MSI1036 X700 Crashing

MSI1036
Turion ML37
Hitachi 100gig
1.5gig Corsair ram
XPpro32bit

X700 crashes during BF2, 3dMark, ATItest, seems anything 3d crashes the system. Reseller claims this is common but I have built many systems in the past and not seen cards do this. I am new to laptops, ideas on what could be wrong, what to check. I have tried new drivers from ATI, Omega driver, reinstalled OS. Thanks

 

Doil,

MSI systems do not officially support Corsair RAM, and it is not on their list of approved RAM manufacturers for the laptop. If it's CAS 2.5, you're definitely going to have a stability problem.

Your other option is heat - make sure you're not overheating, the MLs tend to run a bit hotter in these Turion systems. I would be more suspicious of the Corsair, though. Try a stick of Kingston or SuperTalent (they're supported).

Corsair is great RAM in general thinking, but not with MSI Turion systems.

The system does not crash commonly and shouldn't with the correct components.

 

The onboard ram could be why the video card crashes when it runs something 3D? The video card had 256meg on board ram. If so I will go out today and buy a stick of Kingston and try it. Thanks again, I just want to make sure before I drop more jack on totally new ram. As a side note it is hard to get support from anyone on this, ATI says they don't support laptops, the reseller said this is perfectly normal(it's not), and MSI doesn't respond.

 

It is 2.5 CAS latency.

 

Try reinstalling your video drivers first - uninstall first, then install the drivers.

The RAM could be the reason why the system crashes in any situation.

If it's ONLY crashing when you run video apps, you could either have an overheating issue or something wrong with the gpu.

Check your temps first, then go with a 256mb stick of Kingston ram to test out that theory.

 

I have updated the driver with the newest one from ATI, I tried the Omega drivers, finally I reinstalled and used the driver on the CD - all the same results. I just had a 1 gig and 512 of Kingston overnighted to me, the Kingston is CL3 and the Corsair was CL2.5 like you said so I will try that in the morning when it arrives. The thing only goes buggy when something is running 3d as in BF2, 3dMark, ATItool. How can I monitor the GPU temp? Is there a utility to do that? Thanks again, I should have bought my laptop from you as you are more help than I've got from ATI,MSI,reseller combined.

 

I haven't tried speedfan on my 1036, but you can try that - it may not see the gpu temps, though. http://www.almico.com/sfdownload.php

I'm not big on the Omega drivers on the notebooks, the stock drivers should be the most stable.

I'm glad i can help (hopefully it's helping), don't expect anything from ATI, but MSI should get back to you:
http://www.msicomputer.com/msiforms/c_problem_desc_form2.asp

 

Yeah I just tried the Omega to see if it did anything. Currently I have a fresh install with the latest ATI driver. I am going to try the Kingston ram and see what that does, if you have a 1036 does yours bomb on 3dmark? Thanks

 

No, 3dmark should run fine on the 1036.

 

My MS-1036 came clocked at 350/400 for the core/mem respectively. Most laptops with the x700 clocks it at 350/350. When I run my 1036 at the stock settings, it tends to show artifacts while playing certain games. I asked my reseller about the stock clock speeds and I don't think he had a clue about what I was talking about, saying it is just a byproduct of playing games on laptops.

I clocked down my videocard to 350/350 using atitool, and artifacts have dissappeared. i tried contacting MSI about a BIOS update for the vga card but I havent heard from them in like 3 weeks. Also, using a laptop cooler helps quite a bit. Im using an antec laptap cooler and the right hand bottom side never gets warm for me anymore, even when playing games with full effects on.

 

You can check your vga core/clock frequency in the catalyst control center information center, under graphics hardware. Even on ati's website I beleive they report the clock speeds should be 350/350. So now, I just set my vid card to optimum battery life to boot the vga card to 250/250 speeds, and set it to 350/350 when I play videogames. Kind of a hassle, but temperature can ruin memory quickly so i decided to be better safe than sorry. Otherwise, this laptop is pretty awesome.

