*** Official Sager NP8170/Clevo P170HM Owners Lounge ***

If I prop up the back of the laptop with something under the feet I can drop the temp due to airflow

 

So rsdunphy your avatar IS the HAL 9000? Nice.....

So this lounge comes alive around midnight, eh?

 

Yessir! HAL is so cool, I'm always on this forum, everybody is cool and helpful. Got laid off so I got some time on my hands for a bit. Here is my desktop, nice n simple. Don't like adding huge BMPs for desktop picture. HAL is only small JPG centered. I can't take claim to making my avatar, found it on the web. Made my HAL from snapshot from 2001 A Space Odyssey.

 

Yeah, this forum actually was instrumental in my choice of laptops, glad I stumbled upon it. Seeing the resellers so responsive, & the obvious geek power displayed is awesome. I now understand the idea of calling it a lounge, "just hangin' out here Boss".

Then there are the titles, wow-what does it take to become a Notebook Deity? or a tech x 3. Guess I'll hang out awhile and see.....

RS, what ship was that anyway?

 

I know it was stupid of me, but had to urgently connect my computer while travelling. It was really an emergency. Since there was no possibility for a ground in any outlet of this remote hotel in the mountains, I ripped the ground off the cord and plugged in. Now that the emergency is finished and back I was about to order a new one from the sager accessories page. Does anyone have any alternatives or suggestions. I remember there was talk about a smaller version of the brick but don't remember.

BTW is there a simple way to see if i'm damaging anything voltage/ground wise? In HWINFO 32 maybe? In CPUID I see my vdeo card voltage and it goes from .90 to 1.1v sometimes but if i remeber its normal. There is a bit of static now on the palm rest of the keyboard when plugged in, so i tend to shut off, charge the battery and unplug during use. This would help me alot as well when travelling to the thrid world as sometimes erratic generator power used to create some havoc with static on other pc's.
Thanks for the possible help

 

Something may not be right there then. I have the same laptop and played The Witcher 2 for hours and the maximum temp reached was 83C and I did not use FN+1, I could barely hear my fans. Try raising the back of your laptop a bit. My room also has the same temp you described according to the digital thermometer.

However, my GPU used to reach 92C during intensive games like Crysis before reseating and repasting, now no game has pushed it beyond 83C. My temps were a little high during testing until it was reseated.

 

Guess I'll try propping the back up a bit more. I'd really rather not disassemble/re-seat/re-paste/reassemble.

 

I'm willing to bet anything that 98% of the people have temp issues has something to do with the heatsink not being mounted correctly. Thermal paste application means nothing if the heatsink is off. From my experience the heatsink used on the notebooks (at least the 6970M) is very flimsy, and kind of difficult to get mounted 100% correctly.

As a test, try running HWInfo32. You'll see 4 different temps related to the gpu: Core, DispIO, MemIO, and Shader. All of these temps should be within ~1-3C of each other. If there is any variance greater than that, your heatsink is not mounted right. I've seen situations where the Core is at like 60C but the MemIO is well over a 100C.

 

Those temp sensors are not that accurate. Heck on my CPU I have had temp variations of 10C between cores. I even removed and repasted several times and no difference.

But in any case can't hurt to repaste. This has solved issues for me in the past.

 

I've gotten all those sensors about equal with each other a few times before, and that has been when my temps were the best. I wouldn't want to play around with having one part of the card running cool while another part is out of spec.

It took me awhile to discover those other temps with the gpu. I used to think everything was fine and dandy as long as the main core temp was fine. I was quite surprised when I found that the other 3 temps were all over the place. Every part of the gpu core should be getting good and completely equal contact with the heatsink, or else you'll never get everything in sync. If one screw is tighter than the others it can throw everything off.

 

I currently have an Nvidia 470m gpu in my Sager NP8170. I would like to upgrade to an ATI 6970m. Sager is saying I now have to stick with Nvidia but if I also change the heat sink why would this be a problem?

