Lions and Tigers and Routers, Oh My!

Okay...so I've been pondering and researching and reading posts on the "best" routers out there that will strengthen signals, boost speed, and coordinate traffic throughout the house.

And I'm confused on several levels, and afraid to jump in and buy something that, once bought, may refuse to connect, or confirm a signal, or accept my settings.

In other words, I don't know enough about how to connect a router to a modem and set it up to talk with the other PCs in the house.

Our two-story log cabin (main floor and basement) is connected via Spectrum through a Ubee modem on the main floor. It sits on a shelf between the wall-mounted TV and the adjoining wall leading to the outdoors. We have no separate routers at this time.

There are currently five PCs (not all going at the same time), only one of which is 5GHz-compatible. None of them are wired to the Ubee, and all their wireless cards are old (except for my MSI's Intel AC 8265).

Two PCs are in rooms on the main floor other than where the Ubee is: logs separate the PCs from the Ubee (this being a log cabin). The main floor is maple, underneath which is a subfloor of wood framing.

Three PCs are in the basement. The MSI is closest (relatively speaking) to the Ubee; it's about 8 feet away and one floor down. The ceiling is wood beam and plywood; the walls are wood framed and plywood, with some concrete support beams; the basement floor is poured concrete covered by laminate.

All the routers I've researched require the router to be connected to the modem via an ethernet cable (and plugged into an electric socket). I do not understand how using a device like that will enhance the speed or range of Internet service for the PCs, since the router will be located pretty much where the Ubee modem is.

I understand that MU-MIMO is about the most up-to-date option I could consider--but the good ones appear to be very, very expensive. And I don't think I understand why MU-MIMO would be superior for our devices to a non-MU-MIMO device.

Here's a for instance--and forgive me if I'm using a bad example; I don't know from personal experience what's good and what's bad:

Has anyone used the Google WiFi system, the kind that offers 1 to 3 devices, depending upon the size of your home? (Just look up "Google WiFi system" on Amazon.)

Tech Specs
AC1200 2x2 Wave 2 Wi-Fi
Expandable mesh Wi-Fi.
2 Gigabit Ethernet ports per point
WAN and LAN on primary Wifi point.
Both act as LAN ports on additional Wifi points.
Simultaneous dual-band Wifi (2.4GHz / 5GHz)
Supports IEEE 802.11a/b/g/n/ac.


If I'm understanding the system correctly, the main one would have to be wired to the Ubee...and I've no idea if just that one alone would make any difference in speed and signal strength in the downstairs PCs.

If I bought a second one, I believe it could be set up downstairs, directly below the main one, and configured wirelessly as an access point for WiFi.

Again, I've no idea if such a system would work to boost signal and enhance speed(s)--I don't even know if it would interfere with connectivity and require constant rebooting of PCs and resetting of both the Ubee and the Google WiFi units. All headaches I don't need.

Those are the things that hold me back from trying anything.

Since my new MSI will detect 5GHz, it would be nice to use a router to set up just that PC on its own channel under 5GHz and allow the other PCs to coordinate among the 2.4GHz channels (if there are more than one).

Is that possible? Would something like Google WiFi do that? Or is there a different router that would be a better choice?

I'd (very much) appreciate two kinds of feedback:

(1) Suggestions for the kind of router that will do the above without driving me nuts; and

(2) Links to manuals that will help me read how to set up such a router.
I am not experienced in understanding what my SSID is, what form of security I have and/or need, how to get a router to talk to the Ubee, how to find my IP address if asked, which channel to switch to for which purpose (and how to switch!)...and so on.

I can LEARN, but right now I do not KNOW.

Thanks, guys--and apologies for newbie babble.

 

+rep for making it easy on my poor eyes

 

That actually was for my eyes, I'll confess--I've been at the 'puter working since 3:30 A.M., and I needed a larger type size for when I proofread what I wrote!

 

I personally don't trust Google, they're sure to implement all sorts of telemetry in their devices. On the other hand, I shouldn't care much, using VPN 24/7... But Google stuff is also expensive, so nay.

 

Thank you for your response, @Starlight5--I agree that Google stuff is expensive, but I have yet to find a router that is both well rated and affordable. They all seem to be expensive (and the MU-MIMO routers can at a minimum cost $500 bare bones!).

I'd be overjoyed to find a router that worked really well (per feedback by members here), fit my parameters, and cost between $80 and $200. Those Google WiFi points can be sold as a threesome or just one at a time, and I guess how many you need depends on where your PCs are and how large your home is. One unit costs around $115, and would have to be plugged directly into the Spectrum router (so it wouldn't be an access point). That would be fine if just one worked well. But I doubt that would be my case.

