*** The Official 2019 MSI GS65 Stealth with RTX GPUs Owners and Discussions Lounge ***

Awesome, I'll try out and post my firestrike (before and after) tomorrow.
Thanks and gracias from Ecuador

Its a shame you still hit power limit, with these temps we could probably go 100W easily before temp limit.

Would you agree that, as it stands, the performance on this laptop is mainly gpu (bios) bound?

 

It's completely dependent on program. For instance I loaded up EQ2 and max settings and I get 45-60 FPS in a guild hall and the game is ancient. Game is more reliant on CPU.

Warframe I get 144 FPS easy on max setting. I limit to 120 to avoid the occasional dips. And this game looks 1000x better than EQ2.

Just depends on the program.

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Yeah, you are right, just like WoW used to do a few years back (and maybe still does but I'm "off the wagon" on mmorpgs)

 

Personally I wouldn't be afraid to flash the full desktop 2060 bios then underclock if it gets too toasty.

 

Now THAT'S A GREAT IDEA... I would hope someone else would try first.

 

Lol there is at least 10 of us who have flashed 2060 and 2080s with the 90W. Some have even been bold enough to flash GPU VBIOS of full fledged 1070 desktop cards.

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I feel that the best gpus for flashing this generation would be the RTX 2070 max q (from 80w to 115w max p) and the gtx 1660ti (from 80w to 120w desktop)

I might try flashing a 150w max p bios to my RTX2080 maxq GS75 when it arrives. And depending on how it affects battery life, keep it or go back to 90w stock.

 

So I've got my BestBuy GS65 8SE RTX2060 model all updated now with 32gb RAM in dual channel (added single 16gb stick of crucial Ram) and Inland Premium 1 TB NVME M.2 SSD, throttlestop with 125mv undervolt, silent fan enabled per Justin-Rey settings, and msi afterburner with a 100+ boost to the core clocks (dragon center uninstalled).

My benchmarks:
Timespy: 5913 (graphics 5921; CPU 5874)
Firestrike: 13593 (graphics 15169; Physics 14536; Combined 7244)
CinebenchR20: 2397 (Single Core 408)

Is this good for this model or should I look to optimize more/something else?

In throttlestop, do most people leave BD prochot checked (I have this checked currently)?

Also, is there a way to enable afterburner to run at system startup but not trigger the graphics card/orange power led?

Thanks,
N123

 

Checked for updates in device manager tonight under the firmware section and my GS65 8SE just installed a new bios version: E16Q4IMS.111. It has a build date from May but I don't see it on MSI's website.

 

With a decent undervolt and GPU oc, you should be in the mid 14,xxx's/6,500ish. Looking at your physics and cinebench scores, it appears that your CPU is still throttling quite a bit. Without knowing your ambient or package temperatures it's hard to give detailed advice. You should be able to push the undervolt farther though. Try -0.150 to -0.165. You could do some other things in Windows settings as well. A physics score over 16,000 should be easily attainable with the 8750h.

BD Prochot tldr: if your undervolt works well and overall system stays within its thermal limits, having it in or off shouldn't matter.

What it does is to throttle the CPU if say, the GPU gets too hot, which cools down the whole system. Turning it off tells the CPU to ignore outside signals and only thermal throttle based on CPU temps.

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I tried the Lenovo Y740 with 2070mq for a few weeks. Flashing to the 110W vbios showed no increase in performance over the original 90W version. Performance actually decreased due to thermal limitations. The MSI stuff may provide better results.

The 2060 notebook GPU cannot be flashed to the desktop vbios in my experience. I went through every vbios TPU has and none worked on my GS65. They are different in some non-trivial way. Odds are the 1660 will be the same.

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Hola chino, any news for the bench with the 90w BIOS?Im interested in the same bios flash (2060 80w to 90w)

 

It's not just the GPU vbios but the laptop's VRM holding performance back. nVidia sets the design specs for desktop/mobile/maxq, the laptop power delivery is designed around those specs. Open hardware monitor and tell afterburner to display GPU power and voltage limits. You will see in HWmonitor that 80/90w vbios' don't stop exactly at those numbers but, will max out slightly above. My original 80w 2060 maxed out at ~85 watts and I've seen my flashed 90W vbios hit 99.985W. In game, not only will you hit the power limit, you'll occasionally see voltage limit as well.


Laptops with MXM cards similarly are limited by the pcie slot itself, which is only rated for 80 watts. Any more than that requires an additional power connection coming from the board.


