*OFFICIAL* Alienware 17 R4 Owner's Lounge

While you are waiting for the AW 17" 1080, check out the:

Aorus X7 DT V6 Desktop GTX 1080
Laptop Review / Benchmarks
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...scussion-thread.794965/page-317#post-10385050

 

I REALLY research my stuff before buying. I know every laptop that is announced to have a gtx 1080. And paying that much, I want to be able to get the one I like most. So I'm definitely not going for the aorus knowing there is a laptop that I like more.

The only one I considdered was the ASUS g800vi (note that is not the gx800). This one has a single gtx 1080, and has a mechanical keyboard, but has a few things I don't like: 18.4 inch, looks like a toy spaceship, way too expensive for what you are getting.

So really the AW 17 is the only option for me. Otherwise I will stick to my AW 15 r1 with the 980M I'm currently using

Note: thanks for the link, fun to watch

 

I've got a bestbuy 17R4 coming in with only a 128gb SSD. Would I be able to notice a big difference in gaming performance (ie. load times and such) between a 1TB 850 EVO M2 vs a 512gb 960Pro? I won't be transferring 100gb video files into a thunderbolt 3 SSD array... With new games coming in over 50gb, I'm a bit concerned about 512gb running out of room. Also, the price is the same....

 

No ... not at all ... if you technically measured with some sort of super precise device/metric? Then The 950 would probably show a faster load time by a bit but in practice? I don't think you'd notice it ...

I've currently got two 512gb 950Pros in my 17" and I'm pretty sure I'll be swapping them for a couple 1TB 850 EVO's ... just a pretty obvious value issue for me ... and I seriously doubt I'll notice any difference.

I'll be exchanging the two 950Pros for one of the 960 EVO's when they drop in a month or so ... thankfully, due to holidays, I have until Jan 31 2017 to return the 950's ...

Did a clean install of Win 10 Pro yesterday ... very easy ... no issues whatsoever with either the install or doing it all on a RAID0 array ... what a relief.

ALSO...

The best thing is I now have no Tobii functionality ... cause that thing was bugging the ****e out of me. Stupid camera trying to look at my face every time I wanted to log on (I use an external monitor) ... what a nuisance ... LOL ...

If I could somehow yank that Tobii thing out of my laptop panel, I'd gladly give to anyone who wants it.

 

Really? He's referring to a 960 Pro not a 950 Pro.

The 850 EVO is a Sata M.2 drive at 540Mb/s vs the 960 Pro at 3500Mb/s.

I think I would notice that.....

 

Another thing I've noticed over t

Just loading games and what not? Using the OS and doing daily tasks? I really don't think so... but I'm certainly no authority.

I've used both ... 500mbs mSATA SSD and 950 Pro m.2 ... and I honestly can't tell any difference unless I'm doing some massive file operation ... normal usage? Feels perceptually about the same...

Do what I'm doing if you can ... buy both and use each for a week and then decide ...

 

Interesting...

I've got a 960 EVO 512Gb on order. I might have a rethink.

This adds weight to your argument:



I'm assuming that M.2 Sata SSDs work Ok in the Alienware?

 

Samsung are laughing all the way to the bank with their "pro" bul...

Shame they have forced all the online stores to stop selling the PM/SM drives to non OEM's

 

WTH, how come?

We are not talking about small speed differences, but quite a significant speed difference, and am not only talking about sequential reads also random read speeds.
What about windows boot speed?
So even if loading a game level doesn't only consist out of sole reading files from hard drive, I'd at least expect some difference, there is barely any (also not talkng about booting up game, as those consist out of mainly watching some branding cutscenes)

You see, currently I own a Samsung 840 500GB, is what I only could afford back in the time in terms of 500GB.
Later on I got my father a 850 pro 256 GB. The speed difference is VERY noticable. and the fact that the pro is MLC, with a longer life cycle, it was a very nice thing. I thought about getting the next new release of samsung for myself, which ended up being M.2 pci-e which my laptop doesn't support.

So I myself was thinking about getting the 1TB samsung 960 pro. But you gave me second thoughts.

