I can't decide.... x200/s/t

Here's my delema, The s/t has a better screen than the regular, but carry a $5-700 premium respectively.

I can get:
X200: 4GB ram, 128GB SSD, UltraDock+DVD Burner. But it has a CCFL screen and I read that the colors and viewing angles weren't as good. Leather Upholstery, Automatic Locks.
X200s: 4GB Ram, 64GB SSD. This has a higher res screen, which is always better, is lighter, and oviously the battery life. Same price as above.
X200t: 3GB of Ram, Led or maby Multi Touch screen.
Lenovo won't let me select the 64GB SSD for some reason... only the 128...
This config with the 128GB SSD is really killing my budget, since the warranty I want for all is like $100, and my total budget is around $2400.

I really want a tablet, but can't quite imagine my self using it as much since I don't like to write.

Is there a way to order the 128GB SSD and maby call Lenovo and ask them to put in the 64GB instead? 64 GB is already a lot for me, especially since I have a NAS.
I can get the X200 fully loaded with 3 cup holders and a air freshener, or the 200t barely with a SSD...

I'm going to go to the lenovo store in Beijing tomorrow and fiddle with everything.

But how is the screen difference between the S and the regular x200?

 

i got x200t with the default screen

i wish i had upgraded to the LED ultrabright one. its just barely bright enough on the brightest setting. and theres a brihgt strip across the bottom.

theres some kind of extra layer on the tablet screen for the digitizer

it slightly increases noises, and im pretty sure decreases contrast at off angles

if you dont anticipate using tablet features, id go with the ultrabright WXGA+ option on a x200(s)

 

According to Jonlumpkin the x200t has the best screen options of the x200 series. But I guess it depends what your uses are. I think the x200 screen is fine for office/school work (noting the horrible vertical viewing angles...but I just move the screen if I have to). So I think I'd personally go for an x200s with SSD and LED screen, if I were to choose again (and not having it cost me anything extra).

The x200t adds that different weight factor which I wouldn't want.

 

Yeah good points, I'm going right now to mess with the PCs, but it's not written in English so I don't know what computer has what lol.

 

i think the x200 or x200s is your best choice, i know you want a tablet, but even you said yourself you don't see yourself using it very much. i have a feeling you'd buy it but then realize your not using it very much at all and then you wish u opted for the lightness,of the x200 or x200s (batery also)

thats just my opinion though

 

It sounds to me like you just need to decide what the purpose of the notebook is for you. The X200/s/t are basically 3 completely different notebooks for 3 different types of users. The only commonality they really have is the manufacturer and screen size.

Simply put:

X200: This user wants a highly mobile workhorse. Particularly suitable for the type of user that works from his desk often and also buys the ultrabase and a high quality, high resolution LCD monitor like the Lenovo L220x.

X200s: This user values mobility above all else and is willing to pay extra for it: best in class weight and battery life. If you don't travel a lot and don't frequently need long periods of unplugged time, look at a different notebook. Not the best choice for a desk jockey.

X200t: This user needs tablet function. It is hard to justify the higher cost/weight and decreased battery life solely for the sake of the great display on the tablet. If you don't need tablet function then you should look at a different notebook.

That's how I see it anyway.

 

The X200t screens are IPS screens, which are some of if not the best notebook screens. They're not the brightest, but offer very wide viewing angles and are color consistent unlike most laptops.

 

Yeah they only had the X200 to play with, in China, they wanted me to pay over 28,000 ($4,000 USD) for a X200, with no SSD, and no Docking Station. THey also wanted $300 USD for the docking Station!

But I found that in playing with the X200 is that it's sooo small and sooo light, THe screen wasn't bad, however I think I'm going to go for the X200s, simply because of the longer battery life, and the lighter weight...

How long does the 6 cell last on the 200s?
A 11 hour battery life sounds appealing but in reality I might use it for the most of like 6 hours...

I also used a Toshiba Tablet and I didn't really like having to hold the computer and it felt kinda heavy...