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Fire Strike with 80w bios




Fire Strike with 90w bios



Better late than never.

I'm still hitting power limit while gaming but my clocks do get higher and performance is better.
Temps are about the same, there is a lot of headroom still.

 

Precise.
As you say, while gaming I do get an occasional and very short lived voltage limit which quickly turns into a stable power limit.
Temps never go above 70c.

 

Yeah that's the sad bit, so much potential headroom, temps are amazing for me even on stock paste and 90w.

I assume display port will not work.

By the way guys USB-C/TB3 still outputs display on 90w BIOS. I have been using a USB C to HDMI adapter from my Nintendo switch to get an extra port and make plugging/unplugging faster/easier for when I am mobile.

It a USB C male to HDMI/USB A/USB-C Female. I plug in the monitor and small 5v desk fan into the adapter .



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Minor improvement for a cost.
What about the temp changes?
More power = More heat.

 

I just bought model rtx 2060 with $930. I think if we enable Intel (R) Speed Shift Technology in the BIOS then don't need to set CPU Flex Ratio Settings to 8.

 

Wow that’s already my deal of the year, is that for real $930, or is that typo?

 

So I got my undervolt to 140.6 and I further overclocked my GPU to +175core and +1077mem: this brings my total timespy score to 6091 and total firestrike score to 14057. That being said, my cinebenchR20 is stuck at 2458 and my firestrike physics score 14879--when I check in throttle stop, the main issue with my CPU performance does appear to be temperature throttling on multi-thread workloads and not power-limit throttling--my CPU hits 90 degrees pretty quickly in this instance and throttles down to 3200-3400MHz-- what are the "other windows settings" you mentioned that can be helpful in this instance?

(for what it's worth, when I run cinebenchR20 single thread workload or the parts of firestrike/timespy that are not CPU intensive, I get clockspeeds in the mid high 3900MHz range and my temps are great in the 70's and sometimes 80's) . . . the main issue is the tasks that really peg the CPU....

Thanks,
N123

 

You can toggle BD prochot to disable thermal throttling but do keep an eye on temps so that you don't damage anything

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...trol-of-the-i7-8750h-advanced-version.823065/


Follow the above guide. You should also go through and remove bloatware, set the power slider to performance, close/disable every non-essential program, and go through the nvidia settings to set everything to maximize performance over visual quality. Setting Speed Shift epp value to 0 for benchmarks will keep the CPU at 3.9, which should help. Your graphics score is decent for the 80W vbios.

If your physics score is still below 16,000, dig through these forums for posts referring to Falkentyne's AC/DC load line tweaks. You can also repaste if you're capable. I personally like Kryonaut and GC Extreme. LM Conductonaut is great but can be a pain in the ass to work with and will 100% soak into the bare copper heatsink over time.

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Thanks for all the helpful input everyone. I've uninstalled dragon center and using fresh windows 10 install with silent option/afterburner/etc for the same reasons as many others in this forum.

I've noticed that my fans max out at 6000rpm using the same silent option fan curves as JRey. Is there a way to get the higher "cooler boost" fan speeds without dragon center? I think this might help out my CPU temps as well...

Thanks,
N123

 

6000rpm is pretty much the max, it would help more if you do undervolt and apply Conductonaut.

 

You could install Intel XTU for a simple 1 setting adjustment of -100mV for CPU voltage offset or undervolt, which at 100% load should drop the temp 10c, which if you are thermal throttling will drop the temp below the thermal throttling point. That may allow for lower fan speeds as well.

You may be able to get more than -100mV, some see up to -150mV, but some CPU's only tolerate -20mV to -90mV range as well, so each CPU is different. Starting at -100mV is a good first setting, if you are stable you can try for more, otherwise drop it down to -80mV and test again.

Note that even after 100% load testing for tuning the undervolt, there is another stability point to test, the Idle - lowest voltage. If you kill off all background processes and let it sit for 20-30 minutes without mouse / trackpad / keyboard input - maybe even disconnect the network / wifi, and it is stable then you are done. If it crashes at idle backoff +10mV on your setting and test again.

For a full 10c decrease in 100% load temps is worth it, as repasting often gains less of temperature drop. Once you aren't thermal throttling you can avoid repasting as well.

