*** The Official MSI GT75 Owners and Discussions Lounge ***

It looks like that was run at 4.8GHz. Here is this for comparison. Your temps are better. I'm going to have to do a CPU heat sink mod because the 6700K heat sink is struggling with the hexacore and extra ~50W TDP. It clearly was not made for that, LOL.

 

Greetings,

I owned a GT75 Titan 4K-071 briefly. Bad backlight (pulling lid to close on upper right corner of display would cause it to turn on/off). The outer box had some obvious damage so I can't quite dig MSI for it. I _was_ to pick up a replacement today, but Fry's doesn't know the definition of 'in stock/available' and they didn't actually have anymore. So I placed an order from Amazon. Looks like it'll be here Tues, from Mobile Advance.

Has anyone tried Linux on this yet? I'd like to see how the MMIO groups shake out. Specifically, my hope is to be able to use the igpu has the linux host gpu and pass the 1080 and at least one of the pcie m.2 slots through to a vm. I _think_ Looking Glass can be convinced to work in such a case anyway. But the round 0 of it all hinges on MMIO groupings.

I've seen, or thought I saw, some mention that the igpu was disabled. It's unclear if that was in reference to the BIOS setting or if the actual i9's gpu is actually disabled. The implication being that it's always using the 1080. Presumably the unlocking of the BIOS should correct the former.

Thanks!

 

You have to unlock bios menus to use the iGPU.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-clear-cmos-and-prevent-common-issues.812372/

The same method applies. and there is risk.

Make a backup with FPTW64 (DO NOT USE THE DOWNLOADED MSI BIOS, EVER!).
download AMIBCP 5.0.2 (5.0.1 will NOT work and will corrupt the bios), set all menus in advanced and all submenus in advanced to supervisor, use the mentioned tools (use a backup of your backed up ROM if you want to be safe) to find and get the hex ID For Bios Lock), disable bios lock, flash the modded AMIBCP capsule and there you go.

 

Hi, i have same problem with VID voltages on idle

 

What in the living hell???????
1.454v ????????????

CPU's can -degrade- with voltage above 1.4v at load.....my god.......
I don't want to post the bios unlock combo but I can't let people destroy their chips....it isn't right.....

 

Did I understand correctly that my next step is contact for SVET on msi forum for bios unlock? or i can resolve this problem without bios unlock?

 

Idle voltage has always been high since Skylake forward. It's probably more like 1.250V with the cores under load.

Yes, or you can try setting the voltage lower with ThrottleStop while you are waiting for him to get that ready for you. That may help immensely. Plus, you can set 4 different profiles for different clock speeds and voltage. I have been using it for years (even with an unlocked BIOS) and it works great. I am currently using it with my two machines that have an 8700K.

 

No it's not, It's 1.454v (absolute maximum)
I know how MSI's VID boost system works.
The higher the load, the higher the voltage. But I have to explain why you're seeing the max load voltage at idle.

At idle, at very very low loads, the "Voltage range" jumps between the minimum and maximum load voltages on MSI cancer, brother Fox.
The only way to fix this is to change IA AC DC loadline to 1.

Basically his default voltage is supposed to be *1.3v* at maximum.
SO 1.25v to 1.3v.
But MSI boosts the 1.3v to 1.45v (because of 1.80 mOhms of resistance from IA AC DC Loadline).

That's the problem.

 

You can't solve this problem without bios unlock.
MSI is doing VID Boosting. It's boosting the voltage far beyond what is necessary.
I don't know if its also boosting STATIC voltages (Phoenix didn't test that and testing that is dangerous, we just disabled the VID boost so that 1.280v idle became 1.30v load).
Basically with the unlocked Bios, and changing the IA AC DC Loadline value to 1, your max voltage will be only 30mv (0.03v) higher than your target voltage (e.g. 1.30v will be 1.33v max)..
With the IA AC DC loadline setting at the MSI defaults (179, which is 1.79 mOhms (or 1.80 mOhms), that 1.30v will be 1.45v maximum.

That's the problem here.

 

@Phoenix didn't run 4.8GHz. You probably saw Thermal Velocity Boost (TVB) in action Aka on a single core

 

Hi guys, I've received my new GT75 and not exactly tweaking like Phoenix,

Hidevolution stated that if I choose the best Thernal Material upgrade they would also undervolt it, how do I find out what they have undervolted to?