 

@sona I don't care about MU-MIMO, so perfectly happy with my Xiaomi router; the only con is Ethernet speeds, including WAN port, are limited to 100Mbps. It is very stable and has decent range, and costs $30-something, on the other hand.

 

@Starlight5, could you tell me which model router you have? I've just gone to the Xiaomi website, and they seem to have several router models, so I'm not sure which one you're referring to.

Also, I clicked randomly on two different models, and each one indicates there is a user manual available for downloading--yet there was no clickable way to access the manual. And I accessed a different website in the U.S. that carries the Xiaomi; it indicates that the user manual is included in the package when you purchase the router, but (this is more concerning) it calls it "the Chinese user manual."

Is the manual only in Chinese? (Sorry if this is a dumb question!)

I'm grateful to you, @Starlight5; I've never heard of Xiaomi, and I appreciate learning about a router I've not researched.

 

I usually recommend Netgear with AC1200-1600 w/ external antenna which is more than enough. Then again, ask Phoenix about which mid-range router to buy? He has similar House schema like yours more or less.

 

Hi, @Vasudev,

Well, I certainly know that name (Netgear), at least! That was the name of a router I had years ago, when life was an awful lot simpler.

I'll check out what you've recommended, and yes, I will ask @Phoenix. When I first began to post here, @Phoenix had anticipated my need for a router, and he'd suggested a MU-MIMO to help boost speed as well as signal strength:

"On a side note, I strongly suggest you get a MU-MIMO router in the future for better performance and range.

Don't go as extreme as I did with the Nighthawk X10, but you can go with the much cheaper but respectable Nighthawk X4S or the more expensive Nighthawk X8. They both support MU-MIMO."

And he included a link to a thread that might help me get a sense of which of the Nighthawks might be better for my needs.The X8 costs about the same as the Google WiFi units (three of them), while the X4S is slightly less expensive than that, so I can certainly check them out further.

Your recommended Netgear (1200 or 1600) is reasonably priced, so I'll research that more as well.

What's interesting to me is how there's a price level (probably for everyone, just a different number) below which I feel comfortable experimenting and beyond which I get slightly nervous. For me, once a product costs $180 or more, I start to get serious about how necessary it is to have whatever it is I'm researching.

Thanks, @Vasudev--I very much appreciate your input!

 

Good.

 

@sona I personally use Xiaomi Mi WiFi Router Mini 802.11ac, it's very compact and nice, but not the latest model. Xiaomi Mi WiFi Router 3G 802.11ac has Gigabit WAN port and is newer, I would recommend that if you're looking for a cheap router. The latter link is in Chinese, use Google Translate to read it.

Xiaomi used to provide English firmware for their routers in the past, but now it is Chinese only (at least if you want the latest version). There is also some app to control it from smartphone, it probably has English trasnlation but I didn't try it personally. Some paper in Chinese is included with the router, but nothing interesting there; the router is extremely straightforward, I don't think there is any need for manual, it just works after you configure it according to your ISP. You will need some working internet connection to configure router first time (so that you can use Translate to English feature of Chrome), but other than that there are no complications, at least with my model.

As with any other router, I strongly recommend using different SSIDs for 2.4GHz and 5GHz networks, limiting channel width for 2.4GHz to 20MHz and choosing least congested channel if 2.4GHz spectrum is crowded in your area.

Overall, I trust Xiaomi as a company more than Google. I, my friends and relatives also use Xiaomi smartphones, robot vacuum cleaners, smart lamps, etc. Xiaomi devices are cheaper, well-supported, easy to repair and get parts for - and not too smart to become a serious security risk. It should be noted that most their devices other than routers do support English language.

 

Thank you for this information, @Starlight5! I really appreciate it--it will help a lot, I know.

I now have at least five different models from three brands (or so) to really explore. If I can't find the perfect router for me out of so many good choices, I don't deserve one!

 

That's all well and good but good luck getting any sort of technical assistance if something should go wrong.

@sona - purchase your router from a company that has proper support - Netgear, Linksys, D-Link, or even Apple if you have an iOS device to control it.

 

Never got any decent support from the above anyways.

However Ive never had any issues with any Xiaomi device to date, knock on wood.

Meanwhile I always have issues with D-link, Netgear and Linksys. Hopefully that has changed in the last year or so. Even the HooToo USB router that has basically no features seems to clean up packets better than my D link devices that were twice the price.

