Grab a 650m model cheap or opt for 750m?

What is your thoughts on the 650m vs 750m? From what I read, theyre the same cards, just different clocks is it worth it to pay a premium for the 750m?

 

It dependa how much is the diference ?

 

Around $200

 

750m sli is around $1100+ in lenovo right now. so if you can get the 650m sli at $900 then that would be a great deal! is it used? an open box?

i think they're basically the same chip. based on reports, they have pretty much the same clock per temp. 750m runs faster but also hotter. you can also overclock 650m to 750m range and also get the same temp as 750m. if your up to oc'ing then your good with 650m. i also read that 750m reached above 5000 3dmark11, which i never seen from a 650m. but also keep in mind that it's just a benchmark, not real time gaming. temps could have already reached the threshold. it would be a bad idea gaming for a couple of hours in those temps.

in short, if the 650m is really $200 cheaper, then go for it!

 

I would go for 750M SLi. The 750M performs much better then the 650M + there is no new updates on the drivers for the new cards. Everyone keeps saying, if you overclock the 650M it reaches at the same performance as 750M, what if you overclock the 750M, at what performance is 650M reaching the 750M?

I see big improvement of a single 750M over the 650M during gaming. I run all the games at max resolution with 750M (1366X768) which was not the case for the 650M. And I have never seen this card going above 71-72 degrees after hours of use... But if you take a break of 5 minutes, everything cools back down and start all over...

You guys should compare the 750M with GTX660M and not 650M... No offence please.

 

The diference is something to considerate, but remember if you are a high profile gamer then go for the 750m and spend those $200 ( tax?) , if you are a gamer but not that gamer ( playing only like 3 games ) then go for the 650m,i am an ocasional gamer that only have 3 games instaled on this laptop and i have no complaints at all on the 650 version.
(i would get the 650 and then get an SSD)

 

you are absolutely wrong my friend. both have same chipsets. and 750m is overvolted and overclocked as well and it doesn't got any thing new. its just rebranded gtx660m which based on GK-107 kepler chip.
And 750m got already overclocked. Which the same chip belongs to 650m family. you cant overclock further more 650m's limits(yes 750m has same limits or a bit more due to extra voltage)
if 650m overvolted to 750m voltages then you may not see any differences.
lenovo took a wise decision of replacing 650m with 750m.
u can avoid overclocking. u can enjoy even with your stock bios(not unlocked bios and overclocking stuff)

 

It is kind of confusing what you are trying to explain, there is a lot of contradiction in your comments + the English is not that good. Anyway, bottom line is that 750 is much better and I would go for what is new. I had the 650M and I tried to overclock it like crazy, it could never be at the performance of the 750M. On paper doesn't look at much difference at all, but in reality it makes sense what I am talking about if you experienced both GPU's performance.

Have a look here http://www.geforce.com/hardware/notebook-gpus/geforce-gt-750m/description

NVIDIA Kepler™ architecture - up to 75% faster than the previous generation.2

2 - Game performance in Crysis 2: GeForce GT 650M vs. GeForce GT 750M.

 

Do u really think its 75% faster..omg thats just insane bro
Hey! no dude there is no any contradiction against you.
And what happened to my english?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

 

Kepler is 75% faster than Fermi, I believe is what they mean. No way is a 750m 75% faster than a 650m. That's crazy talk.

 

No, that is called marketing. I am not saying that the 750m is 75% faster, is just much better than the predecessor and for me if there was an issue with the cost at the moment, I would have simply got the single 750M and later I would have upgraded to the SLi model. The only problem is that later you will pay a little more to get the 170w power adapter as well. You are looking at a $300 expense when you get the additional card + the adapter (probably about 10% less if you speak to a rep.).

 

when overclocking, you should also consider temps, it's also about balancing performance vs temps. 750m is an automatic overclocked 650m that's why it's hotter and faster. thus what they say 75% increase, and i say it's pretty exaggerated lol. then they also forgot to mention the 75% increase in temps. if you overclock it further, that would mean further increase in temps. and if you have very good ambient temps like very cold room with ac and also have a very good cooling pad, then good for you and go for 750m. overclock it past 650m limits and you win the 650m vs 750m battle. if not, then just put that at a right temperature, your comfortable with, around the same as an overclocked 650m and they're still the same.

 

Dont feed the troll , i
think we got a new tech fanboy here bro.

 

I know this is a little off topic but if i already had a y500 with a 650 could i buy the 750 ultrabay and sli them or do i have to find a 650?! thxs!

 

Gotta find the 650

 

Gotta defend dronelbeau on this one. I have to admit his posting was a little hard to read from a purely grammatical standpoint, but the facts he was presenting are perfectly sound. He is NOT a troll.

That press release linked above by user Juliant has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with ANYTHING WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE. That's purely marketing material. And not even pertinent marketing material at that.

