SSD Options for IDE/PATA Only Systems Such as CF-51

If the CF-51 boots OK with a standard hard drive then either the SSD is faulty or its a compatibility issue. One reviewer said it's a SATA SSD with internal IDE converter, and we have seen various SATA-IDE converters with compatibility issues. Here's the link http://www.amazon.com/OWC-120GB-Mercury-Legacy-9-5mm/dp/B004I2DNA0#customerReviews

If there is a Master/Slave jumper try setting it to Master or Cable Select.

 

Thanks Springfield

I think you are correct. I did everything and no luck on this type of SSD. I will surely look for another brand or model.

 

You may want to look into an mSATA SSD + adapter, lot of good info here:

forum.thinkpads.com • View topic - New SSD opt. for T4x : mSATA-to-IDE adapter ST663FD9 *PICS*

Yes, I know it's about ThinkPads but the same basic rules apply. OWC PATA drives were a no-go there as well...

 

I tend to agree with the advice that you're getting and I've never tried the type that you're using.
It looks like someone got an OWC working by formatting it to NTFS in an external USB case
then installing Win 7 with it back in the system, see post #2 here:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/panasonic/760996-w7-install-won-t-see-ssd.html

Edit, should have read the entire thread since that didn't work. See post number 10 where the
OP returns the drive and tries an adapter that does work.
I agree with George, try what is suggested in that Thinkpad thread. If you get it working, try
it at cold temps since my setup had problems in such situations coming out of sleep.

 

Ordered the ST663FD9 mSATA adapter and a Micron 64GB microSSD. Have a older CF-M34 mini-Toughbook that could use a power boost. Has a Transcend 32GB PATA SSD in it now, dual booting XP and Linux. Will check specs before and after, assuming the upgrade works.

 

Got the Micron 64GB mSata and adapter. Fits great, no need to mount the adapter crooked in the case like the other post shows, he simply had it upside down. Installed Windows 7 (Home) from standard ISO, it detected the SSD+adapter just fine and installed smoothly.

Here is the Transcend 32GB PATA SSD (old school) in a CF-18P:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0.2 Shizuku Edition (C) 2007-2013 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 28.838 MB/s
Sequential Write : 28.604 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 27.662 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 1.723 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 4.156 MB/s [ 1014.6 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 0.012 MB/s [ 3.0 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 3.419 MB/s [ 834.7 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 0.012 MB/s [ 2.9 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 27.8% (8.1/29.0 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/10/13 19:03:53
OS : Windows 7 Home Premium Edition SP1 [6.1 Build 7601] (x86)

Here is the Micron 64GB mSata with adapter in a CF-18N (same specs as CF-18P above)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0.2 Shizuku Edition (C) 2007-2013 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 31.988 MB/s
Sequential Write : 31.686 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 31.358 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 31.624 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 11.703 MB/s [ 2857.1 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 18.793 MB/s [ 4588.2 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 14.623 MB/s [ 3570.0 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 22.978 MB/s [ 5609.8 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 13.8% (8.2/59.5 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/10/13 16:57:53
OS : Windows 7 Home Premium Edition SP1 [6.1 Build 7601] (x86)

Sequentials are a tad faster at 32MB/s and Randoms are much faster which should make a practical difference. I like that the mSata is available in larger sizes because Transcend is not only hard to find but so far I have only seen 32GB drives. Just bought another Micron that's 128 GB for my next project, which is roomy compared to legacy PATA spinners in the 60-80 GB range.

 

Decided to get another Micron 128GB mSata setup and put it in a CF-29. This is my "keeper" 29 with 2GB memory (thanks Azrial!) and nice Touchscreen transplant, emissive, EnGenius wifi, GPS etc. I forgot it already had a Renice E7 Pata SSD, so now I can measure 2 more Pata contenders side-by-side.