 

Probably saying that because the radeon is being discontinued due to short supply. They can no longer get it so you are stuck with an nvidia 560 or 485.

 

ATI posted a driver update for the HD6970m on their website on 6/15 and I downloaded it and attempted to install it last night only to have the installation fail. I followed ATI's instructions for uninstalling the current driver and then installing the new one (Version 11.6 with AMD Display Driver Version 8.861). I contacted Sager support this morning and was told that the HD6970m card in the NP8170 is an OEM version and that I should be using the driver posted on Sager's website and on the CD that came with the computer (it is Display Driver Version 8.810).

So am I correct in assuming that the HD6970m installed in the NP8170 is not the same as the retail version of the card?

 

I believe it has been posted here before that there IS a physical difference. There are two different laptops made , one for each card. It is not just a matter of "popping" in the new card anymore. There are physical cooling connection differences.

And being "stuck" with the best graphics card out there as in the GTX485M is not a bad thing at all.

 

I realize that there are two different versions of NP8170 to accommodate the ATI and nVidia video cards. My question though is whether or not the NP8170 built for the ATI card contains a retail version of the HD6970m or is it a special OEM modified version according to a(n assumed) lowered spec for the card?

 

Except the price for performance.

 

I would like to expand on this theme.

Maybe our resellers can weigh in on this: what cards are retail-spec if any? If one wanted to later add say the '485 card (and undoubtedly that would be sourced at the retail level, NewEgg et al) what do we need to know? I know that the OEMs often get a "special" (aka "OEM") version of some components. Just as often (as was mentioned above) there are special drivers required. We could use a matrix of what works where.

So the "THEORY" of later upgrading our machines, is often just that, not "REALITY". This is not a rant against our resellers or Sager /Clevo. But as enthusiasts who delve in the "boutique" world of computers- what info can we get now that will allow us to KNOW what we can later do?

Thanks!

 

And that! is a great question. I feel that we got the real deal and that this is not a watered down version. I feel that maybe a Dell or an HP would get a cheaper version but not a Sager. There is just too much reputation from all us guys and gals that play with the best stuff and are willing to pay a bit more for our performance. Ya know, we ARE kinda snobby about our laptops. Like the Apple or Alienware folks. And we are very few and far between. I never met anyone who had a Sager but me. My first laptop was a Pro-Star. Cutting edge in 1988.

 

How come you went with nvidia card and not the 6970m

And yes, I wanted THE best GPU out there with price not a consideration. This is my last laptop. About 2 years or so from now my next toy will be a tablet that can run Ms office, henceforth, some of my lower spec games. I have used a "convertible" laptop that turns into a tablet and really like using my finger to navigate in windows. The two things I would have liked on my NP8170 is a touch sensitive screen in matte that I could navigate by touch and also a backlit screen. I would have paid for those. I would like a 12" tablet. Ya, I know, I am living in a Utopian world where there is no android, apple, linux or windows. I have a rooted 7" barnes and noble nook color running honeycomb and just love the thing. My wife plays bigfish hunt and find games and wants a tablet when they write games for it.

 

So they make 2 different laptops for the video cards....interesting.
Still, if one had a 6970m and wanted to swap in a 485, you can do it right?
Isnt that what upgradable graphics mean?

 

Don't quote me, but no, I don't think it is that simple. I believe there was a sales rep from one of our boutiques that said it was different hardware, That is why they (clevo) makes a separate version. I think it is the actual cooling hardware that is different. But send an email or better yet:

Hey Malibal or Xotic, does this persons question hold water? That's from Joe Pesci in "My Cousin Vinny". I know ... sit down and STFU ...

 

Thanks RS. Will be interesting to know. Would really surprise me if the answer was no. It was my understanding that MXM3 cards are interchangeable. Laptops are definitely not my specialty however. If that is not the case dang, I may of went with the 485m instead.

