Filing a complaint you have against Lenovo Canada to BBB

As shown in the following thread,
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=209379,
many people are experiencing frustrations, stresses, time and financial losses, et cetera, due to Lenovo Canada incompetency and unprofessionalism.

I'm one of those people and I have file a complaint against Lenovo Canada to BBB. As suggested by a fellow NBR member, I've started up a new thread - explaining how to file a complaint against Lenovo Canada to BBB. It's pretty easy; though, it may seem complex for people who have never filed a complaint to BBB before. The process takes less than 5 minutes.

 

1. Go to http://www.ccbbb.ca/complain.cfm (Canadian Council of BBB; Better Business Bureau in Canada)
2. Click on the complain tab
3. Go to the bottom of the page and click on here.
"If you agree to the above terms and would like to file a complaint click here."
4. A new windows/tab will pop up, depend on your browser settings.
5. Check the following options.
- Canada
- A product or service
- No
Then click on next.
6. Select Canada and enter your postal code, check the box, then click on next.
7. Search by company name seems like the easiest option: put Lenovo in the company name box, then click on next.
8. Check Lenovo (Canada) Inc.
10 York Mills Rd
North York, ON M2P2G7, then click next.
9. Click on next again.
10. Select "no" for all options, then click submit.
11. Complete your personal info, then click on next.
12. Select eiter:
- no address attached, or
- 400-10 York Mills Road North York, ON Main Billing Complaint
13. Select the issues you have with Lenovo Canada, then click on next.
14. Fill out the details, then click on submit.

It takes like 3 minutes, if you already have in mind what to say. Good luck everyone. BBB was able to help me several times now. I also encourage you to write your frustrations to consumer report programs/columns/sections of the Globe and Mail, CBC, CTV, et cetera.

 

Lenovo Canada practices of lying to their customers are unacceptable. Asking the same question, even to the same rep, often gives you different (inconsistent) answers. In my case, I was told by one rep that the laptop I ordered was already in Canada. Then another told me it's still in China. Then, another told me it's in Canada again. Then it's still in China...

The estimation for shipping date is always changing as well, from next week to FEB 11, to now FEB 19. I made a purchase based on the (false) informed est of 1-2 weeks as shown on Lenovo Canada website. Had I known I have to wait this long, would I make this purchase? What about other consumers/customers? Had they known they'd have to wait for a month or more, would they place the order? IMO, I considered these deceitful practices, from lying to bait and switch (the waiting time) to be unacceptable; their immoral and unprofessional actions should be prosecuted.

DISHONESTY is not the way to do business.

If other people have links to/or info about other consumer protection agencies/bureaus, e.g., RCMP (?), please do not hesitate to post them here.

 

Good stuff my friend.
I filed my complain already
dont wanna mention again...
wait more than a month already...........still............=(

 

You know that "est" means "estimated", and "estimated" doesn't mean "it will" arrive.

 

He probably knows, but they should give more realistic waiting times.

 

Of course, however, do you estimate a feather to be 1000lbs? Or do you estimate the earth radius to be 1 mm? From 1 to 2 weeks, into 2 months? Another week, another 2 weeks, more and more delays. And many customers are waiting this long already. So shouldn't they at the very least change the estimation time to 2 months? No, they still give an estimation of 1-2 weeks. Why? Is it because they afraid nobody will purchase from them if they have to wait for 2 months.

I know most people in this forum are Lenovo fanboys. I'm a ThinkPad fan myself. I've got nothing against Lenovo as a whole. But you've got to be realistic and practical; unacceptable practices of lying to the customers are unacceptable - and that's just that. Saying that it was in Canada, then in China, then in transit, then back in Canada, then in China, then...

Don't change the subject here. Deliberately lying to the customers is wrong, no matter how you see it. If you don't know, you just don't know, be HONEST UP FRONT.

At the very least, the customers deserve some HONESTY, don't you think? You have good experiences with Lenovo, good for you. You have the right to defend Lenovo. But you think defending something that is universally accepted as immoral (such as countless lies) is the right thing to do?

Lenovo Canada Customers United.

 

I just called Lenovo Canada to have my ordered cancelled. For the rest of you that still waiting for your orders to arrive, good luck. I sincerely hope you get your orders soon.

However, if you want to make a difference, make your voice heard/matters, you may want to tell BBB what happened. At least they'll have some records/references about some of Lenovo Canada current practices.