 

HWMonitor

 

@Phoenix I have heard you have got your new toy (8RG). Could you please post some noise and temp. information in eco, sport and OC mode?

Also guys, what laptop cooler do you recommend with it?

 

All this will come in my review in 2 days.

You don't need a laptop cooler. You need to buy it from HIDevolution, have it pasted with Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut + Fujipoly Thermal pads + Bottom panel mod and you need to tell them not to install Dragon Center. Like ever! It will destroy your laptop as it puts very bad settings in your BIOS every time it launches. I'll make a guide for the best settings later

 

Sure, I will get all the goodies, but my experience is that a laptop cooler helps. Even a stand that positions the back of the laptop higher, because it allows the cold air to come from the low side and the hot air move from the top naturally. Well, it's simple thermodynamics. I get 10C difference on my Dellware only from a stand.

The idea of the Dragon is that it lets you tweak several things fast and together like OC, fans etc. If I have to run 20 different software at the background... argh!

I am so thinking that the P870 with an Prima bios and a i7 8700K is actually a superior product...

 

Yeah the Dragon Center will reset your VR Current Limit, IA, DC, Load Line back to stock every time you launch causing the voltages to go all the way up to 1.4V+ and will make your laptop overheat within seconds of running anything strenuous.

Anything you do in the BIOS will be reset by Dragon Center's Cancer.

It offers nothing good but a fancy interface for overclocking which is broken.

 

thanks for this info! HIDevolution will be working on my build shortly..this is a great headsup!

 

@Phoenix
Yes, I read your tweaks already. Honestly I was shocked. It's like everything Mr. Fox has been saying for years is right.

After all this, if you had to choose again, would you go for the MSI 8RG 094 or the P870-TM with a real 8700K?

Many thanks!

 

Yup, Thermal Convection works to draw heat up and pulls cold air in from the lower side, so even rising the rear higher than the front a couple of inches will work.

Also raising the laptop off the surface of the desk by a few inches keeps the heat from building up on the surface of the desk and reflecting back into the laptop.

A good laptop stand won't have a solid surface - it will be a mesh or skeleton framework to keep heat from being contained in the stand surface, and of course even a simple slow fan under the mesh will negate the effect of stored heat between the laptop and the stand surface.

Unfortunately these combo tools don't promote the full tool interface into their controls, and you lose a lot of functionality, with Intel XTU being the main problem - there are a lot of XTU CPU settings that are hidden by the DGC tool.

Better to uninstall DGC and then work with each tool individually to get the maximum functionality.

I know XTU may seem to be a much more complex interface, but it's really straight-forward interface that shows a lot of good information, and limits the adjustable settings to what you CPU has unlocked.

Prema BIOS lags release of new laptops by many weeks or months, so you have to live with the noodle Clevo BIOS for a long time, a bit of a pain.

By the time the Prema BIOS is out and you and others optimize the settings, the next generation laptop is being leaked, and attention moves to that... which works out to be a very brief window of being on top.

I find the balance of laptop CPU's limited to 45w-65w, with tuning capability almost as high as desktop CPU's, run quieter and are less bulky, much more liveable than the behemoth P870 style desktop's crammed into a laptop models.

The GT75 will get you 99% of the performance for 100% less wasted time and headache, especially if you limit your time tuning to undervolting and OC - setting CPU voltage to lowest needed for stable operation, which reduces thermals and thermal throttling - without re-pasting or unlocking the BIOS - at least do it first and take notes on results to compare for the extreme solution results.

Work smart instead of employing a big hammer to fix that which isn't broken.

 

MSI. The keyboard and screen on this thing are the best screen and keyboard you'll ever see in your life. Period! It blows the Clevo keyboard out of the water and then a little some.
That's if the keyboard matters to you as much as it does to me. It is the best keyboard on the planet. Period

 

@skman @UncleMysh @Papusan @Mr. Fox @Johnksss @Falkentyne @bloodhawk @Prema

Before my review, a small benchmark I just ran:

 

Thank you for answering me.

I am not sure, I got your point though. Are you suggesting that having a fan that forces air is a drawback? I am sorry in this case I will disagree because forced convection (eg. under windspeeds) is always better than free convection.

