Do Lenovo owners think their notebooks are the best?

I did quite a bit of research before I bought my T61 and finally decided I had to have theT61s keyboard and its Trackpoint. If it wasn't for that deciding factor I might have gone nuts choosing between all of the brands. My question is: do Lenovo notebook owners know they bought the best notebook available at their price point, all things considered such as: customer service, actual build quality inside and out, durability, screen goodness---or do all notebook manufacturers put out comparatively good products and it's just personal preference in the end?

It doesn't really work to go onto other manufacturer's forums here at notebookreview because it's almost a showcase for owner's complaints and my eyes glaze over at the litany of pissin' and moanin'. And I'm not really asking you if I made the right decision because I'm completely happy so far with my purchase. I'm just asking if I'd bought a comparatively spec'd Toshiba or Sager or Acer or Whoever would I have bought a comparatively great product?

 

I wanted the best laptop I could get. After looking closely at Asus, Toshiba, HP, Dell, Sony, and Sager I chose a T61p. I found that many of those did not allow the customization that Lenovo did. If found that Viao were technologically behind Thinkpads in processor speed and especially disk capacity and rotational speed. I saw the same with HP and Toshiba.

The more and more I looked, the more and more I thought thinkpads to be really good machines.

 

Yeah.

It depends. To many, the best simply means buying something that works for them and fulfills their needs at the time. So, it is mostly a matter of preference.

While I tend to be a bit brand oriented at times I have no problem at all into switching brands if another brand is offering what I need.

I've owned a few brands so I can say (from my point of view) that there is simply no best, only those that offer what you need and those that don't. I just buy whatever I know I will be happy with.

 

usually Apple and Thinkpad are supported by cult members like fanatic fan boys.

so avoid them. non-thinkpad Lenovo laptops(IDEAPADS and LENOVO3000) are excellent , but the Thinkpads are not as good as 3000 series in terms of pure value and speed.

if you need a real tough computer , buy a Panasonic Tough book.

Thinkpads are not tough or anything but fanboys rave about it and some believe it.

I think in 90th or 80th , we needed to care about build quality of laptops seriously since they used to be so expensive and buying laptop meant using it for at least 3 years. But now , how long will we be using it for ?

I think most of guys changing their system as often as possible , lets say in a year or 2.

So no need to worry about build quality too much , if you still care about build , get a Panasonic , thinkpad is just a normal computer , if you drop it , it dies.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/notebooks/review/2007/02/06/Zen-And-The-Art-Of-ToughBooks/p9

 

Oh well, any of maker I have known of lets you customize its laptops in US and Japan.

If you get a non-thinkpad Lenovo , you can get more in the same price range.

 

Some samples from our friend lappyforlaptop:

lappyforlaptop here's something for you to ponder if you can handle it:
Not everyone who buys Thinkpad or anything at all for that matter buy it in Thailand. Usually I blame Americans for thinking they're the only existing country in the free world but this one takes the hilt.

Also its one thing to have an opinion its quite another to make sweeping general remarks of things which you know nothing about. I don't say all thinkpads run cool. I can only say that based on this one that I have it does. Under intensive gaming, CPU gets up to 70C and GPU never gets over 75C.

If you had qualified your statements by saying thinkpads are expensive where I am, or I've known of a thinkpad that overheated that's quite different from the sweeping generalizations you made.

 

I just went back onto the Lenovo website and checked out the 3000 series and I have to say I think my $1100 T61 (delivered) has more than the 15.4" 3000 version. When I got to one of their configurations that was close to my T8300/160 gb HD/2 gig ram/8400 GT/etc I saw base price of $999 then ADD $400! Plus, no Trackpoint and no option to go with XP. What am I missing here for you to say that the 3000 is "more" than the Thinkpad T61?

 

Good post, Morphy. Our good friend lappyforphotoshop is chock full of pearls of wisdom today. I didn't think fanboyism could exist on a non-gaming forum, but I was clearly wrong. There's fanboyism, flaming, persistence, the whole works. lappy makes things interesting around here, to say the least.

 

Yes, I believe Thinkpads are the best.

I bought a T41 four years ago because my brother owned a T40 and said it was built like a tank. It is very solid, and still serves me without having suffered any mechanical failures. Would it break if I dropped it from high enough ? Yeah, I suppose . . .

Although I am a Thinkpad fan, I would also consider Panasonic Y series or Fujitsu S series, or even the follow on to the HP 6910p for my next purchase. I say "consider", but odds are I will buy another Thinkpad.