Fight for your rights. United we stand.





Peace.




Edit: Please read my reply to ZaZ, he just falsefully accusated me. This is really LOW of him. Maybe, he works for Lenovo?

 

Having your estimated delivery time pushed back a few weeks is not a dishonest business practice and is well within the definition of estimated. Nor is it akin to estimating the weight of a feather to be 1,000 pounds.

You take advantage of a glitch in the system to get a 250GB hard drive for less which means they were probably deluged with orders. Then get out of sorts when a small delay occurs which seems reasonable to me. I think we've reached a new low.

 

Guys, this stuff happens everywhere. It sucks when it affects you, however its a regular thing in the tech world.

For a while I worked as a call center employee. For people who have never done time in a call center, its a whole new world in one of those places. Here are two incidents, and this is just from my experience:

While working on a nationwide dial up ISP tech support contract, they replaced the call record system with a shiny new web based version that was so completely horrible, we literally gave up on it and logged all of out calls on paper "so they could be entered into the system later". Also we were forced to use dedicated DSL lines to operate the system from the central office, and the lines had about enough bandwidth to support 10 people in a call center of 200. All that paperwork got thrown out eventually, weeks of customer concerns, complaints, and promised future concessions flushed away.

Shortly after that I worked as a call escalation rep for the world's top PC manufacturer that may or may not have been DELL. At one point we transistioned from a terminal window based system to GUI. Let me tell you, that terminal window system was AMAZING compared to what they came up with for the GUI. The new GUI system was abolutely mind blowing in its complexity. Die hard geeks and soccer moms we had working there were scratching their heads all day long as it took like 37 steps to do something simple like "Exchange a monitor". One fun thing the system would do is constantly require you to keep inputting customer addresses, then send everything to the wrong address. Piled on top of the complexity, all of the stuff we did would get approved in one of 5 or 6 different places that kept changing, and they would just cancel our work or send it back and forth between the wrong departments for days. Customer returns, exchanges, and new orders (not web orders, but orders we placed from customer service) were failing left and right mainly because the whole thing was so illogical no one could use it. At one point we even found out that employees at the home base were still using the old system since the new one did not work right. Customer service went down the tubes because none of the employees wanted to do ANYTHING for the customer, since they were paid based on having average calls of less than 7 minutes, and it took about 4 minutes just to get to the point where they could start trying to fix any issues...

 

Believe it or not, the term "estimated" when referring to ship time actually means that the number given is an estimate. All CTO systems manufacturers can and do have unexpected delays. Heck, last year some people were waiting almost 2 months to get new Dells shipped to them. The fact remains that if you need a system by XX/XX/XXXX and your life depends on it, you go to the store and you buy one. Period.

EDIT: Some of spellbinders posts are gone now

 

Guys,

Back on topic. If you have a problem with a user, take it to PMs instead of posting it on the forums.

 

Are ThinkPads perfect? No, but I freely admit I am a fan of ThinkPad notebooks. I find them to be well built and serviced notebooks. I am not now nor have I ever been employed by Lenovo/IBM.

I find the whole proposition of this thread that one should file a complaint with the BBB because their order was delayed a few weeks to be absurd regardless of whether there was 250GB hard drive involved or not. I think you are wrong, but that however is not badmouthing you. I live in a democracy where I think I am still entitled to my opinion.

 

Please do not insult/accuse me of something that is not true. I do agree, however, that we've reached a new low - but on whose part, however.

There were no glitches in the system. The system I ordered did not come a 250 GB HD. The order # was 4240002011.

Also, the price I was going to pay Lenovo Canada was $1432.36 CAD. The price from another retailer, directdial.com, was $1581 CAD. I did not exactly get the best deal of the year/century for that matter. Plus, directdial.com did have the 767592U in stock (they still do now), while Lenovo Canada didn't. I thought of saving some money by waiting 1 - 2 weeks.

Please stay on topic, and no personal attacks please.

As the thread title suggested, this thread is for people who wants to find more info about how to file a complaint against BBB for frustrated Lenovo customers. We all know how great the ThinkPads are, myself included. That's why I placed the order for the X61.

 

And I'm entitled to mine. Please stay on topic please and no personal attacks/insults, especially the ones that are not ture. There are pros and cons for many things. We do have appreciation threads.

