*Prospective* News/Discussion: Alienware M18x R3

That be throttling. I can run at 4.2 though without any, but temps are cooler to at 22*.

 

Yeah, that's the thing, even the 3-piped HS won't hold it at 4.5 24/7. We need another 20W+ which means an extra pipe or bigger pipes and extra fins

 

Akikimox Im just curious overclocking refer to this thread http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m18x/599225-help-overclock-intel-core-i7-2630qm-5.html CPUs that don't have unlocked multiplier so they raised FSB/BLCK to get additional performance, im wonder why not do the same to 2960xm for even higher frequency? 2960x flex to 0, all value to 42-45 then raise 99.80 mhz to something like 105, wouldnt it give way more? or is it simply because of a temeprature issue?

 

It's all temp related. I was able to run at 4.4GHz by simply raising the back with an external cooler. He just wants results from taking the M18x and lying it straight on the desk or floor to see how it would handle it.

To be honest I think everyone would raise the back to allow more airflow from common sense...but what do I know?

Aikimox is also an IT person....so he has a lot more knowledge than I do.

 

Exactly. At this point I want to know max OC using the stock cooling only. It's a laptop after all and even though it's 18.4" some still carry it around to and from work. Which means, you can't have it on a cooler pad 24/7, can't keep disassembled, can't use a freezer, etc. So at stock cooling and normal room temps (20-25c), we are looking at 4-4.2ghz across the board. Not too optimistic but it gives some hope. I think it's time get that custom HS project up and running again...

 

so it does answer my question we are able to raise FSB higher if given enough cooling then. imo a cooler isnt hard to bring with, the 18 inch bag i bought fits a cooling pad with m18x in it. only 3 small fans at 1200 rpm max though, still gives enough air flow imo.

that aside, hoping m18x r3 would be a true beast. best possible heatsink and no heating issues, keyboard flex issues etc. no crossfire/SLI cable burning out issue lol. maybe matte and a larger screen? and a thunderbolt port would be nice.. and all I could do right now is wait =(

 

Keep on dreaming, Bro. Not gonna happen. Nothing from your list is real. M18x already has the best in the world CPU cooling given the budget, and I don't see how Dell will pay 30-40% extra to satisfy 0.5% of the owners. Same with the screen, keyboard and crossfire/SLI cables. KB is the only thing that can theoretically change...

 

All they have to do with the keyboard is to put a metal plate behind it like they did with the M7700 and should take care of it.

 

I still dont get the keyboard flex, maybe cause i use external keyboard most of the time. as for the screen, matte seems possible, although not 18+ inch screen. cooling MAYBE possible due to a jump from two pipes to three pipes from R1 to R2, they may decide to up that baby. As for thunderbolt, just a disappointment if they dont have it and Macs do, it doesnt make sense to go for the best laptop anymore not to have the fastest external port. imo no point of having internal SSD storage if they only have esata 3gbps while external storage only at esata 3gbps as well.

 

Exactly why I hate desktop elitists this already beats the majority of desktops... and can you put a desktop on your lap, in a backpack, on your bed or a plane? .... Nah.

 

dell somehow need to release unlocked bios.. windows 8 is being a pain.

 

A matte screen on an Alienware would be amazing!

 

what's the connection? Will unlocked BIOS ease your pain with W8?

 

lol no, but the extra 250 - 300 dollars will hurt

 

I forgot to mention this. due to new Lynx chipset supporting over FOUR SATA III 6gpbs port, if we were to raid0 four SATA III SSDs together we will probably see some bottlenecking in the hardware Raid inside this laptop. Even expansive raid card can still bottleneck when gets to as much as four drives. although I do not know how good M18x hardware raid is but I could picture it bottleneck when this laptop comes out next year, so if at all possible by all means upgrading built in hardware raid.

 

ROFL, add dual screen m18x? LOL

 

It's been done before.

 

yes that would be awesome, but will cost probably too much, its a solution instead of making m20x =)

 

laptop performance wise, chipset/CPU/Graphics and internal storage all seems just fine with exception of bultin hardware raid maybe it can get better?

as for external/internal USB performance could use some work.


as you can see I put in a SLC 128gb SSD which is at 500mb/s read and write into thermaltake max 5G enclosure as well as mediasonic enclosure, and different speed came out. of course because thermaltake 5G max uses a better USB device host inside its enclosure. here read this article about USB 3.0 and UASP on tomshardware.

