Does your T61p freeze? (esp. if w/ Penryn, 2-slot RAM)

I am considering very seriously to buy a 15'' T61p, but there's one glitch that haunts me (and haunts this forums).

It is said, that T61p tend to freeze/hang, especially with 2-slot RAM (e.g. 4GB), and especially in games.

I wonder whether that is still a problem - especially in the newer ThinkPads with Penryn processors (T9300, etc.).

I would really appreciate if you share your experiences. Please, be specific about your basic hardware configuration, RAM and processor in particular.

Thank you.

 

I bought mine about 19 days ago and it has this issue.

T9300
Quadro FX 570M
Had 2gb (2 x 1gb) RAM, but now I'm using 2gb (1 x 2gb) RAM.

With 2 dimms occupied my games shutdown the machine as if the power went out. With 1 dimm everything seems fine and I've never had a crash beside the occasional Windows induced freeze/crash.

Besides this issue the machine is as perfect as it gets for me.

 

got my t61p 3 weeks ago, have 3gb ram, never had any freeze crash issues. That said if I tip the machine while I'm playing a game ( or doing anything ) the HDD will freeze up due to the shock protection. I think that is correct behavior.

 

Never freezes or crashes for me. I think as long as you clean install, you should be relatively fine.

 

I play games all the time and have had zero crashes/freeze ups.

 

Running Linux, it doesn't.

 

(copied from Lenovo forums post I made)

Just thought I'd throw in my $0.02 here, I've had my T61p for about a week now and I've been testing games extensivly (at least thats my excuse ) to make sure I don't have any problems, and I'm happy to report I've had none so far! Maybe the factory has resolved the issue and you guys got a bad batch but so far atleast I haven't encountered any errors aside from my own BMAK (Between Monitor and Keyboard) errors.

Just for reference my specs:
2.5 gHz processor
3gb ram (2 dimms)
160gb HDD

And the games I've tested so far:
WoW
Bioshock
Orange Box (Atleast and hour of play, and more than 10 seperate startups and plays)
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
Oblivoin (Having some chashing errors, but it seems unrelated)
Batllefield 2

I've also run a number of stress tests on 3dmark06 and 05 before I installed extra ram, after, and after I tried the modded drivers and passed all with flying colors.

Hope that helps, :/. It seems to me that most users aren't getting issues, but occasionally a bad one gets out and it really sucks for whoever gets it.

 

Ran XP with 3GB Switch and it froze while running 3DMark06. This realliy isn't a problem since it was expected. I later found out that the 3GB Switch set up only works well with applications that are coded to optimize the extra RAM.


I have 2x2GB and did see an increase in FPS and slight score increase on 3DMark06.


XP operating system is faster with 4GB of RAM.


No freezing for me.

 

2x2GB here, no freezing.

 

Kurochi, can you tell us where to download the modded NVS 570 drivers for 32-bit vista?

 

This is a hardware issue that has been extensively discussed here. I had the same problem, and the only solution so far is to ship your ThinkPad back to Lenovo and have them replace your motherboard.

 

No freezes. 4GB RAM factory installed. Vista 64 Ultimate and 4 Virtal PCs.

 

It's nice to know most people got good machines. But it sure does make me feel unlucky.

I just bought mine 20 days ago and it has this issue. Aside from Hackez I really must be one of the most unluckiest people when it comes to getting a working machine. I had to return 2 machines before this one. Believe it or not this machine is the best despite the graphics issue. The first machine (Dell XPS M1530) had a defective screen. The second one (a Compal JFL92) seems to have had a defective hard drive. Now this one (T61p) sounds like it has a defective Motherboard.

The motherboard issue actually sounds like the most serious... but I didn't try to return it because I'm just so tired of having to return latops already. At least it works perfectly well with 1 Dimm....

 

All: Thank you kindly for your responses. I must say I am surprised in how many cases this issue does NOT happen. I just wonder whether you have tested your machines in graphically-demanding applications, because that's when it happens. A demanding computer game + 2-slot RAM is thought to be a recipe for a freeze.

Anyways, Lenovo have admitted to this problem, supposedly they have a solution and will release it soon. I just don't know whether it will effortlessly apply to existing laptops (say, via BIOS update), or does it require meddling with hardware (i.e. either you take your laptop to service or you're lucky to be buying a new one after the fix is applied @ factory).

 

That is the good thing about this issue. Lenovo is aware of it and the latest news is that they know why it happens and are working on a fix. Mark_Lenovo said they might be able to have more official news later next week.

I would not hesitate purchasing a T61p because of this issue. If I were looking for another notebook I'd buy the T61p again if it still has the deep discounts it has now.

