MSI GX740 with 5870 1gb ddr5

just had a look at this big boy over at xoticpc. hell they sure do get them out fast

under the hood is a 5870 with ddr5.... and that too at such a sweet price.
my first one was a 1719 (aka gt700 i think) and looking to upgrade.

its little brother was also up online with a 5850 ati gpu. one question for the gurus out there.. what kind of performance can i expect between the two gpus? say i keep the rest of the config the same, and play the same game (crysis...) at same settings, what kind of difference should there be between the two?

(by the way eta is march... come on guys u can do better...)

 

THe 5870 Mobility is about the same as a desktop HD 5770/5750 (has the same shadercount as the 5770, but clocks are at the 5750's levels) so performance on it should be decent

As for the 5850 has the same shadercount, but clocks are at 625 (versus the 5870's 700), so don't expect the same performance. However, as it's only (at least I couldn't find any other differences) clock differences you could (theoretically) just clock the 5850 to 5870's levels.

 

Performance should be very good , but no one can answer your questions as it's not available yet.

 

Hey Dead,

Do you know much/enough about MSi notebooks? I was looking at buying the new Asus G73, but got turned off because of it having no eSATA, USB 3.0 or expresscard slot. But the new GX740 has all of the above ('cept for the USB 3.0 <<, but that can be added later with a expresscard..).

So my question is; how is the build quality? Heating problems because of the 1 fan solution etc.

EDIT: I know you can't answer specifically for the GX740, but how was.. say, the GX735 etc?

How does it fare?

 

If I am not mistaken, the base should be the same as the GT740 right? or has it been completely changed?

from the pics on xotic's website it seems to be the same chassis as the gt740. Build quality should be better than average, and one thing about msi, their notebooks are quite slim for what they pack under the hood.

maybe someone from xoticpc can answer the questions here... they may have got a test model to play around with

 

I would recommend an MSI any day go for the GX740. MSI's build quality is very very good , sturdy , not flimsy in any way. Heat ain't an issue either , the 1 fan is doing a great job keeping it cool.

For example , my GPU at idle is 38/40 and load is usually under 70.

They seems to carry on using the same design and chassis on the G-series. which isn't that bad. slim but very good.

And don't forget what you getting for the price , which in most cases .. a bargain !

 

YEah, thanks a lot man!

Considering, the desktop/mobility 4850 is a lot hotter than the mobility 5870, so (right?)

But thanks, I think I've found a winner. Too bad the screen is only 1680x1050 though, but.. Who cares, .. right?

 

1680x1050 is lovely for games. For bluray you would obviously want something higher , no deal breaker though , it's mainly for gaming

yeah but heat can be dealt with .. better compound + cooler

 

You upgraded the cooling paste /cooler in your laptop?

 

upgraded cpu , paste , memory and added an external cooler (have no idea if the cooler is that effective though) , add a good height though

 

Wouldn't that void the warranty?

And do you per chance mean one of those notebook coolers?`Like a pad that you put your laptop on?

 

5870 should effectively run cooler, the single cooling solution in the MSI' is very very efficient, and dam quiet!, and 1650x1080 is much better then 1080p for 17 inch single gpu solutions, much more life in that machine

MSI for the win!

MSI's warrenty is also very flexible, you can do things like that.

 

The Mob. HD5850 in the GX640 is listed as GDDR3 which essentially makes it an overclocked Mob. HD4850 with just over half the memory transfer rate.....and that means there's a very likely chance the GX640's Mob. HD5850 will perform worse than the Mob. HD4850.

 

I'm using this : http://www.enermax.co.uk/products/peripherie/aeolus.html
I'm not that bothered about my warranty Tbh.

You Should get in touch with em before doing so , just in case

 

Woa!

Didn't notice the 5850 had gddr3.. That def. is a combobreaker As in, about half the memory bandwidth.

Anyways,

Dead, I'm thinking of pre-ordering the GX740 today. Would it be worth it to add the

"Full Size Black Aluminum Notebook Cooler - Dual Fans - USB Powered (For up to 17" Laptops) ( + $69 )"?

Other than that, I'm upgrading to the i7-820 as well as 8 gigs of ram.

Too bad the GX740 doesn't have dual harddrives, or I would've gone with a SSD as well as the 500gb hdd. Good thing is it has eSATA.

Another question on that! Is it possible to power the eSATA hdd through USB be it 2 or?