Faster USB 3.0 Performance: Examining UASP And Turbo Mode : USB 3.0: Dude, Where's My Speed?

it explains how USB 3 devices and controller/driver used affect A LOT on usb 3.0 performance. even without ASUS's USB turbo boost a good motherboard with ASMedia usb controller and driver as well as a good enclosure (again ASMedia..) can top up USB 3.0 speed to 300+ MB/s. in my picture it shows Thermaltake 5G > mediasonic enclosure which explains why Thermaltake cost more and is a better quality product, but it should have gotten higher than just 230 MB/s speed easily, should have gotten 300 MB/s and the only explanation for that is USB 3.0 driver/host controller device in the M18x isn't on par to that performance.

Renesas Electronics USB 3.0 Controller can only top out at 230MB/s read and 173 MB/s write. Using same enclosure as Tomshardware did and using SSD can really bring out a device's max limit, which same goes for doing 3-4SSD in raid 0 at SATA 6gbps would bottleneck internal raid controller in the m18x.

I hope Dell sees this and make some changes to the next m18x R3.

 

damn changing USB 3.0 controller, add thunderbolt or esata 6gbps means change mobo + mediacard which is right above optical bay, sucks.

 

with usb 3.0 problems bottlenecking with Renesas usb3 controller I tried to tackle from expressport. using ASMedia usb3.0/esata expresscard 6G, if expresscard slot interface is gen 2.0 it will allow 5.0 gbps transfer speed. I tested with a external raid0 enclosure which gives me 240-250 MB/s on the m18x esata port, with this expresscard gives me nearly the same result if used on my desktop but on my m18x it seems to be gen 1.0.. or worse?



testing using esata port on expresscard, looking at the picture HD Tune at QD1 read 64k test gives maximum just under 150MB/s and CDM QD4 sequential results ~150MB/s ish kinda shows bottlenecking in expresscard slot interface. kinda disappointing, with everything on the inside maxed but external transfer speed being so slow, limits me to use esata only since everything else is much slower. again brings back to me saying need thunderbolt, which Mac laptops are already using them, for quite awhile now too.

any reason paying $3-5k dollars not to have the best? slow expresscard slot interface, no thunderbolt, average USB 3.0 controller, and maybe not even esata6G if haswell chipset only provides four 6G port.

 

dual/tri screen alienware =) maybe something looks like this, would be awesome. added to next m18x as an upgrade option. screen not just on the rightside but also leftside.

 

why do you keep repeating yourself? besides, it's a horrible idea. the M18x is bulky and heavy enough as it is, anything more than that and you might as well hire a crane to carry it around

 

Nonsense, I've been carrying my M18x and M17xR1&R2 to and from work on a daily basis for years. It's not that heavy, all you wusses! Hit the gym once in a while, lol. No offense, jk

 

not if you carry it in a briefcase all day long. a backpack is a lot easier to carry, kudos to you and your manly strength

...besides I'm waiting for mine to arrive, my comment was based on posts I've read haha. still, 6kg is not light by any means

 

Yeah, there is a point where you might as well just be carrying around a all in one or even a desktop on a wagon. Whats the cutoff point for some of you, 25 pounds, 5 inches thick, 30 inches across, and 10,000 dollars?!

 

its like saying you dislike certain type of food. some people certainly don't mind the weight. if you dont like carrying it, why get m18x? why not go for clevo, lighter, 17 inch with dual GPU, 3 fans too? its got almost everything m18x has except smaller screen and 1 msata less.

reason for dual/tri screen is you can still make m18x a m18x, keep it 18 inch which screens can be easily modded or upgraded. you ever taken apart your m18x? if you did then you know LCD thing is easy to take apart from the main machine. if two smaller LCD panel can contract/expand from the two sides you still get to keep a smaller size laptop. heavier? definitely but i'd not mind one bit but thats just me, however I already mentioned offer it as an "upgrade" as you may choose original. if this option is available I would not mind paying additional 2grand on top of it, I just can't stand using m18x doing work with Adobe softwares, too many sub windows its hard on the eyes.

 

some good points, but try to imagine this if you were in Dell's place - how many customers would actually dish out 2k for extra monitors? would it be profitable for them to invest in so much R&D only to have a minimum amount of people going for such an option? keep in mind this is a gaming laptop - and in the majority of instances, you don't need multiple monitors to game.

