*OFFICIAL* Alienware 17 R5 Owner's Lounge

With HIDevolution and their service it can't go wrong. Trust me on that it won't be like the with the AW tech support m*nkeys.

 

Hi11zone when is your expected delivery?

I am still collecting all the stuff to re-paste mine. By the way, something strange. I just opened my laptop to see how I am going to do it later. I did not repaste but I just saw how to do it. I saw my thermal paste that Dell m*nkey put on mine, It was simply too much which I already knew. Anyways, I just assembled again. I do not see any temp spikes now during idle or during doing normal stuff (no gaming).... Maximum temps rarely reach 74C for cpu package and 70 maximum for one of the cores. I used to see temp spikes before even during idle. This suggests that repasting should at least improve things

 

Look at this time we dont know exactly what is going on, there are only a handful examples available of these units that they are overheating. Still ahvent seen a single disassembly so we cannot asses how those heatsinks are now, how the fit is, how the thermal pads are, how the paste is etc etc etc.

Also I dont think it is preferable to have a higher fan noise, that is what kept most people from buying gaming laptops in the past. As long if the temps are max around 80c for cpu and under 80c for the GPU I think the cooling is good enough.

It is true that the current units are heavy, thats the compromise of having at least a well built chassis (that other brands in general often do not offer) but the size itself is way different, the old 17R1 is almost twice as thick as the current unit, an ergonomical nightmare for many, its too high on a desk and not even comfortable to use. But yeah the current 17inch is too heavy, the 15inch a tad too heavy as well but manageable.

But I dont understand why you complain only about the alienwares regarding this, no 8th gen laptop has been released with decent cooling, except for the one thick MSI model. You know the majority are not searching for those type of laptops.

 

Yeah except........you have to send your laptop back to a different continent if you are from Europe and are weeks without a laptop.

 

Some people (experienced as they say) offer repasting services in UK but they are not companies (but doing it themselves) and in addition to not having any real warranty that it will be OK (I wonder if even themselves know) they are charging extremely much too (especially when we know the price of the thermal paste etc ). I can give examples but I wont. I can do it myself. I have experience on re-pasting AW 17 R2. Its takes less time (rather than sending) and its 1000% cheaper. I have received the thermal pads (Gelid) and liquid metal (Conductonaut) but I am waiting for PCH heatsink and the 33+ electrical tape (I will cover the CPU and GPU around the chips). I wont use nail polish (ever though I ordered one) because I find it nonsense when I am going to cover the area around chip with electrical tape to protect from possible liquid metal leakage.

rinneh blaming only AW shows what some people are really here for. After doing a short search the i9 shows similar temp spikes on larger and thicker MSIs with their <<extreme>> cooling system. This was only after looking for 5 minutes or so. If I search more I am sure I will find more. Thats why I was asking about the specific CPU and not similars. It seems to be Intel spec related and not AW or any other brand. I saw many people having new CPUs (not only i9) complaining about the spikes on Intel forums and of course not any serious answer from Intel rather than saying its within the specs.

And yes I love the quiet fans. One more reason I want to keep this machine and try to repaste it. Finally what AW end up to is a combination of quality, portability (heavy but thinner) and real life performance. Not need to talk about the prices of other high end laptops. The downside is the need for re-pasting but if this works you really have it all. But if high temps are not sorted after re-pasting its going back (already offered me refund and waiting for my reply).

 

yeah except that HIDevolution is also based in the UK so no. it isn't like dell. and with HIDevolution, if you buy a worldwide warranty, your warranty is really worldwide. inlike AW where you have to transfer you warranty. and if the country does not provide in home services or repairs at all, you're screwed cause your warranty will be voided. rather have HIDEvolution, or PC specialist.

 

The main point has to be... Alienware was called out due massive overheating the fall 2016. And the problem has just going on. I mean its strange or rather say weird that Dell do it exactly the same once again. A minor change in the cooling wasn't very smart.

All knowed the unlocked i9 BGA would run hot. And Dell put aka advertice 5.0GHz for current gen"

Alienware 15 and 17 boost performance with 8th Gen Intel® Core™ CPUs
Alienware 15 and 17 gaming laptops will offer new 8th Gen Intel® Core™ i5, i7, and i9 processors with up to 6-cores, enabling overclocking up to 5.0GHZ for the first time ever on Alienware’s most powerful family of laptops. "

None of the other OEM's have done it the same. But they have done the opposite on fan noise. It seems dell walk their own way.... Longer and longer away from the other OEM's direction. Less fan noise doesn't fit with whats stated.