 

ThinkPad was best, real masterpiece. My T42p which is 3 years old still works very well however new ThinkPad made by lenovo is not best but normal.

 

I'm not actually in the US.

I am also able to customize systems where I live, just that I have to wait a couple of weeks to get it. For the record, I've also owned Apple laptops and computers, my current notebook is a Dell Vostro 1500 which offered what I needed in terms of price, hardware and performance. I also have a DIY PC desktop system.

Would I switch from PC back to Apple? Maybe, would I switch from Dell to *insert brand here*?

Definitely, just as long as I get what I need.

 

I've owned 10 laptops in my lifetime by IBM, Dell, Toshiba, Gateway, Acer, and Compaq. Over the last four years I've owned/used a T43 and a Dell Latitude D410. The T43 was the best all around laptop I've ever owned for performance, durability, and ease of use. The D410 was picked up just to have an ultraportable for motorcycle touring. Very nice machine.

More recently (since the beginning of this year) I've had a nightmare machine (XPS M1530) and am currently in posession of a Dell Latitiude D630 that is totally underwhelming. I won't bore anyone with the details, but both of these Dells have had enough issues (displays, software, noise, etc.) that the XPS M1530 was returned and I'm getting ready to do the same with the D630. I've never returned a laptop in my life, and I end up doing it twice in 45 days.

So, from my experience, I think the ThinkPad is the best all-around machine for users that need a solid, well built, durable, strong performing, and ergonomically well designed laptop. And that's why I have a new T61p on order now.

 

I recently received my first thinkpad (R61) and for the price I can say without a doubt it's the best laptop I've ever owned (7 or 8 in the last 12 years mostly Dell's but also a compaq and HP). That doesn't mean when the time comes I will definitely buy a Lenovo again, but it does mean that they will be the first place i look when it's time for a replacement.

 

Some companies come out with a way of doing things that's superior to their competition, then somebody else improves on that way while the originator stagnates. I'm reading all these comments about notebooks in the past (seems like everyone loves (loved) their T43!). Maybe Lenovo learned what makes a solid, competent notebook and refined it. It's just mind boggling how many choices there are. I still spend most of my computer hours in front of my desktop. I should probably just put it away so I can get completely comfortable using my T61. Maybe load up Crysis and see if the screen melts.

 

Spotburner--yeah, I too have found myself using my notebook less than intended. This is partially due to changed work circumstances (less travelling) and also due to my preference for larger and larger screens. (With a 24 inch monitor at work, even 20 inches at home feels small).

But the basic requirement for a notebook remains: a light, portable machine capable of enduring the rigors of business travel and still provide a full computing environment.

 

"so avoid them. non-thinkpad Lenovo laptops(IDEAPADS and LENOVO3000) are excellent , but the Thinkpads are not as good as 3000 series in terms of pure value and speed."

I've had both. I found the 3000 to be a great machine and a good performer but it also had some annoyances. The HOME and END keys work through a function key and that was horrible because I used them all the time. The other thing that bothered me was that buttons like the POWER button were so recessed that machine was difficult to power up. It also had a desperate need for a think light. The 3000s viewing angle was tiny compared to my T61p and the color distortion at angles was also severe.

As far as performance is concerned, a 3000 can't touch a think pad.
My 3000 had a 1.8 ghz duo core with 2 gigs or memory with Vista business and a 7200 rpm disk. It cannot touch my t61p with 2.6 ghx duo core running Ultimate.

Value? I so dislike it when my interests are quality and performance as opposed to value. I agree, as far as "value" is concerned the 3000 probably has it over the t61p. But "value" is not what I look for in a machine.

I'm always going to have fond memories of my 3000 because it was my first laptop. But I'm really glad I have a T61p.

 

My T60 works well for me, given the price and capability it offers. I lost track how many of my clients bought ThinkPads based on my recommendation, but they are all extremely satisfied with their purchase. They instantly notice the build quality as compared to the entry level or consumer grade machines they were using before. Business laptops are one stratum higher in build quality.

Based on my hands-on experience, the Panasonic business ruggedized noteboks are even better built than ThinkPads. The T7 can withstand 100kg on its full magnesium alloy case, with 10 hour battery life and all the while weighing less than 1.2kg (2.65lb). I wish I can justify the purchase of one, but financially prudence comes first.

 

I wouldn't say Thinkpads are the best ever for all pricepoints but I like them for the quality and cost.