 

Yeah, I ran 3dmark05 using stock 350/400 and it ran it fine. However, it is not a real game and most people will tell you that a benchmark really doesn't show all the limitations of the hardware, but rather a general overview of how it should perform relative to other hardware.

350/400 = 2800 approx.
350/350 = 2500 approx.

 

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2360

"The MRX700 is also combined with its familiar 128-bit memory bus. The core and memory clock speeds are set by the manufacturer based on TDP, and the clock speeds of this particular MRX700 are 350/300 core/mem. ATI’s maximum rated core and memory clock speeds are 350/350."

So, 400 for memory is a little higher than it should be.

 

I wish the videocard was accesible so that users could apply better thermal coumpound to the heatsink/memory and heatsink/vga cpu interface. The system does get warm when playing games at highest settings. However, like I said earlier, a laptop cooler does help alot. Considering this laptop only has one fan that cools both the heatpipe cooler for the main CPU and VGA/mem.

 

"The thing only goes buggy when something is running 3d as in BF2, 3dMark, ATItool."

If you use atitool, you have to disable ati POWERPLAY in the catalyst control center.

 

It sometimes crashes when you turn off powerplay while running a program/games. So I recommend that you turn it off after a fresh boot into windows.

 

I'll try all of that but I still think something is wrong when no modifications and the laptop shoots **** just running 3D. Should it really be that I have to change something before it works stock?
To review:
Turn off ATI powerplay
Check speeds - 350/350
Reboot
???

 

When you log in to windows:
1. turn off powerplay
2. set clock to 350/350 using atitool
3. run game

Your way, as posted above, will work but as soon as you log into windows, the atitool settings will have been lost. Unless you use a different overclocking/underclocking software, you have to manually set clock to 350/350 using atitool manually when you login to windows. I usually put powerplay back on after playing, cause without it, windows will boot to factory 350/400. And the system may crash if you try to turn powerplay back on after a session of playing at 350/350. Thus, you have to reboot first to turn powerplay back on.

So, after playing, reboot windows again and do the following(optional):
1. turn powerplay back on.
2. set all settings to optimum battery life so that core/mem is underclocked by default to 250/250.
3. this will set core/clock to 250/250 by default everytime you start windows. Otherwise, without using powerplay optimum battery life setting, windows will boot to the factory 350/400. Even at powerplay best performance, the vid card gets set to 350/400, so i suggest using optimum battery life instead.

 

when u reboot, atitool settings get cleared. You have to set 350/350 manually otherwise system will boot using default settings, or settings from powerplay.

 

You change your clock speed everytime you boot window's. Doesn't that tell you there is a problem.

 

Yep, the laptop that I recieved was shipped with 350/400 stock. However, if I use powerplay, at optimum battery, the laptop will boot to 250/250 all the time. So, no, i don't necesarrily change the clock everytime. Only when I play games do I set the clock to 350/350. If ati had shipped the system with a default clock of 350/350, then I wouldnt have bother with changing any setting period. I would just leave the system at 350/350. Maybe if i wanted to save on power, would I use a lower clock setting.

 

And yes, this definitely is a problem. A problem which I had asked both my reseller and MSI about. My reseller, www.rkcomputer.net never got back to me about it, and neither did MSI.

 

I bought my computer from RK Computer also. I told them about the problem and I was told to contact EA and I told him it wasn't just in the game but all 3D. He told me this is a common problem and that 3dMark and ATI tool weren't proper ways to test the card but they couldn't provide a way to test the laptop. I have sent my laptop to MSI as an RMA. I can say RK is responsive but I've found the response to this problem was either there is no problem or I broke it, which is absurd.

 

I hope MSI fixes the problem. Let us know how the returned system performs or if they have changed the stock clock speeds. Was your system set at 350/400 too?

