MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5) Fan Modifications

I love the MSI 16L13. I hate the fans.

AAVID fans have been used in many other MSI devices for several years. These new AAVID fans in the 16L13, GT73VR and others are a newer batch that use the same motor but include support for PWM. Earlier versions of this fan used variable voltage only to control fan speeds in machines like the GT72 Dominator Pro.

My problem with the AAVID fans is not maximum performance. It is the sound profile of the fan at low RPM. I often work in extremely quiet environments and a fan motor whirring in the background is distracting to me. I have disassembled many of these AAVID fans and used various types of lubrication and replacement parts to remove low rpm noise. Despite many attempts, I have never been able to reliably take a noisy stock fan and quiet it down. There are some stock fans that are more quiet than others, but I suspect it is a function of the manufacturing process, over which we have no control.

So what is this mod and who is it for?
This mod is intended for those who need a replacement fan that has a better sound profile across all workloads. Depending on the fan configuration you choose (options below), performance will range from equal to stock to tangibly worse.

In full disclosure, I do not spend time benchmarking my machines with unrealistic synthetic loads like Furmark + Prime95. I made this mod and have used it for the past several months with no discernible impact to the temperatures observed in my typical work and play.

The machine this was tested on is an MSI 16L13, 7700k (stock clocks) with GTX 1070.

What does the mod look like?
CPU Side:

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GPU Side:

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What is the replacement fan?
After trying 15 different fans for this modification, I settled on two of the following fan:

ADDA Part AB08812HX26DB00(00G750)

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This is the 12v GPU fan found in certain models of the Asus G750 series of notebooks.
12v, .60A, reported speed of 5000-5500 by the 16L13. It is slightly thicker than the stock fan, but has approximately the same output length.

The ASUS replacement parts people said it was a DELTA fan when I contacted them, but it is stamped ADDA on the fan. Take care when searching for this fan. There are other fan models used in the Asus G750/G751 series, including incompatible 5v Deltas, so they might have been confused. Search by the part number to be sure. I picked up two of these fans from the seller Asusparts on ebay for $25 each. I later purchased another pair from a Chinese seller for $13 each, but they took 2 weeks to arrive to the USA.

There is also another option for this fan mod that uses one of the above G750 GPU fans and one of the following:

ADDA Part Number AB07512HX26DB00(00CWG750)
This is the 12V CPU fan found in certain models of the Asus G750 series of notebooks.

The CPU fan (Smaller) is on the left in this picture. The earlier mentioned GPU fan is on the right.

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Physical installation

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Physical installation of the G750 GPU fan on the GPU side of the MSI 16L13 requires minimal modification. The size of this fan and its orientation are very similar to the stock fan. The only modification you need to make is to slightly shave down part of the stock fan mount closest to the heatsink (lower left in the above picture.) I used an xacto knife and it took all of 10 seconds.

The CPU side is a little more difficult. On this side the stock CPU fan mount needs to be completely removed from the case to fit the larger G750 GPU fan. I used an xacto knife and a hot knife attachment on my soldering iron.

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The alternative to performing a non-reversible modification on your case is to use the G750 CPU fan which is slightly smaller. This allows you to keep the stock fan mount in the case at the expense of a little performance and/or noise. I'll talk a little more about the downside to this approach in the performance section.

G750 Smaller CPU fan on CPU side

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G750 smaller CPU fan on CPU side and G750 GPU fan on GPU side.

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Mounting
Because the new fans are completely different from the stock fans, the stock mounting holes are useless without fabrication of new mounts. My approach (as is often the case) is to use a foam core, double-stick tape. I actually prefer this approach because the foam dampens vibrations between the fan and case, further reducing noise.

I used 3M VHB 5952 tape to mount the fans to the body. A very little bit goes a long way with this high strength tape. Use less than you think you need.

In addition to the 3M mounting tape, I also used Aluminum foil tape to connect the fan to the heat exchangers. This is especially important since the ADDA fans are taller than the radiators and we need as much air as possible to cross the heat exchanger fins.