Everyone is entitled to his/her own opinions. Therefore, I hope you will allow us to file a complaint to BBB, if we see fit. Stay on topic and no personal attack please.

PEACE.

 

I have to agree, that's what I did - picked up the $499 special at BB while I waited almost 2 months for my R. I could have easily sold it for $400 on eBay or Craigs list, but gave it as a gift instead. I think it's exaggerating a bit to say a few week delay on a custom order causes frustration, stress, time and financial loss. You're putting all your eggs in one basket and getting mad when there's a trip-up and they all break.

Not saying that you shouldn't file with the BBB if you want, but things do happen and you have to be prepared. Have you given them a chance to make it right?

 

Thanks Kdawgca.

 

I did, of course.

The frustrations come from the fact that nobody there really knew what was going on with the order. One day a rep told me a laptop it's in Brampton, Ontario, Canada, and ready to be shipped. The next day, I was told it's in China. The next day, I was told it's in Canada...then back in China... If they didn't know where it really was, you think I deserved to be told the truth? Honesty? Instead of getting false hopes/anticipations for nothing. Put yourself in my shoes.

Peace and thanks for keeping the discussion in a mature manner.

BTW, I have exams and papers to write so I may not be able to reply in a while. I hope people will stay on topic and no personal attacks or insults, please.

Lastly, I just want to make it clear, again, that I do think ThinkPads are great notebooks. That's why I place an order for another one. However, products and services are two different categories. If you have good experience with Lenovo Canada C/S, good for you - but please understand people who are not as fortunate.

 

Exactly where did I say you weren't entitled to your opinion?

I am still entitled to mine, that the notion one should file a BBB complaint over a few weeks delay is absurd. As I stated earlier, a few weeks is well within the bounds of estimated. File all the BBB complaints you want, sue them, heck call the police, I couldn't really care less.

 

3 things:

- Lenovo Canada does have poor customer service.
- Nobody seems to be making any personal attacks on spellbinder whatsoever, so please relax.
- spellbinder's few weeks fails in comparison to much worse problems other customers have with Lenovo Canada; those cases truly merit a BBB complaint.

 

Well said. A delay in your order is just a normal part of doing business. However, what Lenovo Canada has been doing in terms fulfilling customer requests has been amazingly inept and more importantly: completely insincere. The fact that reps have flat out lied to customers and that orders have been consistently shipped incomplete (i.e. it seems to be policy to send out a TP with 1gb of ram and make the customer call into to ask for their missing ram) is the basis of a legitimate BBB complaint.

I don't think anybody is complaining about one bad experience with Lenovo Canada, but rather that every exchange we've had with them since they took our order has been sub-par and, I'm sad to say it, deeply insincere.

The BBB's mandate is to monitor untrustworthy businesses and this is the hole Lenovo Canada has dug itself into.

 

The continuous lying part was the part that made me decided to cancel the order. If they had no ideas what was the "actual" status of my order, they should have told me straight upfront - instead of telling me that it's in Canada, China, Canada, China... It worried me because I wasn't even sure if their factory in China had received my order.

 

Look what I've found, turns out someone has linked a few threads in these forums to Lenovo Canada's official Facebook group!

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lenovo-Canada/7449449399?ref=s

 

LOL...I love that bottom part: "Here is some useful information about Lenovo Canada for everyone:".

Seriously, though...I hope the Canadian BBB takes note of this. It's not a good way to run a business.

 

I am posting this to counter what appears some pretty serious accusations.

Firstly, I am not sure that the BBB is going to register a complaint because of a delay in shipping. I know that some BBBs keep track of customer satisfaction ratings and maybe your unhappiness can affect survey results. As to any lies, dishonesty or accusations of being immoral, I think even the BBB would require specifics and the Company's behavior would have to be centered on more than lies about estimated shipping dates. For example, if Lenovo did not cancel the sale and took off with your money, then that would get the BBB's attention.

In any event, your various posts say that Lenovo people are:

Immoral
Criminals [who should be prosecuted]
Liars
Dishonest
Unprofessional
Incompetent

To be sure, my experience with Lenovo has been way different than yours. While I can't speak about the fraudulent or criminal acts you have experienced or suffered, the two times I have called tech support in the past three weeks [to ask questions about my two new Lenovo notebooks] I noted:

1. I got a live person both times to answer my questions. The phone was answered quite quickly.

2. Both tech guys were respectful, patient and helpful. They were both knowledgeable. One acknowledged that the manual should have been more clear on the issue I was calling about [facial recognition password entry.]

