2080 9900k - which is best laptop?

Hi!

My Alienware m51 broke

It had excellent temperature of 70-85 celcius but it broke because of motherboard powerfailure. I got my money back.

Looking for an alternative.

Sustainable cooling is important to me as setime this will be rendering 4 days straight. Non stop. OC not important to.

2080 GTX essential in very close to desktop performance. The alienware 200 watt performaned better than my own desktop 1080 to.

Considering getting a clevo from hid.

What's the best one?

And is one thing bezel without sacrifice of performance/thermal?

Hope anyone can help

I have little overview because of all the names of clevos just being numbers and letters. Hard to understand what's what.

 

HID is a good choice, especially because they are the only vendor (that im aware of) that offers the previous Clevo flagship P870 with 9900K and 2080. officially, Clevo only offers the P775 and P750 with that combo.

the P870 has superior cooling capabilities and is built like a tank. so my suggestion: by all means go with HID and the P870TM-R

here you can check out the owner's lounge: http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/official-clevo-p870tm-r-owners-lounge-phoenix-5.826848/

 

Bigger is better if you dont mind sacrificing portability.

 

The clevo should give you better thermals and also has some more flexibility (more choices for the display, more HD slots, etc.)
You can opt for the delidded CPU, liquid metal thermal paste, and better thermal pads if you order at HID and want to have best temps.

Unfortunately, as far as I know the RTX 2080 BIOS is still locked and there is no version with more than 150W available for Clevo.
Only AlienWare has the 200W bias so far.

 

The P870 definitely has the best cooling of all the machines that have the 9900K, temps will be great especially at stock and with HIDEvolution's thermal mods. The motherboard is also a much more proven design, as it has been used largely unchanged since 2015 and there have never been any major defects with it.

It is also possible to flash the 200W vBIOS to the Clevo 2080 if you can get hold of it, but I believe you will need a programmer to flash it. Even on the stock vBIOS though, it should still be faster than a 1080.

 

Yes the skypro and 1.8v adapter is the most popular flashing tool.

 

As others have pointed out... Go with HID and the P870TM-R + they offer proper cooling mods + @Prema Custom firmware. Haven't seen many Clevo have went to hardware Heaven as the burning down Area-51m. The Clevo is well proven model.

EVOC High Performance Systems P870TM-R

 

I have the Area-51m. I also owned P870DM/DM3 so I can safely say...

Clevo P870TM-R is the only alternative I'd recommend.

Just be sure to buy it from a Prema partner.

 

Not many people are still offering it.

 

I will chime in with the others to recommend the Clevo P870 over anything else, and definitely from a @Prema partner shop. HIDevolution is my personal favorite, but there are others that will treat you well. https://premamod.com/partner/ LPC Digital and XOTICPC are two additional options in the US. Not sure if all of them still offer this beast.

The first model in the P870 family was released in 2015 and nothing else available in a laptop can touch it. I hope Clevo reconsiders and decides to resume production of it with single GPU and SLI vapor chamber.

It's kind of sad the execution and QC on the Area 51m didn't turn out better. It had some nice things going for it, but being fire prone and performance capped sucks. But, the mess it turned out to be has highlighted how awesome the P870 is for those that didn't already know.

 

I'd hope for a similar ethos but designed around a single card.

 

Sure, that make sense under the circumstances. But the short term approach they decided to take doesn't make good sense. Until the day arrives that something better is ready, there is no real need or good reason for them to retire the platform. If they're eventually going to reinvent the wheel they should at least have a wheel in the interim until the newer and better one is ready to ship. There is nothing wrong with the P870 and, in fact, it is superior to everything else they have on offer. New P870 motherboards could be built without the second PCI-e slot soldered in place to save a few bucks. Or, they could not change anything except for shipping them with a single GPU and vapor chamber for SLI to make the cooling over the top. They could also re-purpose that slave GPU space for something else. Just discontinuing the entire platform only because the Green Goblin doesn't support SLI on mobile GPUs seems very short-sighted and foolish. Like tossing the baby out with the bath water.

 

single gpu with sli vapor chamber: insta-win on highest TDP mobile gpu, bam! 300-400W easily. mobile KP/FTW3, anyone? might even be feasible to do a 2080 Ti mobile in such a scenario

Sent from my Xiaomi Mi Max 2 (Oxygen) using Tapatalk

 

The P870 vapour chamber could easily handle a 2080Ti, the TDP for that is 260W, wheras you'll be pulling 400W+ with 2 overclocked 1080s. With an overclock you could probably expect 300-400W from it, which should be perfectly manageable. It would probably work even better if they redesigned it and laid it out for a single GPU. The GPU would probably have to be another mutant like the 980 to accommodate the VRM, but as long as they stuck with one form factor it wouldn't be an issue. We can only dream though, I don't expect to see anything above the 2080 any time soon.

