GX740 able to use a 6970m?

As the title suggests curious as to the ability to upgrade the 5870m to a 6970m the newer cards even seem to be a bit cooler too so i don't see heat as a issue, will it fit in the same slot and what not?
Thnx in advance.
Mooch

 

Newer cards will not be cooler.
It's pretty much twice the TDP of the 5870, so it's gonna run a lot hotter.

The heatsink might also not be compatible.

 

I'd say that an OCed 5870M would be comparable to 6970M on stock clocks, when considering the temps. With proper cooling mods, GX740 might be able to handle 6970M thermal-wise. BIOS compatibility, PSU and power circuits on the MoBo may be a different story though.

5870M has TDP of 50W, but that's for the GPU chip ONLY, whereas on an MXM module there are also GDDR5 chips (which run very hot) and other components, which also generate heat. I think that an entire 5870M MXM 3.0B module has TDP of about 75W (on stock clocks).

 

How much would the 6970m use? The PSU can be fixed with buying a bigger one, but yer bios and mobo compatibility as well ascooling I guess is what I would be after but unless someone has done it no one would know I guess.

 

The stock 6970M draws between 85W and 90W.

Plus a 5870M heatsink will not fit it, without heavy modification.

 

Why it won't fit?
The silver part around DIE?

5870M vs. 6970M


Eurocom:
" The card is compatible with all the notebooks and embedded systems that support MXM 3.0b graphics modules and its TDP is rated at 75W."
http://news.softpedia.com/news/Euro...adeon-HD-6970M-Powered-Notebooks-193872.shtml

 

The Eurocom Racer has the option of a 5870 or 6970 as well as an array of nvidia cards. So unless they change the cooling for each card i would say it should fit, and my current card never goes over 80 so even if it is slightly hotter im sure it should be fine.

 

well mxm upgrade did try the hd6970 the gx660 and it worked but it was pixelated they assumed the card that was used was bad here have a look.
MXM notebooks 3.0 and up unfortunately i don't know that much about the gx740.

 

if gx660 could handle it, i'm sure 740 can as well, just a stronger psu will be needed. After 6970 mod, i do not recomend 920xm to be installed with it as it is 55w tdp spec cpu, i think 840qm should be the best option just to keep everything a little bit cooler. does anybody have any thoughts about adding radiators on to the gpu heatsink ?

 

I doubt that, Alienware Giant fan at full speed can barely keep it at 80C at stock speed

 

Nearly twice TDP? I want to see your calculation...
The heatsink will fit, if you're unlucky you need to make some little adjustments, but if the system uses standart MXM 3.0 Type B cards then the layout of the card will be identical, thus the heatsink should fit.

Here you can see some cards... compare the layout:


Edit: The 5850 is basically a slightly lower clocked 5870...


I don't know mcuh about the GX740... what's the standard card for this model? A 5870? If it can handle a 5870 and it doesn't run too hot then it could work. What's the PSU rated at? ...because the power draw will increase.

There's still the question about the fan control and whether the BIOS accepts the vbios of the card...

To say it definitely works someone needs to try it... just contact mxm-upgrade and you should be able to make a beta agreement.

That's just bullsh.. I have the 6970m in my M15x (and the system wasn't designed for this card) and it works fine. Idle temps are about 45-50°C, gaming is about 75°C, mem diode get up to about 83-85°C.

 

I have the GX660R. I have bought a 6970m and it should arrive in the next few weeks. I am happy to try this and give you guys the results!!

 

YES, if it will work for you, will work for me as well. I have already tried to OC my 5870 to 820/1020 and i have noticed that vbios of my gfx automaticly rised core Voltage to 1.15 after i went >800mhz, during 3dmark vantage core went up to max temp of 93 - with zalman cooling pad. it is a little bit worrying but not to much

 

m15x and m17x use similar design....
MSI use 1 fan for the gpu+cpu that was my point, will it be able to keep it at 80 or less like the alienwares?

 

I can almost guarantee the GX660 can keep the card at 80C or less under (gaming) load. I am running a 920xm OEM, replaced my i5, and even with the 5870m OC to 860/1020 I only hit a max temp of 69C in BC2. And this is ON STOCK PASTE. I'm thinking that with a stock 6970m the GX660 should be able to keep the card right around 80C, maybe less. Even in the mid 80s that would be more than acceptable temps for a high end gfx card.

