*** The Official MSI GS65 Stealth Owners and Discussions Lounge ***

Dragon Center enables cancer Bios restirctions that are hidden from end users to force your CPU to throttle for no reason
(namely, the TDC enable gets forced on and the TDC Current gets set to something low like 400). Sometimes just 'loading defaults' in the Bios after uninstalling Dragon Center will work. Sometimes you have to do the "45 second" Power button press, and then release, to force a full bios cmos clear (including all hidden settings).

even if you manually unlock your Bios menus and disable TDC, Dragon Center will re-enable it. The only fix is to UNINSTALL Dragon Center and then do a full reset of your Bios.
If you want your CPU to always run at the absolute maximum 6 core turbo multiplier at all times without ever throttling, after this, you need to unlock your Bios menus and set IMON SLOPE to 50 and IMON OFFSET to (negative offset) 31999. I won't help you with that, please do your own research.

 

Has anyone run this laptop while closed with an external monitor? How are the temps when the laptop is closed?

 

First of all thank you for your precious feedback and information.
I'm start feeling disappointend about this; not an entry level price for this system, and lot of tweaks to do, and tricks to avoid.
I would like to have a more easy user experience. Product like this should exit factory default more stable in my opinion.

Can I ask you what do you mean with TDC please?
If I uninstall Dragon Center, and then update the bios with the new one available on MSI, will I reset hidden settings? Those settings are locking the core clock multiplier? In other words, how the 8750H has expected to perform?

Thank you again if you would like to replay again.

 

Dragon center overvolts the voltage to bring the multiplier down on purpose, if you want the CPU to act normally like other brands do (Certainly not Razer that's capped at 35W), you'll have to uninstall Dragon center and reset the settings back to factory and use Silent Option to set the fan profile. About the full time on desired multiplier tweak, it's actually something that we don't want the MSI to see, that their little secret has been discovered. However, there are posts out there in this forum within the MSI section, you can find it easily.

 

Dragon center changes this wonderful THROTTLEBOOK setting for you, something that is supposed to be disabled. (TDC Enable is supposed to be DISABLED). It then sets the value to 640 which caues "EDP Current" throttling in Throttlestop (Limit reasons).

Older versions of Dragon Center on GT73VR and GT75VR never touched this setting; all they touched was messing with the "VR Current Limit" (which is already bad enough if you're trying to overclock a 7820HK).

In some cases even if you disable this option, it re-enables itself, even without DC, BUT as long as the value is set to "0" and not "640" or some higher value, there should be no problems.

 

Hiya MSIbois.

I am about to join your fold!

Question- is there any reason to not get the bestbuy version for 500$ less than the nvme version (im swapping the boot drive to a 1tb evo either way)?

Background info - my understanding is the best buy ver has the same everything minus the HD and killer wifi.....I have a Samsung EVO 1TB and a tube of noctua paste- Im going to open the unit anyway and I dont care about killer WiFi. I am fully resigned to the fact that I'm buying a race car- the tweaking and tinkering to get fine temps is inbuilt.

Is a clean windows 10 build hard to do with this (to get my boot drive on nvme)?
In scanning this thread I saw arctic mx temps after repaste- anyone ever use Noctua NT H1?

Im a couple weeks out from owning one, thanks for reading/responding!

 

Killer WiFi isn't worth the premium unless you know you need it in which case you're probably already running gigabit Ethernet which GS65 has on board.

Going from 30-60 seconds to load a map from rotating rust to ~6 seconds to load that same map from SATA SSD is a big deal. Not so much going from ~6 seconds to ~2-3 seconds to load that same map from NVMe SSD. Nice to have, but not having it is by no means a breaker.

So get the Best Buy edition.

Clean OS install works just fine. A bit tedious installing all of the drivers but that's a one-time thing.

You don't need to tinker much on this machine. A conservative undervolt and 5/6 core multiplier drop will get the full load power draw under the 45W limit and package temps in the 85-90C range and that's fine. You can tinker if you want, and that's fine, too, but it's not necessary.

 

Is this a pressure spot? Is it worth getting it repaired? https://imgur.com/a/V2pxYDA Its a dark blotch right above the mouse, about 1cm by 2 cm, and its most visible in the color Im showing it on. Ignore the stripes and distortion other than the mouse, thats from the camera I used

 

I think that display it's suitable for a RMA service.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm sick of "Data" partition on my main SSD, so I want to delete it and expand the C:\ partition, because I already have a 2nd SSD as "other stuff and data drive".

There's only one little problem...


1) What the heck is the WinRE Tools partition and why is in the middle of the two working partition? I can't expand C: with that stuff in the middle.
Can I swap the position with D:\ so I can delete D:\ and get C:\ bigger?