 

i find them downright huge. i guess using a netbook as your main machine for a few month does that

 

Here is a link with a bunch of photos comparing all three:

http://digi.tech.qq.com/a/20081111/000061.htm

I hope this helps those confused.

 

As a proud owner of an x200 Tablet (and a former owner of an x200) allow me to throw my hat into the ring.

The screen (particularly the 285nit LED with active digitizer) on the x200 Tablet is without compare. It is an IPS (or possibly AFFS+) display that is bright, has good color accuracy, superb viewing angles, and is even useable in direct sunlight (I tried it at noon on a sunny day).

I really don't like to write that much either (my handwriting is poor, and I type 70+ WPM), but the tablet functionality is quite impressive. Vista (along with the grab and drag plugin for Firefox) makes pen based navigation extremely easy, and it is even able to recongnize my very poor cursive handwriting with surprising accuracy (it uses a predictive text dictionary to make a best guess). It's also very nice to be able to use it as a slate for reading documents or watching video.

The x200 Tablet is also the most full featured of the x200 line (or really any notebook for that matter). It is available with webcam, WWAN, tablet input, superior stereo speakers (best on any Thinkpad), as well as all the normal x200 series options. It also has an advantage in both balance and aestetics because the 8 cell battery runs the full width of the tablet and does not lift it up in the back (both the 6 and 9 cell on the x200 raise the laptop).

Have you considered adding an SSD yourself? If you really want a 64GB SSD your best option is probably to order the machine with a 80 or 160GB 5400 RPM drive, and swapping it out yourself (aftermarket tends to be cheaper). You should also look at the Topseller models. These are sometimes available with the features you need at a lower price point. The 7499-88U has most of the features (285nit LED active, 802.11n, Bluetooth, Fingerprint, 8 cell, webcam, Vista Business, Turbo Memory, Ultrabase/DVD±RW, 160GB 7200RPM) and is probably the best value (currently $1881 on Provantage).

Lenovo was originally using a Samsung 64GB SLC drive. It was the best performing drive available (good access times, fast, good with simultaneous access, good on battery life, high MTBF). You can also get this same drive rebadged as an OCZ, G-Skill, and possibly others.

Another option is MLC drives (I believe Lenovo has now switched to these). MLC drives tend to be cheaper than SLC drives and offer decent performance (good access times, fast, fair with simultaneous access, good on battery life, decent MTBF). The best of these is the 80GB Intel MLC SSD. Other cheaper options are available, but many of these have a defective controller that is very poor with multiple simultaneous transfers.

All three of the x200 are decent options. They all have the same great keyboard, good battery life, share the same dock, and have identical ports (albeit in slightly different layouts).

The x200 regular is a good value choice with superior performance, but the screen is sub par (horrible viewing angles, bad color, not good for video, okay for text).

The x200s is ideal if your preference is for lightweight, high resolution, or really long battery life. However it does not offer a webcam/WWAN if you choose the LED, and the screen is still just a TN panel (poor viewing angles, bad color) albeit really bright and with 140DPI.

The x200 Tablet is the best choice if you value features and/or screen quality. It is more expensive and slightly heavier than the other options. However the screen is very bright, has good color accuracy, superb viewing angles and is viewable outdoors. It offers every feature available on either the x200 or x200s, plus it has the convertible tablet feature. There is a link to pictures of mine in my signature if you would like to see what it looks like.

 

I checked that site, but there wasn't anything telling me the differences between the models...
This is my final order, if you can find something like this that'd be great.
SL9400 (1.86GHz
Vista anything, 64Bit is a plus
The WideView MultiTouch + MultiView LED backlit WXGA panel Or just the reg LED panel
Atleast 2GB of memory, I plan to upgrade with a 4GB Crucial kit but not for a month or two.
Either a crappy HDD, or what I really want is a SLC SSD if one can be found, I would rather have one that is more likely to work, and go with the samsung but those are rare now.
Bluetooth, WiFi Link 5300
and the 8 Cell battery.,,

Things like the Ultra Base are just icing on the cake, I'm really not looking for that now, just the SSD really, but those are great too...
That config with a good warranty on Lenovo with the CPP is like $2314