For reproducing the issue I don't think it really matters how demanding the 3D application is. For example World of Warcraft is not that demanding 3D wise (it is RAM wise). Plus some people's machines crash when running 3DMark06, some don't. Some crash running PC Doctor 5, some don't. Almost all that I've heard about do crash with Bioshock and WoW. Having 2Dimms occupied seems like the only common factor.

 

Can you describe the freezing issue? I think my T61 with the 9300 processor and 4GB ram but don't play games, but I do notice a huge delay in opening programs and using IE.

 

IE is annoyingly slow to open for me too. Every other program that I have runs flawlessly. Firefox B4, MS office, Trillian, Adobe Rdr. all open instantaneously and work flawlessly for me. Something wrong with IE, or is there an issue with our Thinkpads?

 

webdtc, thanks, you're right, 3DMarks also triggered this problem, although in my opinion other things, like PC Doctor 5, could possibly have other causes.

Still, I am hesitating to buy a T61p because if fixing this problem requires taking your laptop to service (say, to replace motherboard), this would put me in a very bad position, because here in Poland Lenovo customer / tech service has a terrible reputation. I just don't want to be forced to deal with them, I need everything to work just right.

nytoy, a slowing system is not what we call a freeze. A freeze (or a hang) is when your computer stops responding completely and you need to restart it.

 

Axure, I've heard about the poor Lenovo support in Poland. Lenovo really needs to work on their support and warranty services. Overall I've heard sending your machine into the depot is dreadful. I'm hoping the fix will be a BIOS update.

My T61p's IE opens slow as well. I read somewhere it has something to do with on of the Thinkvantage security software. I don't really mind it though since once it is opened it is fine and I use Firefox mostly. With Vista you don't even need to open IE for Windows Update anymore, which is good. But this is all a totally different issue than the one being discussed in this post.

 

I'm running dual channel 2x2GB. Maby the problem only happens with mix matched ram??? Or when attempting to run the 3GB switch.

 

I'm watching this discussion closely because the T61P is on the short list of systems I'm considering. I'd like a computer that can handle gaming, but would primarily be used for writing term papers and the like. From what I've read, the Thinkpad keyboards are unmatched. However, having just gone through customer service hell because of a Dell that didn't meet expectations (grainy Samsung screen), I'd rather not do a repeat with Lenovo.

I looked at the Lenovo-sponsored forum regarding this shut-down problem and didn't see any posts indicating success. One anticipating success, but no confirmation

 

Right now is a great time to buy. Great pricing.
IMO you couldn't go wrong. Get a good price and lock in a
equote for price protection for 21 days. Can't go wrong IMO.

 

People have seen success. However the only ones that have gotten this issue fixed are the ones who sent theirs in to the depot and got a motherboard replacement. Currently that is the only confirmed fix for the issue. There are a couple who did this but got theirs back unfixed as well due to Lenovo's reportedly poor depot service. This also probably has something to do with the fact that early on Lenovo did not know what was wrong so did not know how to fix the broken machines. But, seems they are more knowledgeable about the issue now.

Sorry to say and hard to believe but it seems like Lenovo's customer service is as bad or worse than Dell's.

But, I agree with SonDa5, the T61 is a great machine. I prefer it to the M1530 which would also be a great machine if they used good lcds.

 

I priced out a nicely spec'ed system at just under $1500... penryn 9300, 200 GB 7200 HD, BT, Vista Business 64, DVD writer, upgraded wireless, you name it. Between the St. Patrick's day sale and using the USPTHRESHOLD coupon code, I would save over $870. Are there any other discounts that I'm missing? I'm not greedy, but what the heck. I'm a starving college student again

 

If you're in the US and use a Visa card:

www.lenovo.com/shop/deals/visa

I always check out that site to see if it gives better discounts. There's a coupon code on the right side of the Visa branded homepage plus a small discount for going through that site. That's on top of the current 25% promo going on.

 

That's funny... I had just found that link in another thread. It looks like you it won't let you combine the Visa discount with the coupon. So the coupon and St Paddy are a slightly better deal. Thanks for the info anyway!

 

Really? Through the Visa site I can get:

25% Lenovo discount
5% Visa discount
10% Visa coupon discount

Yeah, you can't use the normal USPTHRESHOLD coupon on the Visa site but on the Visa branded Lenovo home page there is another coupon for up to 16% off (for T61 I think it's 10%).

How much does the USPTHRESHOLD give?

 

I think 20%, but I'll go back and make sure I configured the system the same way both times (sounds dumb, but I've been pricing a LOT of computers).