After rereading the title of this treat, HSN if you were referring to the GX740, that might be a different story because it does tend to run a bit warmer. Also I have an upgraded 180w PS to handle it all.

 

I said it's not true because you said the Alienware barely can't keep it under 80°C, which is definitely not true, especially for the M17x r3.

It doesn't really depend only on whether there's one or two fans, but mostly on the heatpipes. The 6970m heatsink of the M17x r3 has 3 heatpipes, this really helps... the M15x has two on the GPU, thus runs a bit hotter.

I don't know about the thermal design of the MSI machines... I guess it has two heatpipes on the GPU, should work imo, especially if the GX740 is similar to the GX660 (look at what TalonUIUC is reporting...)


However, the power draw might become an issue, what kind of PSU does this machine use?
Upgrading to a bigger PSU won't help usually, as in most cases the power draw is not limited by the PSU itself, but by some parts on the mobo.
Normally just getting a bigger PSU won't let your system draw more power.

 

Exactly.

There is only 1 heatpipe for each CPU and GPU.
With some mods (like mine Add. GPU FAN MOD & Backcover MOD) on a NC-3000 my X7811 barely hits 75°C at Furmark (games around 70°C).
IDK, if it was 700/[email protected] or at 0.98V.

The stock PSU is only 120W. But also with a 150W one something seems to throttle the GPU, if running Prime and Furmark. GPU load drops to almost 50%. Power usage is nearly 140W. Imo a BIOS lock.
IDK, if the GX740's has similar issues.

 

tilla - WOW - NICE, i really started to smile when i was watching your photos.

I have another question anyway, let's say we do upgrade our MSI/MEDION's to 6970m but will haveing i5 430M instead of QM840/920XM will help our gpu's not to over heat so much ? on the attached photos we can see that 2 heatpipes have their separate (not completely) radiators, fact that there is only one fan to cool it is not important i think.
I am really started to scratch my head, maybe we can redesign whole thing by adding a heatpipe ?
I have found them HERE !!! only cone is, min 500 pieces must be ordered at the same time :/ but we know at least - heatpipes can help us !

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/416022837/Sinter_Powder_Copper_Heatpipe_for_Notebooks.html

To add some comparison Please guyz could you post your 3dmark scores ? - on stock clocks 700/1000 and a processor installed just to see how much CPU helps (i5 vs i7)

my scores are:
3dmark 06 - 11500
vantage - 7800

i use i5 430M

CHEERS !!

 

Ok, thanks for confirming the power issues and the thermal design... I guess it will be similar with the GX740... One heatpipe is bad news, the die of the 6970m is pretty huge, check my picture above. It may work (thermally) but it's hard to say anything definite, you only can say that it works when someone has tried it.

Nice mod btw... there was enough space to put an additional fan in the system? Lol Great work, backplate is a great idea and will definitely help a lot. +rep!

The lower end CPU will help a bit, but not much... the heatpipes are separate I guess. But it will help with the power issue for sure as it draws less power!

Adding a heatpipe is not a bad idea, but almost impossible... you can't really bend them without breaking or damaging them (remember heatpipes are hollow and filled with a fluid and something like really fine copper wire)
You could try getting a second heatsink, desolder the heatpipe and put it next to the other GPU heatpipe... that's the only (more or less) easy and maybe possible way I can think of.


Here are some benches (in spoiler for saving space):

Spoiler

Stock (680/900) 3dMark11, CPU is a 920xm, stock clocks as well:


3dMark Vantage, stock GPU, CPU at 24x multi across all cores (3.2 GHz)




And here some scores when I push the system (but no artefacts at all...)
Though I have to say this is really at the limit... heat and power-wise, this was only for seeing what the system is able to do...
3dM11:



Vantage:

 

I think I am experiencing the same issue on my GX660R. When I run Furmark alone the graphics run smoothly. But when I run it along side Prime95, the Furmarks graphics starts to judder. I also notice that when I remove the "fur" and let the background of Furmark run I get 190fps without Prime95 and about 40fps with. With Furmark my GPU runs at 78C. I am also using a 180w PSU as the 120w PSU would shut off if I run the two programs together.
I have the GX660R.