Renice E7 30GB Pata SSD has Win7 Ult with updates, don't know if that affects SSD speed.
Looks like Writes were so bad maybe this has a 4K alignment (stuttering) issue.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0 (C) 2007-2010 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 89.127 MB/s
Sequential Write : 20.683 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 81.581 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 3.931 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 16.449 MB/s [ 4016.0 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 1.384 MB/s [ 337.9 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 16.773 MB/s [ 4094.9 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 1.322 MB/s [ 322.7 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 62.2% (17.3/27.7 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/10/22 20:02:24
OS : Windows 7 Ultimate Edition SP1 [6.1 Build 7601] (x86)
-----------------------------------------------------------------



Micron 128GB mSata-Pata setup (4K aligned) using about 56GB. Saving the rest to try multi-booting Linux.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0 (C) 2007-2010 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 73.291 MB/s
Sequential Write : 81.109 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 67.785 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 80.779 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 19.073 MB/s [ 4656.6 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 34.849 MB/s [ 8508.1 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 21.589 MB/s [ 5270.6 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 46.654 MB/s [ 11390.2 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 9.7% (11.5/118.9 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/10/22 23:07:34
OS : Windows 7 [6.1 Build 7600] (x86)

Random times are much faster. Interesting that Sequential Read is slower than the Renice E7. Might try re-aligning the Renice and give it another shot.

 

Trying to fix slow writes on the Renice E7. Re-aligned 4K sectors by cloning to an image and restoring it using HDClone with the 4K option. Then used CCleaner to "wipe" (write 0's to) the unused drive space. Here are the results.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0 (C) 2007-2010 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 91.675 MB/s
Sequential Write : 27.409 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 85.991 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 4.066 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 16.988 MB/s [ 4147.6 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 1.570 MB/s [ 383.3 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 19.337 MB/s [ 4721.1 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 1.637 MB/s [ 399.7 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 61.2% (17.0/27.7 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/10/24 18:28:04
OS : Windows 7 Ultimate Edition SP1 [6.1 Build 7601] (x86)

Speed looks about the same, only a slight improvement in the very slow Random Writes. If anyone knows of some good SSD fixing software looks like the Renice needs something . . .

 

The ST663FD9 mSATA adapter and Micron microSSD seems to be a great solution for older Toughbooks. Cost around $50 for a 64GB setup and $70 for 128GB so similar in cost as a used SATA SSD. Both adapters worked great (just don't assemble upside down like in the original thread - mSata socket should be on the open top side.) Access times are relatively good considering it's Pata with an adapter. No issues with Win7 compatibility . . . now to try some Linux

 

In Linux:

I never did anything but put the ssd in the caddy and install the os. But I do use trim as above about once a week.

 

I knew I should of brought the m34 to work to play with. Lol. Dam you baggage chopper weight restriction.

 

This is my first post on this forum and looks like the perfect thread for my question. I have a Panasonic CF-51 MK3 laptop that I would like to install a SSD drive in. I have tried msata adapters based on jmicron and marvell chips. I have used Kingston (sandforce) and Plextor/Liteon (marvell) msata ssd drives with these adapters. Yet, I have the same issue with every combination. When trying to install Ubuntu I get input/output errors and when trying to install Windows 7 I get files can not be found. Traditional spindle drives work fine in this machine. Has anyone had success with a msata + adapter in a CF-51 MK3?

 

Hi Arthur, and Welcome to the Panasonic forum!

Just for you I transferred the 64GB Micron+adapter setup to a CF-51 Mk3LL. Note the CF-51 is the only Toughbook with removable cpu, so this one has a T7200 @ 2GHz

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0 (C) 2007-2010 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 83.313 MB/s
Sequential Write : 77.632 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 77.354 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 77.177 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 16.983 MB/s [ 4146.2 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 27.983 MB/s [ 6831.7 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 20.134 MB/s [ 4915.5 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 43.619 MB/s [ 10649.1 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 23.2% (13.7/59.0 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/10/29 21:22:12
OS : Windows 7 [6.1 Build 7600] (x86)

These results look great for an old Pata Toughbook, at least compared to a Pata spinner. It feels pretty snappy running Win7 with 4GB ram. Might be hard to pry this SSD out of my favorite 51 cuz it runs so good.

