Apple reduces speed of iPhones as batteries wear out, report suggests

I had the white one. In fact, I am going on a Lumia buying spree soon since I just want to have the entire collection to play with. 1020 and another 950xl are my first two!

 

I'm still using Lumia 730 until W10M is EOL and switch to Android phone either Samsung Galaxy or Nokia.

 

W10M IS EOL...ha ha. I jumped ship when I bought my iphone 6s. I wish I kept one of our 1020s though. One less device to buy again. ha ha. I would go with a pixel 2 or essential if I were you. Nokia is just a former shell of their former glory. Their new deivces are about as exciting as........a Samsung galaxy....meaning boring etc. The pixel gives you the best camera, and operating experience not to mention limitless photo storage in the cloud. and the Essential phone gives you the same operating experience with the best built hardware out there right now in a phone. Samsung is apple in android clothing...nothing more. Last device I would buy imo.

That being said...if the new Nokia released a 1020 successor running android....I would be having it the day it was released...I would camp out like an ilemming to do so! ha ha

 

I switched to iphone 7 and was unhappy because some apps I needed were region locked due to India App store. So, I switched back to my Lumia and said goodbye to Apple. iOS has app-gaps as well.
Nokia looks okay to me, and Pixel 2 simply didn't impress after seeing JerryRig everything YT channel and build quality is crap on Px 2.
Essential Phone isn't available in India, so Nokia is a viable option if Samsung Galaxy isn't available.
I don't use Cloud at all, so Unlimited Storage is simply a waste.

 

right on....Nokia it is! yes...the app gap for windows is different in other places of the world. I am fairly "worldly" so I know how that all works....it's a shame they cancelled window 10 moible...it was the best OS for phone.

 

App gap is what's keeping me on WM. I prefer Android over iOS when app store is based in India. In the US App store both iOS and Android are evenly matched.
As a matter of fact, I have a Nokia Asha w/ 900mAh battery that lasts almost 2 months before charging. Windows Phones needs to be charged every 3-4 days. I did stretch the battery life to last 5 days before it died due to low battery.

 

HTC and Motorola say they don’t slow old phones like Apple does
https://www.theverge.com/circuitbre...ont-slow-processor-speeds-old-batteries-apple

"HTC and Motorola say they don’t throttle their phones’ processor speeds as their batteries age, something Apple last week acknowledged doing to prevent errors after iPhone owners documented slowdowns.

Spoiler

In emails to The Verge, both companies said they do not employ similar practices with their smartphones. An HTC spokesperson said that designing phones to slow down their processor as their battery ages “is not something we do.” A Motorola spokesperson said, “We do not throttle CPU performance based on older batteries.”

The Verge also reached out to Google, Samsung, LG, and Sony for comment on whether their phone processors are throttled in response to aging batteries. A Sony spokesperson said a response would be delayed by the holidays, and a Samsung spokesperson said the company was looking into it.

The responses begin to clarify whether or not throttling processor speeds is typical behavior in smartphones — as of last week, we knew that Apple was doing it, but not whether it was common practice among competitors. HTC and Motorola’s responses start to suggest that it’s not.

Apple said it introduced this behavior last year, for the iPhone 6, 6S, and SE, as a way to prevent random shutdowns of aging phones. As the phones’ batteries naturally degrade with use, they become able to output less power, leading the phone to unexpectedly shut off when the processor fires up to a high and demanding speed. Apple limited the phones’ processor speed to prevent those shutdowns, but in the process, also limited how fast a phone can get and did so without making this behavior clear to users.

There have long been conspiracy theories of “planned obsolesce” for iPhones, the idea being that Apple intentionally slows down devices right as a new one is released to encourage customers to upgrade. While this very much plays into that theory, it isn’t the same thing: the behavior Apple introduced for those phones (and recently, for the iPhone 7 as well) is meant to extend their usability, albeit at the cost of overall performance.

That said, Apple didn’t make it clear that replacing an iPhone’s battery could resolve this issue and improve performance. The company doesn’t make it particularly easy to replace batteries, either. And more importantly, it could have designed phones that didn’t need these guardrails just a year after their release, which is arguably the bigger issue.