 

Hmm, I'm wondering whether it's hitting some voltage limit within the motherboard's circuitry.

 

I don't understand how STUPID they are over at that site sometimes.

Who the hell tries out a 6970m and stops testing after its pixelated?

Hook it up to an external monitor and provide some relevant information or stop confusing people. grrr

 

Just to be fair, this was an external beta tester and not directly from MXM-upgrade... the guy who runs this site really knows his business, check out the report about the Clevo W870CU for example.

 

Yes,

Pardon me for saying in this off topic thread but...

I don't know if I like getting information like that when its so obvious they also know their "business"
they should be 2 separate things. and information should be complete. Thats all I'm saying.

 

I have now put a 6970m inside the GX660R yesterday. It works perfectly. The heat that it produces is a big problem. You will have to run turbo fan when playing games. I am still testing. Hopefully the temps will drop a little. I repasted with Shin Estu X23.

My thoughts are if the temps are this high on the 6070m, would it be better to just OC the 5870m and get the same performance from that instead????

MXM Upgrade have done it too: http://www.mxm-upgrade.com/GX660.html

 

WHY NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT GX740 ?

Thread tells GX740, i give a sh.. about gx/gt660/680

Anyway, i think i'll wait until 7XXX series comes out, in smaler nm process should generate less heat.

Maybe mid end 7xxxm series will be faster than 5870m.

Only worry is about MXM 3.0B - PREY THEY NOT INVITE 3.0c or 4.0 with 7xxx series

 

Just buy one and try it. That's what I did...

 

Its not gonna work on the gx740.
The voltage circuits really get stretched on 17" laptops like this, especially cheap ones.
People have already had problems overclocking their CPU and GPU at the same time, I've heard.
Look at how many m570ru died, I think it was for the same reason.

If it takes the upgrade you better settle for a dual core CPU or something, if you can even get it to run at full clocks.

 

Yes, so gx660 is not a cheap one, and it runs 6970 and 940xm together ?
get streched ? why is that so bad ?

user named "archewender" has 940xm @3400 vs all cores and gpu oc'd to 920/1100, seems to me that it's just a matter of cooling, or cooling mods

look how many m570ru died ? - seems like real cheap laptop for me then

anyway...6970m is a not a way to go anymore, 28nm 7xxx series coming on the same MXM 3.0 port, and with less power consumpion of course (max 65w).
I'll wait, 5870 is more than enough for now......

niffcreature, i hope you're not right.
As to The voltage circuits, i will mod them all to gold ones
I just love my gx740 :*

 

Get stretched means overclocking things that people usually don't overclock.

When you overclock a graphics card, many of the power components on the actual card are designed for much higher wattage and voltage, EG the 5870m probably has pretty much the same components as the 6970m.

Unfortunately laptops are not always the same.
AFAIK none of the gx740 or gx640 derivatives were released with a quad core AND type 3.0b MXM GPU such as the 5870m. This means they probably wanted to stay safe because they didn't really do any overcompensation with the voltage circuits.

Once you start going another 60w over 120w you can bet that serious budget cuts are going to make some chips really hot, and these chips do not and aren't meant to have any cooling whatsoever.

There may be something to modding the voltage chips however, on my gx640 they are in some very obvious places.

Adding heatpipes is not as difficult as you think. I am planning on changing the copper plate for my 5850m to that of a Clevo w860cu heatsink which is perfectly fitted to the 5850 and is much bigger and thicker. Then I will add the 2 heatpipes from the w860cu gpu heatsink to the gx640 heatsink. Its a really tight fit.

I think 3 large heatpipes for the GPU will solve any heating problems, don't you?
Also I'm replacing the radiator with a copper one.

I already desoldered many of the pipes and a few others like my gt627 heatsink. I'll post pics of this after my battery charges. The reassembly is no more difficult if you have clamps, solder, and flux.

The tools for disassembly are standard. Pliers (don't hold this with your hands) and very, very, high heat. I chose this in the form of a blowtorch for plumbing soldering which was under 20$ at my hardware store.

 

I have upgraded my gx660r with the 6970m. As mentioned the stock psu cannot handle prime95 and furmark at the same time.