/Eri

 

IF I were you , I would get the cheapest cpu , then get a "controversial" one off eBay. saving you a total of 270$. It's just an opinion http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=456950

Yeah that's what suck about MSI really , always wanted a 2nd hdd !

Most Ext. eSata has both USB and the latter , so you should be fine.

I don't know about that cooler but it's ok for that price I guess.

 

Best option if you're going to buy an aftermarket CPU is to wait for someone to start selling the barebones version of the GX740. I don't know if XoticPC will sell them but I do know RK Computers usually offers them for sale as a barebones.

Also I would consider swapping out the ODD for a second HDD via something like this and then using the ODD as an external drive. To me it makes more sense to have the HDD more readily available than a nearly obsolete ODD.


My major disappointment is that XoticPC is showing these using the i7 quads, meaning the GX740 will probably be using a PM55 chipset that won't support switchable graphics....at CES these machines were shown with i5 Arrandales.

 

HUmhum.... Not such a bad idea, but... I think I'll stick with the non-ES versions.

Well, if I can connect the eSATA drive to the eSATA for datatransfers and USB for power then it's all good!

What exactly is it that takes up so much space in the MSI lappie? Compared to say the G73 which has 2 hdds and also is a 17 inch?

EDIT: Phinagle, I'd rather have the QUAD and just downclock the 5870 if I need more battery time. Granted, it's not really the same, but it's all I need I mean, if I prioritized battery time over performance I wouldn't go for one of theese ^^

EDIT2: The lappie comes with a blue-ray drive though.. And I actually think I'd use it, you know? And sure.. Another HDD would be great, but if I can get about the same performance via a external drive, it's okay with me.

 

Oh you meant that , well I don't know if usb will be enough to power it up. Pretty sure external power would be needed.

May be coz it's slimmer ..

 

Not a bad idea if you don't use the ODD that much

 

Will have to do some research on this.. If not, well, I know for sure that USB 3 has a higher poweroutput than USb 2 (which is still able to power up an external drive, especially if you plug it into 2 usb slots...), and usb 3 is about as fast as eSATA.. So, all is well once I get an expresscard slot

 

Since this uses the same chassis as the gt725, may I ask MSI users how have their machines been holding up?

 

Very very good , nothing to complain about really. I'm pretty sure they will all agree

 

Agreed, there are no flaws, just the touch pad wear within the first two weeks haha.

Coolings superb, noise superb, quality grand and strong, No DPC issues, no stupid issues lol.

Oh and guys, the ASUS G73J? benches are arriving, this is a great oppertunity to see how the New msi machine should hopefully perform.

I asked for a stock run at 1080p to see how it fairs in vantage, if people run at native then the 5870 puts on terms with the 4850 in advents, and slightly higher at 1680x1050 in the MSI's.

Vantage P results are hitting literally 9k marks, because of the raw power of the single gpu, thats very good.

 

Yah, been hanging in the G73 page for some time. I was actually going to buy it first (would've placed in my pre-order when it was first announced, but decided against it.. I mean, no expresscard or USB 3.0 or eSATA (of which the MSI delivers 2 out of 3, so..)!

 

Couldn't be happier with the quality of my GT725. Ultra quiet, solid, and thin and light compared to most 17" gaming machines.

 

Is there anywhere else that ships to Canada other than XoticPC where I can pre-order this machine? I need different places for quotes for a student grant. This laptop looks very interesting.

 

Not sure, ettornio, but try excaliburPC (google it, not sure) or gentechpc

 

http://www1.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=50208&vpn=9S7-17273E-079&manufacture=MSI/MicroStar


You could also try emailing the MSI resellers listed in the FAQ and ask them for a quote. Odds are they'll all carry the model eventually.

 

Cata, do you have an MSI lappie? If so, which one?

modded it in any way?

/Eri

 

The GX740 is supposed to have the HM55 chipset and the GX640 has the PM55 chipset. This is what is in the current specs.

 

i have the MSI GT725 rebrand which was released by advent, although it does have official msi stickers with serial number on the bottom .

 

Ahh, I see.. Hmm, another quick question;

if I buy the GX740 (which atm seems likely ), I will be using it for heavy-duty apps like Maya and photoshop (as well as other rendering apps etc). And I always find myself lacking memory.