 

main issue would be cost. a mobile 2080 ti would likely go into the 2000+ USD/EUR range, for the gpu alone. so a machine equipped with it would likely be in area 51m spheres with the price tag

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Yeah that would be the main issue, though the desktop 2080Ti isn't exactly cheap either.

 

Clevo and others tried, but NVIDIA doesn't allow ODMs to put a 1080Ti/2080Ti into a Notebook.
Would probably make Max-Q look even worse...

 

aaah there's the culprit....doesn#t surprise me in the least tbh typical Nvidia...

 

It's not the first generation the Ti has been requested either.

 

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

 

Are there any reselleres that one could contact in order to buy a barebones version of a p870tm and reuse existing parts?
Asking for a friend.

 

Eurocom sell them but they charge quite a lot for it, @tanzmeister sold some barebones P870s in the past, not sure if he still does or not.

 

Partly why competition would be nice.

 

Where I come from, we call that "manipulation" LOL. And, considering Clevo 1080 has performed close to the same as desktop 1080, I am sure they don't want that. Making Max-Q look bad is easier than it should be. We can always count on the Green Goblin for a healthy measure of nonsense. Probably why they stopped supporting MXM as well. End-user enthusiasts, more often than not with your help , got to be too effective at breaking their rules and achieving more than what the Green Goblin wanted them to achieve. I think maybe it messes with their synthetic next-generation upgrade road map too much. 2080 mobile versus 1080 mobile is a good example of that. There's not enough distance between them on the horsepower "Richter Scale" to warrant the cost for such a small performance upgrade. For most users, getting a new notebook because it sports a RTX 2080 cripple-master GPU is only meaningful if the machine they are replacing is 1070, 980N, 980M or something even more antiquated and anemic by comparison. If they already have 1080 in their notebook it is not compelling enough to justify spending such an ungodly amount of money.

@tanzmeister probably still does. He hasn't been on the forum as much lately since he just opened a new computer shop (lots of hours invested in getting things established). HIDevolution likely sells a barebones option as well. Probably can reach out to @Donald@HIDevolution to confirm what is available.

 

nVidia are the ones that made the chart for Pascal that mobile GPUs are getting closer to desktop GPUs.

Why not say they've caught up and just allow higher TDP 2080s (nVidia limited to 150W but OEMs such as AW/ASUS have 200W) and then just release a 2080Ti lol.

Sucks that they wouldn't allow 1080Ti or 2080Ti. Now that we have at least 2 companies (AW/Clevo) in the game with desktop grade laptops and maybe even a third (MSI) I would hope they can all try together and push for a 2080Ti or 3080Ti.

 

I'm trying to customize the P870TM-R with the exact same specs like my Area 51m and the Area 51m is $540 cheaper than the EVOC system, for the exact same specs!


Moreover, AW comes with a 2 year international warranty while the EVOC comes with a one year warranty only. Also, if OP selects the 9900k option, they're charging extra $195 for the power adapter too. The only difference between the aforementioned systems is that my Area 51m has a 1TB nvme ssd and EVOC has two 512GB nvme SSD as 1TB option doesn't like it is available anymore. I've also not added a $30 perfect panel guarantee option in the EVOC while 51m has it.

So, $500 extra for the exact same specs, for a system which runs at 5% within each other and that comes in a flimsy chassis and looks like its 10 year old system is downright ludicrous and I just cannot justify it.

I just don't see the value of the EVOC compared to the Area 51m. The customer service for overseas customers by Hidevolution and EVOC is absolute garbage too. I've had a 1080 based 870TM1 which I ended up returning last year and it was by far the worst purchase I've ever done. It was being raved about in the NBR forums and the experience was owning one was quite opposite to be honest. It was so flimsy and screen had an yellowish tint on it and I ended up returning it. The refund process was also a nightmare as 30 day return policy doesn't apply to us overseas customers.

So, I would urge OP to weigh in all the factors with an open mind before making a $4000+ purchase.

Edit: How do I post high quality screenshots using Tapatalk?



Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

Not every ones experience is the same, and it sounds like you were unlucky?

But for the extra cost you get, far superior cooling solution, which is alpha and omega in these laptops. And a non-neutered system that won't be throttling because of some behind the scenes code.

 

Can you share links to this store, or is it an offline store? О_о

 

I do not know if he is that far along to have an online presence yet. I believe it may be in Russia or Finland.

 

The EVOC system is backed by people that actually care about their customer, and the EVOC system is less likely to catch on fire or die a month or two outside of its warranty period. And, it isn't crippled by cancer firmware or limited to 2400MHz on RAM. It has amazing @Prema firmware that makes the Clevo everything the Alienware will never be. I unwatched the Alienware Area 51m thread because every time I read the nonsense going on in it all it does is ruins my day and makes me more angry with Dell for selling such an overpriced, broken down pile of trash.

