Kobalt Computers Officially out of business

@Tanith

you just send your letters there addressed to KObalt Computers Ltd, they are not for the former directors the letters are for whoever deals with the next stage of the process. The registered address is an accountants that deals with lots of companies. Send your mail by registered post. Do not threaten or anythingelse just keep it factual and enclose copies of any evidence you have.

Please read the info in the links in the first post... its all there.

Good luck

 

Just in case nobody has seen yet, Kobalt has updated the message on their website.

'Further information regarding warranty statuses of Kobalt Computers Ltd's customers will be posted here on Friday 21st October. '
Posted October 18th.

I've just sent out my claims report a couple days ago with some emails stating that they have my computer since October 5th and proof of purchase. Hope to hear from them soon, and hopefully they will post some information this Friday.

 

I've just looked on their site and the message doesn't see any different to me.

I also heard back from PC Specialists about them doing repair work (paid obviously) on Clevo based laptops that weren't supplied by them, basically they aren't interested! Took them 6 days to reply with that! Nice!

 

It's changed for me - try refreshing, I'm sure your browser is just caching it.

 

For the most part its the same, they just added the sentence at the end of their message.

 

Try Goldenstar Computers Ltd

I contacted them regarding the repair of my Clevo M860TU (For when/If I get it back) and they responded saying they are the official service centre for Clevo products and would be able to repair the laptop without any problem. They even attached an RMA form to the response.

 

Hi there, as mentioned earlier I contacted Goldenstar/Clevo UK+DE to try and find out whether there was any reprieve for warrantied owners.
The basic gist of it is that Goldenstar UK will do PAID repair work, but will not take on the warranties.

In other words, if your Chassis was from Sager or from the likes of Fortune, you might be best contacting them. Here is the feedback I got from Goldenstar/Clevo:

Clevo.De

Goldenstar UK had this to say:

Edit:
There's been an update on the Kobalt Computers site RE: Warranties.
It states more information in regards to the warranties etc should be being posted on the site Friday.

 

A statement about the money they owe to customers might be nice!

 

Check it. I ordered my laptop on:
4th October 2010 at 16:56
and the transaction is still not completed. It took almost a year for them to get the laptop to me, it was shipping on:
9th August 2011 at 00:04
But the order is still not complete. They have yet to give me the partial refund they owe me due to lack of fingerprint reader and downgrading the storage drive.

The stuff in this thread should be very helpful though, so thanks guys. But I think i win for longest wait time for a laptop ever.

 

I don't know whether you're aware but fortune went bust a month or so ago - I posted on the Kobalt forum about it but my post was removed! Fortune seem to have been acquired by PC Specialist but I doubt they have taken on any of the warranty obligations.

 

At least you have your laptop.

Some people are down £2-3k or more and have nothing..

 

Sorry to all to all those who lost money on this - I was in the same boat in 2008 when Rock went under.

Polite note to moderators - you were shutting down "Kobalt hasn't shipped my notebook for X months!" threads with quite a bit of zeal. These threads started springing up almost a year ago, with all the signs of cash flow issues serious enough to entail a reasonable risk of going out of business (which this thread now confirms). Most threads complaining about missing refunds/shipping delays, were quickly locked on the grounds that they were "a private matter". Or that Neil/Andrew had fully explained their failure to deliver a notebook for 5 months or more, by citing one public holiday, problems with his phone, and a plague of locusts. Looking at all the dozens of people on here (and probably hundreds overall) who lost money now, I wonder if that sort of moderating was fair to these people? Since I'd had the "Rock experience", and visit NBR frequently, I managed to catch a glimpse of these threads before they were locked, and so saved a lot of my heard earned money by ordering my latest Clevo from a reseller that was clearly not in serious danger of going out of business. Can we please learn some lessons here?

 

@Alexrose
Thanks for the update that is most useful I have copied a permalink to it in the first post to keep things up to date.

@henrybutt

Hi thanks but yes we do know already and have had great advice from another reseller Jack-Ibo re warranties (see link first post). We will in the meantime have to wait for the Kobalt warranty announcement as and when it finally arrives.

To anyone new please look at the first post in particular which I try and keep updated. There is info for just about every aspect of the situation so far including money, RMAs, Registered company address etc. Feedback and information is welcomed so please let us know if you have any news about Kobalt and also how you get on with the things that you are doing.

