My Kobalt Comptuers Saga

Neil,

I understand what you're saying and you're right - once we know the reasons, as some of us do obviously - it becomes understandable why some take longer. Also, no one should be throwing around random accusations about the status of a company when they have no real idea of the facts.

However, a situation being understandable does not make a situation 'okay'. It does not change the fact that some people are stuck in that situation, still owed large amounts of money several months later, and they believe that other people should be made well aware of the potential for this problem.

And rightfully so. That is after all the whole point of a forum like this.

(Note: I'm not one of these, I'm still in my 30 day period... and hoping. But I have talked to more than one person who is over 4 months and still waiting. Understandably, I am rather concerned...)

 

@Neil

What do you expect people to speculate on?

For example, I've been waiting for you to ship me a correct keyboard for 3 months! You've told me time and time again, that the supplier can't deliver.

When i finally call the supplier myself, they have 25 in stock, and have had that for almost 10 weeks!

The logical explanation must be that:

a) You have been hit by all the worlds plagues at the same time. (Which is your usual excuse)
b) Your credit with the supplier is strained, and you cannot make them ship the keyboard.

So which is it?

Today, I still regret that I didn't just cancel my order on your second excuse for a missed delivery date.

 

Im not going to get into these arguments,

However after you "called" the supplier I actually checked with them and they confirmed to me in writing they do not have the foreign language keyboards for the P150/P170

And we dont have issues as we actually received a large consignment of parts from them this week....go figure...

So what you have (If you have it) is more then likely a W860 keyboard.

Pman

 

Just an fyi, I never got a 'very good reason' why my refund took so long. I only got a 'staff member sick, will deal with it tomorrow' about once or twice.



My posting here was generally about being annoyed to the point where I wanted to share my experience, and I believe I did so in a clear way where nothing that I've stated that happened could be written off as my fault or me misinterpreting anything.

Anyway, finally had that cheque clear around last Friday, ordered from a competitor two hours after I checked my account, just 5 working days later, it's been built and awaiting testing. Going to try to put the thought of these wasted past 3 months or so behind me now.

 

I've had to delete a number of posts from this thread. If you have a beef with a particular reseller, message or preferably email them privately and work it out. Thank you.

 

I have it in my hand right here. Which part # do you want, so you can confirm that you've been bull****ing me around?

Do you want the e-mail from Goldenstar confirming that the keyboard is for a W150?

Do you want the invoice confirming that it was a keyboard for a W150?

Do you want the e-mail from Goldenstar confirming that they ave had these in stock for more than 10 weeks?

You guys are NOT trustworthy and the number of "moved" threads on your forum with customers complaining about deliveries is a testament to your current situation.

EDIT: And btw, their phone number is +44 (0)1189269988, anyone can "call" them, and to anyone having problems with Kobalt, just go ahead, Goldenstar are very helpful.

 

UPDATE:

I just installed the keyboard. And you are right Pman, it wasnt for a P150 (like the one you guys put in). It was for a W150. Using Clevo's terms and partnumbers, you guys installed the wrong keyboard, lol.

 

Could you Pman confirm that you are both speaking about the same or different supplier? Did you guys try to order wrong keyboard for him? It would be nice if this issue was clarified by somebody from Kobalt.

 

I cannot beleive these problems are still ongoing! I've never shared my 'experience' with Kobalt before but since they've clearly not changed (I gave them the benefit of the doubt)........

I ordered some months ago, waited for 3 months then had to get a refund........but the 'small' bit in the middle (3 months!) was an appalling experience, to say the least!
Countless excuses for countless missed eta's, phone problems (still going on!!?? - unbelievable!!....from well over a year ago!!), very slow + very poor quality communication.

Recommendation: AVOID!!

On a happier note:
I ended up buying from pcspecialist. How long did it take? 9 DAYS FROM PURCHASE DATE TILL I RECEIVED IT!!
Would I recommend pcspecialist?....er...what do you think?

Lesson Learned (from here and below): do a very simple Google / Yahoo search (company name + complaints/help/problems/poor/etc). Check the results. Have an open mind.....a bit like tripadvisor - take in the picture as a whole. Take in any isolated extremes but in the context of the whole picture. Look for paterns - normally simple to pick up. Gauge the numbers of different complainants (higher the number the greater chance there's a prob).
- all common sense stuff really.

You should do this for smaller cost purchases also - in the last 5 weeks I ordered a custom made guitar amp cover. What I did not do is consult Google beforehand.
Try entering the following into Google:

silverstone amp covers

This search isn't even looking for 'negative' results!! Now have a good laugh at the first page!! - yep check out results 2,3,4,5 (as of 10:15pm on 12.9.11)...the FIRST PAGE!! ....stopped laughing yet?Without going into details, you'll be guessing correctly that I'm in the process of getting a refund. I've also contacted Sage Pay (who take the money) and after a little pushing of evidence, they are interested and are investigating. I Will be contacting my credit card company also.
I ordered from another company (pianocoversonline) and received the cover in 3 days!! They have now received a very positive review in various amp forums. Result for me. Result for them. Job done!