 

Yeah, you got it wrong, I'll see if restating what I said helps you understand.

 

OK thanks!

@Phoenix
You are so nice! Many thanks. Could you please also post background noise and noise with fans on?

 

Besides some Auto OC, Dragon Gaming Center is useless, its only a lot of bling for nothing.

It was screwing with both my CPU and GPU clocks on a GT72 2QE, it wouldn't let my CPU idle at 800Mhz, and it would keep the GPU at 450Mhz, after uninstalling it, an EC Reset was needed to restore proper settings, it would also change my undervolt, and the display changing colour profiles is plain annoying.

The fan boost is a physical button on my laptop, and for custom fan profile, Svet can help you on that with is EC Editor, edit once, or twice to dial them and no need to run programs in the background to do such a basic thing, heck, MSI should allow settings fan curves on the BIOS like we can on desktop mobos.

 

Updated:

From this:

"...and of course even a simple slow fan under the mesh will negate that effect."

to this:

"...and of course even a simple slow fan under the mesh will negate the effect of stored heat between the laptop and the stand surface."

 

I was going to comment on this the first time you posted it, and Mr Fox responded saying his 8700k was faster at 4.7ghz...

You are running this without the multiplier's locked to 4.8ghz, it's free to underclock based on the CPU control. So it's not a solid 4.8ghz run.

I assumed (and still do) that you will find the top all core OC, whether that is 4.8ghz, or more likely around 4.5ghz (thermally limited), and run benchmarks there for top performance runs.

Your current variable CPU Boost setting is likely a good daily driver setting, letting the CPU scale the performance based on load.

 

@hmscott Already read and liked. Many thanks!

Yes, I agree. Saying this would you suggest any stand? I was looking at the Ergostand IV by Cooler Master...

@Phoenix Your scores are pretty good man!

 

temps are lookin good!

 

I use the previous model:

Ergostand III
http://www.coolermaster.com/product/Detail_aj01/mobile/P1404250001b924/Overview.html

It was strong enough to hold a GT80 SLI 980m even though it extended well beyond the coverage of the surface, the bottom clips held it's size and weight. And the GT73 1080 also rests nicely.

The Ergostand VI looks interesting, a modernized re-imagining of the Erogostand III, please let us know how it works out.

SIMPLE YET POWERFUL - ERGOSTAND IV
http://www.coolermaster.com/cooling/notepal-series/ergostand-iv/

 

@hmscott I promise feedback after it arrives... I am now running the CM SF 17", but the fan has loosen and runs loud and wild around ~45dbA.

 

If you want something more effective, buy a Cooler Master U3 and add three 120MM desktop fans to it with an AC adapter and fan controller. That's what many of us have already done, and it is far more effective than anything off the shelf. If you use a fan controller you can adjust the noise and performance from mild to wild, depending on your use scenario.



Imgur Albums are below. Look in the photo descriptions for suggestions on parts.

Notepal U3 Fan Mod - and - Notepal U3 Plus Fan Mod

Or, if you want to get really serious about keeping it cool, nothing beats this...

 

Ah... too late now @Mr. Fox. I used many of your mods before to retrofit my Dellware, but this one I did not... :-(

 

yes the CPU is clocked at 48,48,47,45,44,43 from the factory depending on how many active cores are running

 

Is that how yours is running now? It's not overclocked to 4.8GHz on all cores?

 

Ahh, that fits what hwinfo was showing as well

Interestingly that's about what I have been suggesting for the 6c/12t and 8c/16t CPU's, pushing the top used cores to the maximum stable, and then reducing the multipliers for the other cores so as to not tax the power and thermal handling when all core loads are running.

For the Ryzen CPU's I also think picking 1 core in each CCX to be the highest multiplier - also pick that core based on AMD tool recommending the "best" core to OC - which is going to spread the top multiplier across the core count - not just Core 0 and 1 like on Ringbus Intel CPU's.

Lots of fun stuff to try tuning to get the most performance out of the implementation in your laptop.

 

oh no I don't wanna overclock just yet, testing the waters at stock I literally just am setting up

 

Looks like no undervolt, maybe it's not needed

 

If it is running that way it also explains how the temperatures are so low. I was wondering how it was doing that at 48x6. Seemed too good to be true. The stock configuration works out to be 43x6 with all cores in use under full load.