 

While it's a good argument overall, when it comes to router, which is basically a pretty dumb box with single overwhelming feature - what sort of support, except for regular firmware updates with security fixes, are we talking about?

Ability to run OpenWRT or some other specific alternative firmware may be important for some - but this is typically implemented for popular devices, and cheap widespread devices actually have a priority.

 

@sona I got this old router for cheap price at Amazon https://wikidevi.com/wiki/Netgear_R6220
It has 2 yr. warranty and 3-4 yr SW support from Netgear.
So I advise you to pick recent model from 2016,2017 to ensure continuous security update and product improvements.
As always newer isn't always better(unless it is a high end/enthusiast level product). Isn't it right? @Papusan

 

Any electronic device can fail at any time for any reason. Should that happen with the product you recommended, the OP would be SOL.

There are dozens of devices she can choose from that are easy to set up/configure, operate with English instructions, and can even be flashed to third-party firmware if desired. @Vasudev made an excellent recommendation above. There is no compelling reason for her to choose what you suggested.

 

What did I recommend? I just asked Sona to choose whichever Router that has newer feature(802.11ac), better warranty & SW support and ofc, economical.

 

I may be misunderstanding @saturnotaku, but I think he was referring to your recommendation that I not jump at buying the newest product on the market (or the cheapest) but give some consideration to 2016/2017 models that have a proven track record of performance and reliable security updates. And that is very sound advice.

@Vasudev, I had a further conversation with Phoenix, who suggested I read some threads over at the SNB forum (I've registered there now) to help me learn and decide what might be best for me, since they specialize in routers.

I find it really interesting that I came to this forum courtesy of Donald@HIDevolution ( ), have been learning so much and was extremely fortunate to have received Phoenix's help here ( )--and through him have registered over at SNB, where I will be able to extend my education (this time, about routers)!

--S

 

Thanks for making me understand the point.
Next thing you do after choosing Router is to check their product forums for any known issues and firmware limitations(if any). It will take some time though. So, have a glance at those forums when you're having a lunch or dinner or even while hanging out with friends.

 

Will do!

 

These devices usually come with 1-year warranty, and can be returned to seller for replacement or refund if they do fail. Unless the device is sold by a shady seller and/or comes with 1-month/no warranty at all, that is.

Price (~$30 on sale), positive reviews. Reviews say the smartphone app supports English language, so it can be configured without Google Translate tricks. I'm merely showing OP an alternative.

 

Must not like chinese products

 

If you mean me, The Reciever, can't be possible. You'd just have to look at the underneath of a dozen or so other kinds of electronic products around my house.

The company Xiaomi is likely a very good one, although I did get a bit concerned when they indicated there would be no English-language support (manuals, downloads) for the second (more recent) of the two models I saw on their site.

And I agree that bad support (and poorly written English-language manuals) can be found anywhere.

I'm trying to squitch in the time between work and sleep to read as much as I can over at the SNB forum about the routers suggested on this thread.

If it turns out that the Ubee router/modem supplied by Spectrum is the problem--if it's not giving me the speeds promised by the routers I'm researching--then unless I replace the Ubee with one of them--something Spectrum won't do for me and something I'd better not screw up if I try to do it on my own--then I don't see how any of the routers will up my download speed, even if they extend my range.

But that wasn't what you were saying, I know. It was just on my mind. I've no problem with a Chinese product, if it's the product I need for my particular situation. That's what I'm working on.

 

Was not directed to you in the slightest

 

Oh...okay. I just wasn't sure.

 

I am using a Xiaomi Redmi 4 right now and it is super fast with amazing battery life for only 140 USD. With that said, I wouldn't recommend you get a router from them and have to go hunting for user manuals in English or do translations. Get what's known, get what's tested. Get a Netgear, and call it a day. MU-MIMO is NOT a must, even a low end old Nighthawk would be night and day better than your ISP router.

1) Try to get a technician (not from your ISP, some external networking company) to help you set it up

2) if that's not a possibility, you can simply connect your current router to your UBEE and set it up as an access point although having the Nighthawk as your main router would provide you with better speeds usually due to it being a better router in general. (ie. lower poing rates)

 

Hey I wanted to ask this, does Redmi 4 or 4X comes with Dual Band Wifi? I thought Snapdragon 400/600 chipsets comes with dual band support?
I observe micro-lags on iphone 7 and s7 on 5GHz band.