These problems have clearly frustrated iPhones owners who found their phones suddenly slower after an update, and several are hoping to bring a class action lawsuit against Apple for the largely undisclosed practice."

Was it really necessary for Apple to slow down old iPhones?
https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/21/16806582/apple-battery-slowdown-science

"Apple yesterday confirmed that a long-held and controversial conspiracy theory actually contains some truth. The company says that, starting last year, it started slowing down older iPhones with lower-capacity batteries, mainly to prevent accidental shutdowns. The news set off a wide-ranging debate about smartphone reusability and longevity. But why does Apple need to do this in the first place?

Spoiler

First off, think of a battery like a system of pipes with water, says Marca Doeff, a battery expert at Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory. Over time, natural side reactions between battery chemicals cause these pipes to clog up, so the water can’t flow as quickly and gets stuck. This causes batteries to deliver less power, and a single charge doesn’t last as long. Cold weather is harmful too because it slows everything down. Battery charging is dependent on lithium ions being able to move back and forth between the two sides of the battery. When the temperature drops, that movement gets slower; when the water stops moving completely, the phone shuts down.

Unexpected shutdown is especially common during what Apple calls “peak current demands.” This is when the system draws on high power for a short amount of time, according to Venkat Srinivasan, a battery expert at the Argonne National Laboratory. “Say you went to the app store and hit ‘update’ all on the apps, then you clicked on a few unopened apps and opened them, then the system is pulling a lot of juice to do all this,” Srinivasan wrote in an email to The Verge.

To prevent such shutdowns, Apple’s fix is basically to lower the amount of water being pushed through the clogged pipes, to avoid slowing the entire process down. (All lithium-ion batteries contain a battery management system that tracks battery capacity, according to Srinivasan. This is how Apple knows what’s going on.) “You’re slowing things down enough so that you can get through, but you’re not draining as much current from the battery,” says Doeff. Using an external battery would add capacity to the battery, she adds, but it’s unclear whether this would cause the phone itself to run more quickly.

It’s possible that this could have been avoided, according to Gerbrand Ceder, a professor of materials science at UC Berkeley. The amount that batteries degrade over time and in cold weather is quite predictable and can be tested ahead early, he wrote in an email toThe Verge.

Battery designers make a trade-off between energy density and lifetime. The more energy you store, the more quickly it degrades. Being able to store a lot of energy at first is “highly desirable from a commercial perspective as this is when critics review the phones, and when users calibrate their experience,” writes Ceder. “But this clearly came with intolerable performance decay.”

Batteries are gaining a little bit of capacity every year, says Doeff. So newer phones probably have more efficient and better-designed batteries — and of course, the batteries in newer phones are newer to begin with. “It’s difficult, though, because we’re really pushing the demand for the battery to the maximum,” says Doeff. One solution could be over-engineered batteries, or batteries that have more capacity than necessary. The downside is that you’re carrying around a bigger phone, which few people want.

“We want more and more, and companies are trying to thread a pretty fine needle,” adds Doeff. “ Having said that, Apple could make it easier to swap out the battery.” (Here’s how to do that.)"

How and where to replace your old, depreciated iPhone battery
https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/21/16803442/iphone-battery-old-slow-warranty-apple-care

 

Was Samsung not caught speeding them up, during benchmarks that is.

John.

 

Their power saving mode exactly states your cpu is slowed down if you want higher battery life. But you can choose not to throttle cpu speed.

 

Apple Apologizes for Slowing Down Your iPhone – Offers $29 Battery Replacements for Limited Time, New Software Update for Checking Battery Health

"Apple Won’t Stop Slowing Down Your iPhone. But Will Tell You if Your Battery Needs to be Replaced for Optimum Performance."

Apple has come through with an apology on its website... Is this enough?

 

Apple apologizes for iPhone slowdown drama, will offer $29 battery replacements for a year
Batteries are “consumable components” now
By Nilay Patel@reckless Dec 28, 2017, 4:34pm EST
https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/28...e-battery-replacement-price-slow-down-apology

"Apple just published a letter to customers apologizing for the “misunderstanding” around older iPhones being slowed down, following its recent admission that it was, in fact, slowing down older phones in order to compensate for degrading batteries. “We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down,” says the company. “We apologize.”