@Varadero
you raise an interesting point about the earlier Kobalt threads but NBR never deleted them so they do remain for people to see. This is more than Kobalt did. Kobalt removed forum posts that complained or questioned deliveries. The other issue for those like myself that waited 5 -6 months from payment to delivery, was the Intel Sandy Bridge recall which was legitimate so it was hard to untangle the issues. I got suspicious because firstly they had too many excuses.... like you said from phone problems to plagues of locusts; and second they never made any effort to communicate individually with customers which is outrageous when they have held your money up front for so long. I don't suppose I will see the rest of the money they owe me but if they still had my laptop they would have made me bankrupt as it is my work.

Notice the difference in customer services and strategic communications with how Intel handled the Sandy Bridge fault. They managed to pacify and keep happy millions of impatient computer buyers and resellers by being open and upfront with the information from day one.

Like you, I now tell everyone to go to NBR for reviews, forum advice and feedback about models and resellers. We are very lucky it exists. I do think they should have a geekie smiley though

 

Polite answer

Our members that have been around for a while have not lost any money that I know about
If they did they would have had to be blind , as the threads that you mention are all here
Unfortunately what I'm seeing here that it's our new members, that have recently found our forum through web searches,that are out of pocket

Our regulars see which retailers are here on a regular basis
These are our retailers that have proved to me time and again that they are going to help out their customers with issues, and in my mind these guys are going to be around for a long time

GenTechPC
MALIBAL
Xotic PC
Power Notebooks
LPC Digital
Fortnax Notebooks
Logical Blue One

I may have missed a couple, but these are the guys that I see here every day , contributing to our forum

 

@Alex:

agree with your forum comment.... Please add Logical Blue One in Australia to your list as Jack-Ibo was so helpful to us regarding warranty support and he didn't have to.

 

Yes I remember his helpful post now
Added

 

Anecdotal 'evidence' mostly, but... for what it's worth.

When I was first about to buy from Kobalt (back in April!) I did indeed come here and saw a couple of people complaining about their service, BUT, there were also several people saying "yes, it was really bad at the end of last year, they've turned the corner now, things are much better" (you get the idea)

Point is, there was some evidence of 'badness', and perhaps it should have warned me away from buying from them, but there were a lot of people saying it was much better now as well.

I figured that I should be safe giving them the benefit of the doubt, since other people seemed to have a lot of faith in them.

Bad choice by me!

My point is, evidence of the risks of going with Kobalt was on this forum, but it was balanced out with good news as well.

Make of that what you will. But I'm fairly sure that any post deletion people were talking about at the time would have been on Kobalt's forums, not here. (Since I've seen their overzealous post deletion many many times on Kobalt's forums since April!)

 

Completely agree on all points, I ordered in July which was just before the major groundswell of complaints started. There's no way I'd have ordered had those sorts of things been obvious at that point.

 

Same here. I also knew about the chronic delays, but it was also clear that people were receiving laptops from Kobalt and were quite happy with them. Since I didn't need the laptop urgently and their prices were very good (especially compared to Switzerland where I live) I decided to order from them. Didn't expect it to take over 3 months though....and definitely didn't expect this to happen.

 

Exactly the same here, I ordered just before the flood of complaints came in, I didn't see anything out of the ordinary, on this Forum. I buoyed up by the fact that their own forum was quite active, and people did seem to be getting laptops. I have another problem aswell, I work away from home, so most of my admin has to be done at weekends when I'm at home, So hopefully the claimback forms will be waiting for me.

 

I frequent the Asus section and a couple of years ago when the G73 series was anounced I watched as members were placed on waiting lists and waited 4 or 5 weeks for their laptops to arrive
And that was just at the start,for a month or two after that customer orders were filled quickly

For comparison when I read threads like the thread I link below would just pass ,and move to one of our regular retailers here (I don't like to wait)

Buying online from a retailer in the US or from a retailer in Canada,as I live in Canada is normal for me


Most of you guys are from the UK ,so I guess Vat /shipping times and having local warranties must have influenced your decisions


http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo/550290-kobalt-computers-etas-help-pls.html

 

Any reason why Kobalt is still listed as being an active company with Company House?