Use this instead to get a better picture for the 750m: NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M - NotebookCheck.net Tech
Then, use this to get a better picture for the 650m: NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M - NotebookCheck.net Tech

Do you see any similarities? How about chip architecture, or shader count, or memory bandwidth, or die size? What?! You mean they're the SAME?!?!? HOW CAN THIS BE?!

This is one of those cases where all of you picking on dronelbeau just have to swallow your pride a bit and concede that you are WRONG (at least in using that article/press release as evidence of 750m's performance over the 650m). The 650m IS a kepler card, and in fact based on the same GK107 chip as the 750m. What does this mean? Given that the 750m's overall shader count and memory bandwidth are the same as the 650m's, ostensibly any gains in performance are limited to increasing clockspeed or voltage (to, again, increase stable clockspeed). When people OC and see artifacting, it usually means the chip isn't supplied enough power to run at that frequency. If you increase the voltage, you can increase the frequency, at least until you physically fry your card. This is probably why Nvidia locks down most laptop's cards' ability to overvolt, but not overclock. So what dronelbeau's saying is that you MAY not even be able to OC your 750m quite that much higher than a 650m. That's all.

In fact you can probably directly compare clock speeds between the 650m/660m/750m, given that the stock 650m's runs at 790Mhz, the 660m's 835Mhz, and finally the 750m's 964Mhz. (I have my two 650'm running at 1110Mhz with no problems, so I'd imagine it's quite a bit faster than a stock 750m)

So, tl;dr: dronelbeau is not a troll, & the rest of you in this thread need to do better research before weighing in on something you clearly don't understand.

Sorry for being preachy, but I read dronelbeau's post and was like, "yeah this guy get's it let's start comparing clocks and having fun being nerds benchmarking stuff" only to see other idiots put him down as a troll. F***ing hate that.

 

Why don't you simple get lost and stop insulting everyone on this forum!!! You have to get 'practically' the hold of both the cards and while using them on similar games and applications, then you should come and comment about it. I have used both cards and standard clocks or overclocked and I can SEE the difference between the two GPU noticeable. I think you are more of a troll then anyone on this forum with your language. Please try to measure your words before talking about something...

Remember, we are not here to defend or insult anybody, we are here to help each other.

 

I was calling banini an idiot, not you btw. But I do apologize for the heated tone, I just didn't like how bronelbeau was disregarded as a troll and completely glossed over even though he made some pretty valid points.
Also as far as the topic at hand, I'm merely trying to have an intelligent conversation, which is why I provided links to try to prove my points. Your article about Keplers advancements over Fermi really don't hold any weight and don't apply here. I apologize for the brash way I said that at first. Also, out of curiosity when you tested the 650m do you happen to remember what clockspeed you OC'ed to? If we can assume clockspeeds are directly comparable due to the same die size/architecture
(and that's the big caveat right?) then any 650m clocked lower than 964Mhz is going to feel worse than a stock 750m, for sure.

BTW- heres arstechnica's take on it: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/04/meet-nvidias-geforce-700m-gpus-same-as-the-geforce-600m-gpus/

 

The biggest benefit I'm seeing of owning the 650M SLI system as opposed to the 750M one is that the GPU temperatures are lower at identical clocks due to the lower voltage. I've got mine running well past stock 750M SLI performance and it is 100% stable 24/7 and neither GPU exceeds 75C in my most demanding games. From what others have written the 750M SLI max temp starts above 75C and only goes up from there as you OC. Maybe I lucked out on mine though since not every machine overclocks so well. So the comments about the 750M being so much better than the 650M are just poppycock and BS and I have the proof right here.

And trust me you won't be able to OC the 750M by the same amount as you can with the 650M because a lot of the headroom on the 750M has already been used up and you will run into the thermal barrier. I would love to see any 750M SLI owner achieve +350-400 MHz on the core and +400-500 MHz on the memory but that ain't happening. A owner already reported on T|I that his Ultrabay 750M reached almost 100C with a moderate OC even after repasting. And let's not forget that due to the inadequate cooling system the CPU will heat up along with the GPU so you may have to throttle back the CPU to prevent thermal shutdown if you are overclocking the 750M.

At the end of the day, if you can OC the 750M past what an OC'ed 650M can do, then sure, you will get some modest performance gains. But in my opinion it's not worth a large difference in price and certainly not worth the tradeoff in extra heat if you are already experiencing thermal issues. I got my system for $200 less than what a comparable 750M SLI costs and see no need to upgrade.

And this is directed @juliant you can act smug about your 750M system all you want but there's no need feign incomprehension or make fun of someone's English skills if it's not his native language. You're Canadian for crying out loud so you've got no right to do that. I understood the man perfectly fine and if you can't maybe you need to get out more or something.

 

^^^ How much you guys defend yourselves because you do not have your 750M / 750M SLi in your systems. You can read it between your lines

 

Max voltage on the 750M is more or less 100 mV (0.1 V) higher than the 650M, which I believe is similar to what most 660M's have.