Wiring
Both of these ADDA fans are PWM by default, which we need for the 16L13. However, these are NOT plug and play! While the connector on the ADDA fans will plug into the motherboard just fine without any modifications, if you do this, you will quickly smell burning fan.

The wiring harness for the ADDA fan is a mirror image of the stock AAVID. This means you need to cut and reattach the wires for the ADDA fans in the following configuration:

Red -> Yellow
Black -> Blue
Blue -> Black
Yellow -> Red

Photo showing configuration (before soldering and heat shrinking)

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Performance
You can use MSI Silent Option to control fans as normal. With two G750 GPU fans, I found no difference in temperatures when playing games, VR Development, rendering video or in my data related work flow. However, the ADDA fans are much quieter, even when set to 100%.

When using the G750 CPU fan, there is a discernible difference in performance. In this configuration, the 7700k CPU would not maintain turbo boost on a 100% 8 thread load. Intel Extreme Tuning utility identified thermal throttling and would reduce clocks to 4.0ghz - 4.2ghz.

I suspect the problem is the exhaust width of the CPU fan in this case. The heat exchangers on the 16L13 are not very big and require air be passed over every square mm for decent performance. More air over the same fins does not contribute much to temperature reduction when what we really need is more radiator surface area. When you use the CPU fan, there are about 6-8 fins not getting airflow, squandering what surface area we do have. With a machine like this that is already at its thermal limits, this is problematic.

The aluminum tape was removed for these photos for a better view:
G750 CPU fan:

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G750 GPU fan:

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Conclusion
After using this configuration, I will not go back to the AAVID fans. The fan sound profile at idle and low loads is much improved. Even during moderate or high loads, the sound profile of the fans is much more to my satisfaction. It now sounds like air moving, not a motor humming. The bottom case of the 16L13 goes back on without difficulty for me, despite the fatter fans. Just take care with how much tape you use because it is very tight. I have not tried the bottom cover fan hole mod with this fan layout, but I don't expect any problems with it.

I tried 15 fans before settling on these. If you have a question about another specific fan, let me know and I will do my best to respond.

Case all back together

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If you are interested in seeing some of the other fan experiments I tried...
MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5) Fan Modifications

 

I have a question, I have the exact same problem with my Clevo P157SM, the CPU fan has the most obnoxious sound profile in a notebook I've ever heard period.

I was wondering about how to find out which fan would fit and be quiet enough. I don't really plan on buying 15 fans but would rather see if someone who already has experimented with this could help me out.

 

Thanks for this!

Ordered one of those GPU fans, the CPU fan I currently have is definitely quieter than the GPU fan.

 

If you remove your stock fan and give me the dimensions I can try to help. I have about 30+ fans in my basement and a P151em hiding somewhere... I can experiment with a few things.

Let us know how it works out.

 

The P151EM has the same fans, if you can find it that would make things much easier!

 

I can try to dig it out.

Back to the 16L13, someone asked if I had tried the Delta KSB0612HBA03 (From the G751JY series I believe?) This fan is also 12v, .40 amp and PWM. This fan fits well, has a good sound profile, but doesn't move quite as much air. It also has a critical problem I was not able to work around... the fan stays on during sleep. For some reason it doesn't get a turn off signal and it keeps running unless the machine is completely turned off AND unplugged from the wall. I tried a few different wiring configurations, in-line resistors, etc. and gave up when I found the ADDA fan I liked better.

 

So how much you selling the already modified fans for those of us who are lazy?

EDIT: I'm guessing you didn't find any fans that fit the housing of the existing fans but provided better noise/cooling?

 

Tremendous experimental work. Thanks very much not only for the configuration you are using, but also for the other trials that didn't work out.

 

I did find components to fit into the housings, but the result was worse than stock.