 

My old samsung 840 500gb loaded windows in 14 seconds cold boot
Then my 950 used to load in 9 seconds
then i tested a Cheap PM961 also 9 seconds
even cheaper PM951 10 seconds

Game loads were nearly identical across all 3

........ if u can wait just 5 seconds when switching on you'll save money

 

Do you have the 840 pro or regular 840? The 840 is one of the worst ssds that Samsung has put out. My 240gb has really slowed down due to TLC errors that Samsung never fixed

 

Unless you are a DATA miner, or run Servers. Fast SSD's are snake-oil being sold as a speed cure all (while they laugh their way to the bank). A "slow" SSD is fine and will save you hundreds and only will notice a few seconds here or there. Just stay away from spinning plates

 

Have the regular one. I wanted to wait upgrading until I got a laptop that supported pci-e ssd.

I think now I might go with the PM961 1TB
Or perhaps the 960 Evo,

This benchmark really threw me off, I need to do more research.

Yeah but I was really sad, seeing my father laptop upgrade to windows 10 anniversary edition in half the time of my laptop. So naturally I thought the 960 pro would only make it faster.

But it seems I was wrong, in real life scenarios, it seems there are other things that act as bottleneck

 

The 960 EVO 1TB is what I'm wanting too ... decent price ... fast ... Newegg says Jan 2017 before they ship, though ...

...

Just speaking of "perceived speed?" (that is, how snappy things "feel" ... how fast apps/OS "seem" to load?) ...

I have x3 512gb Crucial M550 mSATA drives in my MSI GS70 configured as a 1.5TB RAID0 array ... they bench around 1200-1300mb/s ... and it's a Windows 7 machine ...

And in this new AW 17 I currently have x2 950 Pro m.2's configured as a 1TB RAID0 array ... they bench around 2900-3100mb/s ... and it's a Win 10 Pro machine ...

And honestly? I don't know if it's a quirk of Windows 10 or what ... or maybe I'm just reading too much in to things? But to me, my MSI machine feels noticeably more "liquid" and "uninterrupted" in it's disc operation when just doing normal day to day work on the machines. It's very subtle but there.

So who knows? LOL ... I've been using that x3 mSATA MSI machine for two years straight now and so maybe it's just psychological ...

 

That's a shame, do you plan to buy the same again I.e same screen ? Or go with different screen or brand altogether ..?
Thanks for icm file.

 

OK - I've cancelled my 960 Pro order. Before I order a Sata M.2 drive, can someone please please confirm that it will work in the NVME Pcie slot ofthe AW????????

 

going for a 13r3 with the oled see how that goes....

 

That screen won't let you down, and would be my 1st choice over 4K however will have to wait until they do oled in 17''

 

AW17 1080gtx confirmed 11/21 from Frank Azor

Sent from my E6853 using Tapatalk

 

hi @iunlock
got my Aw17 today. 1080p Panel needs VOS (bleed, flicker) but the rest is ok. Panel is from AUO and has ghosting...not much but a bit. OC Maximum is 70Hz.

another thing. run FS Bench a few times and got ~13K Points with 17,6k graphic score. GPU Speed was ~1600mhz at 0.8v
with OC 200/400 i got 13,7k Overall and 19K graphic score @ ~1720mhz...again 0,8v

what voltage does your gpu use? any way to increase it? any way to increase the power Limit?
greetings

 

21st.... *****!!!

hopefully means it won't have any of these heatsink issues and ****.

 

https://twitter.com/AzorFrank/status/797136727517396995 maybe some light at the end of the tunnel. We shall see.

 

Yes and yes. Just stick it in man. ;-)

 

I thought that the Tobii sensors LEDs weren't visible to the human eye; they only show up on camera.

What was annoying about it?

 

They are invisible ... and it's probably something I could have just disabled ... but what was bugging me was that Windows 10 wanted to scan my face as my login credential every time I turned the computer on and since I use an external monitor at work ... I always had to lean over to the laptop screen for "scanning" ... LOL ... or tap the mouse to use a login key ...

Again ... something any user can disable I'm sure ... I was just glad to see it gone ...

Who knows? I may find a use for Tobii but for now it seems like a gimmicky feature ...