2) What is the BIOS RVY partition and why it's soooo big? Does it contain the "out of the box" configuration?

 

Tools + data for recovery. If you do have other means to backup/recovery you can get rid of those and configure your disk to contain only C partition. Several free tools can do it - I've used Easeus Partition Master free for instance: https://www.easeus.com/partition-master/delete-recovery-partition-windows-10.html Other candidates: https://www.lifewire.com/free-disk-partition-software-tools-2624950 (I've used Aomei, Paragon and MiniTool)

 

I set TDC enable = disabled and TDC current limit = 0 and found the multiplier always runs at 38x since doing so (decreased in Throttlestop). Sound roght or will changing the current limit to 600/800 cause the multiplier to be dynamic again?

 

I can test it but i see no reason for this.
When you see the notebookcheck review (pics only) you see that cpu and gpu are locatted in this area (bottom side) and warm air rises up and not down so from my point of view there will be a lot of heat which is blocked by the closed display.

i will play Destiny 2 with open and closed display and share my reasult as editt to this post.

Edit #1 Fan Contro
If someone test this sorry.
I remove dc and install silent option can control and it is working I use it at the moment.
Standard curve for the cpu

Standard for the gpu


Edit#2 temps
display open


closed display


To be honest i would use this little creature only with repaste job and changing the pads.
gaming performance is really nice and i like it but i like my GT75VR 7RF much more...

 

Hi Phoenix, I have a GS65 arriving this week and I'd like to hire you to do the same for me if you're willing please? I'm following your profile but I think the site requires you to PM me first. Thanks!

 

hire me?

 

you started a cottage industry with your offer of boutique tweaks!



----



thread,

If I go with the SSD best buy version and install an NVME as a storage/games drive- do I get the benefit of that speed, or should I go all the way and make NVME the boot drive?

im pretty set on repasting after doing some benchmarks... so ill be in there with the drives anyhow....

 

The teaks are only for HIDevolution Gaming Team not f0r the public or to 'hire me'.

 

Cool, but I do understand why the above person would read the thread back and offer to hire you based on the back and forth in the thread,though. May not have been your intention.

 

Hey everyone.
Laptop arrives on Wednesday from HIDevolution (wooo!!!).
Does anyone have temperature readings of the laptop being on a stand or with the rear lifted 1 inch?
On my GS43VR 7RE, I lose a whopping 7C on the CPU and on the GPU while on Auto Fan. I'm curious if the GS65 would have the same benefit even though it can suck in air from the top of the keyboard.

Thanks.
-JRey

 

So I bought my GS65 back in May and until recently i haven't had any problems with it. However now my fn, win, and enter keys only register about half the time. Has anyone else had this problem and found a solution.

 

Hi, I want to run my gs65 display at 120hz to watch 30fps movie because 144 is no multiple of 30. Is it possible?

 

24p
In video technology, 24p refers to a video format that operates at 24 frames per second (typically, 23.976 frames/s when using equipment based on NTSC frame rates) frame rate with progressive scanning (not interlaced). Originally, 24p was used in the non-linear editing of film-originated material. Today, 24p formats are being increasingly used for aestheticreasons in image acquisition, delivering film-like motion characteristics. Some vendors advertise 24p products as a cheaper alternative to film acquisition.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24p

6 x 24 = 144hz

Having said that, you can pick another refresh rate as you like, setting it up in Nvidia custom resolution settings:

 

Does that even matter with PCs? I thought you only had to worry about that if you up framed movies on televisions. And aren't movies shot in 24hz?

You should be able to make a custom resolution in Intel graphics settings. Just pick the same resolution at 30hz.

 

I get the 24p part but I have some 30fps videos to watch and i don't want to have to keep changing the refresh rate to game. I want just keep it at 120 because 30x4 = 120 and 24x5 = 120. I cant change the resolution and refresh rate on the nvidia control panel (probably beacuse of nvidia optimus) and in intel UHD graphics when tryng to create a 120 hz profile I get an error saying the profile exceeds the maximum bandwidth but I can create 144 and 60hz profiles though so I dont get why 120hz would exceed it. Is it possible to fix this error or any other way to change the display to 120hz?

 

Maybe try Custom Resolution Utility (CRU)?

 

Sigh, Optimus screws up everything, so you need to do what you are doing and find compatible resolution parameters for Intel's custom settings. 120hz might be locked out, but try 100hz / 110hz / 150hz / 90hz (next multiples) / etc.

Check for Intel driver update, check in on the Intel support forums.

There may be other parameters besides the resolution that runs the bandwidth up too high, since 144hz parameters work ok.

If you find a set of parameters that work at 120hz or ?, please post them

 

Intel has dropped the custom modes from the latest drivers CP, but the exe can still be found from System32, CustomModeApp.exe or something like.