3. At the end of the calls they each asked if I was happy with the service and if I obtained the information I was calling about.

4. Lenovo then sent me follow-up e-mails asking to rate the support call I made.

In dealing with Lenovo since they took over IBM, whether it be on the phone, on their website or using their products, my opinion is that the Company is above board, honest and they are trying to do a good job. For sure they are far better than most tech companies I have had to deal with.

Maybe the company has a bad apple or two on the customer service end of the operation who dealt with you, but I have not seen anywhere on the Net where people have said Lenovo is chocked full of con artists who are defrauding customers.

Sorry, this is one satisfied customer who won't be joining your united front against Lenovo.

Just an opinion in counter to yours. As you say... "peace."

 

I'm sure there have been people like you who have had a positive experience in their dealings with Lenovo Canada.

However, as reported in several threads here, many others have had very negative experiences. What you've read in this thread is a reflection of the profound frustration felt by many Lenovo Canada customers. Many of these customers have reported being lied to by Lenovo Canada reps, and I have no reason to doubt their reports. You shouldn't either

Lenovo Canada has had serious problems, which were described in a recent article in a Canadian journal. See http://www.digitaljournal.com/artic..._Uncovers_Nationwide_Internal_Flaws_at_Lenovo.

I have no idea how the BBB will react to the complaints made here. However, as I noted previously in this thread, Lenovo Canada already has an "unsatisfactory record" with at least one BBB in Canada.

Peace

 

Well said.

My post was simply to show that there are experiences such as mine that convey the exact opposite impression than that created in the thread.

Without looking into complaints about Lenovo, it appears from posts that there are some issues, but that also the Company is aware of it and is trying to improve.

For example, I mentioned the follow-up e-mail to me asking how my service situation went. It was a detailed survey and appeared to be done in-house [not by Biz Rate or a company like that.] So this seemed to indicate that Lenovo is 1) aware of the problem; and 2) Taking steps to correct it.

And this is just my opinion having prosecuted consumer fraud cases, here in the U.S. the BBB is the least effective place to register complaints. Part of the problem is that the BBB is somewhat outdated. Moreover, a merchant can join BBB and get a nice plaque, all for a fee. BBB has thus been accused over the years of changing negative ratings to positive if the business complained about is a member of the BBB.

His better bet would be to write to the President of the Company and each VP in charge of operations, marketing and sales. His e-mail should not be in the tone nor contain the personal attacks contained in this thread.

He should outline the history [being brief] and propose a solution.

In all the situations where I have seen that done [communicating with the bosses] the customer has received an apology and remedy. The only time I have not seen that done is if the company was in fact filled with lazy, incompetent personnel or if it is manned by people who don't care about the customer and who are out just to make a sale.

The real power that SpellBinder has is to post on blogs like this, but to post in a brief, mature, reasonable and intelligent manner. That is what companies fear the most, that they are badmouthed on the Net, that word can spread like wildfire and that they can't correct the problem in time to save the company.

Take Sprint, for example. For years they had an attitude of "take it or leave it" when dealing with customers. They were rude to customers and pretty much acted like they were doing people a favor by letting them be a customer.

Well Sprint horror stories spread on the Net like 1000 wildfires burning at the same time. Now, in 2007-2008 Sprint is losing customers and laying off employees. And the worst? Even the most uninformed has heard that they should avoid Sprint.

Lenovo strikes me as a company that cares and is trying to correct what has been a problem within the Company. After my two experiences with their tech support I was left with a very positive impression of the company. [And I love their new computer line.] But like I said before, I cannot speak to the negatives others have suffered.

If you are unhappy, contact Lenovo's President and vice presidents. With the Internet and e-mail it is very easy to do. And remember, the best way to obtain a great result is to be polite, respectful and to simply lay out your problem and what you want [be reasonable, don't say "And I want a free notebook." Leave it up to the President to decide what freebie he or she will toss in.]

Above all else, don't point Lenovo execs to this thread and don't call them immoral, criminals nor opine that they should be prosecuted. When talking like that they tune you out and get on the defensive. If that happens you might have gotten their ear for a few moments, but not a remedy. Besides, it sounds like they know they have to improve customer service.