I don't talk about 17R1, but the Echo models. I mean they was thicker than todays models. Shrink and shrink the thickness ain't exactly the best way if you put in hardware who push more watts than before.

Be you sure... I put up a lot of info, not only about Dell's Gaming notebooks.

 

Yes Dell does bad on cooling on this high end model and it is unacceptable. Maybe gives job to HIDevolution and others offering re-pasting services. Talking about older AW laptops is relevant because they had a decent cooling system. Even old AW M17X R2 which is thick and made of aluminium chassis with larger fans stays quiet after re-pasting. Thinness shows the trend of today. It makes you feel good when you think of the beast hidden under a generally normal looking (still bigger) laptop.

 

In general in my experience you can contact Dell USA if you need support in another country and in regards of Alienware they did offer support once while I was in Japan. It wasnt even a case that had a hurry. Just had uneven core temps with the AW15R2 heatsink and they had sent me a new one to Japan. Just contact Alienware directly and avoid Dell itself.

The thing is HIDEvlution rpesent itselfs as an authorized reseller of Razer and Alienware laptops but from what I understood they arent in those cases. If you buy them there and HideEvolution goes out of business you cant come knocking on Alienware of Razer their doors. They do a great job but its not ideal at all as presented here. Also you need to pay a high fee of shipping costs for your warranty.

 

But the AW M17X R2 could comapre to desktops in that era and thats the big difference now. Laptops and desktops are closer than ever in terms of performance. In that time you could be happy of you had half of the performance of comparable branded desktop. A laptop Geforce 780gtx for example didnt come even remotely close to a desktop 780 and the generation before that where worse.

 

The older echo models where not really using that space wisely, there was a lot of empty space due to the way the chassis was designed, especially in the 17inch version. THey only shaved that wasted space off now. But the heatsinks now are even bigger.

Dell never lied about the 5GHz, but the small print says on just 1 core. Bit of a marketing tricks. Wouldnt say that type of marketing is correct. But blame Intel on that. This generation is for me like the "Hot"well generation. A bit too much for the era.

 

yes because dell operates within japan, but go for example to the middle-east or india and suddenly things are different.

and it also does not matter where you buy your laptop. in the event of buying a product, you're making a contract with the seller, not the manufacter. if Hidevolution has bought AW models, and then put on some of their own expertise, you're making a contract with HIDevolution. not with the company of the laptop you're buying (so for example if you buy a razor from HIDevolution you've bought it from HIDevolution, not from razor. the contract is between you and the reseller.) if you buy an mercedes AMG or a BMW M series, or a nissan GTR or Supra TRD you're not buying the car from the manufacturer, but the shop that tuned the car. you cannot go back with your AMG to mercedes, when you've bought it somewhere else.

thats with everything you buy. you buy from the reseller, and the reseller buys from the manufacturer. else you have to start your own company of you want to approach the company's where they build those machines.

 

I just put in an Coffee lake in my old Clevo P870 from 2015. The one with Z170 chipset.

Stock clocks and default voltage (No tweaking). I fired up Cinebench R15 - First round did 1449cb and temp maxed out 57C.

Dell use 3 differend OC profiles. I'm sure none of them run stock clocks on all 6 cores.

 

Then dont buy a laptop if there isnt a service center near there (i didnt get the heatsink from Dell Japan by the way, it was shipped overnight from the USA).

But with a small company it is a risk that they go out of business (larger risk then a large manufacturer ofcourse).

 

I hope it will not fry your VRM's though, wasnt that the reason why Intel blocked it on the Z170 chipsets? That some motherboard manufacturers didnt have enough headroom? Still nice run if it will hold out in the long run. But just CPU only stressing isnt the problems for AW laptops either.

 

rinneh I do not know if you had used one of those at that time. I am sorry but this is not the case. A high end laptop could compete a desktop even then.

 

Papusan what thermal paste, thermal pads, liquid metal did you use on your old clevo? Thats of main interest

 

that empy space is for airflow. cramping up components against eachother will only heat up the chassis more. if you have space, the components can give of their heat to the atmosphere or "air" that surrounds the system. why do you think razor runs hotter then AW.

the echo models are still beast, the 17 R(5) Can run a 1070. and that's mainly because of the seperate heatsink, more air within the chassis for airflow (just like a desktop also needs to be optimized from within for optimal air cooling) and thicker heatsinks.

also, if your cpu throttles at 4.2 @ 1.2 V on all cores (8950Hk) 5 ghz won't be possible. the mobile tech review, showed that on stock clocks it does not even have ThermalHeadRoom for ocing.

