Decided to buy MSI-1651, which vendor?

Hello all,

I think i've finally decided my next laptop is going to be the MSI-1651. I like the black case with the trim and the 1680x1050 Matte Display. Good battery life too.

I'm looking at 3 vendors right now:

1. XoticPC
2. AVADirect
3. RKC-1651

AVADirect seems to be the cheapest, RKC closely following, and XoticPC's Force model seems to be priced much higher than the other 2. Am I missing something? Normally I'd expect these three to be competitively priced.

I'm just looking to have
* P8400 (minimum),
* 1680x1050 Matte display
* 250GB Sata II 7200RPM HD
* Intel 5300 Wireless + Bluetooth

I could almost care less about the RAM as i will no doubt upgrade it myself. Similarly, I already have an OS so I do not need to buy one-- I only need the drivers.

Can anybody give any feedback here on these vendors in addition to the feedback that can be found in the FAQ (and links within)? Is XoticPC likely to pricematch AVADirect or RKC since their model is the "Force Series"?

Thanks,

Kevin

 

Call them up and see!

 

Also consider the PowerPro 15:3 from PNB ( http://www.powernotebooks.com/viewsystem.php?sysId=2544). It is built on the MSI-1651 and comes with a 3 year warranty. I currently have one and am enjoying it so far, have had to call customer service once to figure out how to get the eSATA to work (I hadn't configured the harddrive correctly when plugging in) and on the first call was able to have the problem resolved, in around 2 minutes. Just another option to consider. If you have any questions just ask.

 

The price difference is due to the 3-year warranty. If you add a similar warranty to the other 2 deals, then the prices will be much closer.

 

You can get the drivers from here:
http://global.msi.com.tw/index.php?func=downloaddetail&type=driver&maincat_no=135&prod_no=1529
You might also want to consider getting just the cheapest barebone, then get your own parts (CPU, RAM, HDD). I can't find the wifi card elsewhere so I ordered the wifi along with the barebone. Total is even cheaper than all those vendors.

 

I'm planning to buy one two now. Had a tossup between the JFL90 and MSI-1651 for a while. Found the Sager at xotic for a good price WITH OS, but the GDDR3 of the MSI-1651 has sold me on that.

Avadirect has the best price that I've found and the MOST option, plus it also seems to be one of the few places with the WSXGA+ screen, so adding that in it's ALOT cheaper than the other guys. (Avadirect is sort of strange on their pricing as the xotic xplorer 7800 (JFL90) was a better and cheaper deal overall than what I could do with the avadirect options. The OS pricing really just killed the JFL90 for avadirect...)

Warranty: 1y is good enough for me. Never used them before and I HAVE bought them in the past, also had other notebooks (Apple) w/o w/no problems, so the forced additional cost plus lack of pricing by the other guys is unappealing to me. The only sore point with Avadirect is that they have crappy OS pricing. (Looked into doing a real barebones but quick searches of component showed no real savings(no good pricings on the P8600 apparently, plus having to wait for all of the pieces to appear.)

(Looking at a P8600, 4GB DDR2 800 CL5, 320GB SATA II 5400RPM, WSXGA+, Intel 5300 WiFi setup myself. Plan to load Ubuntu(64bit need to find WiFi drivers apparently) and XP Pro(32bit - games!) on it.)

[EDIT]
Grabbed a PDF copy of the manual tonight...

Engrish alert. I've seen worse, but it's been a while since I've seen a Taiwanese elctronics mfg with something this bad...
[/EDIT]

[EDIT2]
Meh, enough messing around for me. I've decided rather than look harder/longer for better deals on parts and then trying to get everything arriving at one time that I'm just going to order the 1651 from avadirect in the morning. Now off to search for a good bargain on at least Vista Home Premium 64 bit...
[/EDIT2]

[EDIT3] 10/28/08 630p
Decided to move this into a new post for a little bumpage with some news for people looking at avadirect.
[/EDIT3]

 

If you're going to buy from avadirect better do it RSN as they keep creeping up the price a few dollars several times each day. One more time and they'll have entirely nullified their price advantage, so I'm off to reprice with the other vendors again ATM. (Actually IIRC it went up about $25 over the weekend, $10 yesterday, and then shot up another $25 in the last few hours, so I cancelled out my quote. Going to look at parting it out now as the final price is pretty step considering their hd and RAM markups. CPU price is still OK, and the WSXGA+ option, but you can't get it bare... IOW lost sale)

 

I'm re-evaluating my decision to buy the MSI-1651. The Asus M50Vm-A1 is competitively priced, and actually at Gentech PC it is much cheaper than the MSI-1651. For under $1200 it comes with a 1GB Nvidia card (DDR2 but I don't care), 4GB RAM, an operating system, and a larger (albeit 5400RPM) hard drive. It also have a much nicer keyboard with numeric pad... the main keyboard is not cramped like the right half of the MSI-1651 keyboard, and the control/function keys are not switched.