 

Good point. computer is just a tool.

 

Wow! 70c-75c

Why they say in the review that it goes under 50c?

 

Just want to mention, you probably shouldn't be generalizing Apple & Thinkpad users like that. Not all are "cult members like fanatic fan boys." I can name many Apple & Thinkpad users that are not "cult members like fanatic fan boys."

Also, the use of the word "fan boy" - there are such things as "fan girls" too, not as many, but there are.

 

Would also like to add that "fanboy/fan boy/fanboi/fan boi/fangirl/fan girl/fangurl/fan gurl" are all derogatory - they have a negative connotation attached to them.

 

That's probably idle temps. My idle temps are 45-50C.
70-75C is for load (can't ppl read anymore lol)..no laptop is going to be under 50C after hours of TF2 or CoD4 .

 

Brand loyalty is usually not the most prudent way to base a buying decision on. Ppl who do that are more often than not labeled as fanboys correctly or incorrectly.

On the same token, brand bashing just because you hate fanboys is just as stupid and ignorant. It makes you look as silly as the so called fanboys.

Just make good informed buying decisions. If you don't like it move on and buy something else. In the end no one really cares.

 

"I can name many Apple & Thinkpad users that are not "cult members like fanatic fan boys."

I can't help this but I heard the cutest joke on NPR today.

"There's only one thing more smug than a MAC user. It's a MAC user who is an Obama supporter.

 

There is an ancient Chinese proverb:

"Those who know, do not talk. Those who talk, do not know."

Most of your statements seem to prove this. I find it disappointing that you seem to look at systems as a disposable commodity. Also, just because you cannot find value in an item doesn't mean others cannot.

While I wouldn't pay the price for a new Macbook Pro, I don't discount that they're some pretty nice laptops. And the construction of ThinkPads IS tough, tough enough for everyday use/abuse. Your argument about the Panasonic ToughBook is a straw-man. They are great laptops, but most of them are mil-spec --that is, designed for far more than just the rugged, road-warrior type, and they cost far more than ThinkPads, especially given the current discounts Lenovo offers.

Tell me why a ThinkPad isn't tough. I'd like to hear your evidence here. You certainly don't provide any. I also see plenty of reason for some people to purchase a ThinkPad over a Lenovo 3000. The 3000 doesn't have the TrackPoint/UltraNav. Two versions of the N variant have discrete graphics; the rest do not, and none of the 14" display variants do. Processor options are more limited, among many others.

Your arguments are simply laughable --really, it amounts to the fact that you wouldn't pay that kind of money for a Thinkpad, thus people who do are "fanboys".

 

For the price / performance / reliability / build quality....i say Thinkpads are definitely the best. I work at the computer support center in my college and I've seen my fair share of computers. The oldest computers I've ever worked with go back to the Thinkpad T20 series. sure, they're old (and slow), but build quality wise, still match up to those of current laptops. I've also seen Inspirons falling apart after 3 - 4 years of use. I agree that nowadays we replace laptops every few years...but wouldn't it better if you could have a laptop you could enjoy for those few years, a laptop that gave you no problems? I've had my shares of problems with Vista, but that is not a lenovo problem. I couldn't be happier with my Thinkpad purchase. I've dropped it on accident before from about 3-4 feet up (backpack zipper was open and i didn't realize it...so when i picked it up, the computer fell out), and nothing was wrong with the computer, just a little scratch on the corner of the case. Lenovo doesn't put these magnesium roll cages in for nothing!

 

If you mean "best" as in "superlative in all aspects of operation over every other notebook", then no, neither Lenovo's or anyone else's notebooks for that matter could be called "best". However, given my budget, my usual practices, desired technical specs, and ability to customize, I believe I made the "best" choice for me.

Could I have bought a more powerful notebook? Sure, there's models that you can fit quad-core desktop processors into, as well as high-end models with video solutions that blow every other notebook away.

Could I have went lighter/more portable? Since I bought a 15.4", decidedly so.

Could I have bought a model with a brighter screen? Or maybe a higher resolution screen? Maybe LED backlighting? Yep, yep, and yep, they're all out there.

I'm not going to say that buying a ThinkPad is for everyone, even though I really enjoy mine. You can't get OSX on it, for obvious reasons, and not everyone cares for the aesthetic aspect of the ThinkPad design. However, as I stated above, even though a ThinkPad can't realistically (and in fact no notebook can, either) be rated "best" in every category, as far as I'm concerned, it's the "best" I can get that has what I want in a notebook.