 

Also, FYI everyone out there potentially thinking about buying the system. ALL SALES ARE FINAL(at least where I bought it). I had to find out the hard way.

 

I second the all sales are final, I also found out the hard way. To be honest I think mine was set to 350/350 but I am not real familiar with GPU clocking and such. 2-3 weeks for repair MSI estimated, now I am out ~$2000 in a laptop and parts to possibly get a unit back I bought refurbished. I personally would suggest not buying from RK, if you don't have a problem as with any company I am sure they are fine but actual support is horrible, not response time. Also the warranty on notebooks is worthless, you may as well just deal with the manufacture, if you are looking at buying pay the price difference and go somewhere with a return/exchange policy.

Did you try unchecking the Enable write combining?

 

Another note, not all sales are final. You can return the item if it was shipped defective and cancel the charge on your credit card. Someone can not sell you a defective product and then claim it is their policy to not accept return merchandise, that is fraud. I bought mine on American Express and they are very proactive about cases like this.

 

The gpu is set to 350/400 stock from MSI.

The warranty you purchase is through MSI, not the reseller, unless stated so. That said, you should receive warranty support through the reseller, not directly through MSI. The reseller should be providing the first line of support.

I will be running some tests on the gpu today. If you have any recommendations on certain configurations to test, let me know here. If there are issues I'll be reporting them to MSI to get a solution or recommendation on final settings.

 

I tried going through the reseller but he told me that the crashing was due to the game and that 3dMark and ATItool artifact testing were not proper testing and the crashing was normal. I could never get an answer on what he recommended to "properly" test the card. He said his computers crash all the time running 3d and that I should check the internet because someone else probably has fixed the problem. Being as that I couldn't run any 3D on my brand new laptop I contacted MSI to get some actual support. They sent me a new bios, had me change the ram out(to Kingston), try one dimm, both dimms, reverse the dimms, etc... Still the problem existed. I contacted RK to see if I could get a refund or an exchange and he told me no and that I should have went through him for support but the problem was he wasn't supporting me and he insisted there was no problem and that 3D crashing was common. Later I got a pretty hateful email from him and now I am done dealing with him as it gets me no where. I can't express how disappointed I am, I knew I should have bought an ASUA, and NVIDIA. I have bought many Asus motherboards and NVIDIA cards had few if any problems and great support. Now I have(should get back in 2-3 weeks) a $2000 laptop that I can check email or surf the internet on but not run any 3D.

As far as settings go I left everything default, I didn't change anything - I am not into overclocking and all of that as I like to protect my purchase. I can say for a fact that any 3D crashed the system, 3dMark06, ATItool Artifact, Catalyst 3D preview, Battlefield2.

 

doil,

i'm sorry for your experience, but i hope it doesn't put you off MSI. I personally have a 1036 that is great.

Crashing when running 3d applications is not normal, and if his computers crash all the time, that is a good indication that he's not sure how to build and troubleshoot a system. "go check the internet" is not service.

i'm sorry if i missed it - did you watch your temps from bootup and on?

 

I checked the temps using an AMD program and speedfan which I believe you suggested. All the temps seemed fine and I went over temperatures with MSI support and he said that the CPU temp was fine. I don't remember what the temp was but I believe it was around 60F(I believe). The hard drive using speedfan reported back everything was fine also. THe laptop was a cool laptop, light, sleek, I loved the keyboard but this whole experience is driving me insane. Again this forum is the most help I am getting, I will say MSI has been nice and helpful but you can tell going through them is not the proper channel for this type of situation.

 

Actually I have some screencaps of some items on an ftp site if someone wants to look at them. Actually that other guy posting is right, mine was clocked at 350/400 it looks like.

 

doil:

During the first 30 days, MSI offers a DoA warranty (in this case to the reseller). RK should be able to get an advance replacement on your barebones and swap all of the components out.

 

Yeah, the stock core/mem clocks are 350/398 if I recall correctly. I don't believe these frequencies have anything to do with your issues, however.