 

Yes, I've been working on it--and getting a great deal of veteran advice (and an education in the process).

I suspect I'm not allowed to mention any other forums by name here, so I won't. But your suggestion a few weeks ago, Phoenix, has borne a great deal of fruit.

Here's where I stand right now:

1. Definitely will be getting a new router, but not until July, when my husband is out of town. That will allow me to tinker with the Ubee's settings and determine whether it will remain primary or be replaced. But it's got a lot working through it at this point (Roku for streaming to the TV in particular), and if I end up having to reboot and reassign and reset, he'll have a heart attack. Better he not be around for that.

2. I'm still toggling between the Nighthawk X4S and the Synology RT2600AC. Vasudev, your suggestion about checking the products' forums for user issues is a good one, although Synology doesn't have a dedicated forum (at least, not that I could find). But the specialty-router forum I've been haunting has much info on both products. Thing is, each is good, but each has its own (different) issues. So it will come down, in the end, to which I'd rather deal with: inadequate tech support, firmware/upgrade snafus, connectivity problems, and the like. By July, though, I should know what I want...and where best to purchase it in the event I want to return it.

3. In the interim, to help out my HP Pavilion desktop, I've ordered a Netgear RangeMax Dual Band Wireless-N USB 2.0 Adapter WNDA3100 Network adapter in hopes that it will help me with pitifully low d/l speeds. It's not all that powerful, but it should still be better than what I've got now. Also, I'm a coward, which is why I'm trying this instead of a replacement wireless card. I don't want to have to unscrew and remove anything.

4. Also in the interim, I've ordered an Intel 7260 dual-band wireless-AC network adapter PCI express half mini card for my Inspiron 15R. I'm going out of town the end of next week, and before I go, I'll visit Staples with the Inspiron and the card, and they'll swap it out for me (and hopefully will update drivers and test the thing out). With any luck, if they're successful, when I pick it up a week later, it too will offer me better speeds than I'm getting now.

There is the possibility that no matter how efficient I make my devices I'll still be experiencing d/l speeds in the 70s, 80s, 90s. It's been only about 5 months since Spectrum came to a handful of us up here on top of the mountain where I live, installed their cable(s), and got us up and running. How that happened (without us paying a ridiculous surcharge for the privilege) is a long story, but my point is that perhaps they used cable and access connections that throttle us (not for the purpose of throttling us, just to save money on their materials, perhaps). Just a theory of mine.

Anyway, that's where things stand now!

 

That model (R7800 aka Nighthawk x4S) had frequent firmware update to enhance wifi performance.
You might change the channel on 2.4GHz to 6,11 or 13 and on 5GHz 151,158,161 should do the trick for 100% radio power and max speed. Also switch to Google DNS or OpenDNS and use VPN(if needed, paid ones are best for max privacy).
You can install Netgear Genie OR Netgear UP on your phone to manage your netgear router. Do change the default admin password whilst setup. Use good Cat6 cable instead of flexible or flimsy default Wire Netgear ships in the package.

 

You are allowed - no worries.

 

Hi, Vasudev! I wanted to thank you for this suggestion:

Also switch to Google DNS or OpenDNS and use VPN(if needed, paid ones are best for max privacy).

I know next to nothing about any of these three options, but I'll read up on them and see first if there's any valid reason to avoid making such a switch--for instance, if it will have a baffling or negative effect on my husband's PC and netbook (getting online, wonky connectivity, and so on).

But in the event it looks like it'd help, I'll switch (probably to Google DNS).

And @downloads, thank you for setting me straight--I appreciate it!

The forum is SmallNetBuilders, and they've been awfully nice to me, considering what a newb I am.

So, for instance, one of their suggestions arrived in yesterday's mail (before the major snowstorm I'm going through today). It's a lower-end Netgear N600 WiFi Dual Band USB Adapter, and one of the members there had suggested I consider trying it on my Inspiron, since I didn't want to go in and swap out an internal wireless card on my own.

Instead, I decided to pay Staples to do that, using an Intel card that hasn't arrived yet. And I set up the N600 on my HP Pavilion desktop.

I didn't expect miracles, and I didn't get any. But I got improvement on my download speeds, and for that I am grateful.

Before installation, a speed test clocked me at 38.75 Mbps download and 11.68 Mbps upload.
After installation, download clocked in at 84.28 Mbps, with upload remaining virtually the same.

I don't think the HP ever got that kind of speed on its own, so this little bit of help is welcome.

And it took nothing at all to install it. We like that.

