*** MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5)/EVOC 16L-G-1080 15.6" Owner's Lounge ***

Yes, that is what I expected too, higher base/boost would naturally shave off the top end of the undervolt range a bit

But, I was going to let him find the max stable first before I told him

 

Firestrike with -150mv undervolt / no gpu overclock.

 

It seems that Eurocom is offering extra thermal pads on their Tornado F5 options. Anyone has an idea how good those are? Dunno how expensive that $35 CAD is though compared to other thermal pads

 

That's a great Fire Strike Physics score! 14,154 !!

 

200/400 Gpu overclock (51th place for notebook with a GTX 1070)
I'ma try to push it a little more. I can say it already this notebook is a BEAST.




Edit : 250/300 Overclock (40th place for notebook with a GTX 1070)


Edit : 257/500 Overclock (21th place for notebook with GTX 1070)
Look like everyone above me got their CPU pushed to 4.7 - 4.8, i'm not sure how to overclock with Throttlestop ...

 

Can i change my Turbo boost to 4.8 using Throttlestop without adding any voltage, if so can anyone help me figure out how to do it?

 

Set the multiple to 48 on the FIVR page where you undervolted and checkmark "Overclock" above the multipliers.. Then set your multiplier on the main page to 48... Would be surprised if you could run 4.8ghz without extra voltage though!

 

Can you show me via Teamviewer or something? Cause either something is not right in my program or i'm doing it wrong (Probably both )

 

Sure, i'll PM you.

 

Was playing with @Rocktaze 's machine and it seems the BIOS Eurocom is using somehow is preventing the unlocked feature of the CPU.. Really odd.. his multipliers are locked to stock clocks only.. We could only go down on multipliers, not up.. with XTU and ThrottleStop. The Overclock checkbox is completely grayed out in Throttlestop.. the BIOS doesn't think it's a K SKU proc :/

However, that 7700k is FAST stock.. it's quicker than my 6700k at stock clocks and seems to run a bit cooler even over my de-lid..

 

That's bad... hopefully it's just a BIOS bug. What's the point of having a "K" CPU and Z170 board if it's locked. @Eurocom Support

 

I'm not sure and wasn't even sure that you could even lock a K processor but I guess it's something up with the BIOS .. I'm not sure how Eurocom didn't even test the multipliers... and hoping it's not by design!

 

As Diversion said, we tried Overclocking the i7-7700k and it's definitely locked in some kind of way (Probably the BIOS)
@Eurocom Support , what's going on with this? Is it intentional? Is there a Bios update coming for this?


Just got my best Firestrike score, can't go any higher without overclocking the CPU. It's really impressive score and this Laptop is a beast, i'm kinda pissed off by the Locked 7700k though, hopefully Eurocom got a fix for that coming soon. (Gpu @ 265/500 OC and CPU @ -150mv undervolt)

 

So upon booting up my laptop, I was greeted with this Nvidia error message.... first time I ever saw this. Anyone know what this could mean? @keftih Memtest ran fine by the way..

I was contacted by @eurocomsupport by email earlier today... I responded when I could despite the 5 hour difference which would have been noon their time. I just wish things could move much much faster considering how long this has been going on =/

 

If the 7700K is indeed locked, I'm going to send the computer right back.

 

So do i, i'll take the 6700k and just overclock it. I won't pay 100$ more for something that's giving me no real benefits.

 

For those wondering about the Bios.

 

Yes, that's a tremendous price for someone who doesn't need hyper-threading. I wonder if they will be dropping the skylake prices anytime soon.

 

You might need to wait for throttlestop and xtu to update their support for the new Kaby lake platform


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

My thoughts exactly.

Also that price for the 7600K/1070 build is freaking unreal if you have a student discount. I removed the HD, and did the 10% discount for an out the door total of $1318.00 Such an unreal deal. The i5 in most games is still very potent and would also run a tad cooler. Of course if you've got the cash or play those CPU intensive titles or do productivity work I would opt for the i7 6700K and save the cash.

 

Anyone else notice some ball bearing grinding noise coming form the fans. I think the ball bearing might be dry. Mostly happens when the fans are at idle.

 

Maybe TS, but XTU should already work with Kaby Lake...

I think the best price I had seen for a GTX 1070 notebook was the MSI GT62VR (6700HQ+1070) for $1399, but that had tax and was an in-store only purchase at Microcenter. The fact that you can potentially get a 7600K+1070 for roughly the same price or less (depending on student discount) is absolutely nuts. Heck, you can commonly find GTX 1060 notebooks at this budget. They just need to fix the BIOS issue that is limiting overclocking!

