help! very mysterious wireless problem...

guys, thanks for reading, this is very confusing and I am still new to wireless. I truly appreciate anyone taking a stab at this, I will keep it as succinct as possible:

have acer travelmate 2420 with intel/PRO wireless BG2200. things were fine on my secure wireless network at home (unknown router - in landlord's place upstairs) until connection cut out abruptly with no changes in settings, not even using computer, just saw it go off. fiddled and fiddled and found that the adapter settings were set to 'open', so I set it to shared and immediately connection restored, but mysterious cos I didn't set it to that obviously. so ok connection on same router for a few more weeks.
then, was at a different location using wired ethernet connection for a few days, then upon return to my house could not connect to wireless; connection was made to the router (proper icon in tray, see image at http://www.chrisjongkind.com/driver2.jpg ), but no data moving, just packets being sent and sent but few returned ( http://www.chrisjongkind.com/packets.jpg ). I suspected it was the router because my mcafee network diagram showed this http://www.chrisjongkind.com/mcafeeNetwork.jpg, but, given my previous open/shared problem I was suspicious of my own computer. PLUS, I could no longer get on a friend's unsecure wireless ('limited or no connectivity tho this time), adding to the likelihood that it's my computer. PLUS my landlord still had a good connection and we are using the same router. my internet searching led me down many paths, a driver update didn't help, but someone suggested disabling the ethernet adapter (which as I said was the last networking thing I used before this loss of connectivity), which I did, repaired the wireless adapter, and voila, a connection on my desired router for about 90 seconds, then back to the same - connection icon in tray but no data moving, almost no packets received. ipconfig info is here http://www.chrisjongkind.com/ipconfig.jpg if it helps.
I have been able to use a neighbour's wireless very slowly in order to post questions like this to the www, but that also adds to my confusion - I am able to get onto other wireless networks (both secure and non), but not these two (landlord's upstairs and friend's with 'ltd or no connectivity'). anyone have any similar experience or suggestions for settings? I am not great at this so please keep it in layman's terms, and may have more questions about it for those who respond. I am considering getting a pcmcia slot wireless card for a backup anyway, would this completely solve it anyway or could it be something inherent with the computer's taste for wireless? FYI: running windows XP SP2, have updated drivers recently to 9.0.4.26 (slight change from .jpg I provided), and do not know the make of my router (not in my apt but others receiving ok)...
also, tried using the intel/PROset wireless software (asked me to use previous driver so I rolled back) instead of windows but got same thing (connected to Natwark but no data, or even worse; unable to connect (network called 'Natwark' is the secure one I want to get onto but can't). if I try a pcmcia card and it doesn't work either is that absolute proof that it is the router and not my computer, or is it STILL possible that it's the computer even if on a completely separate wireless card (the pcmcia new one)?
print screens of intel and windows are here http://www.chrisjongkind.com/intelSoftwareOpen.jpg and here http://www.chrisjongkind.com/windowsNetworksShared.jpg . it sure looks like a router problem but I have reason to believe that my computer is acting up (see historical account above), is this possible?!
I know little about the zillions of setting (authentication, 802.1x, WEP/WPA/etc), but am willing to try anything you guys suggest...

thanks a lot guys,

 

It sounds like you may have 2 networks with the same SSID and one keeps changing the other, or interference . Getting another wireless card will not fix this.

Download a copy of netstumber and run a complete scan. Take's about 10 minutes to do a scan. It will show all networks hidden or not. Also wireless phones and devices can interfere with wireless devices.

 

Some other things that might contribute:

1. If there was a power outage/surge or your landlord reset the wireless router, the SSID might have reset to its default. Downloading and running netstumbler, as blue68 mentions, would help you locate it.
2. Something like that might change the security settings (WEP or the key index), too.
3. If the landlord was using MAC filtering as security, it might have wiped out your MAC address on the router.
4. If the landlord moved the router, it may now be in an area that blocks the signal (or there may be interference from phones, a microwave, etc.)

If the landlord's network shows up on Intel PROset but you cannot connect, your best bet is to get all the settings from the landlord and re-enter them.

Since Intel is showing all the networks, you're probably fine and just need to get the correct settings.

 

thanks for your help both of you....will be trying out some of that stuff over the weekend and will get back to you, thanks again!

chris j

 

blue68f100 and sanpabloguy,

I truly appreciate your ongoing help and hope to have this solved soon - couple of Qs about your advice; downloading netstumbler now, but in the meantime -
- I don't know what an SSID is or what mine should be set to or where to find mine or where to find what it SHOULD be
- I have a 26 digit number I type in for what I think is the WEP, but I don't know what the key index is or what to set it to
- how would I know if the mac address is a problem? I have only ever typed in the WEP I mentioned for security, that I know my landlord has no other special security
- location hasn't moved, so I'm guessing is quite alright

thanks again for everything! and for guiding this true noob thru amateur hour....

chris j

 

chris,

When Inte Proset starts, what network names does it show? SSID is the same as the network name.

Is your landlord's network in that list?

Let's see if the network is showing up for you before tackling the other stuff.

 

This is the name of the AP you are connecting to. You should not have one, unless adhoc.