 

Would that apply if the laptop works but the 3d crashes? He told me he would have to start a new support ticket with MSI and he couldn't exchange it. I think I will contact him about it the 30 day DoA warranty. Thanks.

 

As a note I emailed and asked about the 30 day DOA policy with MSI and RK stated he doesn't have to check, MSI does not do this.

 

He's dead wrong and/or avoiding having to deal with it.

 

Is there some link talking about this policy or something I can send him as he cleary stated he is not checking?

 

Unfortunately, I cannot find anything, however, I assure you...that is the policy.

 

I am calling them now to see if that is their policy. I believe you as it makes sense but I need something to go back to him with.

 

I appreciate all the help the thing that irritates me with the reseller is the reluctancy to admit there is or even could be a problem. I don't see why someone would think I would go through all this trouble if there was not a legit problem.

 

i don't think it's a question of a problem, I would say it's a matter of reduced profit margin to the reseller that they don't want to incur by shipping back and forth with you.

 

I've paid for all the shipping, I ship from work as we get a discount. In fact I paid for shipping through the site, he kept that $ and I had him ship the laptop using our account number. Basically I paid $30 shipping I told him he could keep if he could ship it 3rd part overnight.

 

Really all of that doesn't matter I just have to sit by and wait for MSI to fix/replace my notebook. I am curious if anyone else is having the same problem.

 

I'm glad MSI was able to help you directly, things could have been much smoother with more reseller support.

 

Just make sure to share your experience on resellerratings.com.

 

Just wanted to thank you two for being so professional and supportive to another reseller throughout this post. This is not the way this support ticket unfolded and alot is not included here. We have received many emails and calls from other resellers customers and always convinced them to continue with that reseller and that the correct steps were being taken to resolve their issue(s).

1.This customer received support from day one for his notebook purchase, and had responses within miniutes by phone or email to resolve multiple issues. Some honest mistakes he made and some not.

2.We did not tell him his 3d crashes were normal, we informed him that ATItool could and has been known to cause crashes.

3. We did not say that the notebook did not have a problem and that this was a normal condition.

4. The customer bypassed us on his own and started a support ticket with the manufacture. They determined that the unit had a defect and he was told they would RMA it.

5. He wanted the notebook fixed asap (which i cannot blame him, i would too) And asked if we could speed up the process. We informed him he could either ship the notebook back to us or directly to the manufacture ( which he already had a support ticket open with ) it was his choice.


6. After that email we never heard back from him and sent a few emails to see what he was going to do.

7. Then i find this thread about our poor support, we have thousands of customers from end-users to corporations who can confirm that our support is and has always been available to them to resolve any problems they may have.

All of our customers, sales, support, or service ALWAYS praise us on our response time and ability to resolve their issues.
We stand behind all our products, barebones or complete systems and will resolve any issue if given the chance.

 

Well, I was told artifacts were normal by said company...

transcript follows:


That is just a normal condition of running games, happens all the time, whether it’s a desktop or laptop. Check your game manufacture and the msi driver site for updates.


Sincerely,

Rob M

RK Computers



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From:
Sent: Sunday, February 26, 2006 5:34 PM
To: 'RK Computers'
Subject: RE: ms-1036



I have the system running now but now it has another problem. When playing certain games, graphical artifacts start to show up during game play. There may be something wrong with the video card. I have not done anything to the laptop in terms of over clocking, everything is stock. I am using windows XP, and the game that I am playing is “World of Warcraft”.

 

And no artifacts are not normal. Slowdown is normal, but dropping pixels and distorted polygons are definitely an indication that something is wrong.

 

That email was in response to you first call about artifacts during game play. and for that specific complaint with a single problem in a single game which was your only complaint at the time that would have been the first step in trying to resolve the artifact problem. it is a problem that does occur quite often during gameplay and can usually be resolved by an updated driver or an available patch for a specific game.