<!-- Generated by XStandard version 1.7.1.0 on 2007-04-07T21:49:23 -->Not only do many students like having laptops in college these days, at many places it is indeed required. Checkout a recent article in the University of Virginia school newspaper titled Laptop Dependent where a student journalist interviews other students to find out how they depend on laptops. Among reasons cited as to how students depend on laptops are:
- Checking email constantly to keep up with organizations and classes a student is involved in
- Ability to move around and have all of your work in one place
- No need to depend on library computers for doing research while at the library
- Checking email and weather on a laptop (often while still in bed) is the first thing most students do when they get up in the morning
- Doing homework while staying online and chatting with friends
- Taking notes in class
And the list goes on of course.
Some people at Georgetown such as Professor David Cole has no love for laptops
However, Professor of law at Georgetown University, David Cole, writes in a Washington Post op ed today his reasons for banning laptops in the classroom (even though Georgetown requires incoming law students to have a laptop and the campus is wireless). His list of arguments in favor of doing away with laptops during class are:
- Students taking notes turn into stenographers and not thinkers as they just try to write down everything the professor says.
- Students are using laptops to chat, check sports scores, "buy shoes" or do other non-learning related web surfing. This can distract students nearby or the professor who knows it's going on.
- When students are more engaged in their laptops and taking notes, there is less give and take in the classroom, which is important to a law education in particular.
- According to the professor: "Taking notes the old-fashioned way, by hand, is so much slower, one actually has to listen, think and prioritize the most important themes."
The Prof goes on to say that he understands the tempation of checking email, and that even while writing his article he got distracted and checked email "at least a dozen times." So it seems the only cure for the Internet addiction he admits to having is to simply refrain from having web access.
As a test, Cole banned all laptops from the classroom but allowed two students to type notes on their laptops that could be shared with the class as a whole. He claims that after doing this and then conducting an anonymous survey the following results were found:
- 80% of students felt they were more engaged in class discussion without a laptop
- 70% said that overall they like the no laptop policy
- 95% admitted that when they had a laptop they used it for purposes "other than taking notes".
Cole concludes that "The personal computer has revolutionized our lives, in many ways for the better. But it also threatens to take over our lives. At least for some purposes, unplugging may still be the best response."
So what do you think, should students be able to do as they please in the classroom by having a laptop (they are paying to be there after all) or is Professor Cole doing them a favor by banning laptops?
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I actually agree. I'd like to have a laptop to take to class cause I can type much faster than I can write, but really, I would end up doing nothing about class on it anyway. My engineering school is also requiring freshman to have Tablet PCs starting this upcoming year, and it's probably going to be a bad idea. Besides, in engineering school you need a tablet at least to take notes in class, and I don't have a tablet, so a laptop doesn't really do me much good anyway.
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Well, you paid your tuition, if you want to screw it up that's your choice. At the same time, this guy is probably so boring that students need to be "buying shoes" to stay awake in class.
As for needing a computer in class, I don't think it's necessary. I just completed my studies and did not have or use a laptop once. Would it have been handy for lab reports and not having to rely on library computers? Of course, but if I get back into school this Sept, I'll still be taking my notes using the good ole paper and pen. -
I agree, I don't take my computer to class--I know I'd just mess around.
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Homer_Jay_Thompson blathering blatherskite
I am buying a laptop because my pharmcy school requires it. I prefer the lower cost of desktops. $1,200 will buy an average laptop or a top of the line desktop.
This was typed on my Wii, so excuse my grammar and spelling. -
I totally agree with this professor, I find that when I use my laptop in class I don't pay very much attention. I am often talking to people using MSN messenger or just surfing the web and checking email, because of this I only tend to only use it in between classes or when the day is over class wise for me.
Mind you most of my notes are on my university's student web course tools server, therefore when my professors see people in my classes using notebooks they just figure "oh he or she must be following along with the class using the notes" but most of the time that is not the case. Once I saw a guy playing WOW during a class, now how much attention was he paying? If you have ever seen a student using a laptop in a class they never look as attentive as a person who is sitting there with a pad and pen and looking at the person who is front and center.
luckily for me I am in my last semester right now so as time goes by and laptops become easier for alot of people to get, this problem is going to no doubt get worse. -
I will have to agree with the professor though I still wish there was a faster way of taking notes though instead of hurting my hands.