 

At the risk of getting ahead of myself..... or changing the vibe of shock surrounding the "other GPU" missing in action:

GPU drivers for the '560M - use the drivers from Nvidia's site or Sager? When I get my NP8170 tomorrow, I intend to not change anything for a few days, but, I want to start collecting any updates right away, do a clone save of the system drive after all my apps are installed and then begin the tweaks. On my last computer (a Sony F, and it was.... ) I used the "Nvidia Verde" drivers & it was good, even though the computer was so not Sony-like.

 

If the nvidia site says it supports the GPU go ahead and use it, otherwise use Sager's.

 

Because it was about $150 cheaper. Hind sight being what it is, I should have paid the extra money and bought the 6970m.

 

You can use the drivers on nvidia site. Just make sure you get the mobile ones.

Edit. I want to add that I swapped out the boot drive for a SSD drive and it makes all the difference. The system went from very fast to retarded fast real quick.
I even went with the not the fastest intel 320 drive and its still very fast.

Even boots faster then my gaming rig which has a OCZ Revo PCI-E Raid 0 SSD Card in it lol.
Takes about 8 secs or so from end of bios to be at login screen.

 

Seeing as you got a VERY new Sager, you have at least very new drivers. I would just take it out on the freeway for a week or so. That is what I did. I just learned how to use it. I did not update the video driver until a couple of weeks ago. Did not make any difference. I don't game that much so I am not into getting the last bit of frames per sec. My gig is number crunching for 3D CGI. my laptop is most of the time when not cruising the internet, is rendering scenes and transcoding. I drink and drive on the side (pun intended)

My feeling is that this baby just plain cooks and I don't want to mess with it!

 

Good advice to leave it alone for a bit, so I will, barring any problems.....

I have checked on Sager's site and there is a GPU driver dated Jun 10,2011 there, and on nVidia's site a GPU driver dated Jun 1,2011 (a Verde release). Seems like a good move to try the Sager first (yeah yeah-I'll wait ) at some point.

I am very interested in going with an SSD, I think the sweet spot ($$) for me to get one is not that far off. So the next question would be: if I swap in an SSD for the system drive, and move the 500GB drive into a optical bay caddy (which I will need to get) anybody hazard an opinion if I could RAID the 2nd hdd with the (same size) drive that I replaced with the SSD? (that is to say, RAID drives 2 & 3)

Beyond opinion, has anybody actually done this? For my needs (video editing) this would be the bomb.( SSD & RAID 0 )

"Anyone, anyone" with apologies to Ben Stein

 

I don't think you can hardware RAID like you want, but some searching looks like you can software RAID. You would have to partition drives I believe. What I do, and my rendering data, though not professional, is very important to me and I use backup software to make an image of my drive partition on a monthly basis to an external drive. Then that drive goes to a relatives house to be offsite. That way I keep my laptop drives in non RAID and that is the fastest data access.

http://www.technick.net/public/code/cp_dpage.php?aiocp_dp=guide_raid

I will not use "cloud" storage as I don't want my stuff away from my control. Very old fashioned. Back in my HP days, a few of us used to practice hacking on the main frames for fun. I know what can be done. Ain't not nuthin nowhere nohow safe!

I have used this for years and it does a bit for bit exact copy of your hard drive

http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/products/trueimage/index.html

 

Is there any chance that if either Nvidia or ATI come out with new cards this year that they will be the same MXM type so we can swap them out?

I know this machine is killer anyway, but if there is something newer coming out I would hope it would be compatible so I could swap the card in a few years when I need more graphics power.


*edit*

Yeah, I back up to a couple of WD 1tb drives in raid1 and stick em in a fire safe.... Its the only way to do it!

 

This is exactly the situation that I was attempting to address in my earlier post. According to Sager, the new ATI driver posted on the ATI site was not supported by my video card. I was instructed to go back to the driver listed on the Sager site and install that driver. Now admittedly, I did not attempt to force the new driver installation on the updated drivers, by going through Device Manager, but I was being a "good boy" according to the Sager mantra.