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For what its worth, just about any single exit PWM AAVID fan (PABD19735BM) can swap into our housing. I dislike them all. Even the non-PWM versions I got worked, but only at maximum speeds without converting them to PWM.

Not sure this is really clear, but only the top part of the fan housing is different between the AAVID fans. You can unscrew the housing and put in a different one. Again, sound profile isn't different, but might help out in a pinch if you experience a failure and you need to source something immediately from ebay or similar.

GT72 fan on left, 16L13 fan on right. Interchangeable housing, but the GT72 is not PWM.

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Thanks for the kind words. I didn't plan on sharing any of this, but apparently there are other interested people.

A lot of those other failed trials were still fun. My favorite was taking this 12v PCI blower fan for desktops and getting it to work in the MSI. The blower is 12v without even a speed wire. I used a separate controller board to convert the MSI's PWM signal to a variable voltage signal. Basically when the computer told the fan to slow down via PWM, the board instead changed the output voltage from 12v down to some other level (10v, 8v, etc.) It let me try out fans in the MSI that were not PWM. I would have been okay with this if it meant a non-PWM fan turned out to be the best. Fortunately, the best compromise I found was already PWM.

I wish I could explain the sound this setup made...it was horrific. At least performance wasn't too bad with the fans on full strength.

Here are some pics of that setup

PCI blower fan (the PCI bracket / grill have already been removed in this photo)

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Board for converting the MSI to linear voltage regulation for fans

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To get the blower to fit, I had to cut some of the housing off the output side. The cut wasn't perfectly straight (shaky hands...don't get old) but it doesn't matter too much with the thermal tape.

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Very tight fit!

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Check the pcb of the non-PWM fans; most of them have a 'pwm' solder pad and are actually PWM-capable, so only need to solder an additional wire to convert them. Seems the manufacturer simply makes one type of fan and leaves out the pwm wire for the few customers that request voltage-control only.

 

Will this void warranty in any way if we destroy the fan mounts? Not sure how @Eurocom Support would take to us if we returned them these laptops in this condition for service.

 

Oh damn I didn't notice this!


If you want the fans I have them ready and can ship from US. I'll get an FS thread running on the trade section soon.

 

Nice mod! I was noticing how my F5 fan's seem to be louder over a year later at idle.. They just sound kind of grindy on idle now, still quiet in most situations but I feel like I notice them a lot more than I used to.

 

@Eurocom Support Any guidance on if this mod will void warranty?

 

Very nice write up, thank you for sharing ! + rep for you good sir !

 

Yes and No.

as a whole laptop yes it voids the warranty, in case you are wondering.
Physical modifications would allow the manufacturer to refuse any warranty offered previously because they can say it was user error and physical damage.
Have to be careful and smart with how you proceed.
In worst case get permission or ask them for help, have your seller do the mods for you and guarantee it.

 

Worst case, if anyone is coming here because they have broken fans, these can be replaced, me and others have them (anyone who sells the F5 pretty sure, AND maybe even directly with MSI).

Now what I have done for my F5 that I have lying around was not fan mods, but rather a targus fan cooler, I modified that to step the 5V from the USB to 12V ran 2 of them to a rectifier and a little controller to run 3 x NFA9X14 (very thin Noctua fans, but they run good and silent)

I'd show pictures, but it's buried under some junk at the moment from rearranging office, will try and remember when I dig it out eventually.

Gonna test one of these F5's running as an Ethminer.

 

Hello, great advice on PWM and cables! I tried this mod with my MSI 16L3 for GPU only and I have to say that ADDA fan has great potential and has a nice sound profile, but it's so thick it can't take in fresh air with bottom cover on. In my case shaving edge of stock fan mount supposedly isn't enough as I can't close bottom cover perfectly without pushing it strongly. I did some simple test with furmark, with bottom cover on GPU reached 78-80 °C. When I left 0.5 cm space temp fell down to 65-67 °C, so fan hold pretty well when given enough air - amazing!. I think shaving more plastic or bottom cover mod is necessary to make full use of this fan.

