Confusion about SyncToy for synchronization

It never occurred to me that the FAQ on MS's site would address this issue -- but I decided to read it while I was waiting for a response -- and indeed the 2nd question addresses the cause. It does not explain the "incorrect" direction of overwrite but it does give a work around fo rthe first sync whihc should make the problem go away. I don't think the reverse overwrite direction is an issue in my case I am nearly 100% certain that all the files for whihc this occurs are identical anyway.

I am reproducing here the FAQ that is pertinant and the answer form MS' website. WHat a bug that they have known about for a year and have not corrected....

Q. On the first sync after upgrade from SyncToy 1.4 or 2.0 Beta, where one endpoint is on a FAT16/FAT32 drive (e.g. memory stick or USB key), SyncToy 2.0 wants to re-synchronize all files because the file times look different. What can I do about it?

A. The issue arises from the fact that SyncToy 2.0 has to re-create the folder pair metadata after the upgrade and FAT reports file times in local time and NTFS reports UTC times. There are a couple of *one-time* workarounds to fix this issue:
1) Go ahead and let the folder pair re-synchronize all files (i.e. hit Run on the Preview window and let it complete). This should be ok since you should have done a successful sync before upgrade. This “long” sync will only be required once after the upgrade, since SyncToy will ensure during this sync that the timestamp metadata is reconciled on both sides. After this you’ll start seeing normal SyncToy behavior for these folder pairs.
2) Temporarily change options on your folder pair to “Check file contents” and Run the folder pair. This will only copy the files where the content is actually different – but it will take more time to analyze the files since it will have to compare the file contents. Once this sync is done, you can uncheck the option and continue normal operation.

I know this is so basic -- my apologies -- I learn slowly at the start then speed up. I did try to search the forums both here ond on MS's Forums for SyncToy but it is a little dizzying with something so basic.

So I just downloaded SyncToy 2 and created my first pair.

I want to synchronize "My Documents" and all its subfolders and their contents that are on my laptop with same on my flash drive.

E.g., as I understand it, SyncToy will compare the files in Folder A in My Documents on my laptop with the files in Folder A in My Documents on my flash drive. If the file on the two drives is different, SyncToy will take the latest version -- whether it is on the laptop or on the flash drive and overwrite the file that is the older version so that after the operation -- both files are now the same and are the latest version. If a file in folder A exists on the laptop but was deleted after the last modification on the Flash Drive, then SyncToy will delete the file on Laptop's Folder A. And vice versa, if the file was deleted on Laptop's Folder A after it was last modified on Flash Drive’s Folder A, then SureSync will delete it off the Flash Drive.

Assuming my description of what will happen is correct, below is what the preview showed would happen when I set things up. Don't worry I just did a preview and was puzzled by the intended action. No action was actually taken.

But the preview confused me.

I put the Laptop My Documents on the Left of SyncToy and Flash Drive My documents on the right. Selected Synchronize and hit Preview.

What the Preview showed was that for 90% of the files that had a different “last modified” date, SureSync was going to use the Laptop verison as the Source file, it stated that the action was going to be Overwrite and the Target was the same file on the Flash Drive.

The problem is that in every one of those 1800 instances, the laptop version was *older* than the Flash Drive version.
Logic says the overwrite should go the other way.

E.g., One of the early lines read as follows

Operation: Overwrite
Source File: Swole Vegetable Melange.DOC
Source Path: C:\Documents and Settings\Justitia\My Documents\Physical Fitness\Food
Last Modified: 6/2/2008 7:09:26 PM
Target File: Swole Vegetable Melange.DOC
Target Path: E:\ASUS\My Documents\Physical Fitness\Food
Last Modified: 6/2/2008 10:09:26 PM

It showed, of course as one long string across, but I could not figure out how to copy and paste so I typed it here in a vertical column.

The C drive is my laptop and the E drive is the Flash Drive (E drive says ASUS because this is my backup on my flash drive for my ASUS laptop -- I have more than one laptop.)
If you note -- the source file was last modified 3 hours earlier than the target file.

And in fact I am pretty sure that the file in both places is the same. I believe the precise 3 hour (down to the second) difference was because my laptop computer clock or something was set for Pacific time when I was actually in the East coast and the Flash Drive has the correct time.

But regardless -- shouldn’t the target and source be reversed as the flash drive version is stated as being last modified 3 hours after the laptop version? Shouldn’t it be the flash drive’s version that overwrites the Laptop version?. (Because I have multiple machines and I use the flash drive to carry modifications from one machine to the other -- quite often the flash drive will have the latest version of the document. I do not want to use the internet mesh.)