Now I would like to see the temps with the CPU at 48x6 and once @Phoenix has more time to find the correct voltage what the temps are like at 50x6.

 

Ok, no problem. Tag me when you're ready to see what she's really made of. I'm interested in seeing the results.

 

@Mr. Fox
about your last post, I didn't comment fully on that (because of some RL issues going on atm). But basically, what i meant to say is, MSI is using a *Combination* of internal Loadline calibration (LLC) that can NOT be disabled, in COMBINATION with voltage boosting occurring from the AC DC loadline mOhms of 1.79 mOhms (Bios value=179). Both of these are occurring together.

So voltage vdroop (there is no vcore sensor, but there is a 'bug' you can exploit to determine how much vdroop there is "supposed" to be by default is removed internally, and then on TOP of that, there is voltage boosting (VID Boost/AC DC loadline).

AND...the thing about the idle voltage, that's not really idle voltage. Seems to be yet ANOTHER BUG, but remember you see VID there, not VCORE. Basically, when windows first loads up and there is VERY light load, the VID shown will range between the minimum and maximum voltages (approximately), and the maximum VID you see at the far right, is what the VOLTAGE will be at the HIGHEST AMPS/power draw load (due to how IA AC DC loadline resistance works).

so yes, that poor user is going to be getting 1.45v through his BGA chip at heavy load.

Phoenix and I already tested this. He knows I'm right.

 

Undervolt is always available, and even with LM keeping your CPU from thermal throttling, Undervolt will reduce load thermals on the CPU further and without a performance hit, it's free and easy, and a good first step for getting a baseline tuning for OC'ing.

 

Review of MSI GT75 TITAN 8RG-201 Gaming Laptop: Core i9/GTX 1080
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...950h-coffee-lake.810891/page-69#post-10720601

 

This is not true. The Prema BIOS for the EVOC High Performance Systems P870TM1, EVOC High Performance Systems P870TM, EVOC High Performance Systems P775TM1 and EVOC High Performance Systems P750TM1 have been out since shortly after they were released.

 

This man speaks the truth.

 

With thanks to @Falkentyne @Phoenix, @Vistar Shook, @Mr. Fox, @Johnksss and anyone else I missed that helped devolope the proper settings, HIDevolution.com is now using these settings for all new builds at no additional charge.

For our customers that shipped prior to developing these settings, please contact [email protected] or PM @Zoltan@HIDevolution and we will walk you through making these settings.

 

That's great news, last I looked they were still in progress. And, it's been a long history of delays from release of the hardware to the availability of Prema BIOS's, not a complaint, just an observation.

@Mr. Fox and @Prema working together to get through the development cycles have been a long fan favorite here, watching the back and forth.

Prema is just one guy, and he can't be *expected* to be a production line for BIOS's, he's got a life too.

So do I.

My point was that the MSI GT73/75 series have done just fine with undervolting and no fancy BIOS's required.

There may be improvements of the obsessed, but for the rest of us it works fine leaving well enough alone.

I'm not trying to make a cottage industry out of tuning BIOS's or re-pasting services, I am here to help people for free, at no cost or expectation of future income, which I've been doing for a very long time, before others came along and tried to make a business out of it all.

You should be able to buy a laptop at retail, undervolt, tune your fans, tune your FPS to match the refresh of your display, and tune your app / game, all easy to do from software - on your own.

You shouldn't feel compelled or required to only buy from joint's that's got the "good stuff". You don't need LM or re-pasting, or thermal pads, or anything else to enjoy your laptop, we've all being doing so on our own for many years.

We provide the "good stuff" here for free.

 

Hell yeah... i don't want promiss anything but with this kind of customer support you will be in the inner circle for my next gaming ta pto p or maybe my first clevo..
never saw this kind of support from german company's...
i take off my hat for such a service!

 

What are the settings?

I was going to wait to ask @Phoenix and @Falkentyne until more work was done, more testing and results should further optimize the tuning.

But, if the settings are already firm enough to put in customer laptops, I guess now is a good time to ask for the settings to be published here for all to see and have benefit.

Are there BIOS settings only?, or are there TS / XTU / MSI AB / RTSS / DGC settings too?

 

BIOS only. I will post them soon am I still in recovery mode copying my 10TB of data