 

Can you record a video of Eurocom F5 running with modded fans, just to get an idea of how much is it noisy and which kind of noise it makes?

 

Update:
I've drilled a hole in the bottom cover using a hole saw, then covered it with fine-grained mesh. Hole size is same as size of hole on the fan. I decided to keep it small since bottom cover touches fan very tightly and it wouldn't much air suck in with larger hole. Results are phenomenal:

Furmark test with auto fans, GTX 1070:
AAVID Fan (stock one) + NO hole (stock)
75-76 °C, ~3000 RPM

ADDA Fan (thick one) + NO hole
78-80 °C, ~3200 RPM

ADDA Fan (thick one) + Hole
65-67 °C, ~2500 RPM

I haven't tested stock fan + hole yet. I wouldn't expect improvement anywhere near to ADDA, because stock fan makes use of that giant hole in bottom cover already. Difference may be 2-4 °C I guess. Maybe... only maybe ADDA fan is not only more quiet, but it also simply outperforms stock one? Idle temps are better as well (33 °C vs 38 °C) .This requires further investigation.

When it comes to noise, difference is HUGE for me. I have tried several AAVID fans and even the best one was still unbearably growling even under light load. ADDA sounds "clean" and "smooth".
Thing I'm wondering about now is how this mod affects temperature of other components (memory, disk, wifi) ? Now there is no opportunity to cool down other components with air that passes through main hole to the fan since air goes directly to the fan.

Now only stock CPU fan is annoying me with it's noise I've ordered second ADDA fan and will install it when it arrives. I will also check temperature of other components.

@Skylake_
I don't have capable mic right now and of course to make it fairly comparable stock fan should be recorded under similar conditions. If I manage to find some time I will try to record that for you.

 

@alaskajoel @syscrusher @Delgada89 @hfm @Diversion @Skylake_



I will post the aforementioned fans on sale today. Had lots of things going on last december but finally am able to sell them.


Remind me through mention/PM if you don't see a sale thread in the next 12H.

 

I ended up ordering from a seller in China but I haven't installed them yet. I might just do the GPU fan only for now. But please I'll PM couldn't hurt to have an extra but I do plan on these fans being much more reliable.

 

fan sale is up

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ded-fans-free-stickers-6-sets-1-extra.813262/

 

How do you adjust the fan curve on the Tornado F5? Which program is best?
SpeedFan and MSI Afterburner cannot detect my fans.
Are the stock fans PWM?

 

Stock fans are PWM. Use MSI's own "Silent Option" software from their website here

 

I would really love someone to mod the heat radiator.

 

Update: I've received my second Adda AB08812HX26DB00 (big one) fan and I have installed it, this time on CPU side.
Strangely, piece I've got was equipped with 5-pin (?) power plug. Fortunately I was able to replace it with 4-pin power plug from stock fan with same amount of soldering.
Similarly to GPU side, fan doesn't have much space to fit in despite thick casing of MSI 16L3, but I've manged to close bottom cover almost comfortably. I think cutting off some more of the plastic may fix this.
Although this mod is irreversible it does allow you to go back to stock fan, two screws hold it pretty well.

I did OCCT test:
CPU: i7-7700K
Clock: 4.5Ghz
Undervolt: -160mV (I use it everyday, works just fine)
Fans: MAX (with turbo button)

After 10 minutes of OCCT here is how it is:

Stock fan + No hole: 82-84 °C
Stock fan + Hole: 76-80 °C
ADDA fan + Hole: 70-72 °C

Results are outstanding, I can definitely fully recommend using these fans for both GPU and CPU. They are better in terms of both noise level and performance. I can't hear any fans in idle and low load anymore. During higher load it's more noticeable, but no longer obnoxious. I'm just wondering why did MSI choose terrible and more expensive stock AAVID fans instead of cheaper and better performing ADDA ones. With this mod MSI 16L3 is almost perfect 15" power user notebook. Runs really cool, it's relatively light and it's really quiet compared to others.