The situation I describe is the same for about 1800 files. Then there are a handful of files in which the source is the flash drive and it is the last modified and it is going to overwrite the earlier Laptop one. And in these cases -- these are genuinely different versions. All the ones from laptop to flash drive are earlier on the laptop and the difference is precisely the 3 hours that I believe represent different time zones.

So can anyone explain this?
Does this have to do with the fact that the laptop version was put on the left side for SyncToy and the Flash Drive version was put on the right?
The way I understand the operation of "synchronize" it shouldn't matter which source is on the left folder and which is on the right folder of SyncToy . Synchronize means: take the latest version wherever it is -- left ot right and overwrite the older version on the other drive with the latest one.

 

Did you set it up as a one way sync or two way?

My experience with Synctoy was dissapointing. It just didnt have enough options to cater for my needs.

Try Toucan, Dropbox, Syncplicity or Goodsync.

Personally I use Goodsync at the office, its free for 30 days then it goes to a limited function where you can only have 3 sync jobs and maximum of 100files each.

 

It was 2 way. I ultimately decided to just let SyncToy overwrite the files hoping it would correct the problem. I never found out because when I defragged the Flash Drive I messed something up and now i am starting all over again.

Looking up Good sync -- it also mentions problems with time shifts when using FAT files. The laptop is NTFS and the Flash Drive is Fat 32. And that apparently causes the problem. SureSync wouldn't even sync these files, SyncToy wanted to overwrite every file which takes HOURS each time.

It seems GoodSync has a similar problem.

I think I could reformat the flash drive as NTFS but I've read that that totally slows it down and it is already slow enough as it is, that FAT32 is the best and that's why most flash drives default to that.

 

I run allwaysync and it works well between my desktop computer and my NAS.

 

Something else I thought up-
I used to like xcopy, and in Vista there is robocopy. I was only interested in a one-way sync, but neither of these programs would work well with my NAS. I think the problem is the more precise time used by NTFS, and these programs wanted to copy files that had not changed. Maybe one of these programs would work for you.

 

The time stamp issue definitely arises with SyncToy and it wanted to copy files that had not changed because f the time stamp difference. I could not figure out a way to overcome that.

But Suresync had problems syncing NTFS laptop files with the FAT32 files of the Flash Drive without losing data. They had a work-around but I did not have time to figure it out at the time. I am not willing to spend nearly $100 for a syncing product that creates stupid problems.

What does NAS stand for? I will check into allwaysync.

 

Network Attached Storage

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network-attached_storage

 

Thanks!

I decided despite my concerns to do the 30 trial of GoodSync whihc seems to have gotten a lot of positive reviews.

The first sync went off without a hitch but it wasn't a real test. I was just syncing My Documents on Laptop (which has around 1500 or more files and a ton of folders and folder trees) with my Flash Drive. But I had just copied and pasted My documents from laptop to flash drive yesterday. So there was minmal change and I don't think would generate the time stamp issue.

One feature I definitely liked is that it automatically recommneded not assigning the Flash Drive with any particular drive so I didn't have to worry as to which USB port to put it in.

I am putting some files on my PDA and as soon as that gets done, I will do the second test for GoodSync, which will be to back-up My DOcuments onto a second back-up drive.

If that goes fine, then I will have a third and final test which should present all the challenges all the sync programs have difficulties in dealing with, because I will be syncing the backed up files on the FLash Drive from the second test with the My Documents on another laptop. .

I will keep you all posted.

 

Wow! GoodSync just finished an 8 Mbs Back up onto a slow writing flash dirve (2.9 Mbps) in 47 minutes.

The SyncToy -- albeit syncing rather than back-up, which is more work -- took almost 6 hours. And most of the files it wrote over were not changed -- it just did it because of the time stamp issue.

I will be syncing GoodSync on my other computer in a little bit. That will be the final test.

 

Well something happened to the backup on the second flash drive. It was truncated. And now the write speed is down to 1.33 Mbps, less than half of before.

It is the same make and model of flash drive bought at the same time: A-data. But I might have damaged it earlier when I was trying to defrag it and stopped it in mid-stream (yes, I now know it is stupid to defrag a flash drive and I understand why as well.) This flash drive I use a lot, the other hardly at all. I wonder if the wear is contributing to the slow write speed (which is getting slower by the minute; it has drifted down to 1.26 while I have been writing this post and is still descending.

While the other one backed-up the same files in 47 minuted -- for this one we are at 1 hour 45 minutes.

I have only had these flash drives a few months. And even though I use this one more -- I still hardly use it.

I wonder if this was a bad drive -- or A-data is just a bad product.

Anyway, Goodsync says there is about 9 minutes left but it has said that for the last half hour. (Write speed now down to 1.23 mbps)