Does that status not change until they officially go into administration?

 

Yeah Alex I think you are right about the UK....

I look with envy at Xotic and Maribal for instance who seem to offer their customers such consistently good service and always stay in touch here on NBR too. But most of us want warranty support and mailing a laptop to the States is prohibitive. And VAT is 20%

Look at the date I joined NBR. That was when I discovered Clevo and I discovered them because of this site. I was hunting for a laptop that could handle Hi Def video editing and Photoshop and Audio mixing..... I had a long list of requirements and only Clevo came near it or very very expensive Lenovos with limited upgrade possibilities.

Then I learned about Sandy Bridge and it all fell into place. Kobalt seemed ok and although I saw some complaints on here I did believe the excuses at first so I paid in December 2010.

I received my laptop in May 2011 after asking, pleading, explaining, throwing fits you name it. The problem was I got into a situation where getting the money back would potentially take even longer and I had a project deadline.............

The laptop came minus some upgrades I'd paid for but luckily by then I saw even more complaints here and decided against sending it back for fitting. So I've lost money which I cannot afford but at least I got my laptop.

This Reseller Forum is an excellent idea - it keeps reseller issues away from other threads and makes a really clear historical reference point for potential buyers. A future Kobalt would now stick out like a sore thumb.....

Now it looks like PC Specialist are aiming to be the Sagar of the UK by buying up the importer (which would of course have also impacted on Kobalt.......) but they never interact in the NBR forum and they keep their range quite limited and that's all a shame.

I also feel that here at NBR I have a degree of support and knowledge from others that gave me the confidence to actually go for it with a non-standard laptop.

I do think Clevos are going to get more and more popular in the UK (and everywhere) because as someone else said look at how their 'brand' is growing without any advertising just lots of delighted customers singing their praise.

 

Probably, also until they are wound up or go into liquidation there is a (slight) chance someone else could buy them.

 

With the state of the Kobalt Computers name I doubt it. You wouldn't be buying them for that or their logistical prowess!!!

 

As a point of note, my bank has credited my account with a refund for my Kobalt transaction today... via VISA debit chargeback.

However, as has already been stated elsewhere, I'm not sure this means much... they can just as easily take it away again if they can't get the money from Kobalt (as I understand it) which is obviously the likely outcome.

 

Sidartha I'm not 100% au fait with Chargeback rules, but I'm pretty sure that they can only take the money back if the merchant or merchants back challenge the chargeback. As they're bankrupt I can't see they'll have any legitimate grounds to do so, fingers crossed you may be one of the lucky ones.

 

@sidartha

LoL!

Congrats on the chargeback and fingers xed probably wise to pretend it is not there for now but Powernerd makes a good point. I haven't heard anything about mine.............

 

Don't you guys check the Kobalt Computers website!

www.kobaltcomputers.co.uk

 

Blogins have you lost the plot or something?

 

I don't think so, no.

It's an updated message mentioning some further information coming on Friday 21st October.

 

And how long have we been discussing this on this (now 29 pages long) thread and me updating the links on the first post every morning......... sigh! (I even put it in bold with little stars on either side.....)

 

Lucia, he's trying to help, no need to act that way. : )
We all appreciate this thread very much

 

I asked him if he'd lost the plot - suspect you missed that bit!

And I thought it was a "breaking news" ticker.... but honestly you think folks would have a read of at least the first post.....

 

My condolences to all those who were last in the qeue.

Reading through those old posts it still makes my blood boil; all the excuses, the lines about only a small minority of customers having issues and the making complainees out to be unreasonable, spiteful, fantasists.

Accepting responsibility, making a full apology and explaining what happened would be a welcome start.

 

Whilst we're all annoyed to one degree or another, there are quite possibly legal reasons as to why more has not been said so far.

Maybe, maybe not, but if other companies are involved in why they went under, then that does have to be borne to mind. I do hope people without a machine get sorted out though and manage reclaim at least part of thier money

 

They've updated it again. Best for everyone to have another read of their website. I'll post the new info below though. Doesn't look like it was entirely their fault after all.



AMENDMENT - 20TH OCTOBER 2011

Further to the update on 18th October, more information is now available.