 

There is a menu for custom profiles in intel control panel where I can type custom values but any resolution thats not on the standard list or any refresh rate thats not 60 or 144hz results in maximum bandwidth error. I cant even set it to 30 hz. I mean I could set it to 60hz for watching 30 fps content but like I said I dont want to have to keep switching back and forth. As for CRU I had never heard of it before but its website advertises it as being AMD and NVIDIA compatible only so I'm guessing it wont work with optimus. Any other suggestions?

edit: I found this post on intels forum ( https://communities.intel.com/thread/78158) where it says that custom resolution is blocked in any laptop display and the guy from intel answered that the newest drivers support EDID tweaking so you can trick the system into beliving its a different display but it doesnt explain how to do it. Does anyone know how to do it?

edit: after reading more of the forum I linked above I discovered that because of the 3rd party EDID support i could actually use CRU. Using it I managed to create a 120hz profile. Thanks for all the help but I still have one question though. CRU detected the two profiles already created by intel (60 and 144hz) but they arent actually these values, the actual values 60.081 and 144.027 anyone knows why?

 

Hey Falkentyne, quick question, as I am facing the same issue with my MSI GS65 (terrible stuttering/lag). If I simply want to change the TDC option (value set to 0 and Disable) can I use AMIBCP, edit the BIOS file changing those values, save and use the file to flash my BIOS using the standard procedure?

I mean I get that to mod any BIOS you need to unlock it first (so you can mod it from Windows or any other OS), but if I "don't" want to Mod it and I only change these options to the values I want, can I simply update with this file using the regular procedure, that means, from the BIOS (not from Windows)? Or do I still need to unlock the BIOS first?

Thanks!

 

It's probably just calculated from a round number used in pixel clock or something. Nothing to worry about.

 

So after a week my Killer Wlan killed itself which doesnt really surprise me (replaced the killer wlan in my gs60 and gs63 too, but they did not break they were only crap)
and 2 times i didnt had audio.

Edit:
And i am really pleased with the performance

 

You're better off just pressing Left Alt+Right Control+Right Shift+F2 in the Bios.

Using AMIBCP requires you make a LOCAL bios dump (you can absolutely *NOT* edit the bios from MSI's website or you WILL get a brick) with FPTW64 from win-raid.com (on the intel management engine section) for the one at the top (that won't give you an error when trying to run it), then using AMIBCP 5.0.2 (NOT 5.0.1, 5.0.1 will cause corruption) to set all the menus to supervisor, and then you have to deal with changing Bios Lock to disabled, which is a bit complicated (read the unlock/backup thread on the general MSI section above for how to do that; it's Paloesco's thread).

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-clear-cmos-and-prevent-common-issues.812372/

Disabling Bios Lock is VERY annoying without having access to the hidden menus already. You have to get the hex offset for Bios Lock and then use RU (via an EFI prompt on a USB flash drive) to change it via the hexadecimal offset, from 01 to 00. THEN you can flash your modded APTIO with FPTW64.

 

Because exactly 60Hz or 144Hz would flicker.

 

You can change this in BIOS. Mine where swapping from time to time. Once I've uninstalled DragonCenter and set that in BIOS ... issue resolved.

 

Is that default setting? Or is there any performance mode like from dragon center I suppose? Sorry not familiar with gs65.

 

Well that helped A LOT, thanks so much! I didn't know this combination of keys would give me the full BIOS configuration menus and options.

Unfortunately after setting the TDC to disabled status (having uninstalled Dragon Centre) the stuttering and lagging is still present

 

Hi, may I ask which settings did you change in the BIOS? After updating all drivers, disabling ethernet/wifi devices, uninstalling and reinstalling nvidia, intel and chipset drivers, reinstalling ethernet/wifi drivers, and uninstalling all MSI utilities (including Dragon Centre) my MSI GS65 keeps stuttering, lagging and freezing every time I switch between tasks, or open a new one (like a browser).

Thanks!

 

What version of windows are you on? Did you keep the original installation that came with the machine, or install windows fresh?

 

Windows 10 x64 1709 build (Fall Creators Update). I heard 1803 introduces more issues than it fixes for gaming, but I might eventually try it.

I am also tempted to install a brand new 1607 (Anniversary Update) build and block all non-security updates (feature updates) for newer builds. 1607 was the last one without any issues for gamers, while after that a big portion of them have been having issues, stuttering and fps drops.

 

What is the stuttering that you are experiencing? If it is the Optimus microstutters, they are fixed in 1803. If it is other issues, unfortunately all I can say is that the original install the machine came with was stuttery/ laggy for me and doing a fresh install fixed it. I'm currently on 1803 with no issues.