 

Someone somewhere else told me that the Windows Hello wasn't tied to the Tobii eye tracking thing?

I am getting the aw17r4 with the Tobii eye tracking but was curious if units without Tobii had the infrared camera capabilities in the camera at the top of the lid.

 

Someone tried ddr4 3000mhz (ej g.skill ddr4 3000mhz) in this new model 17 r4?

 

if they solve the cpu issues... looks like I'll have another good 5-7 years with this one.

i'm actually impressed how the thermals are doing for the gpus, especially with the kind of power they provide.

 

Azores just tweeted that it's an assembly issue. Some users said upon opening one of the screws wasn't tight......

 

As far as nvme ssd's go, sure I agree why get a 950/960, but no need to go with a regular sata SSD -- get an intel 600p! 1tb 600p for the price of a 512gb 960 pro, and it's got nearly triple the read speed of conventional ssd's. It's a no brainer.

 

There are the two 1TB M.2 SATA SSD's I am looking at:

Sandisk SD8SN8U-1T00-1122 X400 1TB M.2 2280 Solid State Drive - $259
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=0D9-0006-000G1

Crucial MX300 1TB M.2 (2280) Internal Solid State Drive - CT1050MX300SSD4 - $249
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820156155

Compare:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...-155^20-156-155,0D9-0006-000G1^0D9-0006-000G1

 

good price on those, both in the same performance area, I would go with the brand you trust the most for me that would be sandisk, no real reason other than I've had many of their product and rarely had any issues and once when i did with a micro SD they replaced without question.

 

I've had good and bad experiences with both, over a very long time, so I would feel good trying both.

It's been a product by product world for a while now, all makers have had stinkers as well as great products. So far both of these are getting good reports.

Having said all that, a warm fuzzy feeling does emanate from the SanDisk brand for me too.

 

Oh man ... I didn't even know about the camera ... I was just assuming it was Tobii ... I think your probably right though as a camera verification at login makes more sense than the Tobii thingy ...

I'm sure your new system will come with the face recognition thing and I'll bet it's actually via the camera ...

Thanks for calling that out ...

 

I'm not 100% certain, but I thought Windows Hello used an infrared camera for facial recognition. I imagine that the Tobii tracking helps with some of that but Tobii isn't what actually recognizes the face. And a regular camera wouldn't be accurate and/or secure (holding up a pic to the camera) enough as IR, see: https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/mt450467(v=vs.85).aspx

 

Alienware posted a bit ago I though I would share what they had to say



We want to thank you all for your posts, videos, and outreach with the new Alienware 15 and 17. I wanted to touch base on some of the concerns shared that may have negatively impacted your brand experience. Since the launch, we have shipped units worldwide and less than 1% of customers are reporting on irregular thermal performance. We do not want any of our customers to have differing experiences with the Alienware 15/17 and have looked into this discovery. We have determined that a portion of the first set of units were affected by a thermal issue which has since been remedied by rigorous thermal audits and changes on the manufacturing end. If you feel your system is suffering from undesirable CPU/GPU thermal performance, please contact your regional support to have the issue resolved.

I would also like to discuss the Intel i7 6820HK processor and its reported CPU temperatures that were shared. As I've let you know, we've been testing the power management of the 6820HK in our labs and they align with Intel's specifications and operating temperatures of above 90c. Temperatures hitting an average of 95c is to be expected and normal with this processor and with turbo boost it is even expected to spike beyond. We do have safeguards in place, as with previous technologies implemented in earlier Alienware generations, to throttle the processor back to normal operating performance/temperatures. In the first two weeks, systems with the 6820HK were experiencing thermal shutdowns and that’s on us. We’ve remedied that issue in the latest BIOS you can download here. We apologize if this affected you during your biggest gaming moments but it has now been resolved. We thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Another outstanding issue are the reports of LCD light leakage on the Alienware 15 and 17. This has been determined to be caused by a variance in our manufacturing process and it has been remedied. If you are unsatisfied with the LCD build of your Alienware 15/17, please contact support to help resolve the light leakage.