Wrong 5-pin power plug:

 

Fantastic, I love seeing this!

Really odd 5-pin cable. Was that 5th pin location blank or did you remove the pin from it? Can't figure out what that would have been used for. Thanks for sharing!

 

Hey guys,
Are these fans compatible with the GT73VR and GT75VR? Or are they completely different?
Both CPU and GPU fans are the same size, just different layout because of radiator locations.

 

So, yes, the fan will physically fit and run just fine (at least in the GT73,) but both the GT73 and GT75 use dual exit fans and there is not a dual exit variant of these ADDA fans to my knowledge.

 

Ok, have some pics:

Inside:


Smile


It's by no means perfect, but so far I'm pretty satisfied with it

 

Will it fit my msi ms-1762?

 

My GPU fan died a while back, got a replacement for that and bought this recommended pair of ADDA fans back then but never installed them.

Fast forward to now, the CPU fan died. Decided to switch the working fan to the CPU and install the ADDA GPU fan. It's working fantastically!

One thing I will say is if you cut the connector and wire length off the old stock fan you don't have to worry about reversing the wires for the plug when you solder since the wire colors match up with the stock fan connector wires. Plus it gives you a decent wire length extension since you can cut the wire as long as possible.

I bought the G750 pair (cpu + gpu fan) so I have the smaller ADDA CPU fan from the G750. I've decided not to use that and ordered two more ADDA GPU fans for good measure and I'll install one of those when they arrive on the CPU side.

Awesome stuff. Thanks @alaskajoel

EDIT: I did notice my heatpipe configuration on my EVOC looks different from some other people's heat pipe config. Did this change along the way on this model? Is it 1070 vs 1080?

 

I'm finding that the new ADDA fan is much louder under full 4K gaming load. GPU is sitting at throttled 90C while doing this.

 

That doesn't seem normal for the GTX 1080 in this model because I know they used the lower TDP 150W version.

 

If it's louder it is faulty. My GPU fan doesn't make my GTX 1080 throttling...

 

Could be the TIM needs to be reapplied. Shrug. It was running at 5K rpm and the GPU was at 90C. I was playing Skyrim SE on ultra at 4K. I think the same with Divinity Original Sin 2 at 4K. It didn't seem like the airflow was incorrect. Plenty of air was moving though the rear vent. I taped the top of the fan near the edge where the fins the pipes connect to are to reduce air leakage to force it all out the vent with aluminum tape. It's seems sensible that the fan would be loud spinning at 5K. The stock fans top out at 3.5k rpm I think.

I ratcheted the game down to 1080p and it's nearly silent now.

 

I added m.2 adapter to usb 3.0 mini B and I attached to it 2x5V fans to cooldown my ssd, but they didn't start.
Probably m.2 slot have some device authentication before it can run power through the power pins ?
Could some one help ? Can this work with some small modification ?
(I use the adda g20 fans and there is no air flow to the motherboard and SSD -bpx mydigitalssd-temp=75-85C// PCH temp-75-88C)

 

So your idea is interesting, but the M.2 NGFF standard does not include a 5v source, only 3.3v. What it looks like you have there is a PCIe extender board, commonly used for GPU mining. Even though a USB port is present, there is no USB functionality whatsoever and no power is sent across the cable. You can read more about them here.

What you are trying to do is possible with another NGFF adapter made for this purpose. IIRC, USB D+ and D- are provided on the M.2 bus in this laptop, just not 5v. The two cards I have had success with in the past look like the ones below. (I did this to permanently install a wireless USB mouse adapter for my Logitech G700)

One card adds its own controller for 2 USB ports and uses PCIe, the other is just a USB port directly from the D+ and D- in the NGFF interface. Note that both require additional 5v power. The easiest way to get 5v power is from the 2.5" SATA...which since you are just running fans and not using USB data, I would skip the USB headache and just tap the 2.5" SATA power adapter for a 5v source and run your fan off it.