Apple says in its letter that batteries are “consumable components,” and is offering anyone with an iPhone 6 or later a battery replacement for $29 starting in late January through December 2018 — a discount of $50 from the usual replacement cost. Apple’s also promising to add features to iOS that provide more information about the battery health in early 2018, so that users are aware of when their batteries are no longer capable of supporting maximum phone performance. This is a significant change in attitude around iPhone batteries — a decade ago, when the first iPhone came out, Apple said most iPhone users would never need to replace their batteries.

iPhone owners have long believed Apple artificially slows down older phones to drive new sales. But the new information from Apple about performance management poured gasoline on that long-simmering frustration, leading to a lot of bad press and multiple lawsuits. What made it all seem worse is that the scope of the performance penalty only came to light after being discovered by a developer instead of being clearly disclosed by Apple.

The iPhone 6, 6S, SE, and 7 have much slower peak performance as they get older and their batteries aren’t able to provide as much power to the processor. Apple had actually announced this change to performance along with iOS 10.2.1 a year ago, as the fix to a problem with the iPhone 6 that caused unexpected shutdowns if older batteries couldn’t provide enough power to the processor. But it wasn’t transparent about the performance penalty, and the new benchmarks suggest the penalty is much more significant than previously believed.

For its part, Apple continues to insist that it’s never artificially slowed down phones — just that it’s aggressively managing phone performance to maximize the lifespan of iPhone batteries. “This feature’s only intent is to prevent unexpected shutdowns so that the iPhone can still be used,” according to a new knowledge base article Apple published alongside today’s letter. “This power management works by looking at a combination of the device temperature, battery state of charge, and the battery’s impedance. Only if these variables require it, iOS will dynamically manage the maximum performance of some system components, such as the CPU and GPU in order to prevent unexpected shutdowns.”

Processor speed is just one piece of the battery- and performance-management puzzle, according to Apple: iPhones with older batteries may also more aggressively dim their screens, have lower maximum speaker volumes, and even have their camera flashes disabled when the system needs more peak power than the battery can provide. But other core features, like the cell radio, GPS, and camera quality, aren’t affected, Apple says. The whole approach actually quite clever, but cleverness isn’t a great substitute for speed.

In any event, Apple has a long way to go rebuilding trust with its customers — this story broke well past the tech press and hit TV morning shows and local news with zero nuance about “smoothing instantaneous peaks” and battery chemistry degradation. A lot of people already believed that Apple slowed down their iPhones, and this wave of news was a big data point confirming that for them. It’s going to be a difficult road back.

In its letter, Apple says “we’ve always wanted our customers to be able to use their iPhones as long as possible.” If Apple is serious about that, and equally serious about the battery being a consumable, these first two steps are just the beginning of a major reset in the way we think about maintaining the most important devices in our lives."

 

Nice statement. Too bad they forgot to add "pride and accomplishment" in it...
But seriously?!? They still have nerve to charge for battery replacement after all this?!?
I would never...

 

HTC and Motorola say they don’t slow old phones like Apple does-Theverge.com
"HTC and Motorola say they don’t throttle their phones’ processor speeds as their batteries age, something the bastards Apple last week acknowledged doing to prevent errors after iPhone owners documented slowdowns. In emails to The Verge, both companies said they do not employ similar practices with their smartphones. An HTC spokesperson said that designing phones to slow down their processor as their battery ages “is not something we do.” A Motorola spokesperson said, “We do not throttle CPU performance based on older batteries.”


More...
Samsung and LG Take A Dig At Apple, Claim That They Don’t Slow Down Their Phones With Older Batteries-Wccftech.com
"Interestingly, before Apple turned to revealing its activities to users, HTC and Motorola clarified that their Android devices do not run such practices. After HTC and Motorola, LG and Samsung today said that they also do not indulge in throttling their devices and compromise on performance. LG said,“Never have, never will! We care what our customers think.”

 

Someone on the Internet made an interesting observation - Samsung slows down their smartphones with their software

 

$30 is a large drop from the typical $80+, and Apple need's to charge something or everyone will send in to get a "free battery" whether they need to or not.

