NETGEAR Nighthawk AX12 Arrived

After a few days of weighing the pros and cons of the Premier Membership Beta I opted in yesterday morning to the 1 year option and the router arrived about an hour ago without getting a shipping email as stated in the opt-in email.

Attached are a few unboxing photos of the router and included accessories.

The router came in a standard cardboard brown shipping box.Inside was an unmarked white box that had a sealed in plastic wrap router retail box that contained the router,accessories and literature.

The included quick start guide states to setup the router with the Nighthawk app from the Google Play Store which I will do after reading the guide.

 

well I got all my phones,tablets,notebooks,chromebooks,smart tv and smart home devices setup on the 2.4ghz and 5ghz band.
What I haven't found in the router setup is the HT160 setting.
At present inSSIDer shows a steady 866.7 Mbps and no higher.
The R7800 has the HT160 check box but it seems to be absent in the RAX120.
I'll give Netgear a call since it's on of the Premier Membership perks.

 

Well after 2 days of being a leaser of an RAX120 I can say I'm not at all pleased with it.
My R7800 had an HT160 option in the router's settings and mostly yielded data link speeds in the 1200 Mbps to 1733 Mbps range connecting with a Killer 1550.
The highest setting in the AX12 is HT80 that produces a solid 866.7 Mbps when ticking all the correct boxes.
I was on the phone with Netgear Premier Membership support yesterday afternoon to ask if there is settings hidden to enable at least 1733.3 Mbps but 3 different levels of tech support could not help.It's was not surprizing that I felt the people I spoke to at the 3 levels of support seemed not to be very knowledgeable or at least equal to what I the consumer,paying to be a beta tester,knows.
I've owned many Netgear routers since buying a WNDR34 way back when.
I obliged their request and sent screen shots of my setting,hardware and inSSIDer readings.
If after the 30 day trial period new firmware isn't released enabling HT160.
The settings contain the enabling of WPA3 or WPA2 = WPA3.If I select just WPA3 none of my devices will work so I set to WPA2 + WPA3.

 

I did warn you these are still beta devices, it will still be even after launch ($499.99 according to Amazon before page was pulled) till about 4-6 months after launch even for everything to be settled and features and bugs fixed. Will be a while before enough 2nd and 3rd level reps are even trained about it. 1st level reps will generally be clueless about deeper functions as expected.


Mind showing WiFi selection settings image? The drop down menu for wireless rate.

Also at least in the RAX80 you cannot select HT160 on channels 149 and above as there is no contiguous 160 MHz of bandwidth available. You need to select channels 36-128, anywhere in that range for it to work. Also interestingly enough in HT160 mode just like the R7800 which dropped from 4x4 to a 2x2 mode the RAX120 drops from 8x8 to a 4x4 mode when specifically dealing with HT160 clients.





As a side note, just some experiences with HT160:
I did notice regardless of router HT160 on occasion would cause disconnects and occasional latency spikes. Makes sense due to more chances for interference. For most users I would suggest HT80 for best stability, latency and range, unless for simply benchmarking reasons you want to show high bandwidth. In fact for more bandwidth better to buy a Broadcom 3x3ac card like the Dell Wireless DW1830A seen in some Latitudes for better performance rather than HT160 on a 2x2 card. More stable and longer range.

 

With the R7800 and Killer 1550 I don't recall any disconnects or much latency doing my normal tasks and routines but with some driver and firmware range,video buffering and awful transfer speeds were very noticeable.

So far I have a non refundable $9.99 invested in this 1st hand look into the RAX120 and WiFi 6 and have 28 days left in which I can return it with free return shipping.

Yesterday I was told by a Netgear rep that being selected to the Premier Membership Beta should be considered an honor,wow!

As I'm typing this I got a message from Netgear asking when is a good time for them to call my cell for some updated info on my service ticket.

Yes you did warn about early hardware but I've been on this road before and more or less know what to expect but this is less than expectations.

I was also expecting an ES AX200 from China but that has not arrived or is lost in the trade war lol.

 

OK,another chat on the phone with a Netgear engineer in the Philippines.Yeah the cs calls get rerouted to the Philippines.
Today's gained information was that the RAX120 will need a WiFi 6 wireless card to gain AX data link speeds.
The RAX120 paired with a 9260 or 1550 is limited to 866.7 Mbps due to the radios used and Qualcomm chip.