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It's possible to power 5v fan with 3.3V.(tried on 3.3V of a raspberry board) But I need the right adapter :/
I solder wire to the 3.3V and ground (see photos) is connected to the usb to all ground pins.
Is it safe to try it out ? (I isolated the wire after the picture)

 

Why not just use m.2 heat sinks with some high quality pads like Fujipoly?

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAC8W6SF4125

You could also probably run some supply lines from the actual USB ports to provide power. USB-C on the back would be a good candidate as it probably largely goes unused for most people.

 

I already have heatsink with thermal pad ... problem is that this nvme controlled just run hot ... heat sink just get the heat but it needs air ... :/
I am am just worried now if this hack can burn the motherboard if i have wired it wrong

 

Why not just run a USB cable from external to internal (small hole or maybe through the vent).. not much risk in that..

 

I tried the hacked adapter that i made. It works but not really effective to run fan on 3.3v without any space

 

I'm surprised a heat sink with some decent pads wasn't enough to curb temps a little.

 

It's a matter of airflow and air flow over surface area to dissipate heat. Adding a mass of metal to absorb heat only delays slightly the rise in average temperature, until the mass has attained balance with the SSD, then they both continue to rise in temperature.

Some kind of heat transfer to the air, or a larger surface area - larger mass - needs to be set up to direct the heat away from the SSD.

Even scattered air flow, distruption of the still air around the heatsink / SSD could help a little, it might be worth leaving on and buttoning it up to see if the temps are affected.

Maybe a stiff piece of cardboard or other material can be used to funnel or focus the air away from the heatsink / SSD area, and direct it toward the nearest exhaust fan.

 

Your mod seems to be somewhat messy.
And even though I understand why you are going to such lengths, I am not sure whether a simpler mod might be enough.
Therefore: have you previously tried the foil mod:
*** MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5)/EVOC 16L-G-1080 15.6" Owner's Lounge ***

While it will not offer the same cooling potential as using dedicated fans, it increases the surface area for heat transfer and (in my case) was sufficient to achieve tolerable temperatures on the NVME controller.

 

It's not a bad idea after all. I just wait for my step-up voltage module to come. I have some slim fans 8-10mm from hp laptop and they are perfect for the mod.
After the first mod with the adda fans my PCH sensor goes to 80C+ and SSD goes up to 99C with thermal pad and radiator

 

Maybe you can use some really small fan coolers, this is still better than passive cooling, in the hot environment for example.

This one to fit on the nvme drives maybe as well for PCH:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Micro-Brus...v-5-0v-Air-Flow-Rate-0-6-CFM-DC-/123254750671

Also I want to build something smart with temperature and speed control, and connect that internally to some 3.3 V power lines..

P.S.
https://www.amazon.com/Advancing-Gene-Cooler-Heatsinks-Generation/dp/B077BPPFN8

 

WARNING: Just be extremely careful when you modify the wiring on the ADDA fans!!!

I might have killed my EC while adjusting the wires on my ADDA fan, since EC is responsible for the fan control.

As per this guide i cut the wires ... however i used the original AAVID plug* for the fan and at first i reversed the cable colors... The fan did not start.
Then i realized that the colors should match if you use the original AAVID plug -- Black to black, Blue to Blue, Yellow to Yellow, Red to Red.
You should only reverse the colors if you use the ADDA 4 pin plug which is reversed.

Then i matched the colors and the fan started. However after another restart or two my laptop was completely dead (no light went on even after the PSU was plugged in). Same thing happened few months ago again when i was tinkering with the other ADDA fan, trying to figure out why it was not working. Back then the laptop started after the 50th try ...

This time the laptop started after $120+ in repairs and 2 weeks + without laptop. I got my EC chip replaced twice, reprogrammed with the EC bios & another power responsible chip replaced.


*The ADDA fans that i bought were 5 pin version instead of 4 that is why i had to use the 4 pin plugs of the original AAVID.