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The professor is right. It's really hard to resist the urge of using the Internerds and tune out of class when you have wireless sitting right in front of you.
I don't think notebooks should be BANNED; I think people should be aware that using a laptop during class will definitely affect your grade. -
I totally agree with the professor. I am a postgraduate law student and I started taking my laptop to lectues after christmas. I just use it for taking notes during lecture
but still it is less thinking and ony typing. When I take notes without laptop, I realised that I have to think, analyze and then summarise the idea to my notebook.
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Whatever happened to skipping class and having the hot chick/guy take your notes for you? Guess it doesn't work for everyone...
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Interesting to see that most people are overwhelmingly in favor of the professor. I had a laptop the last two years of college (I won't reveal how long ago that was) but never did take my laptop into class and have it open. I did use it for doing classwork outside of lecture of course. I see in business classes and law classes today almost everyone has a laptop at their desk, so if you don't have one you almost look like the odd one out or might feel disadvantaged in some way.
I tend to agree though, for in the class the distraction temptation might be too great. Heck, even having a phone turned on and accessible could be bad enough, a laptop is like a phone on steroids when it comes to avenues of distraction.
I can see how some students would like to quickly look up stuff a prof is referring to during class rather than waiting until after (when you've forgotten what it was you wanted to look up) and taking rapid typed notes could be an advantage. But you could always just record the lecture and listen again later.
The interesting thing that comes to mind in talking about all this, is if laptops are bad for undergrad and grad students, what's the ramifications of giving 3rd world kids laptops in the classroom like the OLPC project is trying to do? Could be just one large distraction for them as well. -
Metamorphical Good computer user
Well looking at it from the perspective of someone with a sadly short attention span (Yep, I'm talking about myself) I have to agree with the professor on this one. For me it is hard enough to stay focused with just a paper notebook and a pencil in my hand let alone with my laptop infront of me, during a boring lecture. However if I told you my school days are spent in a theory room taking notes in my little notebook with the adorable kitten on the cover that would be a lie. I have most of my classes in labs where workstations are already infront of me, and inevitably my own computer is sitting infront of the workstation running linux on VMware for a lab. I probably couldn't count the number of times during class I minimize VMware and run to this very forum to check it out. Is it a coincidence that 90% of the time a new review or news bit pops up during class time? xD
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One of the funniest incident of laptop distraction I recall was from a picture my friend took. Two people were exchanging messages on MSN, when they were just sitting beside each other. My initial reaction was "this is just high tech note-passing". Surely that was a distraction in classes throughout high school and it's the same in post-secondary. I applaud the decision made by the professor, because distraction and lack of attention is the reason why I don't bring my laptop to class. Even though I hate the line-ups and the slow-downs of the library computers.
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It may be bad for some, but it's also good for others. What the professor did by banning laptops was to tell students how to learn, and that's really none of his business. After all this is Georgetown Law School, and the students should at least have enough responsibility to choose how they want to learn.
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Ill agree to a degree as well. I make it clear to students, if you want to surf, or chat online, then dont come to class. You cant do both well, and most of the time you end up being a distraction
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I blame Facebook.
I personally use my laptop for most of my writing class. I can't write as fast as my professor especially when I spend half the time reading their handwriting. -
I only bring my notebook in class if it's absolutely necessary (ie. working on an assignment that is due on the same day that requires electronic submission). After I'm done, I slip it to my backpack.
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CalebSchmerge Woof NBR Reviewer
I disagree. I use my laptop in all of my classes, including classes like Physics or Calculus. I get tempted at times, and I will admit that at times I don't pay attention at all, but I can control my self and I can decide when to pay attention to or not. In some classes, despite being connected I take notes the whole time, no temptations. I think people need to learn to appreciate their educations more, not get rid of laptops. In one of my Computer Science classes, the professor gets annoyed by people playing on computers, but refuses to ban them because there are students that use them legitimately. I think people need to be more responsible. They aren't banned in the "real world", so why in the class room?
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I personally find that this is a great idea. Having one person take notes and share them among class allows everyone to participate more in tutorials, seminars or even lectures.
I am graduating from my undergraduate degree in June. I have been using my laptop to take notes ever since I started university, and it has totally been an academic tool. I refused to install any games on my computer (not that it could run many) and made sure to keep it closed during seminars/tutorials where participation counts as grades. This year I took a 1st year course as an elective and it was filled with around 700 students (it was an introductory course.. bird course for me). I could see that approximately 75% of the 200 or so students with laptops were NOT paying attention but rather checking email, playing games or on Facebook. I guess it takes alot of discipline to actually pay attention and not get distracted by having a laptop, but I'm sure for many students, A LAPTOP CAN BE AS DETRIMENTAL AS IT CAN BE BENEFICIAL.