So that's today's update!

 

I'd suggest a router/PCIe card than USB adapter since USB dongles really get hot. You can check out AC1200/1600 with external antennas(for router).
Google DNS is having best speed and reliability. Switch at router level since changing it through Windows/Linux is a hassle sometimes. For VPN, Phoenix & others have experience.

 

VPN = VPN.AC

0 logging, o monitoring, nada. Fast speeds, nad many servers worldwide. Has a Windows, Mac, Android, and iOS app as well.

 

So no Linux Client support?

 

Hi, guys!

Okay, so I've read a little about VPN (and checked out VPN.AC), but as I wrote in my post above, I'm not clear (or clear enough yet) on why Google DNS, or VPN (via VPN.AC), would be useful for me in my line of work.

That Google DNS would (might?) offer faster speeds is alluring... but I don't yet understand the purpose and application of these options. In other words:

Husband and I live in a cabin. We have six PCs between us and two Android smartphones.

We both also have Verizon Wireless MiFi units. His we keep ready for use at the cabin for those times when we lose power. That happened two days ago (bad snowstorm): the generator kicked in, but it doesn't extend to the Ubee/TV area, just essentials. So we lost Spectrum. We plugged in the Verizon MiFi where we still had generator power, and were able to stay online for the three/four hours without power.

I take my MiFi unit with me when I travel, since I don't like using the free WiFi at motels for business or bill-paying...just for streaming movies, etc.

When I buy a router in July, it will either couple with or replace the Ubee...and hopefully will strengthen WiFi signals and offer faster speeds.

So: Where, how, at which point, and for what reason do Google DNS and VPN factor in to the above equation? How all-pervasive are they--can I engage them for my own PCs alone or must they be "attached" to all the devices that currently connect to the Internet through the same portal (as in Spectrum)? Are they their own entities--are they meant to replace Spectrum--or do they work with Spectrum through the main router in the cabin?

You see how ignorant I am about these services. Security and privacy are always important, as are speed and reliability, but I am not a NASA engineer or NSA upper-level exec. Do so-called normal people--say, a freelance inker for Marvel Comics--use these services, too?

 

1) You don't need a VPN. Not for your usage. Don't even think about it. a VPN is for someone who wants to bypass ISP blacklisted websites due to religious or political reasons, or to have complete anonymity, or to bypass other restrictions such as country specific only content (ie. Netflix)

2) You have the best Antivirus, clean software, clean computer, you do not need a VPN.

Even the Google DNS is questionable because most of the time, your ISP's DNS is faster since their servers are physically closer to your router than a Google DNS server might be located. See:
Why You Might Want to Stick With Your ISP's DNS Server After All

 

@sona When Phoenix says you don't need VPN then you better listen to him. Actually some VPN's slow down your internet speeds depending on the server who've chosen.
Google DNS or IPS DNS, choose whichever has less lags and better response time.
Initially my ISP had Google DNS to give everyone good net speed promise, then they switched to their server which slowed down my speed to 100% and giving sluggish perf. and blocked NBR forums and other sites which I use. So, I switched to Google DNS and everything is fine!
I don't know if VZW throttles your speed or not, its worth a try OR Maybe you won't notice any difference on wired connection but it will make heck of a difference on your MiFi device.

 

Thank you so much, Phoenix--you have relieved my mind! I really have been reading up on an awful lot of different electronics items and Internet service options and WiFi enhancement/analysis tools over the past few weeks, and I felt that some of what I was reading (although interesting) was unnecessarily complex, and potentially monkey-wrenching, for my needs.

As Vasudev writes (thank you, Vasudev!), if you (Phoenix) tell me I don't need VPN or Google DNS, then I don't. Period. I'll have my hands full in July when it's router configuration time, dancing with the Ubee.

@Vasudev, it sounds from your post as though you have more users draining your bandwidth than I do, so Google DNS made sense for you. I think my energy would be better spent focusing on the router/WiFi issues with respect to getting a strong signal and better speed through walls and concrete; I'm not compromised by my husband's use. Our usage hours rarely conflict, as it happens.

Oh--I also wanted to say that the VZW MiFi unit remains dormant unless Spectrum goes out on us, as it did the other day when we lost power. It is too slow for primary usage (perhaps Verizon throttles us after a certain number of GBs, not sure), but it's good to have it for emergencies.

If you were saying that Google DNS might be a possibility for the MiFi unit, because that might speed it up, it's worth thinking about. Once I get the router issue over and done with, I'll look into it. Thank you!