ThrottleStop is another tool like XTU that let's you adjust the BIOS / CPU firmware unlocked tunable settings, but does more and is a bit more complex. TS is a good tool, but if all you want to do is undervolt, XTU is enough.

Also if you have voltage offset settings in the BIOS, once you find a good undervolt setting with XTU or TS you can move that setting to the BIOS and use it without XTU or TS loaded. BIOS undervolt is good for long term use, and non-Window's OS's.

Have fun

 

Hi guys, I'm curious as to which tweak/overclock resulted in the largest performance boost in your system?

How big or small was said improvement?

 

I only did the undervolting on the GPU. My score for 2060 firestrike graphics went from I think 14.5K to 16K.
Similarly, undervolting for cpu to -150mV got my cinebench R15 to 1220 from 1060.

 

On power limited results, when undervolting it will increase the headroom available before hitting those power limits. Wasteful high stock voltage not only burns more power, heating the CPU / GPU, higher stock CPU/GPU voltage wastes performance potential.

A -100mV undervolt will, besides dropping the 100% load temp by about -10c, will often see a performance gain, and lower fan speeds.

 

That much? I did an undervolt stock and it only went down by about 4-5°c.

Maybe because its because I'm testing with maxed fans?

I applied liquid metal later and got a drop from 92 to just 76 (Prime95+Heaven 4.0). Ive also disabled the msi overvolt in bios and removed the cpu power limit (imon slope trick) but have yet to test out the temps on that.

 

And for 2080 Max-Q sku owners. What clockspeed range do you guys get stock and overclocked?

I'm getting 1450-1525 after a 140mhz overclock in metro exodus with Ray tracing enabled (RT on seems to reduce clockspeed, maybe due to additional power draw)

 

YMMV, depends on the application, I use prime95 with AVX/FM functions disabled, which heats things up nicely, and I usually see a 10c temperature reduction. With the higher and higher core counts this may vary, too soon to tell. And, I use Max Fans when testing on prime95, and I use Max Fan's on all benchmarking for numbers runs.

undervolting has little effect at idle with increasing effect the higher the load, and at 100% load all 4 cores (6, 8?) reliably I see a 10c drop in temp with the usual effect being no more thermal throttling and a slight increase in performance - negating the need for re-pasting.

I'm using full frame laptops with typically more than adequate cooling, but on thin and light laptops with under performing cooling systems it's possible the temperature drop will be less than 10c, thanks for the report.

Re-pasting with enthusiast pastes usually starts the self-feeding cycle of re-pasting to get even better results with better and better (theoretically) pastes ending up in using an electrically conductive liquid metal paste that tends to ruin a good percentage of laptops.

The patience and technique and attention to detail required to not get a liquid metal spill long term means that eventually everyone gets stung, shorting out or corroding critical components, ruining a laptop.

The promise of additional temperature reduction using liquid metal has the same kind of attraction as the mythical "sea sirens" calling sailors to their doom crashing onto the rocks just under the water close to shore. With similar results.

The OEM pastes used in laptops are usually formulated for long term viability and stability, meant to allow for long term use without needing a re-paste rather than providing the lowest temperatures. This is a good trade-off for 99% of owners.

undervolting -100mV or better takes 99% of the laptops I've used to under thermal throttling - if they were even thermal throttling in the first place - so I don't bother re-pasting any longer.

 

Whoo, lengthy post. I'll try to address everything. Numbers indicate the paragraph I'm addressing.

1. Yup, I also use the version of Prime 95 without avx (26.6) and in my case I only saw a more modest drop of about 5°c. Possibly because the GS75 also has a cpu TDP limit of 45w.

2. Well, better battery life with undervolting on idle is a nice bonus to me even if the temps dont go down. Its cool enough at idle anyways. I'll talk more about repasting later.

3. I haven't tried LM on larger laptops yet, mainly because a normal repaste will do fine. Ive only used liquid metal 3 times. 1st on a 4790k delid for overclocking , 2nd on a 2015 macbook pro (that thing still hits 99°c :/ ), and now on my GS75 because, well, best paste for my best laptop

4. Being a tinkered I do love squeezing the best out of a machine. Paste wise I use only two now, cooler master mastergel maker (near the best but a lot cheaper, at least locally) and conductonaut (only good choice). I'm not sure how many people have had their laptops ruined with the LM application but the way I do it seems to have held up fine. My macbook pro still works (yes, it's now replaced by the GS75) and it was my daily driver for 3 years. No spills.