BTW, is no one willing to discuss the issue of whether or not the OEM version is a downgraded version of the retail card?

 

The cable that plugs into the brick?
That is an ordinary computer power cord... Google "computer power cord" about $5-10, I have several that came with other equipment.

 

yep, it's a standard type computer cord

 

That was always the problem I had on my G73, AMD was always fuzzy with the catalyst drivers. I'm sorry, but nvidia always made it pretty simple to update. One of the many reasons for the GTX485M

 

Awaiting my Sager NP8170 with custom specs to arrive! Got it from Ken of GentechPC. Hopefully there's no problem when it arrives.

My specs:

- i7-2720qm
- AMD HD6970m
- Intel 510 Series 120GB SSD * Primary
- 500GB 7200RPM HDD * Secondary
- Intel Advanced-N 6230

Hopefully this would last me a long time!

The waiting game begins!

 

Excited for you. Good choice on the ssd + hdd

 

of course!!! I love this computer so much im so paranoid and worried something will happen. Its making me walk on eggshells. thanks and sorry to everyone for wasting space on the forum.

 

I used the standard drivers from ATI's site and they worked just fine for my 6970m. All ati drivers are unified now I believe and do not need a seperate mobile driver.
At least that was my understanding.

I use nvidia's drivers from their site on my 9800m gts laptop and they work just fine as well, the mobile ones at least.

 

In that case, buy an accidental warranty. It may cost a bit, but it's worth peace of mind, plus it comes with a one year warranty in case any component fails on its own, only $79 for a second year. If you're within 30 days of purchase I believe you can still buy the second year warranty.

 

UPS guy was here and my NP8170 is here. First answer that I was requested to relay to the forum:

BIOS: American Megatrends, 4.6.4 release date 5-13-2011

OK, still updating & adding apps. I am psyched dudes!

 

Hey, another thing... I got the Killer Bigfoot wireless-n adapter and have been having to reboot my system on occasion when connecting to a new network. I have tried the windows 7 trouble shooting program and different cmd commands like ipconfig /release then ipconfig /renew and it doesn't seem to help any.

Maybe a problem with the drivers?

 

ORDER Timing Update: My order with Malibal for the Satori P170HM was placed on 6/14/2011
shipped on the 17th and arrived at noon today the 21st. Sweet!! (thanks Malibal)

 

so congrats! how fun!

 

Just played some Dungeon Siege 3 on my radeon equipped laptop and it played flawless at max settings with 4x aa.

Not that its the best looking game however...always good when you can play a new game on a laptop

 

You are very welcome! Please let us know if you need anything else!

 

As far as I know there is no difference. However, the video bios identifies the card as the Sager version of the 6970M. The problem is that the AMD download for mobile consists of a stupid version checking program that checks to see if you have an "approved" system and if so, it downloads the real driver. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, the 6970M in the Sager 8170 system is not on the "approved" list.

You should be able to find an actual copy of the 11.6 mobile driver on the net somewhere. Once you have that, it installs just fine. My wife has the Asus G73 with the 5870 and the AMD software recognizes this just fine, so I use that system to get the real driver file and copy it to the Sager where it installs just fine.

Ira

 

Wrong number.

What's thee 1.xx.xx BIOS Rev?

 

I previously reported what the "Intel Extreme Tuning Utility" indicated for the BIOS . (BIOS 4.6.4)

Here is what I get on startup:
BIOS 1.01.07 aNS1

If it is of any use, here is another data point:
KBC/EC firmware rev 1.00.05 SA1

 

Not sure what you mean by "an actual copy" of the Version 11.6 mobile driver and also where to download it? It would be greatly appreciated if you could provide a link to a usable download version that will install.

Also, any idea if the 6970m in the NP8170 will be "approved"?

 

Try the link in the first post in this thread: ATi Mobility Catalyst 11.6 Display Drivers For Notebooks (15/06/2011)

I have no idea if Sager and AMD will ever allow direct downloads of the Cataylst drivers.

Ira