Anywhoo thats just my two cents... -
If people entering college don't have the ability to learn yet and control themselves then the last thing they have to worry about it taking a notebook to class. My experience in a Technical college has been that the students using their notebooks actually did better then those without because they were able to take better notes of the information presented. The people that weren't going to pay attention and participate in class are doing it laptop or not.
I couldn't imagine my engineering courses where we had to draw ton's of gates and circuits that were usually on the board when we walked in. Sure you could get the notes from the instructor, but that never covered the custom stuff that came up in class. Copy paste quickly became a friend there.
Another reason is that many of the folks in my courses are or were people in the field so the information given by the instructor was more of a formality. This allowed students to work on their programming or circuit designs in the classroom as the instruction was given so that people could get done faster rather then waste their time. Guess thats a toss up to going to a geek-centric school for Engineering and Hard science.
College is where you go to get extensive knowledge and extend your tool set for a career. If you are paying to take up 4-6 years of your life just because you have nothing better to do, I think you could find more interesting things to spend your money on. - Maybe I've got a very jaded perspective on college, but I don't understand people that don't go to learn. -
That's stupid, what if everyone brought a book or magazine and started reading through his lectures? Would he ban books because they distract student's attention? It's my own damn choice I could just the same not take notes (or pay attention) with a pen. Personally the laptop has enabled me to stay awake rather than fall asleep, I don't know about everyone else but I have had some boring professors. Cell phones are still much worse distractions.
And as someone mentioned before, we're the ones paying the money, if anything we should be the ones doing the criticizing.
(and by 'we' I meant students) -
When I was in law school, bringing my laptop to class and surfing the net while listening to the lecture was the only thing that made law school lectures bearable. Anything "learned" in class is generally useless for taking the bar, let alone practicing law.
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I agree with Professor. I didn't see even ONCE a person using laptop who wouldn't start (decently) from checking "oh, correct spelling of author names of XYZ algorithm in wikipedia" and ended in 5 minutes checking mail (private) or general surfing on the net. The temptation of using laptop as a sweet toy, much more appealing than listening to the lecturer is really strong.
Also when you ask the (rethorical) question "this step in algorithm is clear?" all laptop users response is "eh?" -- no, they don't not understand the algorithm, they simply didn't pay attention so they don't even know what algorithm is discussed.
And besides -- there are students nearby. I personally have problems focusing on the lecture when the laptop screen next to me (or in front of me) is flashing. If people had use tablets PC it would be just a personal thing, but since we are talking about classic laptops, one laptop can be distraction for several people in the classroom.
I opt for setting each rules for each class -- and that is up to each person, so in that case Professor Cole has right to ban laptops. -
I still believe that if a student is truly there to learn it's up to them to have the discipline necessary to learn in the environment provided. You can't always pick your environment in the real world, and I think a little distraction can go a long ways into helping people focus above their environment. As I stated earlier, you spend years in required education learning how to learn and getting the basics down in a distraction prone environment, if you can't handle it by college you shouldn't be attending until you can.
College was never intended for everyone anyways, and I think a lot of the problem with "distractions in the class" is because of people who shouldn't truly be attending, or don't want to attend anyways, or going for the wrong reasons... it doesn't matter, but I think more personal responsibility is needed in life.. I'm getting myself into a tangent so I'll stop here
(5 year old arrested for "sexual harassment" because a boy pinched a girl.. Texas.. good thing he wasn't 6 or he'd be heading for the chair...) -
Anyone else just finds paper, pencil, and eraser more convenient when taking notes?
I found it almost impossible to quickly draw diagrams, solve equations, or otherwise get Greek/non-normal characters on a normal laptop. Practicality was the main reason I gave up on laptops in class, distraction and weight/bulk being the other reasons.
Still waiting for a good thin, light, and long lasting tablet pc that can really take the place of a simple paper notebook. -
My concern is, that one person with laptop is distraction for several other students. And since my experience is the person with laptop is doing unrelated things (web surfing for example) there is no benefit to anyone.