 

8700K use less wattage than my dayly [email protected] in Cinebench R15. And 57C max temp with 22C ambient means the VRM who is under same Cpu heatsink run cool. And I run stock voltage. Haven't had time for tweaking.

 

That was not for airflow. There was a 2mm empty space layer between the palmrest and batter for example. This was because the keyboard and keyboard plate also had a 2mm gap and under that there was another 2mm gap between the backside of the motherboard and keyboard. Apart from the fan holes through the keyboard there was zero airflow there. On the bottom of the machine there was also a 3mm gap between the batteru, harddisk etc where no airflow is present (and not it wasnt because of the battery that might would bulge out, no lithium polymer pouches where used). The 17 inch version had an enormous gap between the fan casing and the motherboard, almost 4cm that could be use for a much larger heatsink.

That frame had so much waste of space its baffling.


Single core 5ghz would be easily possible if if all cores would not keep the 4.2ghz when stressed. Single core vs 6 cores ofcourse.

 

easy to say, but that problem is nonexistant with HIDevolution just saying. if it was Dell, you had to choose another laptop, if it was not for HIDevolution, you could (almost) buy a laptop from any brand from Hidevolution, without the warranty headache. HIDevolution is how AW used to be. or the enthousiast, and gamers.

 

like i said, that empty space is for aiflow. Airflow does not have to mean moving air. air that stands still (ever never stands still it vibrates, but air what does not flow) can still take heat from components. Engines in a engine bay work the same. if something is very hot, you'll see the air around it dance. if there is no air (moving or standing still) the component will have to keep heating up because it has nothing to transfer to. Air in the netherlands is also mostly used for isolating homes, but you can use it to cool components too. it does not have to move, it just needs to be able to collect and transport heat from components.

If you want a thin laptop go buy a ultrabook. Desktop-replacements where never meant to be thin. it's a concept Intel started pushing with ultrathin ULV processors and stuff. smartphones, and tablets that's where the space is being wasted. but desktop replacements are meant to be.... DESKTOP replacements.

a desktop is BIG and HEAVY and can COOL HEAVILY. are you seeing toyota, GM or Ford making their suv's or trucks smaller ?? ofcoarse not.. that would defeat the purpose of the car.

 

Stop comparing it with cars, this aint a car (i get where you come from as a high level mechanic, but as someone who did industrial design next to communication & multimedia design, i dotn think these comparisons are fully valid).

I am talking about the empty spaces at the opposite side of the board and away from the board components. Because Dell wants to force people into only servicing parts such as the harddisk, memory and wifi card they use an extra layer inside of the frame, this frame takes a lot of space and causes a lot of empty spots inside of the frame that do not offer any benefits to the thermals. They arent even close to the hotspots. There is no reason why there needs to be a gape of a couple of milimeters from side to side of the laptop and 7cm deep. They could have made it thinner there, ot they could have rearranged the parts so that larger heatsinks are allowed. I did think that the past chassis was a good chassis (very durable) but it did have a lot of wasted space. The current units dont have this but they sure are heavy.

 

5mm thicker as the Echo would Mean a lot for the cooling, fans and heatpipes. Thinner chassis means either bigger footprint or less capacity battery. Remeber Dell couldn't even fit in normal sized M.2 ssd for 3rd ssd slot or nor 4 ram slots.



HID warranty... http://www.hidevolution.com/alienware-warranty

Regarding Dell and fan noise...
Frank Azor: No more loud fans for the Dell XPS 15 9575 2-in-1 convertible thanks to the latest BIOS update
Will it run hotter? Will Dell reduce fan noise in full load as well? The big Q.

 

i'm not comparing, i'm using analogy's to make my point. Big difference.

 

But a few milimeters more wouldnt enable the laptop suddenly to use double the ram slots for example. You cant deny they use the space quite well in the current generation. Considering the huge battery. and the ability to use a spinner drive.

 

https://www.techradar.com/reviews/alienware-17-r5/2

@cinebench a 6 core i9 that scores only 987 is mediocre. my 7820Hk @ 4.5 Ghz scores around 950 already. so there you go. also you can see that in that review the Asus ROG G703GI keeps the cpu at a higher frequency. but the AW guns the asus down, when doing GPU benchmarks (cause AW can cool a GPU just fine, it's the cpu that they cant work with) this is another review that shows that AW still does not have the CPU thermals on fleek.

@Papusan can enlighten you with some chilly 8700K score's. but scoring 900 point's on a six core is not good. very not good.