 

the SAMSUNG MCCOE64G8MPP-0VA is great.... if someone announced TLC tomorrow, everyone would want that instead of MLC or SLC or wahtever.

what i like about the tablet besides the tablet feature is the flatness of the screen, no weird overhanging lip stuff. and no silly fingerprint reader on the palm rest.

the stock screen on x200t is mediocre at best in viewing angle and brightness/contrast, comparing with the Samsung in my 3 year old MSI notebook. i am really regretting not bumping it up for 75. which like the 1.2 to 1.86 is a nobrainer

also the speakers are ****e. i dont know what jonlumpkin is talking about. laptop speakers are always ****e

 

Provantage just lists model types. You need to browse the Lenovo Tabook to find out what those types mean.

Touch gives you the option of finger/pen. However, it is more expensive, 55 nits dimmer, and possibly grainier due to the extra touch layer. I would recommend the standard LED unless you really think you would benefit from finger input. Also for the speakers. I wasn't saying that were as good as desktop ones. Just that they are a lot better than those on the x200 (single underpowered speaker) or my T40 (two underpowered speakers).

I agree that Vista is what you want for a Tablet (ink recognition and tablet integration is very good). 64 bit is nice because it allows you to address 4GB+ of memory and run 64 bit applications, but it may not be required for most people. The problem is that only the 7449-EKU model comes with 64 bit Vista. It is one of the most expensive, and comes with the Touchscreen (which I would recommend against for the reasons above), as well as AT&T WWAN, Turbo memory, 8 cell, 160GB 7200RPM, Cam, Base/DVD±RW. You should know that if you get 32 bit Vista, your key will work for the 64 bit version. However, you will need to acquire a 64 bit Vista install disc, tough to find, and perform a clean install.

For some reason very few of the preconfigure models come with the Intel 5300, and none come with the 5300 and 285nit LED. However, I have the 5100 and it is more than adequate (ABGN, solid range, power efficient). This is common on most of the pre-configured models.

Most of the pre-configured models come with the 1.86GHz processor, 8 cell battery, Bluetooth, modem/5-1 card reader, and the Fingerprint reader. The main thing to look for are the screen and Vista. Everything else is easily adjusted by the end user.

The closest model to what you want is the 7449-84U. This has 4GB RAM, 285 nit LED, 128GB SSD (not sure if SLC or MLC), Ultrabase & DVD±RW, Intel 5100, AT&T WWAN, 8 cell battery, but it comes with XP Tablet PC edition. You can either wait for Windows 7, or see if you can get a copy of Vista for cheap (are you affiliated with a University? Students/faculty can often get MS software for practically nothing).

To get the exact specs you want, you may need to go with a configure to order (7448-CTU like mine) model. However, this tends to be slightly more expensive.

 

Is there another link for the TaBook guide? It's not letting me connect to the page, I think it's the Chinese firewall crap or something. I'll probably just get Screen two, as the SSD is really what matters SLC or not.

 

Lenovo Service and Support Training

Look under PSREF.

 

I don't know what you mean by "Screen two". If you provide me with the type number, I can copy and paste the details from the Tabook into this forum. I would attach it, but I am limited to 1.47MB for PDF and the Tabook is 3.30MB (compression doesn't help enough either, and Foxit won't let me delete the other 150 pages).

 

I did some looking over the last 24 hours and found some interesting news about SSDs. It appears that MLC drives are finally starting to catch up with SLC drives and available at pretty reasonable prices.

The G.Skill FM-25S2 2.5-inch Solid State Disk ( Review) seems to be the best value in Solid State Discs right now. It provides superior read performance to the SLC Samsung/OCZ/G-Skill 64GB SSD that was originally offered in the x300. It also offers very similar (albeit slightly lower) write throughput. Access time is very good on both reads and writes and it seems like a fantastic overall performer in both synthetic and real world tests.

The best news however is price.

The 64GB Samsung SLC drive (shipped with x300) is still selling at $550. Rebadged units from OCZ, G-Skill and others are available, but the price is comparably high.

