs to see what effect the re-pasting has. Re-pasting blindly without getting a good base reading on the stock paste basically gives you no reference to know if you've improved the situation, or made it worse

The MSI GT73 on stock paste runs cool enough, undervolting locks that in for most people, and they don't need to re-paste.

Once you've tuned the undervolt, fans, OC and apps for best performance, without thermal throttling, lower temps are nice but not required, so you can safely skip re-pasting.

Re-pasting often needs to be redone once done, the enthusiast pastes require repasting. Having it done by a professional with lots of experience doing this every day may extend the time between re-pastes, but also maybe not - it depends on the fitment and air gaps created from flexure and use (moving a laptop around).

If you got an extended warranty from the builder / seller they will cover any needed re-pastings should temps start to rise.

 

Ask them if they were using auto fans or cooler boost. If you use auto fans, even liquid metal will get similar temps, because the CPU fan won't kick into medium speed until 80C. GPU fan kicks into medium speed around 75C. Most likely those temps are standard fare. If they used auto fans, seems about what I got with Kryonaut also).

Use coolerboost 100% and then report back on the temps. Whatever you do, do NOT run prime95 small FFT with FMA3 or AVX enabled (you can disable this in the local.txt file, read undoc.txt if u care enough to do that). You *WILL* reach PROCHOT# extremely quickly unless you are using LM.

Prime95 blend custom (75% of total RAM size, FMA3 and AVX disabled), is a good RAM and overall system test, and small FFT (with AVX and FMA3 DISABLED!!) is good to tell you if your CPU overclock is fully stable or not. AIDA64 and anything using Intel Linpack binaries are also okay. For the graphics card, nothing beats looping firestrike extreme stress test for an hour, or running Time Spy.

 

if you do not have hdr option in windows setting
?

 

It's amazing how voltages went from 6th gen to 7th gen. I can't get any undervoltage at 4.2ghz. Infact, I have to at least raise it +10mv to be fully stable, at the very least. I can only undervolt if I use 4ghz, and only around -20mv.

 

The undervolt settings only work because of MSI's vid boosting BS, which grossly underreport the VID. Set AC/DC loadline to 1 (like you should do on desktops) and try undervolting at 4.2 ghz. You'll BSOD the instant you press start on prime95, and that's with AVX and FMA3 disabled. The 'issue' isn't the default VID. It's vdroop, which the laptop can't measure because of there being no vcore sensor. The AC/DC settiings boost VID depending on load (1=no boost at all, 0=intel reference settings which SEEM to be 2.10 mOhms), but the VID shown is not accurate at all unless AC/DC is set to 1. The reason undervolting works at the default settings is the auto AC/DC is a bit overgenerous with the VID boosting, although it works well for novice users.

For good fine tuning, use manual vcore and set AC/DC to 1. If you have problems with vdroop at high overclocks, don't go above 25 on AC/DC. CPU PLL offset may help as well but this needs to be tested more; don't go anywhere near the upper values).

 

on my 7820HK, I was undervolted by -100mV all day long @ 4.2 GHz, super stable. That was on the first BIOS I think it was .317

now on the latest BIOS, even -70mV would give me crashes when I stress the system so I stopped undervolting. But I can still do 4.2 GHz stable after switching to Liquid Ultra, helped bring those temps down by 10C

 

@Phoenix @ryzeki if you're using adaptive voltage, you need to be careful.
the default VID for most chips is a bit too low for stability when doing a full stress test (Prime 95 small FFT with AVX/FMA disabled is a very good test for CPU stability).
There is no "Loadline Calibration" setting on these laptops, so MSI uses "VID Boosting" to boost the VID signal at load, then it *HIDES* the vid boost from the user. It hides it a LOT if using adaptive voltage+IA AC/DC=auto (0), which is default; I believe this is MSI's "Automatic" way to counter vdroop, but it does it extremely liberally. But the VID is reported completely...wrong.

This VID boost becomes VERY obvious when you use manual override voltage rather than adaptive; the power draw is through the roof.
ignoring VDROOP (which there is no sensor measure realtime vcore), if you set IA AC/DC loadline to 1, with either adaptive or manual vcore (the default value that should be used for desktops) then you will see the TRUE VID that won't be "MSI"d from you. And prepare to BSOD in a stress test (use positive offset if you need).

Due to the higher vdroop on the higher VID cpus (6820HK runs at a higher voltage), you will have more difficulty getting stability with an IA AC/DC=1 than with a 7820HK. in that case, use a value of 10-25, whatever works.

Increasing CPU PLL Voltage offset to 90mv can also improve things, particularly if you're messing with RAM timings and overclocking.

Not going to derail this thread with more fried CPU microwave happyface nvidia egg science, but someone with a degree in engineering please explain the difference in power draw here and temps, with the same VID shown:

Adaptive voltage, IA AC/DC=0 (Auto):


Adaptive voltage, IA AC/DC=1, +100mv offset:


Manual voltage, 1135mv, IA AC/DC=auto. Same VID shown at load. Temps and power draw are in outer space.


Manual voltage, *1182mv*, IA AC/DC=1.

 

The screen itself is not HDR.