 

i got my my eurocom in my sig for less thn 1450$ (doesnt include extra 8gb ram) and that including ship + tax so yea tht msgt62vr i isnt really cheapest!

 

And I just switched from the MSI GT62VR and i can tell you guys the performance difference is night and day.

I used to play H1Z1 on high setting and my fps would fluctuate from 130 to 50 fps.
I just tested it and I get on ultra setting 140-120 fps.

6700HQ is a bad performance CPU

 

You have an invoice to prove that ? Seems a VERY low price. Sounds like 20% off.

 

I've seen these sort of issues, almost every laptop so far:



I mean seriously... there is a piece of plastic there.

I have to replace thermal pads sometimes... because look at this (same laptop, for my next customer)





The thermal pads were placed like a jerk and caught in the screws/mounts :
And here is also why I also keep encouraging proper thermal paste education.

Oh and my favorite for a second time in a row (maybe even third, but never found out what caused the dead motherboard the first times)


nothing like loose screws.

ALSO bent heatsinks FTW !



all of this is just a single unboxing and opening of the backplate/cover and removing the main heatsink to see what is what.

In my customers case, he is lucky, because I will be delidding and applying thermal paste and testing the CPU and videocard thoroughly, if anything is wrong, when I have more then 1 on hand of each so, he gets the best of whats available, as I always do.

So this is why I recommend a closer 3rd party for inspection before getting your laptop. I am more then happy to offer the service, since I'm very close to a distributor, and more then capable of fixing up small errors like these and saving you down time with back and forth RMA's and grief.

Know that for sure, no one lets a laptop go on purpose like this to a customer, but someone where there is a jerk who is not doing his job, and is being given the benifit of doubt and these are passing the INITIAL QA testing and inspection.

BTW, this CPU did 99C at stock speeds, and could barely hold 4.2Ghz. It score roughly 800 points on XTU, which is good for a 3610mq from 4 years ago, but **** for a 7700K Desktop card.

I expect the CPU to be able to hold 4.9Ghz at 1.4v and not reach 90C for it's life when I'm done. If your spending 2,000CAD on a laptop, go the extra mile and get someone like me to fix your system for near next to nothing and get double the stock performance compared to out of the box, or read some guides and ask questions from your peers and do it yourself !~

I'm more then happy to share my knowledge for free, and always have been, as so many of you know, because I've given you dozens of my hours and asked for nothing. except passing the good deeds to the next guy, to keep these laptop dreams alive ~!

edit :

if you see the speckling white stuff on the connectors, they were dirty. I think it's really old dried thermal paste or some type of solvent.

Now the issue is, is it dirty inside ? AVOID these sort of mistakes, and get these things checked by someone you KNOW will actually do the testing and checking of these things, don;t just take thier word for it, ask them to show you.

 

and here is an AFTER photo, from being cleaned up abit, CPU already delid and ready to go, heatsink small polish to help termals and thermal pads affixed properly (well close, i will make them perfect...perfectionist here after all )



And after pasting, quick test shows all cores balanced thermally and 25C cooler



The videocard now runs 20C cooler too. Just keep in mind these are stock settings, nothing optimised, but before it was way out of whack. The thermal paste job before hand was a nightmare. I mean - 25C of a difference !!!

 

This temporary Kabylake BIOS was already announced pre-preemptively by @Eurocom Support a few weeks ago, they are working on updates through the early release of the Kabylake versions with limitations that will be removed as they get the features into the new BIOS.

I'll see if I can find his post(s), and maybe he can answer here and give an update.

 

Hmmm, maybe @Eurocom Support can clarify this:

 

Post it here http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/bga-vs-pga-continuation.775786/page-17#post-10426042

Edit. Can you run CINEBENCH_R11.5 and post the results. Compare with this results http://www.eurocom.com/ec/benchmark(162)ec

 

Guy's the bios is not yet perfect, this is why your also paying 1500-2000$ for a 3,000-3,500$ laptop.

It will be perfect, just give it time, right now, not only are the cards and CPU's in side soo new that everyone getting one is an early adopter, but it takes real man power hours to fix a bios and add support, they are balancing between adding controls for the new LCD's like brightness and 3200MhzRAM speeds and higher performance on the Kabylake CPU's...

it's just all a work in progress, it's not gonna take long either, The laptops will come with a bios that by default clocks the CPU's to a great workable/playable value. So long as thermals are not an issue you should get like 4.5ghz on all 4's.

I've posted completely non-special stock benchmarks through 3DMark11 in this thread already, to show you out of the box experience (once, thermals are taken care of).