The 6970m can consume 100watt under load.

 

Yes, i'm totally with you MAN !
Only thing is..gx660 MOBO is 99% same as mine(components), and some people were able to put 940xm inside it and run 3400MHZ@4 cores just with a better cooling (180w psu). GX740 has MXM3.0b witch have to has its own standards like "maximum power handling". And 5870M ocd to 920 on core @1.15V assured me that this laptop can handle almost everything if it runs so much oc'ed Radeon and XM cpu.
I have no plans to throw out another money on alienware, witch is overpriced even if i can get it without VAT (there was only 1 NICE offer when dell website offered "NIGHT OWL OFFER TILL 10AM" that was saving me 300GBP off any alienware >899GBP and - 20% VAT it gave me 600GBP saving on a new M17X with 6970M)
I decided not to buy, becouse it was not such a leap that was worth changing my gx740.

Anyway, cooling mods is a way to go like you said, and by adding just one more heatpipe we can make a difference ...I think by soldering them into one, same radiator is not such as effective as adding independent radiator/heatpipe lead to the bottom cover that will be cooled by zalman 3000 pad (with some holes in the cover )

As to the gx740 with quads relase, there are many of them in US and 720/40qm's on board is a standard there

I really want to see your mod with heatpipes.....never saw such a thing before

 

You missed my point...

The voltage circuits which are applied to the MXM 3.0 slot... Well, MSI can make its own decisions about this anyway and limit the power consumption...
BUT what I was saying is that there are other voltage circuits that are the initial circuits running into both the CPU and GPU power circuitry.

No one has pushed the limit of these base power components until they overclock the 920xm with a 100w GPU card and stress it at the same time...

Its not a matter of the laptop shutting off, either. Thats what power adapters have protection for. This would be a matter of slow decay and motherboard failure in several months of stressing the components.
I may not really know what I am talking about but a few who are much more knowledgeable about these things would probably agree with me and they were talking about Clevos which are generally better built machines.

One thing I am very interested to know, why do you think the gx660 motherboard is the same?
There is the fact that it uses LED screens if this is true. So you could upgrade to an LED backlit screen. But it would also prove that some cards tested in the gx660 will also work with the gx740/gx640.

Unfortunately I don't really believe you, I mean 99% sure if you mean basic specs but not electrically, BIOS wise and the physical form all of which can be important in these cases.
I think I've seen the gx660 motherboard, and well, its very small because it has like 5 large daughterboards, which is not like the gx740 at all.

In any case, you are all forgetting some important things, more specifically some important graphics cards that do not have such high power consumption.
The 6950m is a very good card... and does not have as high a power consumption.
Also there are nvidia 400 series which have not been confirmed completely incompatible.
Not to mention the upcoming AMD 7000 series....

 

Assuming I have the msi gx740 with specifications:
i7-740QM (stock, without oc)
4 gb ddr3
rm5870

Which PSU will be most appropriate for RM6970 (i mean voltage) ?
Or maybe standard PSU will be enough good for RM6970 with frequencies of 6950? Does anyone know where i can buy a RM 6950 or if it is at all in sell ?

greetings!

 

Any PSU that delivers 19V at 9,5A (180W) with a 5.5x2.5mm tip. I've been using Targus 180W PSU (APA05) for 2 years now, I've never had any problems with it. It's a rebranded Liteon PA-1181-08.

 

FYI this will support nvidia 400 series so there may be hope for other cards.

You know, even when they had the early naming scheme, its MR not RM. Not we just say 6970m like all the nvidia cards.

Anyway, I think you can get a 6950m from Dell. BUT they might make these in ddr3 which is much less powerful. I would like to know your experience if you can get one from them in gddr5.

 

I'll let you know about results as soon as i get it.
Excuse me for disrespect to all MR funs.

 

hi
which notebook with i7 and mxm 3 b is best for an amd 7000 change later on?

i thought about the medion x7811 or MSI - GX660R-i7447LW7P
are these good ones?
thx

oh this one have even i7 260qm in it
MSI GX680R-i748LW7P

if you say this one best for amd 7000 upgrade ill buy it ;-)

 

Won't know until 7000 series is released and people have tried.