Now maybe pop the spinner back in for a side-by-side taste test . . .

 

Thank you Springfield for your response and for trying this in your CF-51. Those numbers look really good!

My CF-51 is a CF-51QG5EEBM. So far I have only upgraded the memory from 2GB to 4GB. I do have a T7200 and T7600, I might pop one of them in there. The big question is what adapter are you using? So far I have no joy with any adapter or SSD I have tried. Also what bios version does your laptop have?

 

I'm using the Minerva ST663FD9 mSATA adapter recommended by ajkula66 on the previous page. Just ordered another from eBay seller "storage-adapter" who said it is backordered from Taiwan and will take a few days.
My CF-51RCVDFBM has BIOS V3.50L13 and EC V3.50L12

ETA: Your 51Q is a Mk-3 high performance with BIOS V3.0xxx, T2500 cpu and has the higher resolution 1600x1200 display. My 51R is a Mk-3 lower performance that originally came with a T2300 @ 1.66 GHz. Don't know if there is any difference in drive controllers tho.

 

I tried a MicroSATACables.com PN#: MSATA-44P-IDE-HSG which I believe is the same as the Minerva ST663FD9. I could not install Win 7 or Ubuntu. My BIOS is V3.0L22 & EC V3.0L12

I don't know what else to try. I really want to get an SSD in this thing!

 

You could try spending $22 and get a real Minerva ST663FD9. The one you already tried may not be exactly the same, and this one has worked well for me (so far) in a CF-18, CF-29, and CF-51. Just don't install the circuit board upside down in the metal carrier like the OP in the original thread did.

 

I spoke with tech support at MicroSATACables.com and Addonics.com, they both feel it's a Bios issue. Panasonic never released any updates for this model. I fear that a newer Phoenix Bios for the Intel 945M chipset is needed. If yours is version 3.50... most likely that is required for an IDE to SATA/SSD adaptor to work. I believe I could make a custom Bios if I had the right files. I would need to start with your Bios version (file) if I can find it.

 

read these results

https://www.google.com/search?num=2...j1.1.0....0...1c.1.58.serp..1.0.0.RtpAp8MUcjU

these worked for me sometimes..I had to try 3 or 4 to find one that worked

New Hot Sale Blue SATA to IDE 44pin PATA Interface SSD Adapter Riser Hysp | eBay

 

Just for comparison purposes, here is the same CF-51 Mk3LL with T7200 running a Hitachi 80GB spinner HTS541080G9AT00 PATA
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 3.0 (C) 2007-2010 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : Crystal Dew World
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
* MB/s = 1,000,000 byte/s [SATA/300 = 300,000,000 byte/s]

Sequential Read : 24.592 MB/s
Sequential Write : 23.219 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 16.090 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 16.023 MB/s
Random Read 4KB (QD=1) : 0.336 MB/s [ 82.0 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=1) : 0.533 MB/s [ 130.0 IOPS]
Random Read 4KB (QD=32) : 0.406 MB/s [ 99.2 IOPS]
Random Write 4KB (QD=32) : 0.531 MB/s [ 129.7 IOPS]

Test : 1000 MB [C: 21.6% (16.1/74.4 GB)] (x3)
Date : 2014/11/01 9:34:00
OS : Windows 7 SP1 [6.1 Build 7601] (x64)

Large block read & writes are 3-4 times slower than the SSD, and 4K small block I/O is two orders of magnitude slower. Doesn't feel so snappy. Note that this drive was loaded with 64-bit Win7, don't know if that would make much difference.

 

I think 64bit will make it slower without 4gb or more ram..



Another thing that has been discovered is compatibility issues between the BIOS and some drive manufacturers firmware. Even with a IDE SSD drive.
I have read reports of this in several different Toughbooks. More with SSD drives, but the later CF29 mks would not run certain Samsung IDE HC160 drives.