If you have to use computer during lecture/seminar buy tablet PC. -
Well I use my laptop to look up law and case reports from online law resources. But we aren't allowed laptops in class. In lectures, the few that bring one, do so to watch a film or listen to music when its a boring lecture; usually the Public Law one. Paper resources are much more useful than the internet for my degree (apart from online reports). A law textbook is infinitely better and more necessary, as you only get small snippets of info on the internet. There's a reason the textbooks cost £30 each. They're not about to allow law info to be widely available online! And also, wikipedia is not a recognised academic source!
I suppose it depends on your subject; i.e. I'd imagine someone who uses CAD has a lot more of a justification to use their laptop than someone who's meant to read the latest law chapter! Also whether the lecturer/professor has control over use; no good if they let you get away with listening to music or msn'ing
Rambling sorry! But I agree with the prof since he's in Law as well (which I presume he was only talking about specifically) -
Agree.
While I am all for students being able to do what they want when they want, assuming that said students are going to be responsible enough to NOT be a distraction to others in class is stretching it a bit far. Many people can think of what benefits themselves, but not the impact of their decisions on other people.
That said, I study in allied health and the only laptops brought into class are closed with the only sound recorders going. From a previous business degree, having the person next to you tapping noisily away on their keyboard is not only distracting, its annoying. Not to mention their paper notes spilling onto you because they have no space left to put it...
I go into lectures to study. If I wanted to play, I could think of a dozen better places to do it. -
Interesting replies so far. I can see both the positive and negative aspects to having a notebook in class.
Notebooks were a relative rarity--if seen at all in class--and extremely expensive when I was in college (oh boy--does that show age ;P)? I would have appreciated being able to use something to type notes in certain classes though. Writing by hand sometimes made it difficult to keep up with the lecture and get everything I wanted down. At times I would miss some of the information--and usually this is the stuff that you can't just look up in the text book.
But there are definitely instances where simple pen and paper note-taking would be more efficient unless you really know how to do diagrams or simple figures, etc. And the distraction factor I think is the biggest drawback.
I agree that college students should be able to focus on their own. And those that can't handle the temptation to do something else while sitting in class might as well just cut class.
But with the vast majority of college students now owning personal notebook computers--I can understand where this professor is coming from. -
That prof needs to lighten up, for better or for worse this is the digital age. He should try to make his lectures more interesting and appealing, and maybe people wouldnt need to be surfin the net while hes yapping
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@ chrisyano, its hard to focus! You want to read, but with the nice warm weather all the girls are walking past... -
I disagree with this professor's decision. In my view, he just lowered himself from being a law professor to a high school teacher. In high school teachers held our hands and told us not to do this or that during class so we can pay attention and learn better. These are law students we're talking about here. If they had the capability to get into law school, I'm sure they have an inkling of how they should approach school without the "help" of one anal professor.
However, I do agree that notebooks are huge distractions in the classroom. I took my notebook in to a class once to finish another assignment due later in the day. After I finished I just ended playing WOW for the rest of class rather then listen. But then again...I don't take notes, period, in most of my classes... -
Again, and again -- if you want to surf the net while boring seminar, better stay at home -- why even bother coming there? To annoy others? -
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and thats why i don't take my notebook to class. that was a one time thing because I had an assignment I had to finish. I know I will get distracted and not pay attention.
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It's true, many students bring laptops to class to watch shows, play games and chat with friends. I try not to bring my laptop unless i need to use it. But prof's should let students do what they want. It's their choice to not listen in class.. if they can still learn and pass the course.. why not.
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When notes are not given, and the lecturer talks fast and compresses ideas in a small amount of time, a laptop is a lifesaver. While it may be true that we may end up stenographing instead of learning, that's only for students who actually write (by hand) what the lecturer says ... so it's not the laptop which is bad, but the student. While I am oldschool myself, the reason is more that I actually do not write notes AT ALL! My friends go through like 8 pages in a 2h lecture and all I would have written would be a page or two. I still take my laptop to browse through an e-version of the book though. On the other hand, imagine these stenographer-aspired students, now that they can copy-out faster they even have the chance to understand what the lecturer said in the few extra pauses they have now.
