*** Official Clevo P960EP6/ P960ED/ P960EF/ P960EN Owner's Lounge ***

I have been looking into bios tweaks and what not as well, and I have to agree that it really doesn't seem worth it given the risk.
I also went through the exercise of flashing the 2080MQ 90W vbios with nvflash and will not recommend this either. It didn't brick the card, but the voltage \ frequency controls didn't carry over properly so the GPU was locked at 930 MHz or something like that.
Best results I have gotten are with Throttlestop & Afterburner. If you modify the .ini file in Afterburner you can move the 'curve' graph back so you can see the ~500mV starting range of the MQ cards and treat it sort of like an undervolt.

 

This XOTIC G68 EAGLE looked pretty interesting with Prema BIOS option to set things up safely.

Prema BIOS (control over voltages, clock speeds, and more) $50.00

Is there any other way to add Prema later? BTW all it also seems Nvidia now offers Metro Exodus, Anthem and Battlefield V for new RTX purchases!

 

I suspect it's not actually Prema and just an unlocked BIOS. There isn't a Prema for the P960, and all the resellers are telling me that Prema is only doing them for the desktop CPU Clevos. Either way, it's still worth the $50 just get an unlocked BIOS imo. I'd gladly pay for it if it'd work on the Vanilla Sagers.

 

Well if you bought the G68 Eagle, or G67 Hawk without the Prema option then what custom bios does it come with? Xotic also sells the vanilla P960EN/EF and those options match other resellers. It's a mystery what the bios differences are.

 

If you bought it without I think they'd let you upgrade afterwards, since it's usually done remotely after delivery anyway. I assume it's just the usual stockish BIOS with their own boot logo like most other resellers who rebrand do, and then an unlocked version for the $50. This is all obviously speculation on my part given the information available. Perhaps they struck some exclusive deal with Prema for their branded P960s or something, but I've not seen or heard anything about that.

 

For everyone who can't decide whether to go with 2060 or 2070 max-q version - here is the test that tests both on same exact model:
https://gamerdad.ca/reviews/rtx-2060-vs-rtx-2070-max-q/
This is not Clevo but same results should be valid for Clevo models.

 

Aftershock provides drivers on their support website, but they are a little delayed. Last I checked, the Slate15/P960Ex drivers were not available on their website yet. Clevo has them posted on their site though.

 

Maybe @Support.1@XOTIC PC, @Support.2@XOTIC PC or @Support.3@XOTIC PC can shed some light on this?

 

There is another model out P950EF with a 15.6” display to save $150 off the P960 series price. $1529 vs $1679 pretty interesting. Is that an older chassis too?

 

Xotic are not the kind of shop to use Prema's name without cause.

 

I don't know if this review has been already posted here
Review: PC Specialist 16.1" Defiance V RTX
https://hexus.net/tech/reviews/laptop/127568-pc-specialist-161-defiance-v-rtx/

 

Anyone know where I can get this laptop in the UK with the per key RGB option?

 

The link above is the major distributor in the UK.

 

But theres no per key rgb option and Ive already contacted them about it (which they said they wont) so Im looking for other options. So could I import the keyboard somewhere else separately and just replace the current one?

 

Might be worth looking into importing from one of the US sellers that ships overseas. Might not cost much more with the exchange rate.

 

Usually the interface is different but maybe.

 

I'm assuming your referring to the keyboard connection, in response to him swapping a per-key one in?

Have you tried Shenker/XMG? I was pretty sure they had the per-key RGB but could be wrong. If you can't find an EU seller with the per-key, then alot of the US sellers offer foreign keyboard layouts, sometimes free of charge, and the Windows localization is easily changed. Worth at least getting some quotes from a few US based companies to see what they say. Will take longer to get to you, but at least you'll get what you want.

 

Yes a more simple controller can just have a few lines going to it where as a rgb per key needs a proper interface.

 

Replacing two Alienware 15 R3s. One is a i7-6700HQ with a 1070. The other has i7-7700HQ with a 1060.