Here is what I put in through the VISA site:

ThinkPad T61 15 Widescreen - 1 Yr Depot Warranty
Edit
Ships within 2-3 weeks** $1,515.64 $1,515.64

Intel® Core™ 2 Duo processor T9300 (2.5GHz 800MHz 6MBL2)[1]
Genuine Windows Vista Business 64[12]
15.4 WSXGA+ TFT
NVIDIA Quadro FX 570M (256MB Open GL)
2 GB PC2-5300 DDR2 SDRAM 667MHz SODIMM Memory (1 DIMM)[8]
UltraNav (TrackPoint and TouchPad)
200GB Hard Disk Drive, 7200rpm with Disk Encryption[4]
DVD Recordable 8x Max Dual Layer, Ultrabay Slim[5]
Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN (supporting Centrino Pro)[10]
Integrated Bluetooth PAN
9 cell Li-Ion Battery[60]
6459: Express - 1 Yr Depot Warranty

It shows a total savings of $747.36.

 

20% is the better deal

 

Okay, with USPTHRESHOLD on the following system:

ThinkPad T61 15 Widescreen - 1 Yr Depot Warranty
Edit
Ships within 2-3 weeks** $1,527.52 $1,527.52

Intel® Core™ 2 Duo processor T9300 (2.5GHz 800MHz 6MBL2)[1]
Genuine Windows Vista Business 64[12]
15.4 WSXGA+ TFT
NVIDIA Quadro FX 570M (256MB Open GL)
2 GB PC2-5300 DDR2 SDRAM 667MHz SODIMM Memory (1 DIMM)[8]
UltraNav (TrackPoint and TouchPad)
200GB Hard Disk Drive, 7200rpm with Disk Encryption[4]
DVD Recordable 8x Max Dual Layer, Ultrabay Slim[5]
Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN (supporting Centrino Pro)[10]
Integrated Bluetooth PAN
9 cell Li-Ion Battery[60]
6459: Express - 1 Yr Depot Warranty

It's actually a slightly worse deal. Good call on the Visa link! Thanks webdtc.

 

Ahem, aren't we getting a little off-topic guys?

It's interesting that everyone has the same problem with IE. I use Opera now too, but even that from a dead load is slow to come up. Hmmm... Should I try switching back down to 3 physical GB of ram vs. 4???

 

I can't believe all the people in the same boat as me. I am also waiting to see if this T61p issue will pan out any time soon. Depot service seems bad and it looks like this fix might require a motherboard replacement. If this is a motherboard problem I just hope Lenovo is able to identify the defective ones and pull them from the assembly line so no new machines get assembled with this board. Also I still have not heard from anyone if this affects all T61s or just the T61p with the 570 Quadro. This just sucks sitting here lucky enough to have money and having found the machine I want and not being able to buy it. Just waiting and waiting and waiting.......

Also from what I have read Dell has a more flexible return policy. I have read so many threads with the "grainy" screen problem but in all the cases the people were able to get the monitor swapped out. Some people have had 3 or 4 swaps. That is at least pretty good.

nytoy - Your issue is completely separate. The issue that we are talking about it running a T61 with both slots of memory filled with RAM(any size) and running GPU intensive apps(ex: games, PCDoctor etc) which causes the machine to just shut off, BSOD or freeze. I would suggest you follow the clean install guide on this site by stallen and get rid of any useless processes on your machine.

 

Ha! Maybe current problems with T61p are precisely the reason for those generous discounts? I mean, if fixing this problem requires changing the motherboard, and they still have to introduce this fix into the factories, albeit in very near future (as they have only figured out the solution very recenlty), then they must be having tons of faulty T61p to get rid of!

On a side note, if first pieces of fixed T61p will start leaving factories in, say, two weeks, and transport to Europe takes 4 weeks, then the nearest date when I can buy my T61p is in 6 to 8 weeks... This is really painful!!!

 

I ordered mine a little over 3 weeks ago. I ordered it on a Monday and received it on Friday of the same week.

My T61p does not freeze.

4GB of RAM. No freezing. Look at my sig for specs.

 

I don't think that I can agree with this line of reasoning. There are plenty of T61 users with NVidia graphics chipsets and 2 DIMMS that are not reporting any issues with their machines. It does not appear that all T61 motherboards are somehow intrinsically faulty. Furthermore, why would Lenovo fire-sale these machines to get rid of them with the knowledge that they are selling a defective device that will need to be returned for service at Lenovo's expense? This would be injurious to Lenovo's reputation as well as their bottom line as they would be responsible for the expenses related to repairing these machines (shipping, parts, etc.). IMHO it would be prudent to keep an eye of the pertinent thread over at the Lenovo Forums ( HERE) and wait for the company to officially address this issue. It would not surprise me to see this resolved with some sort of BIOS or driver update.

 

I know not all T61ps with 2 DIMMs have that problem, but a significant percent do. You could also argue that selling them with a hope that not all will be returned for serivce is a better option than just dumping them in a thrash bin . But I guess you're right, this would be disastrous to their reputation (and to some extent this very defect already is).

I am following that forums thread and have actually contributed to it in order to press Lenovo to come up with a solution swiftly. Unfortunately, I'm afraid it might be more complicated than a BIOS update, because if it were just a software problem, they would say "buy our stuff, don't worry, we'll give you a patch in a week or two".