Again, we humbly apologize if these issues have affected your Alienware experience. We respect your choice in choosing us as your premiere gaming hardware brand and we are always pushing the envelope in ensuring the best gaming performance and community experience for all. Alienware fully stands by its products and will remedy any of these issues as found by any affected customers. Thank you for helping bring these issues to our attention.

Thank you, Umar Khan

Alienware Community Team

BIOS download: http://dell.to/2eLaI8Y

Intel i7 6820HK specifications: http://intel.ly/2fIVZzM


Seems like more than 1 percent and 90 plus degrees does not seem normal but I guess we shall see.

 

If you go to that Intel Ark link, with the 6820HK specifications, the Tj, Junction Temperature is the maximum temperature allowed at the processor die.

TJUNCTION 100°C

Going above 92c-93c should start thermal throttling, IDK why these CPU's are hitting 95c and above, but it's not acceptable.

If AW is improving QA procedures to catch the cases of high CPU core temperature differential, and rework them to fix the CPU heatplate pressure / paste to even out the thermal properties to get even core temperatures, as a side effect the cooling should improve overall, and we shouldn't see 95c again.

Time will tell if AW's manufacturing process improvements make a difference.

Please keep testing your new units for high CPU core temperature differentials, and please post your results here:

Warning: Some i7-6820HKs and i7-6700HQ have Uneven Core Temps due to Uneven Heatsink Pressure
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ven-core-temps-due-to-uneven-heatsink.797477/

 

Thanks for that ...

At least they are humble enough to admit fault ... "that's on us." ...

I'm sure your right. It's the infrared camera ... LOL ... I thought Tobii was reading my iris or something .. LMFAO~ ! aka Mission Impossible ..

 

exactly so im lost why alienware keep saying " they align with Intel's specifications and operating temperatures of above 90c. Temperatures hitting an average of 95c is to be expected and normal with this processor and with turbo boost it is even expected to spike beyond" but then go to say " systems with the 6820HK were experiencing thermal shutdowns and that’s on us."

link? and isnt he the one who said the 16th... im getting tired of waiting might get the 1070

 

Twitter

Sent from my E6853 using Tapatalk

 

they had $300 off, right now its 10% off on top of a $100 dicount, by the 21st this promo will over too.
on top of the 1080 being more expensive, we're paying more because we're not getting to use the promos.

going to see if i can order something now, and change it to the 1080 on the 21st so i can still get the promo.

 

Congrats on your new system! You'll need to adjust the power limit in BIOS and also use XTU to tune your multipliers and power limits for it to stick.

 

Honestly I wouldn't care about 90c+ temps if it wasn't throttled. If the temp is safe then the CPU shouldn't throttle IMO.

 

The thing is, 90C's regardless if it is within Intels specs is way too high and there are other consequences with having an environment with high heat.

I along with a lot of folks here have showed what these things can do, running in the 60C's and 70C's under load. A 30C drop in temps is huge and it's hard to justify or to make excuses like they are doing when there is a difference that is that significant.

Then again....lets be thankful that they are listening and taking action....that's a plus.

 

Hey Iunlock I'm not that familiar with liquid metal. If I repaste using conductonaut is it going to last over the lifecycle or is it a repaste once a year type deal.

 

AW Umar Khan, sorry to say.


This is the final nail in the coffin for my Alienware laptop purchase this GPU generation. I have no more respect for you until the next iteration of Alienware notebooks with Kaby and/or Volta. I was going to pick up a 17R4 1080 when it lands on 21st of November but it seems that Alienware as a whole probably won't care about the systems running in excess of 90c. Alienware's viewpoint on how a thermal management system is supposed to be designed/perform is unacceptable even if I have the technical expertise to fully fix the system myself. I am keeping my money and will only be sticking with the rMBP that I have already ordered.

It seems that you are building thermal management system to the standard that they're only good enough to run out of the box without problems, and forgetting to add headroom for enthusiast who want to push it to the limit (and yes I figured how to remove the GPU power-based throttling). I fear that whatever is coming for the 1080-based flagships system will not be adequate to allow me to tweak and overclock without the aid of modifying the cooling system and/or using it in a very cold environment.


You went from being manufacturers that care about their products (even the 17R3 I tested), and they had the best "stock out of box" thermal performance compared to similar offerings from other mass produced brands to being ones that make their thermal specifications "barely good enough to run at stock".