 

I couldn't be happier with my purchase. There is not one single issue with my laptop and it has been running smoothly since day one. Of course I wouldn't call it the best of all notebook computers. There are some notebooks out there I would love to take a design or two from and implement it into my ThinkPad, but as TheCynical1 said, the ThinkPad T61 was my best choice at the time. Heck, it still would be.

I've been working with my notebook for over 6 months now and I've come to one conclusion: I don't think I'll ever buy another brand of notebooks; this TrackPoint is just impossible to live without. And the all black scheme of design is flawless; I much prefer it over the popular Dell XPS.

But if I have to answer the thread question; yes, I think that my notebook is the best...for me.

 

My very first encounter with a ThinkPad was the T30, a corporate issue some years back. Along with my privately owned T61, I would conclude that Thinkpad has balanced excellence; yet, I cannot claim that ThinkPad is the best there is. Every brand has comparative advantage(s); else, other brands mind as well just close shop.


rgds.

 

They are not the best but they are better than others...you criticize Lenovo and Mac please save us...Mac are awesome and Lenovo are too.

 

Hm. You must be a "fanboy" of bashing Acer, ThinkPads, Apple, HP, and Asus. I can easily find multiple examples of you downplaying all of the above brands.

IdeaPads and the 3000 series have a different target audience than the ThinkPads, so I don't see how you can be comparing them like that. Your speed statement is irrelevant as you can find the same components throughout all three lines.

Your build quality statement is also irrelevant, because you're ignoring the people who take their notebooks with them on travel, into harsh environments, etc. Your ignorance clearly shines within your post.

You, sir, are a real tool. Your statements change nearly everyday, and you seem to be unable to support your arguments.

 

Awwww....but every forum needs a cute, lovable troll.

I wonder though, at the irony of his name --what's his ideal "lappy for Photoshop" if he hates Macs and ThinkPads? Other than perhaps the current Dell Latitude D630/830 and Precision Workstation variant of the same, I can't think of better laptops for Photoshop than the T61 and the Macbook Pro.

I have a feeling he's one of those folks that is a true forum troll --that is, he delights in creating an account, and going into each brand forum, and insulting people's choices just to stir the pot and watch the !@#$ boil over. Maybe he wasn't given enough attention as a child?

 

Regarding the "troll" that popped up on this thread--all forums seem to have at least one grumpy head who's sole reason for posting is just to talk ****. You just can't avoid them and it's almost better just to not reply to them. Anyway...

When I started reading reviews of notebooks (I never used to 'till I decided to buy one) I would look at the rating first (wow, look here, 8.3!!) then the price. I was astonished to find how many notebooks cost $2k or more. Who would need to spend that much? What do you get if you spend that much? So I started only reading reviews of the higher-rated notebooks that cost below $1400 then around $1000. The T61 (and R61) were highly rated AND started below $1000. I concentrated on notebooks around 5.5 to 6 lbs.

Through comparing specs and price and options I narrowed it down to the Vostro 1500 (I did a cost comparo yesterday and it came in around $150 below what I paid for my T61) but once I had checked out the Thinkbook's Trackpoint I was sold. That made my decision real easy.

No one else does a Trackpoint thingy do they? Does Lenovo have a patent on it or something? Why would the rest of the manufacturers think the public doesn't want something like that? So that's what started me wondering if Lenovo was just ahead of everyone else in maybe other ways of putting together their notebooks.

BTW, my T61 with a 6-cell battery weighs 6.10 lbs and weighing both the T61 and AC adapter it weighs 6.85 lbs. Hey, I weigh my bike parts too!

 

I believe that the HP business models DO have a Trackpoint as well.

 

Lenovo doesn't have a patent on it but it's trademarked by IBM as TrackPoint. I believe they invented it, but don't quote me on that.

Correct. The Dell Latitude series has it as well, but IMO, neither are as good as the ThinkPads'.

 

Ted Selker invented it while he was at IBM. His resume can be found at http://web.media.mit.edu/~selker/

 

I played newbie and went over to the Dell and HP websites to see if they did, indeed, have a Trackpoint-like pointing device. I saw what appeared to be a green button in the same location as my T61's Trackpoint but no mention of what it was (in the Latitude section). And not even that on the HP website. I believe the poster when they say those two other brands have a Trackpoint of some sort, but for a guy going in their website specifically looking for proof of that, you know, so the playing field might level out a bit as far as choosing on features, I came up empty handed. I can't imagine why anyone would NOT want a Trackpoint, what's the downside? Of course, I'm using my mouse but on a plane it sure would speed things up.