 

It is really tough to get a grasp on what percentage of the units out there suffer from this issue. Having worked in software QA for years I have noticed that bugs and/or issues with software and hardware reported on the Internet can be grossly overstated. For every person posting here or over at the Lenovo forums regarding this issue there are many many more users who do not have any problems. The very nature of support forums attracts users suffering some sort of difficulty with their product. Those without any issues are generally not compelled to post their positive experiences as they are too busy enjoying their problem-free Thinkpads. Furthermore, I have seen lots of memory compatibility issues resolved with a BIOS upgrade having built and upgraded countless desktop PCs over the years. The good news is that Lenovo has acknowledged the issue and will apparently be addressing it by the end of next week (according to posts at the Lenovo forums). So far my week-old T61 has been running quite well after I uninstalled a bunch of the bloatware that it shipped with. I hope that Lenovo is able to resolve this issue without recalling thousands of ThinkPads for a hardware fix. My gut feeling tells me that they will.

 

For people who have the issue it probably seems like a bigger percentage.

If it is a very small percentage then we are a bunch of really unlucky buyers

I bought a T61p and I kind of read about the issue but most of it was from last year so I thought they must have fixed it. But, I am affected by it.

 

Also keep in mind that not all RAM is compatible with particular motherboard chipsets. Swapping RAM brands, types, speeds, ect can lead to these type of problems. (I''ve had them before).

Get the right RAM and you will increase your chances of avoiding these type of problems.

As soon as I installed my RAM I ran the Lenovo system utility software that came with the T61p to test the RAM and see if it was compatible. That is one way to see if the RAM will work.

Intel has a list of RAM that is compatible with each chipset. Those are the prefered ones to buy to avoid problems.

http://intel.com


Lately it seems like alot of post in this forum are FUD.

Not that they are but they come close.

Best wishes to those with the problems.

 

I certainly would not count this issue as FUD. The issue happens on machines that have been untouched. Everything including RAM is from Lenovo. In fact, mine came with 2gb (2dimm) and I had this issue right out of the box. Taking out 1 stick removed the issue completely. So, I purchased a couple of 2gb sticks and I'm running on 1 2gb stick instead of the 2 1gb that came with the machine. The only thing that produces the issue is using both dimms. This is the only way I know of that tells you that your machine has this specific issue.

1gb + 1gb = random shutdowns during gaming
1gb = perfectly stable during gaming but very slow due to 1gb
2gb = perfectly stable during gaming
2gb + 1gb = random shutdowns during gaming
1gb + 2gb = random shutdowns during gaming
2gb + 2gb = random shutdowns during gaming

I think this is definitely a real issue with some of the T61p that have been sent out.

Of course people may have similar issues and think they have this issue.

 

I gotta ask, what is FUD?

 

from here: http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/F/FUD.html

 

LOL thanks

 

So I called Lenovo and they're sending me a box to send my lappy in to fix this problem.

Question is, how do they treat your files when you send in your laptop?

I'm worried about my hard drive being wiped since I have Office and a couple of games (mainly WoW) that I would rather -not- have to re-buy.

 

I don't think they guarantee keeping your data intact.

You could include a note asking them not to wipe your hard drive but it's still no guarantee they won't.

I've also read that some people take their hdd out before sending it back. You could ask if you can do this.

You wouldn't have to re-buy WoW. You just need the game client and an account. Your other programs I don't know about

 

I also am one of the unfortunate ones. My new t61p spontaneously shuts down (observed so far) under gaming conditions when I have 2 dimms installed.

This happened w/ the factory installed memory 2x512 and my newly purchased gskill 2x2GB. I am currently running on only 1x2GB gskill dimm now and do not have the crash issues anymore.

Guess I will also be calling Lenovo tomorrow to ask them to send me a box to send to the depot

UPDATE: Called them today, friday, and they will be sending a box, Monday, for me to send the lappy to get the mobo swapped at the depot. Hope this fixes the problem

 

For those interested in this topic:
Lenovo has yet to fix this problem

They're not incredibly fast, are they?
I hope they will offer some generous discounts once this notebook is out - and internationally, 'cuz 8600 GT (and hence Quadro 570) is not worth as much as it used to, considering recent price drops in graphic cards.

 

This is very true Axure. Just waiting and waiting will mean others are enjoying their machines and the T61p technology is becoming more out of date. If I could just figure out if this problem was just isolated to the t61p and not the other T61s(with or without the Nvidia card), I would say forget it I will have to just get the T61. These are the defining years for Lenovo. If they learn from their mistakes and and start catering to customers better, i think they will become one of the best brands. If they don't, I think the company and sadly the Thinkpad will become extinct.

 

Keep us updated!