We're not asking for much from companies - most importantly -
1. FAST, HONEST COMMUNICATION.
2. If something goes wrong ALWAYS OFFER (in the options) A FULL, PROMPT REFUND.
If your obey 1 and 2 MOST FOLK GIVE THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT and don't seek a refund!!
3. DON'T REPEATEDLY FRUSTRATE, IRRITATE, AGRIVATE, ANNOY (dosen't even come close to conveying the true feeling but u get what I mean!) THE CUSTOMER
4. IT'S ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO REMOVE BAD INTERNET PUBLICITY.
- this, of course, can work the other way...competitors DO and OFTEN find ways to try to influence opinions on various forums. This applies to ALL online businesses.
[edit.......actually, Forum Moderators CAN and DO remove forum posts. I would ask that they take note that many posts - such as this - also seek to genuinely help and inform other individuals. Please note that paterns of post removal are also picked up by users. You may be deleting dispute evidence!!]

5....this is a new thought.....TRY AND GET AN EMAILED COMPLETION TIME GUARANTEE
-Dunno how this would hold up in law but it might just if worded correctly!! I'll try this in future. If you're not happy with the guarantee given, pause for thought...consider another company...you might finally encounter a 'good' un e.g. pcspecialist.

So, as I said, wear your most open-minded hat, search more than one pathway/forum/etc. Use other search engines. I do this for resort and hotel reviews on all holiday and most item purchases - things have primarily turned out very close to the 'whole picture' I envisaged.
I'm definitely, with good reason, getting a bit more militant in how I deal with companies.

-just my 2 cents. Hope it helps others.

 

For what it's worth, my own saga is still ongoing, I'm still awaiting a refund, and have even been advised by Kobalt to do a chargeback via my bank to get the money back...

Ho hum...

Lets just hope the bank doesn't kick up any fuss because it's been going on so long.

 

Ooops looks like he's had his post deleted again!

Small update from me, my e-mails to Trading Standards and Consumer Direct were met with a lovely response of "tough you're on your own" largely. They certainly weren't willing to provide any help despite me pointing out I'd been waiting over the required 30 days. So I've raised a Section 75 dispute with my bank, they were very helpful and have got the ball rolling straightaway.

At the risk of being banned for speculating I was told by the adviser that in his experience (though this view is not neccessarily that of the bank) this sort of thing often occurs when companies have cash flow issues. Whether this is true or not I don't know, but they see more of this stuff than I do.

The other thing I'm going to do (it's worth a try) is to get in touch with the Head of Card Services for my Credit Card Provider (whom I know as I used to work for them) and suggest that they stop authorising card payments to Kobalt. They've already done this for other problem sellers in the past so it might save them the hassle of having lots of customers calling to do Section 75s. I probably won't get anywhere as the number of transactions is likely to be too small compared to the overall volume they get - but at least they'll know about it.

 

What!!! Advised to do a chargeback??? What reason/s did they give you to recover the money from your own bank - rather than them refunding you??

 

Pman has on a previous occasion, confirmed that it is the same supplier.

 

Rather than heresay - could you provide a link to support your statement? Thanks

 

I would rather not post the e-mail message here. Even though Pman does not include a privacy disclaimer in his signature, and I therefore are not obligated to keep any part of the messages confidential.

I am glad that I kept copies of all my conversations with Kobalt on their forum, since they deleted my forum account (and order queries posts)...

I can, if you insist, provide the documentation for the claim in a private message.

 

Essentially that they've done the refund at their end and the problem delaying the refund isn't something they are in control of. Ie, the problem is caused by whatever intermediary companies are between business and customer these days.

Whether we believe the exact reason or not (and I might as well, I don't really see that they would have any benefit in deception at this point!) makes little difference. It leaves me with no recourse other than to my bank.

*crosses fingers*

 

Dandelionz:
I've just done a little bit of research into the way chargeback, intermediary companies & card payments work. I'm a bit surprised that so many companies are involved in a simple transaction! ....and that, as a result, the process of refund/chargeback isn't more straightforward.
Hope you get the refund sooner rather than later! ....I'm just starting the process of a chargeback concerning Silverstone amp covers. Luckily, it was for a much smaller amount than my (fast turnaround /helpfull/nofuss/etc... pcspecialist!!) laptop.

Arntc:
no probs. Good to see that you got your keyboard issue resolved.

 

See I still have a real problem with this, they're making it your problem to sort with your bank rather than doing it themselves? If they've done a refund through their bank (which frankly I don't believe) why are they not on the phone to them demanding to know why their customers are being treated this way?

Well, a cynic would point out that they get to keep your money a few weeks longer which helps with any cash flow issues. But I'm not a cynic so would never suggest such a thing.

Good luck though - the good news is if you paid on a credit card you have the full weight of the law behind you. And even if it's a VISA chargeback (rather than Section 75) you're more than likely to get a full refund.

 

Yeah, I'd considered that, but I didn't really consider that my amount by itself would make a lot of difference.

Maybe I'm just too trusting (hell, I waited 16 weeks before finaly cancelling ;P) but I figure that a lie at this point is pretty much wasted.