 

Seriously, dual monitors? Be realistic fellas. I didn't expect anyone to take this thread that far, wow. Ever heard of an external monitor and HDMI cable? Pretty cheap too.

Sure, it's possible, but not realistic for Alienware systems at all. Even if they did one day decide to do something crazy like that, it's sure as hell not going to happen for the R3, which is what we are talking about - a system that will come out in about six months, not 6 years.

 

Yeah, a couple years ago Dell actually came out with a 20+ inch laptop that had loads of storage and ram space, and up to TRI SLI graphics. Basically a powerful desktop/workstation on the go. Even had a built in handle. It started at 3,000$ and upgrade options could send it upwards of over 8 grand.

It sold so few they quit selling it within a year and haven't taken a stab at making such a monster laptop since. There just isn't a large enough of a market for one to be profitable for a large company like dell. The only way to make any money off of such machines would be to be a small, made to order manufacturer that caters especially towards people who needs unusual custom laptops. I only know of a couple such companies. And they are redonculously expensive. Because of the exclusiveness and labor, and the fact they don't get massive bulk deals on parts like large manufacturers do.

 

yes i understand in the end Dell will have to look at how much people are willing to pay for it even as an option for upgrade. having an additional type of screen may seem not much but for them manufacturing it, model, shape, paying extra for screens and have contract with other companies theres probably tons more to be included just maybe not worth the trouble.

theres quite a few of us, would pay for the screen you see on levono w702ds type, although that machine did come with 7k price tag. the dual screen that slides isn't my type and I prefer more of a smaller screens on two sides and slide in and out but thats just me.

anyway just my 2 cents, along with all the USB3 / expresscard slot / thunderbolt/ esata6G thing ive mentioned, who knows how many will change. maybe none =/

 

IMO If Dell does release an M18xR3 it will probably look just like the M18xR2/R1 but with a newer gen CPU/GPU..

What major differences were there between the M18xR1/R2? An extra SATA port, a Cache drive and a newer mobo to support the newer gen CPU and GPU cards. Not to forget the cutback on all the goodies you normally got (leather manual, decent packaging).

 

Yeah, I'm disappointed about the packaging deal. It's a flagship system! Give us some unique packaging...and a unique experience.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it, and the m17x get a new design. Been the same for 2 years, and with cooler, more efficient parts suck as Haswell, keplar, and better SSD's on the market today, they can probably afford to slim both systems down a little bit and change up the cooling systems.

The other brands have changed their designs in the last 2 years, AW has to as well at some point or they will look like turtles.

 

i dont think m17x will change now. Dell knows people will pay for dual GPU so that is settled. unless they somehow loses a whole lot of sales in m18x then they might reconsider change m17x back to like how it was R2.

@prank1, msata or cache drive as a choice already present.. imo those are just to advertize and increase upgrading options. anyone in the right mind knows for true performance and speed and with enough money to blow would get multiple SSDs in Raid 0. those are for people who doesnt know how to upgrade and choose SSD.

 

Dear Dell,

For the M18x R3 I would like the following:

1: More screen options (maybe the current one + an RGB led or higher color gamut one in case we want some choice)
2: That soft matte material the palm rest is made from looks nice but gets scratched and smudged really easily. Perhaps a different choice of material? Then I won't be scared of touching my laptop.
3: The glossy plastic grill in the front is the easiest thing to scratch on earth, can we do something about that?
4: The GPUs are rather difficult to remove, or take apart for re-pasting/cleaning. Can we make it so the GPUs can be removed from the rear panel without needing to take 80% of the laptop apart?

I'm happy with the rest,

Peace on earth,

 

I don't think they will make the m17x a dual GPU system again, I just think they will make it a bit thinner. Over the last couple years other brands have slimmed down their systems a bit, and will likely do so again in the next generation. Dell has to make sure they don't get stuck with systems looking like bricks in comparison.

The m18x will also probably be a bit thinner.

 

imo m18x is a nice machine as it is. fairly easy to take it apart and since I owned R1 and R2 is similar, it would be nice if R3 is very much the same except better internal hardware. make it thinner maybe I wouldn't mind that but i will refuse to buy m18x if they go from Aluminum chassis into plastic. in that case i'll just go sagers, make no difference. since sager is cheaper, and even easier to disassemble, and come with desktop CPU, Dell only wins with bigger screen/ metal chassis and good looks.