I'm looking at the aluminum build quality for the HIDEvolution EVOC variant of the P960ED. Is this laptop a solid replacement both in quality and performance?

The runner-up is a Razer Blade 15 Base from HIDEvolution.



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If you're just looking to match the performance, but a newer model, the P960 would be a good machine. The Razorblade is far overpriced for it's specs imo. However, if you're looking for an improvement in performance the P960 probably isn't the best. The RTX 2060 model will roughly match your 1070. The 2070 and 2080 versions are Max-Q though, so the 2070MQ will probably be a minor bump for more money. If you want a Clevo, look at the PB51/71. They do have a plastic underbody, but the lid and top of the chassis are aluminum, and they're very solid, also utilize the full 2070, which would give you a good upgrade in performance. If you're specifically going for thin and light though, you'll have a hard time finding something better than 1070/2060/2070MQ performance in a thin chassis. Maybe look into the Aorus 15, probably as thin as you'll get for a reasonable price.

 

Thanks for the response and suggestions. I'm looking at a thin and light replacement for the AW15s around $2000. I'll give the Aorus 15 another look.


Edit: The Aorus 15 is too bulky and heavy for my purposes. I travel often and I want something less than 5 lbs.


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You are going to find a balance of cost/size/performance, it's where is comfortable for you.

 

one more review finally appears in the wild

 

So are you guys getting 7hrs battery life on energy saving settings or a really hot palm rest on the left side when gaming for long periods?

 

There's no way anyone will get 7 hr battery use out of this even when not playing games. The person in this video just assumed that without actual tests.

 

Maybe @GizmoSlip can provide further information or elaborate on the topic at hand.

 

You have to optimize the system. Make sure your Optimus is running properly, brightness low, etc. And only 7 hrs when doing very light work, like word documents. Normal web browsing should be closer to 4 hrs if you have your optimization on point.

 

It looks like the 1TB hdd (2.5” bay) is located under the left wrist rest. I suppose that’s where all the heat is generated. Putting your hand on a 7200rpm would get hot. I guess using an SSD there or sticking with the M.2 would make it cooler in that section.

 

Most SSDs will be much colder yes.

 

Can confirm, I have a 2.5" SSD in my HDD bay, and I can feel a slight warmth at the palm rest but nothing like the heat at the top left of the keyboard which is where the processor is located.

 

It lets drives like that transmit their heat out and stay reasonably cool.

 

I've been looking around again at laptops, no clue if I'm actually going to buy or not but really curious about the P960ED since my P150EM is showing its age hardware wise. I mainly play SWTOR and have taken up WoW so specs haven't mattered but Division was a struggle and Division 2 that much more of one. The idea of a 5 generation newer architecture being able to actually maintain higher load clock speeds than mine plus with 2 more cores is really nice... and of course the better GPU.

From what I'm reading, I'm better off getting the 2060 model over the 2070 Max-Q model. Apparently performance in games on average is the same between the two and I guess temps not all that different either? I browsed a little bit of this thread and watched a few review videos.

From the reviews, I'm definitely interested in undervolting the CPU if that's going to help with thermal throttling and such. The main question I have is is that done via software or is that BIOS level only? And do I need to buy from a certain reseller to do that?

I'm currently looking at XoticPC since that's where I bought my P150EM. I see they have two of the same Clevo chasis. One branded by Sager and one by themselves. The XoticPC one has a Prema BIOS option that specifies some cpu options. Does this mean the Sager model cannot adjust voltage to undervolt? In addition to that, is there any particular reason to go with one over the other? Repairs, etc. I'm looking at pricing options between the two and seeing a $142 difference with similar options (both 2x8GB 2666 RAM, 1 TB 970 EVO/970 EVO Plus, W10 Pro, no HDD, Prema BIOS on the Xotic model).

And I guess something unrelated to the laptop specifically, any reason to go with NVME PCIe over SATA 3? Like in deciding a 970 EVO vs 960 EVO. Between gaming, booting, light video editing (1080p), would I actually see any noticeable difference worth the extra cost?