 

@rinneh - Intel blocked the upgrade because they are like their bed fellows, Micro$loth and NVIDIA: Greed. The reasons excuses they gave are totally bogus. They and their "partners" would sell far fewer motherboards if they allowed 8700K to be a drop-in upgrade for Z170 and Z270. It's obviously their decision how to handle it and they are free to do whatever they feel like doing with the products they manufacture. That's their right, but we can all count on the fact that their decisions are always going to be self-serving. It would be a lot better if they would just be honest instead of making lame excuses and telling lies to mask their greed.

 

The 5 missing mm could done a lot for the cooling.

The Cinebench scores is awful. Same for the Asus ROG G703GI with i9-8950hk. The Cinebench R15 - 1070cb score from Asus is barly better than first round Cinebench R15 from the much thinner Asus GL703GE (Core i7-8750H). Seems Asus have major problems as well. Crippled power limits, temps or firmware.

 

I wish to share with you the reply from Dell tech asking him what is going to happen if I do not accept refund. What is interesting is what he says about the heatsink:

I cant guarantee you that refund will be also offered again, I mean that this offer might be valid for You like 2-3 weeks, if you decide to keep the PC then we will just proceed under valid service contract You have with us.

There might be chance that some new heatsink version will be relased to decrease temps like it was with older alienwares but I am not sure about that so nothing guaranteed.

In case you will accept refund then i will provide you 15% discount voucher for any brand new products from Dell / Alienware online store. Discount code will be valid until 10th of July 2018.

From the last logs you provided me I really think that the heatsink replacement and thermal paste decreased temps. There was no throttling in log and the fact that it was done by prime95+furmark at once which is really the most demanding thing you can do for the computer. I guess with the FarCry it spiked the max temp to higher value because of the way that CPU works, when max power / frequency is required it simply cant cool down fast enough so the temp raises but then once fans kick in or frequency changes...temps are going down again. So max tem is 100c sometime, but average is 90c.

Im not trying to explain again same thing its really up to You if You want to keep it or return it, but in case You will not decide for return now then that offer wont be valid for another couple of months or 1 year. Usually we can offer refund within first 2 months, after that you can get the system repaired regarding valid service contract and warranty You have with us. You can get the cooling pad and test the system, in case it wont get better then you will find use of it with another computer I am sure.

Feel free to test it for couple of more days or one week, then let me know how did you decided.

I wish You a great day and contact me anytime!

 

So intel was playing roulette to see if they can milk in max cash.
So you're seeing no difference at all even at 5GHz?

Might as well send a Dell etech to remove the fans for free just to get rid off the noise.
These days if the PC doesn't make a noise then it has a problem. Those people who are having trouble with noise can invest in iPad.

 

Return it immediately and if you still need Dell get older 7577 with 1050 ti or something which is Alienware 15/17 r4/r5 at stock.

 

The only smart thing to do would be to accept the refund, be thankful they offered it, and not look a gift horse in the mouth. Cut your losses and move on. If, in fact, they eventually release a magic heat sink that fixes their mistakes, you can always decide whether or not it makes senses to roll the dice on another system later on and just pray that they didn't screw something else up in the process. Those temperatures are unacceptable and inexcusable. They never should have released a half-assed product like that. But, that sort of behavior is unfortunately too common. Notebook OEMs are going to continue to do stupid crap like that as long as people keep giving them money for broken garbage.

 

Or keep using my old and reliable AW M17X R2 with i7 920XM and AMD 8970 (4GB).

 

Nothing wrong with that if it does what it needs to. Sounds like a good plan. Awesome product, too. They use to make truly superior machines that had no match.

 

Well thats why I went for another AW without thinking.. Times have changed.

By the way here is another reply.


thanks for the reply, I fully understand this and the fact that CPU is running on high temps, thats why we offered You return and refund after all. However using the computer for extended period of time and then simply return it and get a full refund also does not seems fair for our side and I really think You understand that too.

Can you buy brand new car, ride it for 15000 miles and then decide to return it for a full price?

I am just saying that we offered You basically everything we could and I also did everything I could and if this was not enough then You can return this product and get the money back but that offer can not be valid for extended period of time, its valid now.

BTW I have read over the internet about i9 8950hk and it really seems that it simply spikes to 95+ with any computer that runs with that CPU. So just stay with i7 in case you decide to get another PC (any gaming brand basically)

 

Tell them you'll buy new AW once the thermal mgmt mess is solved.

 

Lmao, this rep sure is full of himself. "Can you buy a brand new car, ride it for 15k miles and then decide to return it for a full price"

Boy, if your car don't perform the minimum task it should without almost falling apart, you can be sure you'll refund me.

Anyway, you get a full refund and a 15% coupon for a maybe future purchase if they (probably not but you never know) fix their stuff.

Just take the refund, move on and learn from this disastrous experience.