@ vzachari, definitely need some screen options. if they can't go dual/ extra side screens, then at least offer matte screen material as an upgrade.

 

18.4" screen options depends on the screen manufacturers making them, which is not many and there are not that many 18.4" systems which means progress is slow on them. Hopefully as the next wave of resolution improvements come in the 18.4" panels will get swept up too.

 

I wish Samsung made the screens, they are quite superior in TV and computer monitors. 120Hz and a higher resolution would be amazing IMO. I'm personally brand loyal to Samsung for TV and monitors, as well as SSD's.

 

and mobile phones, and washing machines (at least here haha)

I would like to see at least an RG+BLED panel on the AW - my Dell XPS 15 monitor had gorgeous colours and outstanding quality, also, the availability of a BluRay write option as well wouldn't hurt.

 

Agreed.

Dude, what a coincidence, we had similar laptops prior to getting our Alienware's, haha. I just sold my xps 15 but it had the 2820QM and 8GB ram. That's funny.

I'm having order troubles again though, this is the fourth time, damn.

 

quite a spooky coincidence haha. my AW's due next week, should be in front of me by Wednesday. what I'm more concerned about are technical issues, since it's a refurbed product. I had no problems with my XPS, which was also a refurbed one... so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. last 4 days of agony, then hopefully - bliss

try piling a bit of pressure on Dell - this shouldn't be happening, you have every right as a consumer to demand some form of compensation, either in money or in kind (most probably in kind). you could always get some freebies such as tactx accessories, etc

 

I'd like to see a new chassis carved from thick billet aluminum for a more industrial machinery look, but still keep the angular alien motif, AlienFX, etc... It would be cool to see brushed and polished aluminum finish options, a little bit larger and heavier, with 6 drive bays, 2 eSATA ports, plus ODD, 3-way SLI, desktop CPU socket and 1000W external PSU. They could add another inch or so thickness to the chassis base to accommodate these extras and I would be totally happy with that. I would like to see all traces of plastic exterior surfaces except for the keyboard and touchpad vanish. Have everything with a precision machined fit and screwed into place with allen-head screws... no clips or tabs holding anything in place. I'd like to see them go nuts with either a sealed liquid cooling system or massive copper heat sinks that are too large for the processors to saturate them with heat. I would also like to see manual fan controls. This would be the ideal DTR that easily travels.

 

I second the chassis change (but without increasing weight or bulk, just better materials, preferably not shiny plastics). Also the screws instead of clips or tabs but I could live with them if I didn't have to mess with them, like for example when removing the GPUs. I mean it can be done, in the newer dual GPU Clevos one can remove the entire GPU assembly from the rear panel and everything is held together with screws (no keyboard/keyboard frame removal no nothing). Manual fan controls are always nice and before I forget, maybe some improvement on the thermal pads of the GPU memory. Mine lasted about a year and I kept the laptop pretty darn clean, GPU memory is now 10+ degrees more than it used to be when I first got it (in case dell/Alienware is listening).

 

Assuming traditional design
They could switch back to 17" with a touch panel that is ips or amoled based with dual gpu. Make it a metal or carbon fiber chassis with vapor cooling. They will also need to update the design to differentiate it from past Alienware systems of the last few years. Ditch the macro keys and instead focus on something unique like razors switchblade.

Something new and innovative
Or follow current trends and make it even better by having the display be detachable while the main base powers games and other taxing functions wirelessly. The detachable display could serve as a high end tablet though this would work best for an M13x rather than M17x.

Finally Dell should consider a proprietary external gpu system that allows dual mobile gpu while keeping the computer itself super light and thin. This is something I wouldn't mind seeing as long as the enclosure was mxm compatible. It could be used for the entire Alienware line of systems and would really make them stand out, especially if the M13x has a detachable display. The M17x would then be a very nice mobile platform equipped with a touch panel (amoled or IPS) while being thin and light.

As much as I like Mr Fox's suggestion, it wouldn't sell much and even I wouldn't buy it due to bulk. The trend is towards lighter, robust and more power efficient forms of computing and Alienware must adapt or it will die off.