 

And you on the other hand like to rub in the fact that you do? Go ahead, keep shouting it from the mountaintops.

Stay classy juliant.

 

dude juliant of course! I got my 650m Y500 and was excited, only to see the newer one with 750m's come out like a month or two later. There's absolutely no question there. I'm totally jealous!

But does that mean that we can't question Nvidia's marketing strategies or even just get a clearer picture as to HOW much faster the 750m is than the 650m? hardly. You're the one stifling intelligent conversation here friend.

 

octiceps, you on the other hand... you ight. You get it. You totally get it. Let's be friends

quick question for you, have you noticed that when you have SLI enabled on this machine that you'll see the in-game menu from the last played game when you fire up the game you want to play? Jesus that made no sense. Hopefully it rings a bell with you haha

 

Guys, enough fighting lets keep this civil and not personal.

 

If you have the money for 750m sli, may better off opt for single card machines.

 

Haha! Nice!

 

I was telling troll to Juliant, i was supporting dragon argument... nice one there budy. Thanks for insulting me for nothing.

 

Well here you go. This should dispel any notions that the 750M is faster than the 650M at identical clock speeds or whatever else people are suggesting. They're the exact same thing just with different voltages and clock speeds. So if you've got a 650M running at 1058/2500 or whatever the 750M is at stock then you have the performance of the newer part. And to go even further once you flash the 650M vBIOS with the 750M vBIOS to gain that extra 100 mV of voltage difference they're completely identical. So please don't spew any more BS about the 750M being vastly superior as if it's on a whole new architecture or something.

My 650M SLI OC. Actual speed is 1125/2250 because the core speed reporting is off by 45 MHz.


3DMark 11. Go ahead and check the stock 750M SLI scores on this forum and you'll see that this is higher despite the lower clocked memory. Pretty funny that the histogram is showing my score to be in the top 10 (or is that the 90th percentile?) for similar systems and I'm only using my 24/7 stable OC which is lower than what I could bench at. I think if I push my core to around 1200 MHz I could nab one of those top spots.


And some Unigine Heaven and Metro 2033 Benchmark scores for good measure. Every possible setting maxed out.


I've found that when using SLI increasing the memory clock and memory bandwidth does very little to improve performance even when you're delibrately trying to stress it such as applying extreme levels of anti-aliasing at native resolution. Performance seems very much limited by the core speed in my situation and law of diminishing returns is kicking in as far as VRAM is concerned. Obviously, if you've got the single GPU then VRAM overclocking will be more important as you are effectively operating at half the memory bandwidth and bus width. I got a 25% boost in Unigine with the core overclock and only a 5% on top of that with the VRAM OC, and 0% if I kept the core at stock.

 

Wow I can't believe how some people are speaking to others over a graphics card. What you have to remember is not all silicone is equal. So someone may have had a poor quality 650m which wouldnt overclock very well then got a higher clocked 750m and would obviously notice a difference. On the other hand you could get an average 750m but a high quality 650m and both would reach the same OC on their stock voltages and would from my understanding have the same performance (but may have different temperatures depending on voltages). Unless there are some unpublished architecture changes these chips will perform the same when clocked the same.

My card isn't directly comparable as it only has DDR3 memory but here is my experience with different voltages. As soon as I got my laptop I flashed a custom unlocked bios with more voltage to the 650M GPU and reached a core of 1350mhz Core and 1160mhz memory. I found my temps were getting into the mid 80C's on the GPU and even experienced a couple of shut downs. Below is my 3D Mark 11 score P3180:
NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7-3720QM Processor,CLEVO CO. W110ER score: P3180 3DMarks

For me those temps were too high so I then flashed a Bios to under volt the GPU and reached Core 1150mhz and Memory 1140mhz with a 3D Mark 11 score of P2752. The main difference was obviously the card wouldn't clock as high but my temps were never going over 70C and I had zero shut downs as well as better battery life. I know the bench mark results look a fair bit lower but there is no discernable difference (to my eyes) in actual games.
NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7-3720QM Processor,CLEVO CO. W110ER score: P2752 3DMarks
So until we see clock for clock benchmarks of 750m vs 650m i'd wager money that like for like cards in the same system are the same GPU core and i'd go for the cheaper system with lower voltages.

Prema is currently working on a vBios for the 650m to flash to a 750m and he says its getting higher memory clocks at pretty much the same UV levels as i'm running now. I'd assume GPU-Z will also see the flashed chip as a 750m.. Good news all round if the only improvements are driver and Bios based!

On a side note to get the 75% increase in Crysis 2 they probably compared a stock clocked 650m DDR3 with old drivers to a new DDR5 750m with newer Crysis 2 optimised drivers. It's very easy to bend numbers to meet marketing requirements without actually lying.