 

Hmm if that woul dbe fully true that would suck. I do expect good Zxxx boards for desktops to be able to handle it. Most of them come with oversized power circuits anyway. But in laptops I would worry. How are the VRM temps? This smell like a class action lawsuit material if people can prove there should be no reason that older boards are locked out from the Coffee lake upgrade path.

 

Yeah called that early on from othe rlaptops, I havent seen a laptop yet that can keep the boost clocks up for prologned times with the i& and i9's. In the end they arent that much better than the past generation.

 

Ok I just requested return/refund. It is so sad! I asked the Dell tech to let me know if the machine/heatsink is going to be revised so I can buy again. But this time, I will look for reviews first.

 

Wise decision I'd say.

 

yup, i did the same
going to rebuy with the i7 as thermals a bit more manageable with that and looking at reviews this gen does run higher and peak high under load. Its just the laptops cooling system which is meant to limit how high that peak is (hopefully not above 100) and control the heat.
The i9 doesnt seem deliverable at the moment as no ones got a decent cooling system... how they thing its going to work in an XPS i dont know but comparing to the others - i dont want a plastic laptop. Even if the thermals are better - every time i look at it it wont feel as premium particularly since the price is similar.
I guess as said before - there isnt a perfect laptop out there. Its picking what you comprimise on and i think id rather comprimise on the i9 to a i7 and have a premium feel and chassis. Its not like im going to use it at high load for long periods of time and sending my one back - ive struggled without a laptop!

 

I ll use my AW M17X R2 (still good for reasonable gaming) and wait. i9 temps seem to be a huge problem on all laptops now. See how it goes. Its a time of waiting. If Intel (and I talk about Intel and not any laptop brand) losses from reduced sales then lets see if they will go on saying << its within the specs>>

 

It seems to me the CPU side of the heatsink is flaky.

Here is my explanation from my own observations during the short time I was in ownership of the Alienware 17 R5. I did not dare to open it, but now I can see the problem.

As you can see on the attached photo, the CPU fan assembly has two outlets and two heatsinks, one on the side and one at the back. During my tests and while the fans were at max and the CPU was cooking hot (95C++) there was a stream of COOL air coming out the left vent as shown on the picture with large, blue arrows, and there was a gentle stream of HOT air coming out the back, as shown with red arrows. As we can see the left vent+heatsink has a purpose, clearly there is a heat pipe travelling all the way from the GPU, then the CPU, then past the rear heatsink (where it dumps its heat) and on to the side heatsink where now it is cool, no more heat to expel.

As you see the left vent is ONLY servicing this 3rd heat pipe, nothing else. Dedicated vent for one heat pipe only. But the STRONG stream of air coming out is cool, almost cold, whereas the CPU is boiling hot, 100C, throttling etc.

How is this even possible?

Without further tests (eg thermometer probing) I can guess that :

(a) the heat pipe is "broken" and we are sending a lot of VALUABLE air onto a cold heatpipe that does not trasnfer any heat away from the CPU.

(b) all the heat pipes are "broken" because two users have sealed the left vent with tape, presumably diverting all the air flow to the rear vent, but it did not make a difference. Therefore it would seem that all the heat pipes are failing to transfer heat away from the CPU enough to cool it down when the GPU+heatsink is also producing heat and cannot take as much heat away from the CPU.

Any other ideas to explain why we have cold air gushing out the left vent are welcome.

 

@doofus99 You had cold air coming out the left vent because the section of the heatsink where the pipe in question goes over the CPU was not making good contact with the CPU. I have two Alienware 17R4's with the same heatsink design sitting here, and both have hot air coming out the left vent when under load. This is a quality control issue, and many units leave the factory with a poorly fitted heatsink.

Right now is a very poor time to choose an Alienware for a top-spec laptop. They already have had quality control issues with their heatsink with the last revision, and have just added a processor that is a significant jump in TDP when overclocked.

 

again it was me haha that suggested taping off the left vent. and in my case it did increase the airflow over the back, and reduce noice/temps (5C max sometimes in some cases no difference.) i think because the air that's being pushed back in the chassis, is being diverted to the back. i also had hot air coming from the left vent, but now they go out through the back. all the extra air that passes over the heatsink fins maybe enhances the cooling. but i'm still in the process of testing with different settings. i have an 7820HK LM'ed. running 4.5 Ghz with a max of 83c (when gaming) @ 22c room temperature.

 

There should still come our some heat although the pipe hasn't any contact with Cpu. There will still be some heat that will flow from GPU.

 

Mine probably be here in 2 weeks, and thats really sad Im trying to have hi hopes that my temps will be fine.