Yes, it looks super nice. But, so do high-end prostitutes. And, they don't actually love you... even if they say they do.

 

Have you seen Donald's comments on the Area-51m vs. Clevo in the reddit thread?

Have you seen all flaws with the Area-51m? I'm sure you have

Second and last... Have you seen Alienwares QC and quality problems the last 6 years?


How will the Area-51m stack up regarding quality? If this new Aw model follow its predecessors from the last years... This doesn't look very promising. And even worse for those who opted for minimun warranty. + buy spare parts second hand will be a Nightmare! http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-owners-lounge.826831/page-1133#post-10913163

For the records.. OWNorDisown on YouTube haveen't experienced same with Clevo P870 series as what you did. And he have tested same model several times (older + refreshed models).

 

A51M with LGA doesn't make sense if they release new Chips and mobo on yearly basis and lock out CPU upgrades on A51m rev1 to sell newer A51M rev X. Limited by BIOS and thermal headroom, the ultimate jokebook laptop engineered to wreck havoc against end user.


High-end prostitutes??
Does it exist? Well, it might. A loss in main part unless you pay more just like 2 power adapters on A51M.

I think Donald is getting mad at A51M rip-off.

 

I think the Area 51m makes great sense for the reason that it is not a BGA turdbook and it can be repaired. And, it still runs better than a BGA turdbook in spite of the fact that it is crippled. So, I give kudos to them for having an option that isn't BGA garbage. It's absolutely a step in the right direction for them and other brands should follow the lead of Clevo, just as Alienware has had the good sense to do.

It's just unfortunate that Alienware gimped it. But, that is their modus operandi and I fully expected it based on their history of always doing that to everything (including their desktops). Maybe we will get lucky and MSI and ASUS will release something with a desktop CPU capable of competing with Clevo that doesn't have a proprietary GPU and hasn't been CPU neutered as much as the Area 51m.

 

I feel like the AW machines are like newer cars.
You open the hood and there's a plastic shroud around the whole engine.
Only thing you're allowed is to refill the sprinkler fluid.

 

But I feel users can't upgrade their A51M's CPU to 10th gen 14nm++ PCLGA because BIOS support will be missing anyway and that lower DRAM freq will put down most RAM performance benefits as well.

 

They can't upgrade their BGA turdbooks either. But, at least they don't have to choose between selling it for parts, throwing it away, or spending $1200-1500 on a motherboard when it dies outside of warranty. And, at least they'll enjoy much better performance than they can have with a BGA turdbook. Those are all positive things that shouldn't be dismissed.

Alienware refused to provide simple BIOS updates for their desktop motherboards when everyone else in the world was dropping in an 8700K in place of 7700K, so we shouldn't expect any support for upgrades where Alienware laptops are concerned. They want to sell systems and don't want anyone to be able to enjoy upgrades. That's just how they roll.

Plus, there is a limit to upgrades even in the desktop world. For example, you cannot upgrade from Ivy Bridge to Haswell, or Z390 to X299, or AM4 to TR. And, it looks like next gen AMD customers are going to need a new mobo/chipset to keep up with what AMD has planned for Ryzen (even if the CPU fits the socket). We don't want progress to be stifled only for the sake of being able to claim an easy upgrade. It is bad for those ready to go new on everything to be held back for the sake of those that don't want to spend as much. But, BGA stifles upgrades even when an upgrade would be otherwise possible but for the piece of crap being a soldered abortion.

 

A friends Audi came without a dipstick :/

 

Next time it'll be like..

Spoiler

 

You mean it was shipped without a gear!?

 

Then I feel AW took a wrong decision in the wrong direction. Even if it is upgradable they will find ways to make it worse and force people to buy newer tech with more promises and thermal issues inside the box (not out of the box).
z series to X series requires new mobo nonetheless X series has beefier parts to sustain high clocks and power. I wonder what'll happen if Dell used EVGA X299 board with their same crippled BIOS marketed as LGA Savior?

 

No dipstick means no easy way to check the engine oil level.

 

Ohh... So how does one check it? I don't really trust computers on cars.

 

I am not sure since I didn't know they were doing what @Meaker@Sager mentioned. I would assume checking by computer, and I am with you on that trust thing. Plus, it is just plain stupid to not have any way to manually check the oil level with a dipstick if the computer is the only way. It would be OK if you had both ways available, but not only relying on the computer.

 

Any chances for @Prema update??? Or maybe they need hardware update.
@Papusan Any ideas?

 

Why offer quality if your faithful #disciples# don't care what they will get?

Spoiler: disciples meaning... They will follow you until the utter/bitter end!!

/SPOILER]

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-owners-lounge.826831/page-1135#post-10913233

 

A sensor, there is a pipe for a dipstick with a dummy in it under the engine cover so he ordered a 3rd party one to check it himself.

 

Pretty much this.

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

 

They dont want to upset their larger partners.