I originally opted not to get an M50 since I thought it got bad battery life, but I just read a review of it and peoples comments and it is claimed to get 2h30m+ battery life. While that may not be true in every case, I don't game a lot and my use will mostly fall into that type of usage.

I think the MSI-1651 looks nicer, but the keyboard is a real killer... for a hundred or two cheaper I can get the Asus which is only marginally bigger, has a better keyboard, and comparable hardware. I can always change out the HD or Ram if I want different stuff in the future.. and Asus has a great warranty.

I guess i'm considering both still, since it would be nice to have my choice of equipment on the MSI-1651, but I feel like the keyboard would really bug me if I am using it in class and at school a lot to type reports and research.

 

Yeah, I might look into that myself, as I couldn't find a good enough deal on the WSXGA+ screen elsewhere so I was just going to bite the bullet with what avadirect had, however right after you submit the order you get this nice little item at the top stating more or less:
Oh yeah, please fill out and FAX (***?! I haven't seen a FAX machine in years...) to blah blah...
[EDIT] This is apparently for order > $1000 which means just about anything useful from them... [/EDIT]

This sort of makes me queasy as it means that avadirect is really smalltime. Probably better to pay $100 or so more and go with guys that are right upfront about everything and/or offer "cash" (check/wire transfer) discounts(seemed like most did 5% while one did a 3% generic discount for some reason). [EDIT] Part of the reason why I was going to buy from avadirect beyond price was that they are about a 2.5h or so drive from where I live... which is not too far if I REALLY had to actually go there... [/EDIT]

Going to look at this Asus if avadirect continues to give me grief...

OK, I saw that Asus on a couple of sites while wandering around but the ones that I saw it at it was more expensive so I didn't check to see if it was DDR3 or not.

Might want to look at the GT735 (uses crappy AMD Turion x2s so the CPU will suck) but had a DDR3 Radeon Mobility 3850, which in theory, should be one of the better GPUs in notebooks although the notebookcheck entry looks pathetic. (9700M GT beats it handily, and actual game FPS are awful...)

[EDIT2]
If worse comes to worst does anyone remember the site that let you send FAXes from online (from web interface or by emailing the item to be faxed plus #)? If it's still around or if there's another one like it? (It was free.) nvm, found a bunch of likely candidates... free trials at least if nothing completely free any longer...
[/EDIT2]

The 2.5h battery life is what the MS-1651 should've gotten w/the 6cell battery too from the big thread...

[Gah more editing]
OS is kind of bad, as it's pre-installed kind where you get to make your own recover disks AND it's only the 32bit version so it only sees what 3.5GB of the 4GB otherwise it's about the same spec as the MS-1651 that I was trying to order from avadirect, so the MSI is cheaper for me ignoring the OS which I don't really need right away as I've got XP Pro + Ubuntu (see below).

Plan on putting Ubuntu 64bit + winxp + some version of 64bit vista (eventually) on mine so I'll have to do a full re-install no matter what I get...
[/edit]

 

Jumped through the hoops and still ordered the 1651 from ava but ended up using paypal.

I looked and thought seriously about the Asus, but decided that I'd rather go with the little bit of extra performance from a GDDR3 based solution. Might give it that little bit of extra life in the end as I'm expecting this to last at least 5y and I'm starting off with a MUCH better GPU this time around. (Replacing a powerbook which even when new had an OLD ATI RagePro still. I still can't believe how long Apple clung to those old ATIs as IIRC the next 2y after that they were still using them, but with a bit more memory... Seems like they only changed GPUs when they updated Quartz which required something better.)

[EDIT]
...and *cough* I see from a review on this very site of avadirect, which I had previously overlooked they do do a sort of just-in-time inventorying in that, apparently, they order parts only as necessary which would explain the fairly rapid shifting in prices at their site, which is reasonable...

My order is in the "processing" stage which I assume means that they are ordering the components not on hand (they must have some components on hand I imagine), so I'll probably just followup the post once I receive the notebook and get Ubuntu and XP pro up on it.

From the Ubuntu site it would appear that only the 32bit version currently works well with PM45 chipset used in this and other notebooks, and the 8.10 release is recommended. 64 bit apparently enters an endless boot-reboot cycle which AFAICT no one has tracked down yet, so I'll be going 32bit Ubuntu ATM but will go 64bit as soon as the above is resolved, or a promising alpha release appears.
[/EDIT]

 

Well, now I am just teetering back and forth. I first thought that the ASUS M50Vm-A1 had a better keyboard, only to find they miniaturize keys too (like the left shift key which I use quite a bit.) I guess that sort of negates the negatives on the MSI 1651 for the keyboard and that is no longer an advantage of either.