With "slow" Samsung applications (at full speed CPU / GPU) it's still drawing "normal / full" battery power.

When Apple is slowing down the performance overall - throttling the CPU / GPU - performance decreases in all applications even the fast ones.

 

I have no problem with still charging something for a new battery. The battery still needs replacing. It's not like this is a defective battery story.

The trouble is, they're giving nothing to the people who ALREADY bought a new $900 phone but would have been satisfied with a free AppleCare+ battery replacement (or $80 replacement for non Care+ buyers) had they been told what was going on.

 

Regardless of if it's good or not that they throttle to preserve battery life : we should know that !

We should know that they're reducing our performance and changing the battery might improve it. The way I see it they did not tell us it's slowing down because of the wear level in order to buy a new model. But the fact itself that we're throttling to preserve battery I'm not against it

 

We need choices. Not what they think is best for you or me. Just insert on / off in their software for battery savings (settings). How difficult must it be? Maybe they should state this in their advertising... Be prepared to get reduced performance. Because we care about our products

 

Another odd thing I observed is, battery saver works while charging the phone? I think they are disabling the ability to turbo charge or reach max charge rate of wall charger or usb charging.

 

This is something I manually manage with the Samsung Fast cable Charging.

I enable the Fast cable Charging option in Power settings, but only "use" it when I occasionally plug in the high power charging adapter that supports Fast cable Charging.

Most of the time I use the lower power charging adapter which charges at the slower rate.

I do think Fast Charging heats up the battery too much and would shorten the battery life if I used it 100% of the time.

I probably only use the higher power charging adapter 1 out of 20 times, and only when I need to do a fast charge due to unplanned usage. Most of the time I can plan my charging accurately and am not worried about running out of run time, so I can use the lower power slower and cooler charging cycle.

I would hope you could do the same thing with the iphone Fast Charging, yes/no? That way you could disable Fast Charging by using a lower power charging adapter.

Is it true that the Apple performance throttling is based on charging cycles? I had just heard that, but haven't seen a count where performance throttling is started... does it pay attention to fast vs slow charging cycles?

I would have hoped Apple did a more intelligent method of deciding when to power throttle than just based on charging cycle count.

 

Battery saver must not be active during Charging, we do want check for background activities and update them if possible.
Sure fast charge heats up the battery, I noticed my dad's s7 deactivating battery power/power saving toggle switch grayed out during charging and active only on battery mode. It seems Apple is pulling a W10 style to release unfinished OS for GP/testing on iOS devices.
For the record, my old w/o turbo charging wall adapter charges 5-100% in 45-50 mins if the charger doesn't heat up. My battery is 2200mAh and Apple takes hell lot of time to charge and it gets too hot as well. It had a weird bug that showed 98% when I was using wall adapter and I plugged into PC and it showed 100% battery fully Charged. I intentionally left it on the PC for an hour and battery life is so good while iOS updates are completely blocked. Haha.

 

Call Bull on this statement...I have many android devices and their batteries are just as bad if not worse than apple. That's a fanboy statement right there. Don't keep your note 7 in your house or car!

3 of my iphone 6s are 2 years old now. All of their batteries are still at around 95% health. I tested 3 of them when this story broke. So, their batteries are JUST FINE. The only battery in any apple product I have right now that is giving me fits is my ipad 2 which was bought on release day, in ....2011. It has been well used by me, then my youngest son, and now my wife. I feel that battery is a great battery since, it has been charged multiple times a day since my son started using it. It still hold a 5-6 hr charge. I have owned 4 android tablets, and the only one to have a reasonable battery is my cheap LePan Mini. The 2 samsungs and nexus I owned were terrible. So, again....Android devices are just as bad, if not worse than apple devices for battery life/longevity!

 

What are you calling "bull" on? My ability to manage my Android device batteries better than you?

"That's a fanboy statement right there." <<== You called yourself a fanboy

Yes, I agree, in the context of your statement, you're calling yourself a fanboy.

What the heck does this mean?:

"Don't keep your note 7 in your house or car!"

I never spoke about a Note 7, either in my house or my car

And, I think a lot of other Apple owners have just as good of battery longevity as you are having, so that's why I don't believe Apple's slowing down their devices is motivated by "failing" batteries.