The G.Skill FM-25S2-128GB 2.5-inch Solid State Disk is available in both 64GB and 128GB capacities. You can get the 64GB drive for $152. And the 128 GB drive for $278.

This drive seems to be on par with the Intel X25-M MLC SSD ( $621 was considered to be the best MLC) for performance and is far far cheaper. This option should let you get an x200 Tablet with a bare drive, pop in a quality 64GB SSD and still be in your target price range.

 

Holy crap dude nice find.
That drive is crazy, I hope they can keep the supply up for that thing wow.
I'm not buying for a month now my BillmeLAter account isnt working or something so I can't buy the laptop until I get my christmas bonus
Oh well..
Hopefully the price will go down after thanksgiving.
I notices last week Lenovo raised the price of the X200 by $50....

 

Ya but remember they also dropped the x200 a lot from initial launch price

 

Hey Jon,

Since you've had your tablet for some time now, can you comment on how long does the 8 cell battery life last on a single charge? Thanks!

 

It is being a bit intermittent. Some times, it can get down below 7 watts with reasonable settings (slow processor, 6/15 brightness, wi-fi on). This equates to 9+ hours.

Other times, with the same settings, I can't get it to stay below 11 watts. This equates to only about 6 hours.

I have also found inking to use approximately 2 watts. When the pen is within 0.5", the power usage spikes, but it drops as soon as the pen moves away. I think this is normal behavior because it is an active digitizer, and the screen must power the pen through induction.

It is also important that the 8 cell battery in the x200 Tablet is of a slightly inferior technology to the 6/9 cell on the x200/x200s. The 8 cell on the x200 Tablet is similar to the one on the x61 and is rated at 66 WHr design (mine still reports ≈70WHr) or 8.25 WHr per cell. The 9 cell in the x200/x200s is rated at 84 Whr or 9.33 WHr per cell. This is why the tablet gets less battery life than the x200s (they are otherwise comparable spec wise [low voltage C2D, LED screen, etc.]). However, I would gladly trade this reduced power per cell for the better balance (no lift in rear, rubberized underside) of the battery on the x200 Tablet.

In either case it is adequate, but the inconsistency is a little bothersome. I think it might just need a bit more time to stabilize, because it certainly is possible for it to operate at under 7 watts (I have even seen it drop to 5.5 watts with minimal settings).

 

I did a search and read on the G.Skill forum that these still have the Jmicron controller which has been reported to have bad stuttering problems. Have you considered this?

 

I wasn't aware that this drive had the Jmicron controller. I do know that many of the early MLC drives were bad (especially with simultaneous random writes) because of the controller.

However, the benchmarks for this drive (real world and synthetic) seem very good. This is compared to both the top reference SLC drive (faster for reads, marginally slower for writes), and much better than the earlier MLC drives (reads faster, writes were much much faster). So maybe there was something else wrong with the early MLC drives (OCZ core, Crucial, etc.).

If simultaneous random writes (particularly of small files) are your top priority, you are still best with a SLC drive. However, this drive seems very good, is a solid performer, and a terrific bargain.

 

Here is the thread that I found where G.Skill confirms that they use the jmicron controller in the FM-25S2 drives:

http://gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?p=902#post902

You might want to read this excellent AnandTech article if you haven't already, particularly the section where they talk about the jmicron controller and its nasty effects on real world performance:

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=3403&p=8

It is possible that the these new drives from G.Skill don't have stuttering problems but my understanding is that this is unlikely. If they don't, the pricepoint of $152/64GB means that this is the first problem-free SSD in my price range. That would be great news! I'll anxiously await some Anandtech style test results.

 

As the weeks fly past us I'm still wondering whether Lenovo gets their act together and designs a LED-backlit display with webcam or not. Any of you guys have an idea?

 

I wouldn't expect a webcam on the x200s LED anytime soon (maybe on the x201s, but I wouldn't hold your breath). If you want a webcam and LED in a small package you can either get the x200 Tablet, x300, or x301. All of them feature webcams, WWAN, and LED. However, they are slightly heavier and use inferior batteries (less WHr) than the x200s.