And don't worry, I fully appreciate the fact that I shouldn't be needing to do this, but at this stage, frankly... I just want my money back! I've been eyeing up an XPS for a while now (basically since I started the refund process) and it's looking mighty tempting. But I can't do a thing without my money back first.

 

My own personal nightmare here:

Ordered on the 8th of July
Demanded a refund on the 5th of october
Ordered a g970x
Spent £2,646.17
Paid by money transfer (not card)
Haven´t heard anything from them in like a month.

I´m screwed.

But I´m booking a flight to gatwick next week.
I´ll go to their nearest police station to report them for fraud.
Then I´ll go to the shop (if it still exists) and will try to talk to them.

Save yourself the trouble and go buy somewhere else.

 

It would be nice if more people from the UK joined forces and reported them to police for fraud together. If reported by multiple people, the problem may be taken more seriously. Ask police there how other Kobalt customers (even from abroad) can get in contact with them to avoid duplicate work while investigating the case.

 

Same problem for me. I live in France, I ordered a G150 in May, cancelled it on the fourth of August, received some messages from Kobalt, who promised to refund me within 30 days. 2 months later, still nothing !
I'm worried about that, I think I will send a consumer complaint form to them. If they don't reply, then I'll have to make an European order for payment procedure...

 

And unfortunately, their 'having a backlog' is pretty much status quo for them as far as I can tell.

Last I saw on their forums they were STILL stating "3/4 weeks" when people ask what the current delivery times are... They were saying that in JUNE, and I called them up on it (and had my post moved/removed at the time, as I challenged that assertation, as I was already over 8 weeks, without an end in sight)

Given that people that have ordered in June have very obviously NOT got their products within 4 weeks, and given that they're still giving the same rubbish about a 3/4 week lead time even now (well... a week ago, since their forums have now 'died' it's hard to say!), surely you could make some sort of case from that?

Unfortunately, the only proof is on their forums... and bits that they don't like being on their forums tends to get removed. So there's no evidence to fall back on really.

Anyway, quick update from me. Still no money back from Kobalt. Now I can't even contact them since their forum is having it's security updated (for at least 4 days that I know of ;P) so I'm entirely reliant on Barclays coming through for me... and they're taking their time at the moment (though that might be because our postal service is crap... took 9 days for my paperwork to get to the bank apparently!)

So... it's now 22 weeks since I originally paid over a grand, and I have nothing.

As Shadowstalker says, making a fraud claim stick is probably not possible, as they're very careful to always give estimates, probabilities, and conditional assurances. But as everyone who's dealt with them know, it's impossible to get something approaching a concrete assurance.
It is however appalling bad business practices, that they shouldn't be able to get away with at all, and surely if they have people's money and haven't returned it, it must be criminal in SOME way?...

 

That could be done - police could ask for documentation about your order from Kobalt, list of ordered parts (from both sides, Kobalt and the supplier), and I they may find out that no parts have been ordered for you from supplier at all. They will probably find out this is the case for many customers. In that case it proves they had no intention of shipping your machine, and if they find out the same problem happened for other customers as well, it proves it isn't by accident. The accusation wouldn't be that they aren't shipping laptops at all - it would be that they never intended to ship YOUR laptop, despite all the ETA claims and email assurances. The end result is money has been paid, laptop not delivered and no money returned long after 30 days mandated by law. I think its worth the try even if some of you think it will fail.

 

Except that they often update status to "waiting for parts", "in the build queue", "testing" etc, but quite likely the parts haven't been ordered at all. If they claim laptop is in build queue or being tested, then it would be very suspicious if parts haven't actually been ordered at all.

Over here there used to be companies that borrowed money from people in exchange for huge interest rate (like 20-30%, way higher that any bank would offer you). They kept paying off old customers using newly borrowed money, and guess what, they were prosecuted for fraud. So the argument that they are shipping goods/paying off customers from time to time doesn't always help.

Who knows where the money people send to Kobalt is going, in my opinion such cases are worth to report, as something unlawful may be discovered during the investigation. Customer passivity and stupidity is exactly what feeds fradulent companies, while people keep ony complaining on forums and pubs. If police don't find anything unlawful, then there is only one thing left to do - smash somebody's face hard.

Obtaining the refund is entirely different matter, customers need to take them to court of justice, it won't happen on its own.

 

Have to say this thread makes me feel sad; I've met the guys at Kobalt in person both at the new premises and the old, and spoken to them a lot before now, and was chatting with Pman both when we had M17s before either of us had anything to do with Kobalt; and my thoughts were always they were a load of blokes trying really hard. They've also been top chaps to me through my last couple of machines and through a few niggling faults, there have been delays etc and they've done me far more right than wrong.

It's obvious that something went wrong somewhere for there to be this many complaints, all I can say is I hope it all gets resolved, both for you and the guys at Kobalt.

 

I understand exactly. I purchased a W860CU from Kobalt 2 years ago, and it was a positive experience. I am now buying a new laptop and it is with great regret I cannot take the risk with Kobalt. If you are reading this - Sorry!! Too much bad press to slap down a couple of grand. Long delivery times imply that no supplier will deliver unless payed in advance, and the refund issue would indicate cash flow problems.

 

Kobalt have now ceased trading.