You're absolutely right, bigger and heavier is not the direction AW needs to go and I think my above suggestions would be a good compromise. Whenever I go to work (e.g. urgent care on Thursdays) I want to take my notebook with me but the M18x is far too bulky. If it were scaled back to an M17x with a high end touch panel + super light and thin (e.g. thin as a macbook pro) with an e-gpu (capable of dual mobile GPU) I'd take it everywhere with me and leave the e-gpu at home for when I game. The biggest hurdle for Dell would be creating a proprietary connection that could feed the e-gpu with enough bandwidth but they could probably pull it off with the assistance of nVidia/AMD.


Sent from my GT-N7000

 

I would not consider an extra inch in thickness to be too much bulk. That would be a negligible increase in size to me. And the extra weight from the billet chassis and 1000W PSU would not bother me either. I would love it, and it would still go with me on all of my business trips.

That must be because the die-hard PC performance enthusiasts are becoming less common, even in the desktop world. More and more people, especially many folks that are just ignorant on the subject and/or don't have any money to spend on quality products, are willing to adopt under-powered trash and dub it as being "good" because it's cheap, and little, and light weight. It's sad, because it will leave people that don't want a immobilized desktop monster with no alternative but to accept a crappy compromise. I mean, sure, I love extreme desktops... I just hate that they have to stay parked in one spot, cannot sit on my lap in the family room or go with me when I travel.

Just dreaming about what would be most awesome to me, I guess... Wish I had the resources to start a business building the kind of laptop that people such as myself would like and charge accordingly. Alienware does it with the M18x, Clevo does it with their plastic P370EM beast (but negate its value with cheap build and locked-down BIOS), but there are no true über-performance laptops other than these two. If Alienware stops building the M18x or something more powerful, it will definitely be the last one I buy. Unless it can at least match the build quality and outperform what I own right now it will be considered an unacceptable downgrade.

 

It's not that people lack the money to buy a quality product or want "under powered trash", rather they do not want bulk. A 1000W PSU would be absurdly huge and heavy, you literally would need a second backpack (or wheelbarrow) just to carry that thing around. It wouldn't make sense at all for AW to design such a product, might as well go with a desktop.

It's fun for speculation but for practical (and economically feasible) purposes, AW will have to scale back on the bulk, not add an inch. People are already derisive of AW's bulk, upping it another 1" would be a disaster for marketing, even if the performance was there. Remember, Dell has to please their stockholders and having a line of computers bulkier than the rest of the market while being priced out of reach for 95% of consumers would likely (and rightfully) cost the designers and their managers their jobs.

Keep in mind Dell is being squeezed out of the market everyday by its Asian rivals and their profits are plummeting so there's no way they will continue making niche products that appeal to a shrinking handful of hardcore enthusiasts. It's reminiscent of Detroit of old vs Japanese cars, Detroit kept pushing gas guzzlers until they entered bankruptcy. Current Alienware designs remind me of inefficient gas guzzling Hummers, it just can't continue because Washington won't bail Dell/AW out when they go bankrupt.

 

Well, the 330W PSU is just barely enough to power an M18x with two heavily overclocked 680M and and a heavily overclocked XM CPU right now, so they will have to downgrade performance to go smaller, thinner and lighter. To me that would be unacceptable. I'm not a conformist or a compromiser. In doing what the masses want, the brand will be marginalized and become more insignificant among true performance enthusiasts. It would be a real shame for something crappy like an HP Envy or P170EM to become the fastest and most powerful option available.

Plus, I think they could build a 1000W laptop PSU that is no larger than a 1000W ATX PSU, and I would not consider that to be too big or absurd. An ATX PSU is not much larger than our existing 330W PSU, and I have no problem at all with the size of our current PSU. To say "might as well go with a desktop" is a really horrible and unacceptable option for reasons I mention in the post above. It would not serve my purposes because it can only be used where it is parked. But, a machine the size of the M18x or something just a little bit larger to house more awesomeness, would still be considered completely portable and highly desirable in my view.

The M18x still seems to be a great seller from what I can see. I don't agree with the thought that Alienware needs to move to a smaller and lighter option. They already offer that kind of compromise and people that are interested in compromising performance for smallness are buying those models instead of an M18x.

 

That's not necessarily true. Components are also getting smaller as technology advances. Performance wouldn't necessarily be affected if the chassis were slightly redesigned. I think the PSU could be upgraded as it is the same since the m18x came out. Perhaps a 360 watt PSU would suffice? I'm not sure, but 1000 is overkill.