As a sidenote, nVidia's Pascal architecture will thermally adjust the clockspeed when the die reaches temperatures beyond 49c, and Intel CPUs start to throttle and engage thermal-based protection beyond 89c. You get less performance as temperature rises.

I would like to stress that in no way the new Skylake/Pascal Alienwares are poorly built. In fact, they have the best build quality of a gaming laptop I've seen to date, only rivaled by a select few non gaming products. The experience of testing the 15R3 on my signature have been a blast so far and I'm sincerely loving the experience. However, it's your design standards and viewpoint that I do not agree with.

Maybe you can learn from another competing brand's take on thermal management system: https://www.msi.com/blog/most-powerful-nb-cooling-of-cooler-boost-titan-for-gt83vr-and-gt73vr

Don't let this deter you from buying an Alienware machine, these generation of laptops are definitely worth a look if you are willing to invest your time and money in tweaking the system so that it performs in an acceptable fashion (Liquid Metal or bust, due to the thermal density). They have the potential to be the best in class performing (thermally) machines given the size/weight/thickness factor while having an exceptional chassis and backed by Dell's warranty.



I sincerely believe that you'll take this mistake into consideration for the next generation notebooks and improve on your product. But until then, goodbye.

PS: Alienware/Dell also have failed to make a fan control utility for notebooks in the AW Command center. You are only providing an option to set the fans on max speed through the BIOS and it is not adjustable unless you enter the bios and save the configuration to be off/on. This isn't necessary when you are gaming if and only if the unit have been given the Liquid Metal treatment, but it's just a nice amenity to have, especially on an expensive performance-oriented laptop which advertises an overclocked K-series CPU.

Competing brands on the other hand have implemented software-independent hotkeys or even a dedicated button to engage max fanspeed.







@Papusan @Ashtrix @Mr. Fox @TBoneSan @Raidriar @Prema @TomJGX @Phoenix @Georgel





And no, this isn't true. At least from Alienware.

 

If done properly and if the fitment between the cpu, gpu and heat sink is flush, then yes LM will last...forever...well you know what I mean. It'll outlast the computer for the most part.

If there is a gap between the heat sink and die then it'll basically "liquioxidate" lol...Just made up that word on the fly.

::iunlock::

 

Can you please ask Alienware Umar what processor throttling point Dell have put in their firmware? What's point in running processor with 95C and receiving fully throttling mess?

And Aw Ceo Mr. Azor aka @Alienware-Frank said We have a extra 15% thermal headroom for expected higher internal hardware temperature. When processor run 95C degrees. What will happen when you eat up a bit of this thermal headroom they bragging about. You haven't any extra headroom for later rised higher temperature or overclocking!! Pure ignorance or no knowledge about what he talking about.

A lots of OEM's laptop models use processor thermal throttling point even under 90C

Hitting average around 95C with a brand new machine without dust inside and with Dell's advertised 15% extra thermal headroom is scary reading!! You haven't dust in a brand new machine. And haven't used up the extra 15% thermal headroom Mr. Azor talked so nicely they have implemented into the new AW models.

Oh'well. And the thermal paste doesn't pump out - or will dry out faster with damn high temperature? You will need to re-paste much sooner than you needed with such high hardware temperatures

Have you extra headroom for overclocking the unlocked 6820BGA when your hardware already touch 95C? And if you want OC your graphics? Shared heatsink/ pipes between cpu/gpu will stop you, if you listening on Umar/Mr. Azor

 

Well said. There's no wiggle room for anyone to justify 90C+ as being acceptable when I along with many others have shown a 30C drop in temps.

Facts are facts and anyone with a sound mind will call BS when they see it.



::iunlock::

 

It should be as simple like a re-paste to reduce cpu / gpu temp at most laptoptops... If you must/need to modify the heatsink to get the temperature result you want. Yes, Then I will call it a design flaw. Quite simple The new AW models heatsink have a design flaw aka the famous 3 screws attaching. A warped/uneven heastsink can occur on all brands laptop models. But this is no design flaw!! rather more like a Qc problem. A design flaw is much worse