It has previously been stated that two separate companies contracted to provide merchant services to Kobalt Computers Ltd were the major contributing factors to the company ceasing trading. The first of these companies was WorldPay, a merchant service provider that was contracted to provide these services for Kobalt Computers Ltd. During the time that WorldPay were providing Merchant services, Paypoint (previously known as Secpay) was contractedas a payment service provider; Kobalt Computers Ltd would like to make it very clear that Paypoint had at all times (since 2007) provided an excellent level of service and was not involved in any detrimental actions towards Kobalt Computers Ltd. The involvement of a payment service provider (PSP) is standard procedure for any company taking credit & debit card payments.

The second company is PayPal who, after WorldPay's contract was terminated, provided payment services from debit & credit card transactions and direct Paypal payments.

Both of these companies had retained substantial sums owing to Kobalt Computers Ltd. Kobalt Computers Ltd had to undertake legal action to recover these funds, which did result in partial return of the sums. The return of the remaining funds (due back on the days prior to the cessation of trading) was not forthcoming as Kobalt Computers Ltd believe they should have been under the legal agreements and contracts in place. Without these funds being returned it was impossible for Kobalt Computers Ltd to continue trading.

Immediately prior to the Shareholders meeting of 11th October 2011, WorldPay and PayPal were holding between them in excess of £75,000. Kobalt Computers Ltd stands by its view that these funds should have been returned to the company in full as per the legal and contractual agreements.

CONTINUATION OF KOBALT BRAND

Following investor interest, negotiations are currently underway to continue operating the Kobalt brand and product range. It is hoped that an announcement will be made regarding this on or around Thursday 27th October.

WARRANTY OF KOBALT COMPUTERS LTD PRODUCTS

As part of the negotiations for the continuation of the Kobalt brand, the various parties involved are exploring the possibility of limited warranty support. Further information will be provided at the earliest opportunity.

 

well spotted Elltot you must have got there within minutes of it being posted cos I only looked a wee while ago when bogins posted....
Have updated first post with a link to your post........

Hmm I suspected there was something going on with payment sites because when I started this thread I was enquiring about third party payment sites. And Kobayashi shot his mouth off at me about it..... If you look at the information for Companies on PayPal they talk about holding funds to protect from fraudulent chargebacks. But likewise they make it almost impossible for customers to make a chargeback. There's loads of sites for businesses complaining about PayPal. But that doesn't explain all Kobalt's behaviour for the last year....

I hate Paypal and now refuse to use them and it is not the only way for companies to take payments. It is the only way when companies do not have sufficient credit rating to run their own secure Visa payments.........

Fingers Xed for Kobalt's negotiations......................

 

Hopefully once the cash starts flowing again they can resolve all the issues posted here.

It's not going to be easy for a company to come back from this however.

 

I do hope that Kobalt does continue. They were once a very good company with excellent customer service, who delivered high quality products.

They really would need to work hard to be that again.

 

This is very interesting information, I wonder though (and this is pure speculation) how much of this situation was due to the number of chargebacks/Section 75 disputes Kobalt customers have raised because of lack of delivery (going back to the summer). Previous posters on this board have questioned what reaction payment service providers will take to what looked like a higher than average level?

Still, this is good news for everyone in a bad position, or at worst it's a small glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel!

 

I agree with the previous poster - I would also speculate that the payment service providers would only hold back funds for good reason: if many customers were getting frustrated about long waiting times and poor communication by Kobalt and started requesting chargebacks and refunds en masse.

 

'Morning guys......

glad some of you have seen the notice - everyone else go back to p29 or follow link from first post - and good to have some news......

However, probably best not to speculate and also not to get hopes up too much. I don't want to rain on anyone's parade but we still do not know at this point what lies ahead. I think Powernerd's "glimmer at the end of the tunnel" is probably the wisest approach!

I don't want to get into it but please be aware that PSPs and 'third party payment providers' are slippery as hell which ever side of the deal you are on. There's a wealth of material on the subject if you look but probably best not to discuss it here for now..........

 

Mornin' all.

Curious to see that some people have got money back relatively soon after their chargeback claim, whereas Barclays has told me I have to wait the 30 odd days to give the merchant a chance to reply to Barclays.