5. I made sure I knew everything there was to know about the LM repaste, accepted the risk and did it myself. I do acknowledge that not everyone will be the same though.

6. I wouldn't liken it to a myth, the benefits are there but I'd say its more similar to stock trading. Do it right and you'll earn big, but many don't and end up losing money.

7. I've heard of that before but in my experience opening and replacing the paste (for fun ) on laptops, the noctua paste I used to use performed as well as factory pastes. Not sure about the mastergel maker yet.

8. Yes, this is true for most laptop I've used before, exceptions being the macbook pro and a lenovo y410p. Both due to poor thermal design.

And now on my GS75, I've used foam dams (like how HIDEvolution does it) as a failsafe so it's more protected than the macbook pro.

 

Would a non-CNVi wifi card work on the GS65? I want to upgrade the wifi card to the one that supports wifi6 (the intel ax200 or ax201 cards). The equivalent killer card available in Amazon is only the non-CNVi card (the AX1650x) while the one supporting CNVi (AX1650i) is not available. I know that a CNVi card won't work on a system that does not support it, but would a non-CNVi card work properly on a system that supports CNVi?

 

Could you provide links to foam dam please? Or did you dumpster dive and search storage bins and scavenge packaging material like I did (kidding, sorta )

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I bought and used the new killer ax1650 module and works fine on my GS65 8SE.

There is a forum thread on this topic in the networking subforums.


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Ok great! I think I just found the thread that you mentioned. There was someone there who tried to use the ax1650 on GS75 and it did not work, but at least you confirmed that it would work with the GS65 8SE. I guess I'll try to order it also.

 

I just went to a hardware store and got the softest sponge I could find. Which happened to be a dollar pack of 4 sponges. XD

 

I forgot where I read this but I remember reading that the AX WiFi cards were incompatible with the Wifi slots.

 

Hey Guys, i tried to search the forum but i cannot seem to find it. Im looking for the higher wattage 2070 Max Q bios and preferably a guide to upgrade it i'm seeing lots of people do it with 2060 and 2080. But anyone who can help me with 2070?

 

You can use Jrey's guide on this thread or Hackness' guide on the 2018 gs65 thread.

As for VBIOS you can search techpowerup VBIOS database for 2070 mobile or max Q.

Make a back up of your VBIOS, attempt to match file size and then just compare default clock and memory frequencies.

This is really superficial info I am providing. There is a more detailed explanation on the guides.

https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/207833/razer-rtx2070mobile-8192-181218 - Official VBIOS, you can find more unofficial ones that should work just as well.




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thanks! that explains why no one did it when i go to techpowerup, there is only one bios, and thats a Razer one.. Cannot imagine that that one has more wattage going through it

 

The newer razer blade 17 Pro has an even higher tdp vbios of 100w for the 2070 and 2080 Max-q.

 

On GPU BRAND select UNVERIFIED , then sort by memory type GDDR6.

Then use the filter CARD MODEL to choose card.


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Thanks guys found multiple now how would i konw which of these has a higher tdp? i tried searching for the version numbers but no info to be found... in details it also doesn't tell anything about that....

Also I still cannot find the post by Jrey or Hackness on these forums, i tried the search and went through half of both those topics, but that 100's of pages. anyone could link it?

 

Check the core, should be 1110, but I think this is the wrong approach because the Razer blades show up as 80W but pull 90W.

Will try and flash one of those this weekend and report back.

FLASHING THE STRIX II VBIOS WILL DISABLE YOUR MINI DP!

Search "WARNING" in the 2018 thread and you will see Hackness' post

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...trol-of-the-i7-8750h-advanced-version.823065/

Here

 

Thanks! i found it

That guide is only for the gpu if im not mistaken! but xLima helped me out i will go through bios mod during the weekend just have to figure out what exactly i want from my battery mode... SOOO Many variables... .

 

I updated my post to put in the quote

 

Thank you @hackness I figured it out.
STOCK BIOS MSI GS65 8SE - Check out TARGET (mw)

Acer Triton 500, Asus Strix II, RB 15 Adv, RB Pro 17


RB Pro 17 - CHECK OUT TARGET AND LIMIT



ASUS STRIX II - CHECK OUT TARGET AND LIMIT
This is the only one that shows up as 1110 Core on GPU Z because target is 90W off the bat versus all other ones have Target 80, limit 90 (Excepcion MSI and Acer)



I apologise @Joikansai , you were right all along!