Router or access point??

My current network consists of all wired connections.

I have Cable internet and run from the modem to a router which splits the signal off to the various rooms of the house. I am planning on adding a wireless access point in the house to recieve wireless for the laptop.

I also have a 4 car garage built of concrete filled Cinderblock walls and it is probably about 150-200' away from the inside router, currently I have a wired connection in the garage. I know I will not be able to get onto the wireless from in the garage because cordless phone reception is next to nothing from in there.

So for the garage my plan was to get a wireless router, plug the cable coming from the house into that and be set. I want to keep the wired option in the garage which is why I am going with a router in the garage rather than an access point.

Now I have been reading and I keep seeing IP adresses being discussed.

What am I going to have to deal with as far as IP's are concerned??

I plan on securing both the WAP and Router with WPA 2 for security.

 

I think what you're going to want in the garage is a so-called wireless access device; basically, a wireless router with the routing functions turned off so that it remains a part of the same original network and doesn't create a second subnetwork in the garage. That wireless access device should be configured to get its IP address from the main router controlling the network, and, I believe, the systems that connect to the network through that wireless access point will also receive their IP addresses from the main controlling router in the house.

 

Shyster is absolutely right. Having two routers on a network can cause some serious issues. Something liek this should work alright.
http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Sate...nksys/Common/VisitorWrapper&lid=9877339789B26

 

I can't use an access point in the garage. If I do I will loose my wired connection.

I guess the best bet would be to use an access point in the house and use a router in the garage set both up so they get their IP from the wired router in the house.

 

You are looking to extend your network into the garage, so a "bridge mode" configuration. So router1 (AP1) is communicating directly with router2 (AP2). Both AP must be capable of point-to-point bridging and usually have to be from the same manufacturer.

 

You can use a second router with out any problems, I have 2 connected to main router.

What you need to do is, with the second router set it to a static IP address outside of your DHCP range (main router). This is to allow you to access it when you turn off DHCP in it. With the DHCP turned off (lan side) and having a static IP you will now connect the cat5 cable from your main router into one of the LAN ports. This will allow the main router to handle the DHCP function. You just turned your router into a switch with a wireless AP. If you need to access the second router in the garage you use the static IP address.

 

if you have the exta LAN ports on your router...run two cat5e cables to your garage...1 handling wired...and an access point or wireless router set to cascade as describe above

 

Yes, but I think the terminology "router" confuses people. Technically, a router connects two different subnets together. In this example, the 2nd device isn't being used as a router, but as an access point.

To the OP. What you want is a Wireless Access Point, or a Wireless Router that has a Wireless Access Point mode. (Not all do.)

1. Log into the Access Point via ethernet and turn off DHCP, then set a static IP address to something on your existing network outside of the DHCP scope. Let's say 192.168.1.2. (Assuming your router is 192.168.1.1) Set the subnet mask to 255.255.255.0. Set the Gateway to the IP addiress of your router.

2. Set an SSID on the AP

3. Set up WEP or WPA on the Access point

4. Connect the Access Point via ethernet anywhere on the network that there is wired ethernet available. If the Access Point is actually a "router" being used as an Access Point, make sure you connect it to the ethernet via one of the LAN ports, not the WAN port.

5. You should now be able to connect wirelessly to the access point and have access to the rest of the network, be it Internet, file shares, whatever you have set up.

BTW, you can set up multiple Wireless Access Points at various points like this if you need to distribute wireless to far flung areas.

 

Isn't 192.168.1.2 within the DHCP range?

 

Well, I wouldn't have any idea what the DHCP range would be on someone else's network, nor would I even know what subnet they were using. 192.168.1.2 was merely an example. The original poster would need to determine their own appropriate IP address based on his particular subnet and DHCP scope.

My own opinion would be for the OP to save all of the single-digit addresses for devices that require fixed addresses...access points, network printers, whatever....then start the DHCP scope at x.x.x.10. But that's just my own personal preference.

 

A subnet would change the third digit of the IP address, so any address outside the first subnet should be xxx.xxx.y.xx, whereas y is the digit defining the second subnet. But anyway, I think the overall idea is fine. And even if you treated both routers as AP (bridge mode), it would work, without even doing anything in the addressing protocol. It seems that the OP already has a ethernet jack in the garage, so just connect the second router on that jack and operate as a wireless AP, it will work.

 

Not if you use a router that acts as an access point - plug the wire from the house into the input side of the router, and then an extra bit of cable into one of the four LAN output sockets, and you've now got both wired and wireless access to your network via the router/access-point.

 

Well, yeah. But I'm not sure what that has to do with anything I suggested.