I think Apple picked a recharge cycle count that was "reasonable" and "defensible" as an excuse to reduce performance to temper load to "extend life" of the battery, but I don't really think it was necessary.

And, you are validating that with your own personal experience.

Once your Apple devices hit the recharge cycle count, and the performance is throttled - if Apple still tries to get away with it - then you will also fall victim to Apple's machinations.

In *your* experience that may be true, but it's not my experience. All of my devices have consistant battery life and runtime throughout their lifetime,

I spend a lot of time when I first get a new device learning how to manage the battery runtime loads effectively through settings and usage, and I don't misuse them when recharging. I try to optimize both use and charging, and that gives my devices their best chance to have good runtimes and long life.

That's not the point of the thread.

The point of the thread is that Apple surreptitiously conflated a supposed battery failing issue by throttling the device performance behind the back of their customers, the device owners.

I think you will agree that Apple and Android are not equivalent in that aspect. Apple wins here at deceiving their customers, "hand's up".

 

Bowing out now...the fanboy is flying around way to much! take care!

 

Sorry to take the wind out of your sails, but when you start calling "Bull" on perfectly reaonable statements, and calling people fanboy's when it's not called for, you have to expect being called on it.

Next time discuss it rationally, it would come out the same, but at least you wouldn't be upset about it.

 

Again, My "ability" to manage batteries has nothing to do with the discussion...you "CLAIMED" that batteries are better designed in "YOUR" android devices....And I called you out. because that statement is NOT TRUE. it's a fanboy statement...not a factual one. I Don't want to have to mess with my phone to get decent battery life. It should just do it at this point. NO android phone has any better battery that will survive longer than any other device. My iphone gets bettery stand by time, screen on time etc than all of my android phones. SIMPLE. I use, own and enjoy all devices. I am not a fanboy of any device. If something comes out that looks like a cool device I buy it. I am not in the APPLE IS AWESOME everything else is crap camp...just as I am not in the ANDROID is awesome and everything else is crap camp.

Your claims regarding android devices are pure fanboy drivel...sorry...if you were not coming off that way intensionally thats how it sounded.

 

I'm relating actual experiences too, I am just stating the facts as I see them in my actual usage.

You are reading between the lines and running off the rails with your interpretation of what I am saying.

I said that the Android batteries aren't showing any weakness such as Apple said their iphones are showing that require performance throttling.

I didn't say I thought Apple iphone batteries were worse than I am experiencing with Android, I said Apple was saying that and I was calling BS on it.

I don't see Apple iphone's batteries failing en masse and I don't think Apple are justified in power throttling their iphones via IOS updates as they reach certain charge cycle counts.

Your fanboy reading on my text / posts is way off base.

 

But, you are wrong when you say android batteries are not showing weakness...They do, it's just you lose screen and standby time....Happened to EVERY ONE of my android devices. As well as many laptops, tooth brushes etc....I am no fanboy. NOT AT ALL. I enjoy my iphone, but I also enjoy my keyone, essential, and many other android, windows, and other devices. A fanboy says THEIR WAY or the highway....Not what I am saying. I am saying that you stating that android deivces have no degradation over time is entirely FALSE. Its a battery....I wears out. Its just apple decided to give their users the longest screen on times possible with their devices....at the expense of a slow down in device. They went about it wrong. But it is what it is. NOT every apple phone magically slowed down the instant that 11 was installed on it, NOR did they magically slow down the day the "new" phones were released.

 

The Apple slowing down iPhones thing
Louis Rossmann <== Has Apple Repair business, does not disappoint

 

We need a list of all phones that the owner can replace the battery themselves (maybe a website that`s updated), I will not buy another non-user replaceable battery phone.

John.

 

I was hoping the Samsung Note 8 would have motivated companies to bring back replaceable batteries, but maybe this Apple fiasco will not only bring back replaceable batteries, but also bring back innovation to competing companies - instead of copying Apple's designs - which turns out isn't such a good idea any longer.

 

It would have saved Samsung a lot of money if the Note 8 had a user replaceable battery.