To those of you with the MSI 1651, how do you like your WSXGA+ screens? Does the Matte screen work well?? I don't game much, but I don't want something that is too grainy looking. I've been looking around and I can't find any real good screenshots comparisons of what it looks like.

Kevin

 

Carrying on from the Asus thread:
I just went and looked at pix again, and the ONLY key that LOOKS smaller on the keyboard is the left SHIFT key. The period keys looks the same size as the letter keys(same with my desktop kb) and the period/Del key on the keypad is looks to be twice the size of the # keys, while on my desktop kb it's the same size as the # keys which are also the same size as the letter keys, cursor control keys, and the Prt Scr/Insert block keys.

Other than the LEFT SHIFT and PERIOD keypad key the only difference looks to be the elimination of the extra space that my desktop kb has around the various key grouping blocks (alpha numeric, cursor/control blocks, and keypad block plus row of Fn keys at top).

(You got me worried about the keyboard so I dug through as many keyboard specific photos as I could and it looks A-OK to me... My only concern now is if the keys are mushy(I HATE "modern" keyboards, and miss clickety-click tank IBM kbs and the flex cited...)

 

The MSI-1651 has a very cramped keyboard near the enter key area:

See here: http://www.rkcomputer.net/downloads/photos/ms-1651-wsxga/touchsensors.html

The period, shift, question mark, arrows, and forward slash keys are all shrunken considerably. Also notice the duplication of the "Pipe and Forward Slash" key that is above and below the enter key--- what gives? Also, the left side CTRL and FN keys are switched from the "standard" configuration. I think I can deal with most of those changes, but they'd be annoying at first.

The ASUS M50Vm-A1 keyboard (no link here.. don't feel like finding it) has a decently sized keyboard except I dislike the fact that the left shift key is miniature. Again, it might be something I could get use to.

I wish the N50Vn wasn't so ugly or I'd probably buy it. It has a nice keyboard and good lookin' features. The looks aren't AWFUL, but they sure aren't MSI-1651 style.

 

Didn't notice the duplicate key, this could be useful for other functions. . .

 

And you own one! Keyboard must not be that bad afterall.

Maybe somebody can comment on these issues i'm debating over:

1) Is the period key a real PITA to use since it is shrunk?


2) The review on NBR says that the screen isn't very bright. What does this imply? Is it unviewable in bright conditions? I don't have a baseline measurement for that statement.


3) Is the Matte Screen easy to keep clean? Is it delicate? I feel like the Glossy screens might be more robust. When I'm thinking of the Matte screen, i'm thinking of the old big-screen TV's that had a cloth-like screen.


I'd like to make a decision this week, and it is down to a MSI-1651 and Asus M50Vm-A1 (now that I found out the left shift key is actually regular size).

Thanks,

Kevin

 

I was readin last night somewhere on anandtech or tomshardware that Worst Buy is selling the Asus G50Vt (special for BB) 13?? x ??? screen, 9800GS not sure about the hdd & CPU other than they said it was lower spec than normal G50s along with the lower res screen for $1250 but also only having a 1y warranty through Worst Buy (I smell hard selling on their crappy warranties...).

Also noted in the 627 thread that the manual for the 627 is the same as the 620 (1651) and apparently the BIOS is the same as well, so it's looking more like the 1651 can take MXM III spec cards so a 9800GS upgrade (or better) seems to be possible, if a little pricey at some point...

[EDIT]
That keyboard photo looks completely different than another one that I was looking at...

The PERIOD key on that one looked about double sized(# pad), while on this one it looks normal, and I notice that the normal PERIOD and other keys look squished...

Wonder if the photo that I saw was mis-posted...
[/EDIT]

 

1. It is not the best, but overall I have not had a problem with the period key. That may be due to my typing style, but I rarely have a problem with the small period key.

They keyboard is pretty good, it is a little springy, but I find that to be a benefit rather than a deterrent, the keys are nice and clicky and I can type quite easily. Though sometimes I wish the keyboard was a little more sturdy.

2. The screen is plenty bright, I have not had trouble even in bright environments seeing the screen. They screen isn't the brightest around, but neither will you have problems seeing it.

3. The screen is easy to clean, I just wipe it down with a slightly damp cloth or a dry cloth to clean off dust. The screen seems fine to me, I do not see any problems with it in terms of delicacy, do you mean is it likely to break if pressure is applied? It is more squishy compared to glossy screens, but it does not seem weak to me. Plus, since I often turn down brightness in order to gain battery life during classes, the non-reflective nature helps out a lot.

Have you check on the Asus forums, what are you considering the pros and cons of each laptop? This could better help me in informing you on what I know from my experience with this notebook.