I was in a local Circuit City when I first began looking. Trackpads are weird as heck for someone who's never used one. I stumbled on a R61 and a bright light went off in my head when I tried the Trackpoint. F...n Ay, I cried out. I turned to the sales dude and said why don't the rest of these manufacturer's do this? He muttered something about it being some old-style leftover outdated basically worthless thing. I didn't say anything to him but to myself I said "I gotta have it."

Then through my research I found out the Thinkpads are great notebooks as well. And at my price point. Am I some lowly fanboy?

 

Definitely not a lowly fanboy. I wouldn't call myself a fanboy neither but personally, I would choose the ThinkPad over most of the notebooks out today for reasons according to me of course.

 

No, you're not a fanboy. You're probably a capable typist, though.

Trackpoints are love-them-or-hate-them devices; there's no in between. I love them because I can type 75-80wpm, and I hate having to leave the keyboard just to use the mouse (one reason why I make sure to know my hotkey commands too). IIRC, there is a patent that must be licensed to use them however, which costs companies money. I believe that is part of why Dell only uses them on the business-class Latitudes, and several models of mobile Precision Workstation, because it is an added expense.

Toshiba used to use them on quite a few models; like Dell I believe they now limit it to their business class machines. Some early Toshibas (i.e., AMD K6, Pentium/Pentium II) had the trackpoint only, with no trackpad at all.

Your salesguy probably never even used one, and to the uninitiated (or those that tried it once and didn't get the hang of it the first time) they are "clunky, old, outdated devices". You just won't find them on home/consumer machines, so it's easy for someone to pan them when they haven't used a truly great business-class notebook

 

Hey, there's no shame in calling yourself a fanboy

I'll admit that I'm one, having grown up around Thinkpads since I was 6 or 7. My dad got his 600E around that time, and I got to use it a lot when he got his 600X a year or so later. Got used to the TrackPoint, haven't gone back ever since.


There's a million other things I could list about why I chose a Thinkpad, but if I typed them all here you'd have a thread in itself

 

135 WPS? Is that words per second? Now that's fast! I top out at around 70-80 WPM. Been typing with my eyes shut since high school. That's why the best keyboard available was so important. I haven't used my T61 enough to come up with anything that I don't like except maybe that the screen (hardware ID says LEN4050) is real sensitive to the viewing angle. I tilt the screen back so I'm looking at it dead on, it looks great. But it lightens and darkens radically off center. I'd have to sit in front of other brands' screens to know if that was normal for a notebook.

 

I think that TrackPoints offered in HP's business models are even better than the original IBM's.
I do not know whether it is a driver or a mechanical issue but I'm able to perform drag'n'drop or double click operations with my HP without any effort (just by a gentle double tapping - in turn, I need a firm double pressing to force the same operations in my z60t and in T61p I use sporadically - which is not so comfortable).
On the other hand side - the inverted middle button in ThinkPads is simply the best.

 

You mean WPM? The world record is 170 WPM so you'd be blowing that record out of the water.

 

I'm fairly positive the record has to be higher than that.

 

Typing, Fastest. Mrs. Barbara Blackburn of Salem, Oregon can maintain 150 wpm for 50 min (37,500 key strokes) and attains a speed of 170 wpm using the Dvorak Simplified Keyboard (DSK) system. Her top speed was recorded at 212 wpm. Source: Norris McWhirter, ed. (1985), THE GUINNESS BOOK OF WORLD RECORDS, 23rd US edition, New York: Sterling Publishing Co., Inc.

 

She can maintain it over a time of 50 minutes. The typing test I took took me less than a minute to complete.

If I were to try for 50 minutes straight, my speed would decrease after a few minutes, and my fingers would curl up, cramp, and die.

Lol.

 

I know you're messing with us. Forget some dinky test you took back when, just set up a newspaper in front of you and type out some story. There's no way in heck you're gonna top 100 real words per MINUTE. No misspelled words either. I dare ya.

 

I can type about 100000 WPM as long as the text consists of only the letter "a".

 

Lol, like I said, I can't keep up a certain speed forever. It's just on the little typing tests I can find on Google. Those obviously aren't indicative of long-term typing.

WPS ratings are useless anyway. As long as I know how to type, I'm happy.