I wonder if it's just because my claim went in BEFORE they went under, whereas other peoples were after?...

It's annoying... either way

As for the news, I'm not sure it would make a lot of difference to us to be honest. Kobalt always told me that they had already processed the refund to me at their end, and had done everything they could. If it's really these PSP's that haven't then sent the money where it was supposed to go, I don't see Kobalt coming back to life changing that.

Obviously it's good news for Kobalt, it's workers, and the brand, but I don't think it'll make any difference to those of us who are already awaiting refunds, as the problem with them wasn't with Kobalt (so we were continuously told anyway... it's always possible that was a delaying tactic on their part though, but that's pure supposition of course.)

(And also, I know this is treading old ground, but I feel obliged to point out that even if the payment side of things wasn't Kobalts fault, their... how can I put it... continued obfuscation of the facts, or unwillingness to be straight and honest with their paying customers, is still the part that caused most of our problems. That can't be excused as the fault of one of the PSP's)

 

What utter tosh.

Speaking as a small business owner myself I really cant believe what a bunch of incompetents Kobalt Computers seem to be. Why even bother updating that website message unless it is to give some pertinent information to their out of pocket customers regarding their receivership or claims procedures.

The update they posted looks more like a facebook status. It has no value, and is just yet more excuses. Every small business knows that cashflow is what will kill you in the end, and we have to mitigate against that fact - to say effectively they went out of business because someone withheld 75K from them over and above their agreed payment terms, is nonsense. Most businesses have to deal with non-payment by clients or suchlike at some point, and whether this is a long and protracted or brief affair makes no difference. The money the payment companies witheld may well be symptomatic of the greater fact that the business was poorly run in general - as indeed everyones experience including my own would point to, but its certainly not the reason they went under.

When delivery dates slipped, it was the suppliers fault. When the machine broke repeatedly it was the manufacturers fault, when the RMA collection didnt happen even though i stayed in on three seperate occasions it was the couriers fault, and the business problems in general were down to ill health etc etc .... now Kobalt dies, and surprise surprise, its someone elses fault again.

Kobalt. Man Up - dont update the website unless you have something useful regarding claims to say to the customers you failed, and stop making excuses for your own desperate ineptitude.

Apologies for the rant it is aimed at no one but Kobalt themselves, but there is no reason at all that those of us on this thread should accept these excuses or speculate on how this might be a positive thing.

Thanks to all the contributors to this thread who are posting RMA and funds reclamation advice, please keep it coming its very useful.

R.

 

Well I think the post of their site was good, hopefully we might get to hear some more information in the near future (27th ish).

I'm sure there were issues apart from what Kobalt are saying, but it could also be 100% accurate, we just don't know at the minute. At least they updated that post with new information (usefull info in my case regarding warranties) when they said they would.

Time will tell!

 

@Maverick

I don't know if you've seen it but there is a comprehensive list of "help" links in the first post. The aim is to keep all information updated there. Please do have a look and keep an eye on it too. Good luck

 

regarding chargeback: i requested my chargeback claim right after kobalt went bonkers but so far i got no money back/no response from my bank. i paid with a visa debit card...and i wonder: what banks are you people with who got their money back so quickly?!

regarding the update on the website: it is indeed a glimmer of hope.

 

Got all my admin sorted filled in form for chargeback, used the template letter etc, gave them a copy of every bit if evidence I had. Also Sent a letter to the registered address of Kobalt.

Now the wait begins.

I'm guessing that if I get a full refund via chargeback, I have to inform the registered office of Kobalt that this has happened so I get taken off the list of recievers.

 

To keep everyone updated...

The bulk of my purchase was via Debit card. However, a smaller part of my purchase, about £200, was via PayPal. This was for an upgade to my original order.

When I filed a dispute against the transaction for non-delivery of goods it strangely went immediately to 'claim' status. Which as I understand it is unusual. 'Claim' status is the stage beyond filing an initial claim.
I don't know if this is due to kobalt's status with PayPal. I can't shed any light on that.

However, what I can tell you is that having filed a claim about 10 days ago, PayPal have e-mailed me today finding in my favour and are refunding that part of the transaction to me. So no matter what happens, it appears I have got some money back, albeit the minor part of the transaction.

So those claiming via PayPal, I would say your chances look good.