I mean, when I bought my desktop pc a few years ago, I thought "Hey, 4 gigs is more than enough, will never have to use all of it". Yeah right, ... <<

So, it might take a year or 2, but I'm sure those 8gb of ram will seem small enough in not too long, so will I be able to put in say, 2 * 8gb sticks in it (whenever those will be available, that is.. <<) instead of the 2*4gb that's in it atm, or is it physically locked to 8gb max?

/Eri

 

Curious, do 8Gb banks exist,

I'd say the more ram the merrier these days to be honest, using things like AE, i would have liked 32 gigs from time to time haha, but i do believe 4-8 gb for photoshop will be fine, and im not too sure how demanding maya is,

But in your case, alot of ram is definately your friend haha.

 

Eh, no 8gb ram sticks do not exist.. yet.

That was sort of my question, when 8gb ram sticks arrive in say 2 years, will I be able to bump it up to 16gb?

As for aftereffects.. yessire.. That is one memory intensive app <<

Maya also is quite intensive when it comes to specs, especially if you work alot with hi-texture models and different sorts of visual effects/fluids..

Also considering a 4096x4096 32bit texture takes up an astounding 64MB of memory when used on a 3D-model, I wouldn't mind having 32gb of VRAM either....

/Eri

 

Sounds good. Thanks for the info.

 

Well when you work with 3d scenes you often use placeholder textures, and placeholder models until you are ready to render. They are like stand-ins that allow you to manipulate animated scenes speedily. Though a bit dated now, the bonus material of toystory2 shows some good examples of this. You can also render higher rez topology to a texture and sort of fake the complexity with bump mapping, while keeping the mesh less complex. Its always ram intensive though no matter what.. and you could have maya open and photoshop open at the same time working on textures, etc.


Like others, I've also been following the ASUS G73JH thread, but as others have indicated, I would also miss the esata and express slot so I want to see what this MSI GX740 is like. The screen resolution is somewhat of a trade-off for me. I do only game at native rez and obviously 1680 x 1050 would yield better fps, however I do like per pixel accuracy on 1080p movies, and I like to use dual mode or clone with an external 1080p monitor sometimes and prefer same rez on both. The desktop app screen real estate is also a loss obviously.

Some concerns I have about the MSI GX740 vs the ASUS G73JH are:

cooling architecture/design and quality..
quality/vibrance/saturation/uniformity of the lcd
quality of the hinges
quality of the keyboard
quality of the chasis
usb functionality, noise/interference on the bus issues, etc.
3yr warranty support quality

I'm being patient and waiting for reviews and numbers to come in on various new notebooks and notebook gpus like these. Its looking promising overall.

 

yeah sure, normal maps (yay more textures) and placeholders are all good, but sculpting out/modelling out the models themselves and making sure they look good in the scene kind of needs to be done using the original hi-poly model.

As for your issues, I'll do my best to ease some of them (from what I've read so far that is..)

The cooling: Highly efficient 1-fan system.. It can cool of an ATI HD 4850M, which as far as I know is ALOT hotter than the M5870 (40nm, yay!), so that shouldn't really be a problem.

Quality: The overall build quality is said to be really good (comparing it with the GT725 I think it was, which is basically the same chassis etc)

Usb funcionality? Not sure I get what you mean by this, but.. :S As for Bus intereference, shouldn't be a problem, but I'm bouncing this one over to Dead/Cataclysm

As for the warranty, as far as I understand it's quite good.. Again, Cataclysm/dead please clearify this as well

thanks
/Eri

EDIT: TBH, I would've gotten the G73 (and had it this moment, in my hands ): ) had it not been for the lacking expresscard slot. I fricken want a expresscard USB 3.0 adapter, so. Dealbreaker with the ASUS. The MSI however, purrrfect

 

Outside of the weak DC jack on the 1722 chassis (It is known to become loose and intermittent and eventually require replacing), the 1722 chassis is really rock solid. Just treat the DC jack with TLC and it will treat you right.

As for the 5870, only point of concern is the ~60w consumption vs. the ~28w consumption of the 250M in regards to both pull and heat dissipation in combination with the i7 (especially 920xm) under load.

 

Alright, will keep that in mind. As for the cooling, didn't Cata say he had the GT725? Isn't that the same chassi, but with a HD M4850 (among other differences)

If that runs cool enough, shouldn't a 5870 be able to as well?

Or did I get it all wrong :\

/Eri

 

Are we sure the barebones version is going to be sold at all? MSI did never release a barebones version for the GT-725...