This should be the WPA key, WEP is normally HEX.

 

hey thanks again guys,

blue68f11 - netstumbler said the SSID of the network I'm trying to get onto is 'Natwark', which is the desired network (landlord). this has always appeared when I sign onto it. I don't know what AP is or what ad-hoc means. I have this 26 digit number that historically I have typed in when asked and it connected fine - shall I change the security info to WPA and try the same number? pretty sure that it was always on WEP when network was working fine tho...

sanpabloguy - both the intel software and the windows wireless software show Natwark in my list (the desired [landlord's] network). for all purposes it shows up and connects fine to Natwark, but then no data coming in, it's that close (for eg see the packets.jpg in the original post).

now, since I have been fiddling with netstumbler and a zillion other settings without knowing what they are, I now have NO connection to unsecure neighbour that I have had in the meantime, and a bubble in the tray saying 'IP address conflict'. I will be away from the computer over the weekend but will be back on it on monday night and will make some printscreens for you guys. I truly appreciate the help of both of you and anyone else, and am truly desperately relying on you to stick with me til I get it straight, thanks again and again!!!!

chris j

 

If it connects with WEP Stay with it. If it does not retain the settings, try deleting the wireless location then re-connect entering the key.

AP= Access Point (the radio part of a wireless router)
Adhoc = is a connection between pc's using wireless, without going through a router.

IP address conflict
This is not good, which may explain your dropped or limited connection. Report to your lanlord that your are receiving a IP conflict. Make a note of the time, so he can look at the routers log. It's possiable that someone has broken the WEP key and has cloned your Mac Address. His Signal is proably stronger and knocking you off.

As you noticed with netstumbler reads the mac address of the AP's.

Contact your lan lord and tell him your problem, indicating his router is being used by un-authorized users, hacked. Or his DHCP range is to narrow for the numbers of users, very unusuall because def is 50 users.

This assumes you did not create 2 network connections to the same AP.

 

sanpabloguy and blue, thanks both of you for keeping up with my post and sticking with me until this thing hopefully works out. as per your request sanpablo, I have started from scratch with the info you asked for - the network I want is in my list (Natwark, have WEP for it); connect with 54mbps excellent but no data coming in, and the network I leech off from my neighbour that is slow but allows me to post here to you guys (linksys, also in list). printscreen of windows list is here - www.chrisjongkind.com/natwarkWin.jpg and of netstumbler is here with both those networks expanded www.chrisjongkind.com/natwarkNetstumbler.jpg
lets assume for now that I can't access the router (he's on vacation til next week) and that even if I could, my landlord knows far less than I do about it and his internet is fine (wired).
I think you know everything else about it that I can tell (from first post) - packets going like crazy but not coming, used wired ethernet just before all this happened, had to reset from open to shared for some reason several weeks earlier, and can also get on other secure and unsecure networks elsewhere obviously.
I am immensely appreciative to you guys for helping me thus far, and if you find this would expedite things and you have it in you to assist a bumbling stranger, please feel mega free to add me on msn (chris0002(at)hotmail.com) or skype (chrisjongkind), because chatting is low bandwidth enough to work on my neighbour's wireless (which I'm on now). I am home monday, then wed OR thurs this week from 6 - 11p eastern time. I am more than willing to make zillions more printscreens of any specific things you request.

thanks again and again,

chris j

 

sanpabloguy and blue,
in case you guys read this, it's monday morning and for some reason this morning I couldn't even get connected on the neighbour's like I was last night when I asked you about the possibility of chatting on msn etc for assistance - I will try again tonight but if you don't see me (in the very gracious event that you take me up on the msn/skype) it's because I can't even leech off neighbour, like I have been able to. packets being received but no web pages/skype connection etc, argh. will try tho.

thanks again,

chris j

 

What I see is that you have 5 networks, with 2 (natwork and mshome) to close to each other, and using the same channel (6). I would have your lanlord change (natwark) is channel to 1 and MSHOME to 11. This is where all of your conflicts are accouring.

Find out who is operating MSHOME and see if he will move his to 11. Then every one should be happy.

 

blue, thanks a lot for taking a look,

- would that channel conflict be responsible for a connection to natwark but no packets coming in?

- in case my landlord doesn't know how to change the channel, is it easy?

- could this have changed somehow on its own and someone like myself might lose a connection all of a sudden like this? what about linksys and buckbuckchelle which also appear to have channel 6 in addition to mshome and Natwark?

- I don't know who mshome network is, probably a neighbour whom I don't know, I hope that's alright. another suggestion in this case?

again, I truly appreciate your assistance to this bumbling stranger (me).

chris j

 

The channel is very easy to change. Just a little pull down list to select. Then save settings.

Networks fighting for the same freq can rage havic on any network. Moving just one may be enough to correct the problem, wider the spread the better. Who ever it is was probably have problems too. You may use some post it notes on doors. Asking the owner of "MSHOME" to please change the default channel to 11. Hopefully it's not one of the newer MIMO units not playing well with others. If thats the case you may have a fight on your hand.

 

hey thanks blue...