What was also said is that the RAX200 will be released for sale very soon but it should work with the Intel 9260 and 1550 as the R7800 does to reach the 1733.3 Mbps data Link Speed....Broadcom chip

 

They have no idea what they are talking about. Looking at the RAX120 and even some other devices FCC filings as well that are using the same WiFi chipset, the unit should technically be able to do HT160 on ac mode as it was apparently even tested for it during the approval process.

Of course you need an AX card to get AX link rates not sure why they thought you didn’t know that.

Problem is these routers are actually made by the likes of Delta Networks (R7800, RAX120), Foxconn (RAX80, R7000, R8500) etc. They also apparently do some of the core firmware using Qualcomm and Broadcom base software and Netgear adds it’s UI and software features & additions on top of that and then they do bug fixing too of course. No surprise that sometimes they don’t know what these chipsets are capable of.


From what I got from Voxel (a firmware dev) is that the R7800 for example, it’s firmware wasn’t even compiled to fully take advantage of the CPU’s capabilities in terms of crypto acceleration, he made changes to take better advantage of it while also updating ancient/outdated OpenWRT packages from stock firmware.


Honestly bud, cancel the lease. General problems on their routers that NG refuses to fix despite numerous calls, even from some major reviewers in regards to the UI, at these premium price points ($499.99 for the RAX120, $599.99 for the RAX200):

-No VPN third party client option, ie ExpressVPN, Nord VPN and others, only stuck with the default Pure VPN.
-No granular WiFi controls (ie ax only, ac only ac/n mixed etc) Basically missing many advanced controls, take a look at Asus/Linksys.
-Messy QoS Icons/labeling that differs on router/phone app/desktop app. No consistency basically and each over rides the other in labeling/icons.
-Traffic monitoring isn’t very real time and very basic
-System stats CPU/MEM usage etc is in a separate debug page instead of main UI.

UI would be simplified if you had advanced options unhidable in same page as basic settings for each page ie Wireless etc.

For $449.99 Asus’s GT-AX11000 (same hardware as RAX200 which is $599.99) for example gives you most of the above features plus ability for USB Internet backup/fail over. Not to mention ability to split VPN to only certain clients and have others bypass VPN. Lastly they actually offer a 2 year warranty vs 1 year for NG.

If I buy it, it would be because of Voxel’s firmware or OpenWRT support and the QCA hardware. Stock firmware is just rubbish if charging that premium price. I still think the hardware is well built though so for standard home users I still recommend some of their routers.

 

I'm leaning on sending it back at the end of the 30 day trial and setting the R7800 back up.

Actually there is a PureVPN setup option in the Advanced Setup.

The catch is that it's not free

1 year = $4.08/mo
2 years = $2.88/mo

 

Yeah I saw that, PureVPN is available in the R7800’s as well but other than that default option you don’t really have the ability to import third party OpenVPN profiles from much better providers like ExpressVPN, NordVPN and many others that actually provide much faster connections/servers and importantly better privacy policies, read Pure’s TOS completely. For a premium router not to support “Premium” VPN providers or at least import third party profiles is a joke.

 

I'll use it for the remainder of the trial period and swap out one of the 1550 for a 9260 and hope a WiFi 6 adapter comes my way before the trial period is up.The swap should not make any difference.

I've reached out to Rivet about a 1650 but it fell on deaf ears.

Once computer pre orders with WiFi 6 start appearing the China sellers should begin their ebay sales.
I reached out to a few China sellers I've dealt with in the past with only one responding about an ES AX200-

 

Er...there is no Qualcomm chip used in the 9260 or 1550. Both use Intel radios. There is no Qualcomm in those devices whatsoever.

-- Anthony with Killer Networking

 

I’m pretty sure he meant the Qualcomm chip in the RAX120 vs the Intel 9260ac. But yeah the RAX120 & R7800 are both Qualcomm based.

 

You sir are absolutely correct

 

As I said earlier the RAX120’s chipset was tested for HT160 and it seems they finally enabled it:

https://kb.netgear.com/000060819/RAX120-Firmware-Version-1-0-0-84

As I suspected @WhatsThePoint, NG reps you spoke with didn’t really train yet on its capabilities.

Update the firmware and test with your 9260ac it should hopefully work now.

 

As stated above the RAX120 received a firmware update that added an HT160 router WiFi settings option
I don't have the AX support enabled so it only shows as AC

This is a 5 year old MSI GS60 notebook with a Killer 1550 installed and driver v21.0.0.5

Another issue I had with my RAX120 is if I chose WPA2(AES) + WPA3 I would lose the 5ghz SSID

If I choose only WPA2(AES) all is well.