 

Thanks Gaara42, is there any chance you could post some close-up pictures of the screen so I can have an idea of what it looks like? With the screen both on and off (hard to see texture with scree on).

If not, that is ok - I understand people are busy, I am too Doesn't hurt to ask though

As far as pros and con's, here is a quick list I have:

Asus M50Vm-A1:
Pros:
*Supposedly a great screen
*Keyboard is more 'full'
*Comes with better hardware stock
*Comes with an operating system
*Is currently $1100 after MIR
*Runs cool

Cons
*Battery life seems less than MSI-1651
*A little bulkier
*Includes 32-bit OS with 4GB ram? Why?
*Lower Resolution (but high enough)
*Doesn't look as nice as MSI-1651, but doesn't look bad
*Touchpad has dumb buttons

MSI-1651
Pros:
*Looks very nice
*Aluminum chassis seems solid
*Can be configured with good hardware
*Doesn't include OS that I don't want particularly
*Good battery life (in comparison)
*Seems it might work with XP with less hassle
*Higher resolution (not too high, I don't want 1900x1280 on 15.4")

Cons
*Keyboard looks cramped on the side
*Costs about $1350 -- $250 more than AsusM50vm-A1
*Doesn't include operating system, but I can put XP on it (it will just take time)
*Unsure if I will like Matte Screen and brightness (but it sounds like it is fine)
*Runs cool, but palm area might get a little hot due to chassis material (according to review)

 

Are you sure about the no OS, because IIRC most of the other vendors that I looked at that had higher prices included at least Vista Home Premium 32b as a freebie with varying amounts more for 64b or "better" Vista versions...

IIRC one of them even shipped with both 32b AND 64b Vista Home Premium, can't recall who offhand though...

OS doesn't matter so much to me as XP is better for gaming and I have a spare pro license, but will use linux for most work...

 

Hmm.. which vendors were you looking at that were including Vista 32-Bit free with the MSI-1651?

Btw, did you end up getting your laptop yet?

 

Attached images Included in the pictures my old school DS, hope this helps in comparing (not the greatest comparison).

In response to Cons.

1. The keyboard is a little cramped, I did not find much of a problem with it, only occasionally. See if you can find a similar keyboard on a notebook at a local computer.

2. The difference in cost seems to me to be due to the better GPU, higher screen resolution and some other things.

3. If you have an OS, all the better. I did not have a XP or Vista license key and don't wish to use a Unix based OS, so bought a new copy.

4. It depends if you want blinding brightness or brightness adequate enough to deal with almost any environment. I have not encountered an environment which this computers screen stops being visible, including the bright outdoors.

5. The palm rest becomes warm over time, but usually is cool to the touch and I have not had to take my hand off of the computer in the time I have had it, including when I am playing games. Here are my max temps ( http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=4047524&postcount=15)

Take into account the warranties different vendors offer as well, whether you need a 3 year warranty. I felt I did but that is a matter of personal preference.

If you have any other questions, let me know.

 

Thanks Gaara, that was very nice and helpful of you. I am thinking I might just eat the extra couple hundred bucks and lose the OS (I have XP anyways) and get the MSI.

I can get it from RK Computers for $1260 with everything I want in it but only a 1 yr warranty, or I can get it from XoticPC right now on sale for like $1380-- but with a 3 year warranty (same specs roughly). I think PowerPro was quite a bit more expensive than Xotic is right now so i'll have to take a look.

It might come down to who has the best return policy, in the event I don't like it. (After all, I can't see the darn thing before I get it!)

The screen definitely looks a little different than I was envisioning... the ones with it turned off really helped.

Thanks

**EDIT** Just checked Power Notebooks and apparently they and XoticPC always carry the same deals and exact same pricing. Will have to look into return policies for them, XoticPC, and RK Computers to see what I really need. The 3 year warranty could definitely be nice, depending on what exactly it covers.. I'll have to read the fine print.

 

If it helps you any, here is a personal story about support from PNB.

I installed the new BIOS for the MSI-1561 (1.OI) and found that windows was not starting at all, it would try to load then blue screen every time. I tried some stuff that didn't work, so called customer support. The man was very professional and got the problem resolved in a minute or two. See if you can check with whichever vendor you are buying it from and see how good their customer support is, this may or may not be important to your decision-making.

 

So OOC and in case we may need it, what was the problem and how did you resolve it?

 

The problem turned out to be that when I flashed the BIOS and restored it to MSI default settings, it changed the HDD detection to AHCI instead of the needed IDE. I did not know that the BIOS should need to detect the HDD as IDE, so was working on the assumption that I needed to install the driver again (hence the use of the Drivers Utility and Vista Install disc) or restore back to a previous saved state.

OOC in reference to. . .?