These are with stock drivers and nothing running, no overclock, etc.. and games run fantastic !


on another topic, since it's been mentioned here AND the prevalent thermal issues as these arrive stock from depots..

I want to talk about liquid thermal pasting. For those of you that are new, there are some things help videos do not cover, let me quickly address this stuff I see missing.

The paste itself, is easy to work into the surface, it should feel semi scratchy, just sort of scratch it in with the Q-tip and it will stick. Now, if you look in all the video's they always show doing this to botht eh heatsink and the Die's surface, this is because if it's not scratched in or worked into the surface already, it sort of acts like oil on a slick clean surface, it just doesn't stick and can drip and drop or move around when it gets hot and cause a shortage.

Now, speaking of shortages, like all thermal pastes, less is more. by this I mean, since someone recommended doing liquid themral pasting yourself in this thread, i don;t want you guys making this major mistake.

in youtube video's they show the surfaces have so much liquid thermal paste that it becomes a clear pool or silvery reflective paste.... both the heatsinks and the Die... this is bad.

The two surfaces will combine and then have EXCESSIVE liquid paste. It will drip and short out your videocard or cpu. I've seen dozens of returns, this sort of burn out it NOT covered by ANY warranty service. This is the same as physical damage. So be VERY careful. use enough that you can scratch it into the surface, but if you were to try the Q-tip on another surface - it has none left to cover it. That's how you know your running thin enough. If you can recycle any amount of the paste and cover another surface, then you still have too much, remember when the two surfaces make contact - whatever microscopic amount is excess, will just be a slippery liquid inbetween to pressing plates of pressure at higher temperatures.

It's like inviting disaster. So be careful. It would be irresponsible of me to show pictures of this stuff without warning you guys. Knowledge and experience and patience is key when using this stuff. It's also poisonous most of the time, so handle it with care. Getting this stuff ingested is asking to have Alzheimer's in a few decades...

 

@woodzstack - thanks for pointing out in detail the dangers of applying and using Liquid Metal.

I fear that there will be a percentage of newbie's that will try to use LM, and get stung by the "silvery droplets of doom", losing their brand new laptop to a short.

It's not worth the few degree's of improvement as a trade-off for the danger to your laptop and your health.

 

1

What? Will 4.5GHz on all 4 cores be the max with a new Bios? Will firmware lock further overclocking with TS/XTU?

 

I absolutely agree, but if someone is bent on getting it done, then I insist I do it myself, and do it with the minimalist way I do it, because there is no way in hell it's dripping. Even so I don't take chances and still leave tape on the CPU or around the GPU. Can never be too careful, better safe then sorry.

Just a week or two ago, a guy sold a X9 or X9E2 to someone on NBR, and it had 2x 980M in it, both with G-Sync and burnt out. There was physical evidence of the Liquid thermal paste all over the card. You can't just wipe this stuff off. It chemically reacts with silicon and almost everything. putting this under a scope will reveal it 100%.

(The molecules in this are sooo small, the human eye can;t see the residue it leaves behind, but a scope can )

 

Actually yes, the Kaby lake bios ATM locks in a 4.5Ghz Turbo , and 4.2Ghz non-Turbo. however - just installing XTU, (even though none of the controls allow you to change any of the settings currently) will automatically make the cores run at 4.5Ghz when you game.

The intended function is to unlock the power lock that is currently on this bios AND unlock the multipliers too. The menu's will be a stock locked in bios though, can always ask SVET for an unlock with a small donation. I have tried to make contact with Prema for years, but he doesn't want to do business with me or Eurocom it seems, or something. (though he still helps people contacting him, I think, he never gave me permission to send anyone his way though, so don't go to Prema saying I sent you, your on your own there if you do.)

Anyways, i'm relatively sure the bios is not something to be concerned about on this laptop. I've a good working Skylake bios and what it can do, it was still new, and had a medium upper limit power cap that I was not too happy about, but performance was still great. I also know it can be modified and removed, so it's only a matter of time really.

I wouldn't be surprised if this laptop goes up in price 500$ or more once they have it. It would still be worth it. Think of it as this, your not buying a new laptop s much as investing into a laptop that in the future will have all the features you wish, and be getting it at a premium price, as an early adopter, not unlike supporting your favorite project on Kickstarter.

So, on that note, we all basically have Eurocom to thank for having the opportunity to buy these, really. (they are the distributor to all the other vendors with them, after all - am I alright/allowed to be saying that sort of thing? If not let me know... just a common truth many do not know/realise.)