 

I should make clear to everyone that Lenovo Canada does not state that 1-2 weeks is an estimate anywhere on their website.

@wrighton

I'm not sure if you think MichaelSF was talking about his experience with Lenovo Canada. He is from the US.

Also, While we are on the topic of unsatisfactory status with the BBB, did you know that Lenovo USA was #1 for complaints last year?

http://triangle.bizjournals.com/triangle/stories/2007/10/15/story2.html

@MichaelSF

It is clear you have not been dealing with Lenovo CANADA. They DON'T care. I would absolutely LOVE to email the people in charge, please feel free to send me their email addresses. Actually, better yet, just find me the names of the president/vp of Lenovo CANADA. I've already tried, it's impossible for a reason.

Here was my last conversation with CS:

I spoke to Andrew who took my order number and put me on hold. He said that my order is in the brampton warehouse and was ready to be shipped out but had not yet so there was no tracking number. He said it should arrive in less then 7 business days. Good enough.

Seconds later, I called back and talked to Chris. He told me that the system had a "minor virus" and it was preventing them from getting order status.

Andrew had absolutely no idea where my order was. He just made random **** up.
=

Also what kind of company knowingly ships your order incomplete, missing ram, and leaves the onus on you to contact them about it. This is very common for Canadian orders (at least for a while now) and if you are not tech savvy, you are SOL. That seems kind of sketchy to me and would probably be exactly the sort of thing the BBB is interested in.

 

His name is Peter Mockler. You can find this in the Digital Journal article posted in the Article: Deep Problems at Lenovo Canada thread or on the Lenovo Canada site here: Press Release at Lenovo Canada

I find that more than mildly entertaining. You have to give that guy points for creativity.

I personally think people are getting too melodramatic over all this. It is bad but it is not that bad.

 

I had in fact believed he was writing about his experience with Lenovo Canada. I wonder now why he even felt a need to comment (unless it was to give us unnecessary lessons in courtesy).

You've done good research to come up with the article on Lenovo's leadership position in attracting complaints to the U.S. BBB. I suspect these kinds of problems will soon be showing up in Consumer Reports and other magazine surveys on customer satisfaction and support.

BTW, I've pretty much decided not to buy a T61P because of these problems at Lenovo Canada.

 

Uh, know your facts before you deride. My calls to Lenovo were to Canada [I asked both times where I was calling to since the calls were in the late hour. Not sure, but I thought he said Toronto, but could be wrong on the city.]

Guess it's you who needs lessons in courtesy. Typical, the people who need help are the ones who don't think they need it.

Cracks me up people who support others who emotionally toss out words like "fraud" "criminals" and "should be prosecuted."

And good call, don't buy a Lenovo computer. I am am not sure why you "felt a need to comment" since you are not buying one.

 

Sorry if I made a mistake about whether you were in touch with Lenovo Canada. Someone else had written that you weren't and I took them at their word.

At the time of writing (which was some months ago), there was a lot of evidence that Lenovo Canada was having a lot of difficulties with its website and in providing customer support. As a result of this evidence, I was disillusioned and had pretty much decided not to buy from Lenovo, even though its systems met my criteria better than those of any other brands. I'm surprised you believe I shouldn't, therefore, have commented. And, by the way, I never used words such as "fraud" or "criminal," as you know very well.

Since then, I believe the situation has improved. At least, there seem to be fewer complaints. As a consequence, I ended up buying a T61P.

Even then, it was not all smooth sailing, as I've reported elsewhere on this forum. Because of an error in the online configurator, I had real difficulties getting Lenovo to honour my warranty/support package. Thanks to Mark_Lenovo and an excellent customer complaint advocate, Lenovo now recognizes the package.

I'm more or less a happy camper. But unlike you, I'm not inclined to sneer at people who have genuine complaints.

 

Amazing! ... I thought I was the only one with a Lenovo horror story at first ... looks like it's an ongoing thing ....

check out this nightmare >> http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=311022

 

I understand that the estimated ship date is an "estimate" and there can be "unexpected" delays. However, if there has been consistent delays for over a month and the website and customer service is still quoting a 1-2 week shipping estimate how is this legitimate?

Estimated ship date may be just an estimate... but since when is a daily occurence "unexpected".