 

I ended up buying the Sager branded version through XoticPC (I also had a previous laptop from Xotic and I have found them to provide very good and responsive service).

While the 2070 Max-Q is probably better than the 2060 across the board, I'm not convinced that it's $200 better. Unless you demand perfect performance in all current and future games, the same is probably true for you. There are better places to spend the cash. Speaking of which...

I did consider it worthwhile to buy a PCIe SSD over a SATA one. The difference in speeds depends on the task at hand, but users and benchmarkers report a difference in speeds of at least twice as fast for a PCIe connection, and sometimes substantially more than that. On top of that, Xotic was offering a very good price for the Samsung 970 EVO, which is one of the fastest SSDs currently on the market, only a smidge behind the 970 PRO, and with very high endurance to boot. For me the price was worth it, but I use my laptop for heavy workloads in addition to gaming. If you are only concerned with gaming performance, a faster SSD will help your load times, but it won't have a major effect on your FPS. Keep in mind that SSD prices fluctuate frequently.

The Sager BIOS does not enable undervolting (unless I'm missing something, but I don't think I am). You will have to use third party software for it. However, I would much rather use free or cheap undervolting software than pay well over $100 just for the privilege of doing it through the BIOS.

You may even decide that it isn't worth it. This laptop tends to reach power limits before it encounters thermal throttling (especially if you decide to get higher quality thermal paste), and while undervolting could let you push a few extra fps, the difference has been pretty marginal in the cases I've seen. Unlike some other lightweight laptops in the current generation, this Clevo unit is actually equipped with a proper heatsink setup to cool the 8750H. On my own unit, I have yet to see either the CPU or GPU reach the high 80s, with nothing more than IC Diamond on the CPU.

 

There is no logical reason not to undervolt an intel cpu. Zero

Worth clicking .125. Then checking apply? Use throttle stop hit fviv click enable twice hit .125 twice

Then look up how to make it a task on Windows start uo

I dont know what situation its not worth it.
This is just wasted power and performance. There is no case to make save your time writing this paragraph of total nonsense and undervolt your laptop

Just the added battery time will add minutes to your life .


I cant even say enough that paying for paste on the cpu so you can avoid undervolting is out of touch with reality

 

I would say that laziness is a perfectly valid reason not to undervolt an Intel CPU, but I would grant that this is a subjective issue and opinions may vary. Not everyone finds thrill in the pursuit of tiny percentage points of performance adjustments.

Selecting the quality of thermal paste on a CPU is definitely not mutually exclusive with undervolting, and nobody has ever said it was. If such a hypothetical person existed, I would agree that they were out of touch with reality.

 

Yea, not everyone wants to waste time on undervolting especially since it is never guaranteed and your CPU might only tolerate a small voltage decrease which would have no noticeable impact on anything.

 

Exactly, it's so easy, a small app install + setting 1 value, I suggest -100mv to start as that particular value has been enough to reduce 100% CPU all core load by 10c repeatably.

-125mv is also a reasonable starting point, but there are some CPU runs that don't support so much of an undervolt, or even -100mV, so even starting out at -25mV, then -50mV, then -100mV, etc is another reasonable stepping up of undervolt to try.

For many in the out of the box 90c to 100c gaming temperature range, a simple -100mV undervolt can bring that down to 80c to 90c range, which is typically under the thermal throttling point.

Reducing the power used by undervolting can also stop power throttling, another benefit.

Undervolting can also completely avoid re-pasting. If you aren't thermal throttling there's little actual real reason to then go ahead with a re-paste, it's more of a DIY game play than an actual need.

Besides, who wants to hardware hack when software tuning will give you what you need, and then you can get back to gaming, or whatever you got the laptop to use in the first place.

Tuning the fan curve can also be helpful. Start the fan spin up earlier and limit the 100% fan kick-in as late as possible. Makes for quieter operation, which can satisfy roomates, girlfriends, wives - always important to check your effect on others nerves when running loud fan blaring laptops.