 

Thank you for all the replies everyone. I'm not sure how to proceed though. lol

 

Are you trying to install 32 bit Win 7 and not 64 bit?
Also, I think you mentioned Sandforce based SSDs, and it is well known that these do _not_ work.

Have you tried putting the msata with the adapter on a USB to PATA adapter and
trying to access it on another machine? Next I'd try taking one of your spindle
drives with the OS already installed and doing a disk image to the msata on the USB
adapter, then try to boot it in the CF-51. If it is just the BIOS being unable to handle
the interface it might work with the full OS driver. I've done this sort of thing with
Acronis but did not have to do it with my CF51.

Also, if you look at my post #6 the MK3 that I was using back then had V3.00 BIOS and I eventually got it to work.

 

I thought that I reported the detailed model of the Toshiba 1.8" SSD that worked
for me but I couldn't find it in the thread. It was THNSNC128GMMJ and I bought
it on ebay for $85. The adapter was listed as this on ebay:
1.8" Micro SATA 7+9 16-pin to IDE 44-pin HDD PCB Adapter JM20330 Chipset
from link-delight-na on ebay.
Be sure to wrap the flex cable in the caddy with aluminum foil and that it does not
touch anything, you could cover it with electrical tape.

 

I have a question relating to installing SDD on my CF-18.

Now the prices have come down I have found that I can buy a ZHEINO 2.5" IDE/PATA 128GB SSD for about £70. So I would consider this upgrade.

I have CF-18 running Windows 7 - (CF-18DDB25ME) currently 160GB (77GB used) with 1.25GB memory. Mostly used running mapping software.

My question is if I do buy this SDD (or similar - recommendations please!), is it a straight forward installation as far as the BIOS goes. I don't have any problems with the physical installation.

Hope I have posted this in the correct place on the forum.

 

Have you seen this product for the CF-18 posted down further in the forum:
http://www.digitzoom.com/

 

No I had not, but thank you for the link. I have asked digitzoom if they will ship to the UK, where I live. Sound a better solution as I would prefer to uses a Samsung SDD.

 

The cost of large USB drives has come way down, 32GB in a physically small package,
so Readyboost is an option at a much lower cost:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1084439-REG/sandisk_sdcz43_032g_a46_cz43_cruzer_fit_32gb.html

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/ff356869.aspx

Has anyone tried it, how does it compare with a large 32 GB drive, I might try it since
I have quite a few extra CF-51s.

 

Did you know you can not install Readyboost when using a SSD.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ReadyBoost

 

Yes, I am aware. I have several more CF-51s with spinner drives, so if Readyboost helps
a lot for less than $15 - why not do it?
I was pointing it out as an alternative to an SSD.

 

I have used Readyboost on my CF-29MK5 W7 and my CF-51MK3 W7 it did speed things up a little. On my CF-30MK1/3 I used it until I upgraded to a SSD and now we are talking "helps a lot". With Readyboost you will see some increase in speed but nothing that big. If your looking for speed then get yourself a SSD.

 

Hey, been a lurker here for quite a while. To PeteB77, WOW. Source the exact items you described for an SSD upgrade for my MK3 and it worked like a champ. What a performance improvement for day to day ops. Running Windows 7 Pro T7600 Core 2 Duo, 4GB RAM, Intel 7260 Wireless AC NIC and Catalyst 10.2 legacy via Mobility Mod tool for the X1300 256MB. Even finally updated to the L23 BIOS that was supposed to be the route to VISA compatibility/upgrade. Not much more I can do with it now.

 

We

Well I was going to welcome you but guess you been around for 3+ years . The 51 is a great Toughbook and I still have mine in the shop. Really it works just as good as the 52 with the ssd upgrade.

Don't be shy and take another 3 years to post something . We don't bite .

 

Thinking about trying this in a 29 and 51 myself. http://www.ebay.com/itm/KingSpec-PA...5&pid=100005&rk=4&rkt=6&sd=151247397255&rt=nc

Wow that link turned out long. It's only 32gb so will experiment with Linux before filling it up with Windopes.