The thing is this... the best thing a lecturer can ever do is give out ready-printed notes. Like that, all students have to do is to take the printed notes with them, related them to what the lecturer is saying and write in the margin the occasional clarifier (which you cannot do with a laptop!). This guy's on the right track - if he starts giving the notes beforehand (citing a chapter for reference too, which I think he does though as most good lecturers do), he'll have reached his goal entirely. The way he implemented it however will be detrimental to students because once exams come, your mind will go blank and you will need notes with which to "re-learn" what you did during the semester or indeed years; I can do it from 2 pages - others need 8... why discriminate? -
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what about tablet pc ?
how is it different from hand notes ? -
The task of the teacher is to ensure the "environment" is learning-friendly, so no playing games on seminars, no phone-calls, etc. _Let_ the students learn (in other words: no student can stop others from learning, and if she/he tries -- her/his place is outside).
Or maybe more obvious example -- have you been in library and have you seen the sign "silence"? It is exactly for the same purpose, let the students read, without any disturbance. -
As pyro said, if people don't have self-control by college age, then there isn't a point to...
Well, for those who type fast (NOT me) so that they can IM/social-network while taking notes, that just seems to me like being productive. If someone can "help" themselves while learning, more power to them. Presumably the distractions that exist thanks to the Internet are helpful in networking skills (i.e, talk to friends, make connections, etc) I take my notebook to class once in a while, but I use the tablet end of things for notes. I wouldn't be able to keep up via typing.
As someone who believes in personal liberties very strongly, I think that a ban on most things is a bad idea. If students cannot manage their own study habits, the professors shouldn't enforce it on them. Plus, I keep hearing how much of a boon it is for the law students here to have a notebook in class...allows them to have notebook exams and other things. -
I also wasn't refering to labs, I was refering to all my courses, lectures and all. They almost all have had computers. It's intrinsic to an engineering and computer student to have computers for really grasping the skills. But I guess the schools I've attended have all been hands on and skill based, not theory based. -
I think he means laptops distract others; who cares about what it does to the individual. That's their business. That it affects others is the point? I get the argument no one can force you to pay attention at uni. But if you're not going to take notes and mess around instead, why go into the classroom? To keep up appearances? Isn't that somewhat self-defeating?
It is inevitable you will distract others. You'll be only one of a handful with a laptop whilst everyone else has a pen and pad of paper. We're not talking about courses here where everyone has a laptop btw before I continue - otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussionThat is the reason laptops are not allowed in classes for my course. It bothers others.
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his argument just doesn't make sense. School offers wireless for all students including class is the problem. And there would be too many people against him and he's the only one complaining.
students using laptop in school is not disturbing the whole class. Students be have the right to do anything in class unless it is disturbing others. The best method would be not allowed to be using wireless in class but banning a laptop in class is ridiculous.
The only way that laptop could be banned is only if it can actually explode,be used as a dangerous weapon, having a too noisy fan like the sound of a rocket. Or maybe the keyboard is just too loud and annoying.
This professor is silly and don't take this professor for your law, I can guess students taking him is too bored and had to go buy a laptop -
Subjectively at least, if the majority of polled/surveyed students DON'T want laptops in their lecture, doesn't that indicate that laptops are a disturbance, and moreso than pencil, paper and eraser at that? If the disturbance level was the same for both notetaking mediums, then i'd imagine nobody would care.
Of course, that raises the issue of professional jealousy, of who has the better technology to take better notes *cough cough*, but I'd hate to think it boils down to such a petty thing...
teDDe -
I can't agree with the professor more. I mean, it's hard enough resisting the temptation of "over-entertaining" myself (with games, email, and ugh... you know what) on my home computer, nevermind bringing one to class.
I especially agree about the notetaking part. While typing is usually the faster method, students usually resort to copying everything on the board and and not process (or put in own words) what is taken. -
I agree with him, im reading economics and i also find it a too big distraction when i bring my laptop and less useful since a lot of the diagrams are impossible to draw as fast as when you use pen and paper. And yes, it is annoying as hell when you sit next to a person that uses one and you have to listening to him beating away on the keyboard. I'm also one of those that tend to sit in front at lectures, since i get bored with the professor when he is so far away, and i get too distracted by what others are doing in front of me, and especially from notebooks when you can see that the screen is changing. It's just a reflex, if i see a screen blik, i will look to see what the hell that was. I think it is a very good idea, and that the students will thank him later on.
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We agree to disagree
Georgetown Law Prof Blasts Laptops in the Classroom as Bad for Learning
Discussion in 'Notebook News and Reviews' started by Andrew Baxter, Apr 7, 2007.