Undervolting, voltage tuning for least power use at load and idle, it's not just a good idea, it actually works.

 

The 8th gen cpu undervolt more than ever. Battery life will be huge.

There is no one in thr world who is going to tell you not to undervolt an intel cpu that's like saying don't pick up free money

I mean read about why you undervolt all laptop cpus why they are all overvolted.

Or don't just do it that would waste thr least time it takes less than a minute

It covers the thermal limit and the power limit of the cpu. I dont even understand why you would actually test the temperatures of the cpu before you undervolt that is a bizzarre collosal waste of time. Who cares what the temperatures are before you undervolt except for 1 time. I mean why waste the time taking a test of an ignorant persons laptop cpu score?

At this point notebookcheck etc all undervolt in their tests

 

It has been a real problem with youtube reviews for quite a while.

When they put out reviews complaining about thermal throttling all because they didn't undervolt or tune the fan curve - both simple and basic things every owner should do.

The reviewer is supposed to have more experience than the newbie viewer could set a precedent for good ownership, instead they say they are "reviewing the out of the box experience", which is a buncha lazy BS.

It's been getting better over the last few years, but you still have to point out the fallacy of results from reviews that don't undervolt or tune the fan cureve as part of their review.

 

Yes but real reviewers undervolt like in written magazines. From 6th gen intel cpus on its been years

 

So, if I am interested in a P960ED, and am interested in being able to undervolt to try and get the best performance out of it, who are some of the better companies to purchase from?

I think thermal throttling is the single most annoying thing I've dealt with in my current laptop for years. Nothing more frustrating than my 3840qm that's currently setup in XTU to run all 4 cores at 3.6 GHz through turbo and constantly see it bounce down to 2.8GHz non-turbo then back up but only average 3.3-3.4 GHz.

 

If you are interested in purchasing P960 - I suggest trying out HIDevolution. Their price might be higher than others but they have a good communication, their website looks and functions well and they offer services like selecting display with least amount of backlight bleeding (if this is important to you) or applying Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut LM (for best thermal performance) without affecting the warranty length.

If you just want to get this model for cheapest price and things like these don't matter to you - try GenTechPC. Or Rjtech if you just want to buy barebones without RAM/OS/storage.

 

RJTech just posted a bunch more new RTX 2060 models today. GenTechPc also claims free Conductonaut and Fujipoly thermal pads if that matters to you.

 

Hi All,

I bought the 2060 version of this PC from gentech PC with thermal grizzly krayonaut + fujipoly option. This is my first gaming device so I want a little advice.

When running stress test in Intel extreme tuning utility the temperature touched 100C on one of the core but the core clocks remained at 3.8GHz, is it usual for temps to hit 100C even with Krayonaut + fujipoly? I do plan to under volt and see if it helps.

Also, I haven't updated Bios, do I need to update it? Where will I get the latest bios?

Thanks in Advance

 

Hi everyone,

I got my P960EF with 2070 Max Q a few weeks ago and have been having a few weird issues like stuttering for a few minutes at start up which sometimes leads to crashing and what not. For the most part I've figured out how to avoid this happening and everything is fine.

What I want to know is has anyone been able to update their graphics card driver? I have tried downloading drivers from Nvidia (DCH and standard, neither work) and using Geforce experience as well which simply tells me I have the most up to date driver which I know is not true. Any of you guys experiencing the same thing or is this an isolated issue?

 

Nvidia's drivers may not work with some laptops unless they are modified. You need to find the modified version.
You can try this one:
https://premamod.wordpress.com/2017/08/15/j95-nvidia-inf/

Or just download latest drivers from Clevo's website.

 

In such a harsh test with a small thermal mass compared to desktops (it heats up quickly) that's pretty normal.

 

I have a P960EF and I just updated to 419.67 using Geforce Experience

 

Hmmm weird. I'm not sure why I'm having difficulty then. I've tried heaps of different things that I have read online but none of them have worked. I'm still stuck at 418.81

 

Might be the tight time to uninstall and use DDU to clear it out and start over.