 

If 4.5GHz all 4 cores is the max with an unlocked 7700K.. Is this a BIG NO from me. You shouldnt need a unlocked firmware to reach over a wimpy 4.5GHz overclock. Almost stock speed Only the thermal should be the limit for your overclock. Or Intel's maximum allowed voltage for the chips.

 

Yup, that brush if used poorly can flick little droplets everywhere. That's why I recommend applying it off the laptop (MXM / LGA), and use a cut away shroud for protection for the BGA applications where you can't avoid spraying droplets onto the motherboard and internal components.

Flicking little silvery droplets of doom...**Shudders** ...even worse, breathing those fine droplets into the lungs.

 

actually even the syringes can get bubbles in them and just POP a droplet out of no where. Really annoying.

 

Right, but the bios is just not ready yet, so that's pretty much all it does. Works better for Skylake mind you, but even then it's not perfect yet. Give it time, it is in Eurocom's best interest to fix it, so you can bet money on it that they will.

 

since my brother in the US did the purchase i dont have invoice but i have these;

Currency: $ USD
Original Price: $1,603
Tornado F5 *** BLACK FRIDAY SPECIAL *** Nov 24 and 25, 2016 [ 10% off ]: -$160
Price: $1,443
Shipping: Continental USA: FEDEX Ground; 1-5 days $27
Quantity: 1
Sub Total: $1,470
Tax: USA all states - shipping from NY, USA [0%] $0
Total: $1,470

Payment
Method: Bank Transfer

i was given another 5% discount since i did wire transfer.
quoting email from Garry :

"Shipping to the US is $27. Add this to the $1362.55"

Garry

i attached the original wire receipt.

 

Hi I am new MS16L1 type users,

Several day ago I purchased MS16L11 which is the older version of 16L13. I tried 7700K and it cannot boot up.
The reason is clearly BIOS.

Since Eurocom are going to release new compatible BIOS for Kabylake processor, Is it possible to use 16L13 Bios on 16L11 type?

 

I can assure you that this price can be true. I paid $1320 with shipping for my but I got the i7 6700, no ram, no HD and the realtek (crappy) wifi card. I also got a 10% student discount.

I already had the ram and HD. I paid with a debit card with my order.

 

Thank you for the valuable information!

I don't know if the Tornado F5 is really worth $3000-3500, but the potential to buy it for ~$1350 does seem quite low.

The Kaby Lake i7's do have great performance out-of-the-box, so the problem isn't that... The complaint is that this laptop is equipped with "K" series CPUs and a Z170 motherboard, yet has locked multipliers. Until they patch the BIOS, it is a bit misleading that customers expect to be able to overclock their Kaby Lake CPUs, while in reality they cannot right now.

Liquid metal does sound quite dangerous, and the majority of Youtube guides are so casually applying it without regards to safety. I plan to apply liquid metal only between the CPU die and IHS, but will use IC diamond between the IHS and heaksink. I think this is a safer option for a newbie like me

 

I completely disagree. No one can justify to me selling a product with premium hardware (with a premium price increase) that is locked down. That is the reason why I sent back my initial Sager P870DM3, gimped locked bios. I will say in Sager's/XoticPC's defense, I could adjust the multipliers and was able to hit 4.8+ on the 6700K.

If the bios aren't ready and they aren't allowing advertised functionality, then in the words of my brothers, Mr. Fox/Papusan, it is nothing more than a BGA turdbook. Actually, it is probably worse, because even BGA notebooks like the MSI GT73VR allows overclocking with extreme temps to match.

I reserve judgement until I get mine and I test it. I still don't think Eurocom should be selling it if I have to wait for functionality I paid for now.

 

"Attempted to read or write protected memory. This is often an indication that other memory is corrupt."

You can rarely get this message if your driver is corrupt. As for what corrupted your driver... can you run a malware scan just in case? Use Malwarebytes -> Scan -> Custom Scan -> Configure Scan (select your local drives) -> Scan Now

 

I just received this from Eurocom Support this morning.


7700K CPU is 1day old / officially announced by Intel yesterday so it will take a little bit of time to do fine tuning. So please enjoy Tornado F5 for now as is and check with us in about 2 weeks. We need to make sure that system is stable when O/C so we implemented locks in our BIOS to make sure that there is no potential damage caused by O/C.

Next week mr.fox will be conducting O/C tune and then we will tune up our BIOS accordingly.


Gogogo @Mr. Fox !!!

 

Awesome, thanks.

 

LOL, okay....

 

CPU-Z Benchmark compared to 6700k

 

WTF, out of the blue the laptop just went from Rocket speed to turtle speed.
What the heck is wrong with my memory, i literally got no program expect for Throttlestop & ShareX open.