 

Very true Purlpo, hmmmm.

As for the similarities, the 4850 has a slightly lesser consumption level (~55w I believe), and coupled with a 720 or 820, it should be ok (720/820 = 45w, same as Q9000, Q9100, QX9300), but throw in a 920xm @ 55w and with the ~10% increase in consumption with the GPU and it is something to keep an eye on. The i7 quads are power hungry:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/mobile-core-i7,2443-12.html


Under very heavy stress, the 4850 did throttle down in the GT725 during Tomshardware testing of it (when reviewing the D900F).

What size PSU is MSI including with this beauty?

The 1727 hits a nice sweet spot, especially with a shared exhaust system, with supporting the 920xm coupled with a decent middle of the pack GPU like the 250M which succeeds the 9600M GT nicely with over 2x the power and only ~5w increase in consumption (coincidentally, the same increase from the 4850->5870 it seems).

 

Yeah.

Tbh, I don't know much about lappies. Most of what I know I've picked up these last few weeks ( from this site ), so take it with a grain of salt..

Anyways, would MSI through out a lappie that in no way could handle the heat? Surely they test it out etc?

And then there's the turboboost, if it can barely manage to cool down the unclocked 5870, then how's it going to be with the "turboed" one?

/Eri

 

I saw that, but I have never experienced it myself, and haven't heard any other GT725 owner complain about it. I think it was a problem with their particular test unit.

 

Odd, i've passed 12 hours of the OCCT power test, and im fairly sure it doesn't throttle down either (Checked with gpu-z sensors,) ^^ toms hardware must have got a weaker unit lol.

What might be noticable will be the stutter of the Northbridge, because the cpu running at 80, NB hitting 90 and GPU hitting 90, this can feel a bit hot lol. (I'd like to throw in the 4850 runs hotter at my lower resolution then it does at 1080p.)

MSI could potentially upgrade the fan and slightly modify the heatsink/structure of the new releases though, and i believe the machines would work fine for 5 series gpu as well as i series, although slightly worried about i7-9**, that could run alittle hot, and although i've faith the cpu would stay nice and cool, (Wait are north bridges still there? i know i series integrate a bit more then the usual lol.)

I worry about the NB, thats it haha, the rest seems cake.

MSI wont give turboboost either, as far as im aware, ocing i7 in lappys is near enough impossible.

Not to mention MSI could just drill some more holes, (Has anyone taken the bottom off and ran the machine?) I mean that thing gets brutally cool.

(Poor components with only pint sized holes to live with.)

 

I'm not quite sure I want to take off the back lid... o.o

As far as I know, however, the Clarksfield (mobile nehalems, eg. 820QM) has the northbridge on-die, so there shouldn't really be a northbridge chip, right? Which is one of the reasons why it pulls 10W more than their Pennryn cousins. ..

Right?

I'm getting a bit hessitant now though, don't know if I want to buy it if it might have cooling issues :\

 

I did once , GPU at idle was like 30c something (with cooler). I Got rid of all the grill underneath to let more air in and soon will drill some holes

EDIT : Why trust those reviewers ? All the do is push the machine to its limits WHICH will never occur in real life scenario.
Go ahead and see those temps on (whichever websites they saying temps are hotter) and others ... and ask every single MSI owner if they are experiencing it ... most will tell you no , even under hours of gaming.

Some reviewers are biased too.

 

Haha, i know, that fans RPM must be rediculous dont you think? i mean of course you have the pipes which extend quite far distance (good dissipation.)

Put it this way eraid, MSI are not going to release a machine if the cooling system isn't up to scratch, wana know how i know?

Find me another 17" gaming notebook that runs on 1 fan, a series of heat pipes, and puts up with a quad (q9000-qx9300, see dead there, hes running a 9200 ) with a 4850,

Then you win lol.

 

I guess I see your point, however, why did they put only 1 fan on it?

Also, take into account the added 10W from the NB-on-die :\

Anyways, thanks for helping me get my head straight (already somewhat frustrated with work, needed some good news )

+rep to you for that

 

The i7 has the turboboost thingy which in most cases will run cool and will overclock itself only when needed. I'm pretty sure you will be able to disable it if it's not important to you.

As for the 1 fan , I presume it's the form factor , MSI notebooks are kinda slim.

Here is a pic of how the interior of the 725 looks like. (sorry for the awesome pic quality )

We are here for that