All I was saying is to assign the Access Point any unused IP address within the subnet that isn't part of his DHCP scope.

 

So if I get 2 DIR-615 Routers I should be able to set them up to work. I would use one inside go from the Cable modem to the 615, then run the wired connections off of that. In the garage use the other 615 to run wireless and one of the LAN ports to run the wired connection.

Is the 615 able to be set up as an AP instead of a router?

 

Yes, you can set up the first DIR-615 to be your router with the cable modem connected to the WAN port, and connect the rest of the wired LAN from one of the LAN ports on the 615. I assume that this router will then run DHCP for your network?

For the 2nd DIR-615, I can't say whether it can be used in Access Point mode. I have a DIR-624 set up as an access point, though there's no official mode for it. Basically, just disable DHCP (on the 2nd 615) on the LAN side and also on the WAN side. (You'll not connect anything to the WAN port anyway.) Assign it a static LAN IP address in your subnet, set up the SSID/Security, and connect it to the network with an ethernet cable into one of the LAN ports.

Should work out just fine.

 

You said outside of the subnet but the IP address you suggested is within the subnet. But it doesn't matter, the big picture of your suggestion is what it counts.

 

Actually, I said "outside the DHCP scope", ie, the pool of addresses available for distribution...not "outside the subnet." Obviously assigning an address outside the subnet would not work.

 

A router is literally an AP, both routers are AP in the sense that they connect clients to the internet. The second 615 is also an AP for your laptop in the garage, because it will connect your laptop to the first 615, which will connect your laptop to internet, we call that "bridge". The first 615 is an AP to the other clients connected to it, whether they are wired (ethernet) or wireless (WiFi).

You could actually even cascade both routers wirelessly, but in this circumtances the garage cement structure won't allow it, but since you have this jack in the garage wall you will connect router 1 to router 2 through an ethernet port, it will work, just try it.

 

This thread has turned in to a mess. My #6 post answered the question of the original post. Can a router be used as a AP? The simple answer is YES. Any wireless router can be used as a AP whether not it has a AP mode. All we are doing is disabling the NAT in the second router. Allowing the main router to handle all NAT and DHCP functions. If your main router is a GigE adding multiple sub routers (100baset) will not have little to no impact on speed if the users decide to use the remaining LAN ports for pc's or ethernet hardware.

Infact you can connect to the WAN port on the router and normal internet access will work, different subnets preferred. It just messes up file and printer sharing. It's common practice to use multiple routers to add layer of security, group isolation if you do not want to use VLANs.

 

If the OP keep coming is perhaps he is not clear yet about how to do it.

What I find interesting tough, is that not only the OP is learning but even us by all the posts, thank you!

 

Using routers as AP came about when AP became more expensive than routers. But AP normally give you more options in configurations. Most AP basicly used the same CPU as the router but did not have to process NAT, DHCP and switch functions, in turn better performance. But the after market firmware corrected a lot of this now. And the modern router no longer have a low powered (speed) cpu.

 

Interesting, and do we have in the market strickly AP's?

 

Yes, AP are still in the market and are mainly used buy business or if you need a special function like bridge, multi-point bridge. They can also be setup for a client card, gaming devices. These were better if you need to cover a large area and need the roaming feature. So they are very useful. Since they are a stand alone package, it does not take away the resources from a router. Early on they had more powerful cpu to handle the encryption. The cost for a AP in most cases is the same or slightly higher than some routers. The reason I just buy routers now and re-configure them, unless I'm needing the bridge or gaming. This way I have a piece of hardware I can reuse for other purposes.

 

Very interesting, thank you for taking the time to explain.

 

yeah...you can connect two routers together...LAN to LAN...fourth ocelot on second router set to one number higher than the first router...disable all DHCP functions on second router...don't have to set up main page in static...use auto config if you're unfamiliar with networking...also no port forwarding or range triggering on second router...if there is an advanced wireless set-up page set second router set to 'router' mode instead of 'gateway' mode...now you've got a dummy wireless switch...with three extra LAN ports...period

 

Ok so I am digging this back up as I am finally getting around to doing all of this.

I have 2 D-Link DIR 615's ready to be installed in my system.

Here are a few things I could use some help on to clear it all up for me.

First when I added a router on my wired connection I never set up anything. I plugged a cat 5 cable from the Cable modem into the WAN port on the router, then plugged cat 5 cables into the LAN ports of the router to go to all the other wired computers in the house. I do not need or have any file sharing of any sort setup between computers basicly the only thing they are sharing is an internet connection.