 

I think it's optimus related, because I see the power led changing color (from white to yellow) when I open Chrome or Firefox and that when the stuttering kicks in for like 1 sec (mouse frezzes) then it all continues to normal. It clearly happens when switching tasks, being it a browser, opening VLC to watch a movie, etc ... It gets worse when I am gaming and switch back to the desktop, or the other way around. With some games like BF1 the stuttering when switching is minimal, but with Rocket League it's terrible, when I get back to the game it takes like 2-3 seconds for it to react, completely frozen (the sound works well in the meantime). But when I am fully within the task/game, stuttering is gone, I only experience it when I switch/move through apps and games, but after that games work well. Same for movies, it might freeze for like half a sec when I am switching back to the video player, but after that movie plays smoothly.

 

That sounds like Optimus. A fresh install may make it a little better, but it won't be gone until you update through the latest patch of 1803. I would of course try updating before a fresh install. Just make an image of your current state, update and see if it goes away

 

Thanks, I'll give it a try. I guess it's better to perform a fresh clean install of the 1803 than just using Windows update to install the Feature Upgrade to 1803, right? (the only pain is I'll have to reinstall everything, including those 50GB games from Steam/Origin). At least I won't have MSI's crapware anymore ...

Also, if you could suggest which values should I tune in my BIOS to optimize everything and avoid any issues like this? (or recommended values to optimize my system).

 

I personally feel a completely fresh install is better, but like you said, then you have to reinstall everything, so either way. You shouldn't HAVE to change anything in your BIOS, and I personally don't have anything changed.

 

Well I just started using it (literally last Sunday) so I'd rather start with a new fresh build and see how it goes. If it doesn't work well I'll definitely install a fresh new 1607 build, which I know it does not have any weird stuttering/freezing issue or FPS drops.

As I was looking to solve the stuttering, I turned off a few options in my BIOS, like C3 state and other power saving options that could be disrupting the system and interfering with the interrupts (none of this helped a bit). I also disabled the TDC option (after using the key combination to access the advanced features), the one Dragon Centre is supposed to silently turn on (for reference: here is where I found out about this).

 

I had the same issues, the first solved after updating to Windows 10 1803, the second one (Nvidia GPU for chrome browsing) after updating Nvidia driver to 391.
At the moment, no stucking and no strange GPU use with Chrome. The PC is also definitely cooler and quieter.

 

@Phoenix Laptop has arrived. I'm ready to schedule with you when convenient on your end.

 

That's encouraging!! I'll definitely try this during the weekend

I can't wait to have this issue solved. Because other than that, the laptop is gorgeous, amazingly lightweight and powerful at the same time. I get around 120-30FPS on BF1 with everything at ULTRA (except a couple of options), 1920 x 1020 and 144MHz. The screen is also gorgeous, looks fantastic when watching movies, colors are crispy and backlight is minimal -I took the reseller option to handpick a unit from the 20% with less backlight, for a fee. Totally worth it-.

The fans at 100% are pretty loud but that's totally understandable under heavy load and I don't mind. I prefer them to be loud while GPU/CPU are kept at decent temps (also had it repasted by the reseller) rather than being silent and GPU/CPU getting toasted (I use noise cancelling headphones anyway so it doesn't bother me).

On the "not so positive", I will need some time to get used to the steelseries keyboard. The backlight looks great but coming from a Lenovo Thinkpad, the separation among keys is not ideal (they're definitely too close) and I miss the "big L" enter from european layouts, so I end up pressing the useless slash key when I want to press Enter 50% of the times. Also, key distribution is a bit weird: right alt is not next to the space bar, there's the <> key in-between (WHY), home/end/del/supr, pgup/pgdown and volume/brightness key are at odd places... Touchpad is really crap. And the whole laptop feels a bit cranky due to the "kind of metallic" material MSI used, although I understand this makes the laptop be less heavier than if they had used metal or another hard material. So again, a good trade. It doesn't look bad at all.

Anyway, highs outweight the lows in my opinion. Hope I can fix the issue and enjoy it at full!

 

Sometimes Nvidia still powers up when opening File Explorer, but no more causes the whole system lagging.
Curiously, this doesn't happen if you use an external monitor.

 

hi guys, i just got my GS65... i have done undervolt of -160 for cpu and -110 for cache with Multiplier of 39x/38x/37x to try and keep the temperature down.

however when i game on Destiny 2 for about 45mins, i checked the temperature and the CPU is at 192F and GPU is at 183F

should i be worried about it? or is Destiny 2 really demanding and that is normal? I have my Destiny 2 graphics settings maxed out.

Edit: wrong CPU temperature

 

Are you sure the fans are at 100% when this happens?

(also BTW how did you do the undervolt?)