But on a second though, It was making the battery so thin that any fault in manufacturing, On the Note 8 battery the anode and cathode touched (bang), also the battery need a small amount of space as they can swell/expand slightly when being charged, and this was not done as far as i have read.

So making phones thinner and thinner bit Samsung in the ass.

EDIT: So have they started selling all the returned Note 8 phones?

John.

 

I fix it for you
Making phones or notebooks thinner and thinner... Is a awful idea!! Will never bring something good.

 

Apple’s $29 Battery Replacement Program Does Not Require a Failed Diagnostic Test

https://www.extremetech.com/mobile/...ail&utm_campaign=extremetech&utm_medium=title

John.

 

I'm not convinced that it's overall bad. I mean, PCs aren't the size of refrigerators any more. The very LGA systems we glorify here are a product of miniaturization to some degree. The above problems in construction were errors in execution, but I think it's a mistake to consider a goal flawed because of failures along the way. As with every technology, eventually someone gets it right and we remember the problems along the way as bumps in the road, if they are remembered at all. Besides, I'm sure that advancements in thin tech can possibly have benefits that go back up the line to the higher performance tech that we like. Miniaturizing one part (battery/capacitor, lcd, etc.) can potentially free up more room for other things in the form factors we appreciate. Less space taken up by a battery might mean more space for cooling. I'd prefer to be optimistic about what advancements in any area can mean for others.

 

Well offer 2 versions, PRETTY (slim, non-removable battery) and PRACTICAL (boxy, user-removable battery) version.

John.

 

That would be ideal. Battery pack cases were a nice stop-gap, but nothing will substitute for an actual replaceable battery for some.

 

Personally I was a fan of the 5s design, I liked the boxy look. Felt like I wasn't going to bend it in half holding it in my hand.

 

The 5S was the last iPhone I owned before going Android, and agreed, it was very solid feeling.

 

In my totally subjective opinion, the iPhone 5S (or SE) is the best looking iPhone ever made. Not for me because I like phablets, but just stunning design.

 

Rumor has it that there is a new SE in the pipe. Same size as the SE but with 4.7" screen...that's interesting. I could be down for that device.

 

This is my passmark score for iphone 7 128GB version https://www.iphonebenchmark.net/baseline.php?ids=671838
Can you test yours as well. Geekbench is too expensive for a single iOS license.

 

I just ran mine....your phone is a "bit" faster...very slightly...I don't know how to post my scores...but your 3d score was 1812, mine was 1809. your cpu was 212ish...from what I read and mine is 192...thats the difference between the a9 and 10 chips I figure...

 

Okay kojack just check out this link https://www.iphonebenchmark.net/baseline.php?ids=672246,671838


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Sorry it is a mess typing on a phone. The scores are bad because of thermals. I can try for better scores. The update 11.2.2 feels snappy and fast. I'll try to beat iPhone 8 and x based on pass mark ratings and not on cpumark scores.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Cool. I don't mess with benchmarks anyways....They are not an indication of real world use. My phone is fast, gets great battery and I have no issues with it. I don't care what it benchmarks....It's like dyno'ing a vehicle. It has X number of horsepower, I am not changing or tuning it so who cares what it actually gets on the dyno. Drive it and enjoy it.

 

I'll update the post if I get better battery life or not.
Your 6s can beat an iphone 7 if jailbroken. They simply restrict the phone's performance.
Let's see how it goes.
Do you have a problem in safari where the full link is not shown because Safari decides to trim it down to fit the screen?

 

Some people need to know that in theory with a professional driver, their machine could beat someone else's, which is what makes the dyno numbers so popular. That mentality extends to computers and phones as well. You don't need to do that, but it can be fun. Makes mundane daily use more fun knowing that "if I wanted to I could". I'll admit though, it doesn't really have the same effect with phones for me.

 

Nope. I build Custom motorcycles/ATV's/UTV's/Snowombiles as my Job. I know all about dynoing stuff...as I do it regularly...but for the NORMAL driver...it's useless information.

 

That's what I was getting at, I'd guess the majority drivers/riders (rather than mechanics/builders) who have dynoed their personal vehicles have never used them remotely close to the edge of their performance envelope, they don't do it because it's useful, they do it because it makes them feel good about what they bought and so they can brag about the numbers they got.