I am planning on replacing the wired router I am using now with one of the DIR-615's. I have no idea as to what my IP range is or anything like that. Where would I obtain this info or would I even need it considering there is no file sharing going on in my system.

For the second DIR-615 I was going to run a cat 5 cable from one of the LAN ports on the first DIR-615 to the LAN port on the 2nd DIR-615.

It seems like the main problem I am having is with all of the IP address stuff.

 

The first router should be setup with DHCP and the second one with a static IP address. In your case (first router) you would normally have an IP addresses range from 198.168.1.1 to 192.168.1.255.

 

One other thing...make sure that the static IP address that you set for the second router (or any other device with a fixed address) is outside the DHCP pool on the first router. So if your main router is 192.168.1.1, set the second one to 192.168.1.2, and then set the DHCP server to assign addresses starting with 192.168.1.10 (or whatever, depending on how many addresses you want to exclude for other fixed devices). You just don't want to assign a fixed address to something and then also have a DHCP server duplicating it.

 

Where would I get the IP range??

From the Cable company??

WIll the router be able to tell what IP address it should have when I set it up?

 

The ISP is not involved on that, the first router DHCP protocol will take care of that.

Unfortunately I don't know the DIR-615 so I can't help you to set it up, but this is basically how to connect into your router, with one computer connected to an Ethernet port of the router, on the IE/FF url bar type 192.168.1.1 or 192.168.0.1 (some router uses this IP address), this is the router IP address, then search the options you need to setup.

 

Got it.

So for the second router that I will just be using as an access point. Turn DHCP off, plug the cat 5 into one of the LAN ports instead of the WAN port, set up security and I should be good.

 

The main router will have two IP addresses, one external address (WAN address) supplied by your ISP (whether this is dynamically obtained or fixed depends on your ISP) and an internal address (LAN address). The internal address can be whatever you want it to be, but by default most manufacturers assign either 192.168.1.x, or 192.168.0.x. The documentation with your router will tell you what has been set by default. You can change it to suit your needs, but either 192.168.1.1 or 192.168.0.1 is certainly the most common. Whatever address you set here will be the "default gateway" for any other device on your network.

So your pool of addresses that you should set for DHCP would be anything from 192.168.1.2 to 192.168.1.254...excluding any addresses that you want to save as fixed addresses. So set the pool to be maybe 192.168.1.10 through 192.168.1.254, and then you can use 192.168.1.2 through 192.168.1.9 for fixed IP's.

Is this making sense?

 

That makes lot of sense, but how does he actually implement this on the routers? I'm not familiar with DIR-615, are you?

 

Not the 615. I've used the 624 and have a 655 though.

All he needs to do is set up router #1 to work with his ISP with whatever settings his ISP requires. We can't really help him with that. Then he needs to set up the LAN address on the 615...either accepting the default, or choosing another subnet. Then he needs to activate DHCP for the LAN, setting the address range to exclude a few addresses...starting it at x.x.x.10 for example.

Then for the second router (to be used as an AP) he assigns one of the addresses (LAN) that he excluded from his DHCP pool, sets the subnet mask to 255.255.255.0, and the gateway to the LAN address of router one. He sets nothing up for WAN on the AP. He connects router 2 to router 1 via ethernet ports. (He also disables the DHCP server on router #2.)

Where I'm now confused (and am too lazy to go back and read the original posts) is why he's setting up both a router and another identical router as an AP. Why not just use the wireless on router #1? Unless he's running a really long ethernet cable and router #2 is some distance away.

 

That's an excellent question, why? May be the modem is in the basement, so he will connect the router #1 there, and with a cat 5 connect router #2 in a second/main floor to connect with other computers. Or perhaps he simply wants to extend the range of the first router.

 

I am using 2 because the first one will be in the house. The second is for a detached 4 car garage that is about 200' away. Also the detached garage is made of 8" thick CMU(Cinder Block) walls with a combination of re-bar, cement, and foam insulation completely filling the voids in the CMU. On the inside there is metal chanels attached to the CMU wall with 5/8" sheetorck over that. No way is a wireless router going to reach that far and through that much stuff to deliver a good wireless signal in the garage.

 

OK, that explains it. How are you going to connect router 2 to router 1? Are you burying a really long ethernet cable or something? BTW, the distance limit for CAT5 is 100 meters, so you'll be OK with 200 feet.

 

I already have a wired connection in my garage. It is just a PITA to have to plug the laptop in everytime I need to use it.

 

PITA??????? Isn't that a Greek bread?

(I know what it means )

 

I thought the Euro was Greek bread?

 

I agree, even the Canadian dollar for that sake