I will probably continue to ask Qs about everything, but you are certainly clearing things up, please take your time.

- I can't put this to the test until next monday. when I do, and I ask for a change to the channel (is it some software that should be on landlord's computer?), do I need to change anything on my computer as well to match the new channel, or will it pick it up properly anyway?

- what about the others in the www.chrisjongkind.com/natwarkNetstumbler.jpg that are also on channel 6?

- I'm not entirely sure I can find out who is mshome here, nor the others, as there are zillions of units around here. hopefully just a channel change to natwark will do it.

- since my connection to natwark was fine for months, what might have abruptly caused this?

I am again leeching off linksys neighbour (unsecure, and slow), and can intermittently be reached at chris0002(at)hotmail.com on msn or chrisjongkind on skype...

thanks again for it all!!!!

chris j

 

Yes, another router will cause all of these problems. If its a 11n or MIMO using the channel bonding, will wrecks havic on others networks. If there firmware works correctly this should not happen.

The setting he needs to change is located in the router. Must connect to the routers admin to change the channel. Should be located under the wireless main setup page. All clients (users) will not be impacted. Your side will auto scan for the SSID (router) and connect. You will notice nothing different on your side. But hopefully a good connection without all of your problems.

Get you a book of post-it-notes and request who ever is operating the AP named MSHOME change their operating channel. Post it on all of the apt in your area. it has to be close to you by the strength of it. If you happen to talk to them in person, also ask if they could lower the power to the radio. ( I run my AP on Low Power). If you have a external antenna or a pc-slot 11g card, you could make a shield to turn yours into a beam antenna. This way you could figure which way it is come from.

Netstumbler will pick up clients too, if they are activity talking to a AP. So if you are scanning under peak times you may see alot of nodes. If you are actively scanning you could see when they connect to their MSHOME.

 

Per post #3 above, any number of things could have changed for almost any reason. Including, someone else using the network.

I think you should start out with the basics, and Blue's is one. From your landlord's router you should get this info:

1. Type of security: None, WEP, WAP, MAC Filtering, and channel he's broadcasting on. He'll have to call this info up on his router's configuration page through his web browser.

2. If he's not using security, you just need to be sure his channel (a number 1 through 11) matches yours and is not the same channel as all the other networks in your area. Hopefully this will fix it, since it sounds like he's not using security.

2A. Another easy option at this point would be to be sure the network group has a unique name and that your network name is identical (System Properties | Computer Name tab | Change, then change the network name to be the same as your landlord's Network name on his computer. This is not the same as the network name in Intel Pro.)

3. If he's using security (and it's strongly recommended), you need to find out what type and the passphrase or what the code is. You'll need to create the same type of security (WEP, WAP), and enter the same passphrase/code on your network settings in Intel Pro, and make sure the channels match, you'll be good to go. Again, he can get this from his router config page, and you enter the identical info in your Intel Pro settings for the network of the same name.

4. If he's using MAC filtering, you'll need to find the MAC address of your laptop. You can find this by doing the following steps:

Start
Run
cmd
Enter
In the DOS box that appears type:

ipconfig /all>c:\ipconfig.txt

(Note the space after ipconfig. That is the only space in that string.)

This creates a text file of your IP settings on your C:\ drive. Which you can copy/paste here if you need further help. Like this:

Physical address in the above (under MAC Bridge Miniport) is your MAC address. If he's using MAC filtering, he'll need to enter that address into his router configuration.

 

sanpabloguy, thanks for the in-depth answers...

since I will not be able to figure this out until monday, I will leave some questions for you guys behind to answer only at your leisure, as I'm still very curious about the wireless...

in response to sanpabloguy's Q#...

1 & 3. by 'secure' do you mean that it says 'secure' in my list, as you can see in both the windows and netstumbler images (little lock on it)? I have been signing into my landlord's 'Natwark' with a WEP (at least I think it's a WEP - he gave me a text file called wep.txt with 26 digits that got me connected), so I'm guessing it is in fact 'secure', while my neighbour's linksys that I have been leeching off is 'unsecure' (unlocked)?

2. make sure that his channel matches mine - is this something that I can set myself to specifically match the channel he sets it to, or can I only find OUT what channel he's sending on using something like netstumber, but not actually set it myself?

3. it appears from my list of found networks that 'Natwark' is the only one with that name, is that all you mean by this?

4. I don't know if he is using MAC filter, nor do I know what that is, nor do I think he would know what that is....his inability like mine may either hurt or help me, we'll see.

thanks again for everything both of you - will try out on monday and ask occasional question, no obligation but thanks again!!!!

chris j

 

guys,

on my landlord's return, he started his computer, which was off during the month without internet, and voila, connection restored. does that mean that there is some communication b/t the router and his computer that is vital to my wireless connection? I checked netstumbler again while connected to Natwark (my desired one) and it and others are still on channel 6, is that possible? anyway thanks for your help guys I really appreciate it...

chris j

 

He may have not loaded the router with his settings. May need his mac address cloned along with userid and PW for PPPoE if that what he is using. So without his pc on the lease was not being renewed.

 

Not unless the AP owner set it that way.

My SSID is not the same as my network name.