I don't want to test if that reported issue has been addressed because I don't want to go through setting up again.

I'll wait till I have an Intel AX200

The scheduled April 2019 Windows 10 update to 1903 should have WPA3 support baked in?

 

B&H Photo in NYC has the RAX120 up for preorder.
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1469206-REG/netgear_rax120_nighthawk_ax12_12_stream_wifi.ht

Ebay has it for $500 with guaranteed April 10th delivery

 

Received an email 2 days ago that a new RAX120 firmware was available,v1.0.1.86

I used my Google Pixel 3XL with Android Nighthawk app to update the firmware.

The app reported the firmware was successfully updated but after logging into the router I see it's still on the old version 1.0.0.84

After 3 unsuccessful attempts to update I searched Netgear's site for the new firmware but it was nowhere to be found

The next step was a google search that revealed others suffering the same fate.

Information suggests the firmware was quickly removed due to bugs reported by early updaters.

Why not an email stating the firmware was removed?

Just more bad Netgear Customer Service.

My next router may be an Asus?

 

Exactly why I got the ASUS ROG Rapture GT-AX11000. I love the fact that NETGEAR routers have the Plex Media Server, that was one feature my baby used a lot but after getting bit by NETGEAR with one bad firmware after the other on the NETGEAR X10, I was leery to get another NEGEAR router. This just fortifies my decision. The company's customer service is atrocious and they don't give flagship routers the attention that they deserve.

 

I’m on .86. but yeah it’s probably pulled. Asus and Netgear both delegate part of the firmware development to the actual contracted manufacturers. Difference is Asus sticks to one chipset (Mostly Broadcom) for simplicity as they can have consistent firmware and features sets across devices and do more work on their part rather than leaving much of the heavy lifting to contractors. Netgear on the other hand uses excellent Qualcomm chipsets in addition to the Broadcom models but you end up in situations where low end units or previous gen units have certain features missing in current high end units on the firmware side (ie circle, downloader, PLEX).

I like Netgear’s more muted and professional design vs Asus somewhat childish looks on the ROG units (more of subjective and superficial assessment on my part), but overall Asus has more mature software and support and thus is a better buy. I’ve started recommending NG only for those who care purely for WiFi performance and don’t use any advanced features and for tweakers and Advanced users I recommend Asus. The R7800 is the one I recommend of theirs. The RAX80/120 have been decent but have 0 advanced features or user controls to warrant the high prices.

As for latest ax devices both companies still have major issues with certain APs/clients and certain conditions as the WiFi firmware from QCA/BCM still need work, and the updates come directly from them. But that’s the price of early adoption.

 

If a firmware is pulled that's probably a very good thing but the Netgear Nighthawk app on my phone still shows I need to update my firmware.

The app goes through all the motions of updating and then says update successful when no updating actually occurred.

If I look right now it will show "UPDATE"

 

Any updates on the firmware bro?

ASUS just released a new firmware today:

 

There is a .89 firmware out to fix a rare issue some people had with AX200/1650 devices causing the router to reboot as soon as they connect but it’s still in engineering. Not available to public yet. I filed a complaint as I had a relative who’s OnePlus 5 won’t connect with WPA2+WPA3 enabled. Literally every Apple and Windows device, TV, Soundbar etc connects except that phone. I think @WhatsThePoint had a similar issue.


I also complained about the fact the USB reads drop to like 90-100 MB/s while writes are 140-160 MB/s. Usually it’s supposed to be the opposite lol. It’s probably the most powerful consumer chipset, just needs a little more tweaking.

They spent over an hour with me on phone and forwarded debug logs to engineering. I asked about .86 being pulled and got no answer about anything being wrong with it. I asked for the .89 firmware but they said it’s probably only being given to people with the AX200 issue by engineering and support guy had no access to it.

@WhatsThePoint PM the thread starter on NETGEAR Forums with the thread title RAX 120 Reboots, the OP has .89 might be able to give it you, it may have other fixes in it as well.

 

OP,
On the AX12 are you able to change wifi channel availability by simply changing your country/region on the router?
Cheers

 

You need to use a telnet command for region change. As it’s technically illegal to do so I can’t go into the details. I’m sure if you scrounge the internet for a few minutes you will figure out how.

 

Understood, however on my UK purchased R6300v2, simply changing the region to USA gives me different channels on the 5ghz band. I'm guessing this is no longer possible on the latest & greatest Netgear routers, ie they now come as region locked?

 

Yeah it’s now a FCC requirement at least here in the US that region change be locked down by all vendors for US skus.