Core 2 duo in IBM T-Series

Hi,

I've tried looking for this information all throughout the forums. I want to buy an IBM T-Series laptop, but have been waiting for the Core 2 Duos to come out.

Does anyone know when I'll be able to order and IBM T60/61 with a Core 2 Duo in it?

Thanks,
Jeff

 

I want to know too.

 

I've heard rumors about the T60 having a Merom chip. However, from what I've observed, Lenovo is a bit slower to integrate new processors. If I was getting an Asus or Sony Vaio, I would just wait for Merom (Sony is out now and Asus is in a matter of weeks). I opted for the T60 and figured it would take Lenovo probably 6 months to finally roll out the new C2D chip so I went ahead and ordered. It seemed when the Core Duo came out, Lenovo was one of the last ones to adopt it. I am just guessing but I think that they do more extensive testing and integration with their Thinkadvantage stuff... or they are just more cautious.

Also, keep in mind that the socket is the same for Core Duo as it is for Core 2 Duo. You can always get a Core Duo and get good use out of it. When the Core 2 Duo is out, you could pretty easily upgrade the chip. You may have to do a quick BIOS upgrade as well but otherwise, it is just drop and play.

 

Although when it came to the x60/x60s lenovo was among the first to release an ultraportable with a dualcore cpu.
That makes me a bit nervous. Since I'm about to pull the trigger on an x60s and I won't be able to just switch CPUs later on since they are soldered in x60/x60s.

Especially since the roumers of an new x61(?) tablet coming one could speculate that they would announce more models/changes at the same time. Or maybe not.

As you say, they are compatible so unless lenovo can't get ahold of enough CPUs I'm dissapointed on them for not going for it.

 

Hardly anyone can get ahold of enough CPU's right now. Intel isn't at all able to meet demand, and Dell seems to be getting them all.

 

Yeah, the X series was quick. Maybe the T series is their bread and butter and they are very careful with changes.
So far, you can get C2D's on many Dell's, HP, Sony SZ's, Gateway, Alienware, Toshiba. (that I'm aware of).

 

You have to remember that a big appeal of business machines is the longevity of the various models in the marketplace. When you're working IT in a big corporation, the last thing you want is to have to validate new laptops every three months. Some Thinkpads have a workhorse designation, which is a guarantee that they'll remain on the market for a certain length of time. But all business notebooks, including all Thinkpads, HP's business line, and Dell's Latitude will see fewer refreshes and new models.

Seeing that Core 2 is a drop in replacement we're seeing it deployed rather quickly, but it's still a change, and in IT any change is something to be leary of. Lenovo is being smart here, they're taking their time to test and probably watching reactions to HP and Dell Core 2 deployment. Of course it's also likely that they can't get enough of the things yet to really be happy.

 

ooohhh .

I was hoping the answer would be something more like 'The end of the month' or 'in a couple weeks'.

I seem to recall that IBM/Lenovo wasn't that slow to get Core Duo T60s out. Or at least we got to see leaked pictures of the T60.

Up till now, I haven't heard anything of a T60 or Tanything with a Core 2 Duo.

Almost makes me wanna just bite the bullet and go for a Core Duo.

jeff

 

I've been hearing October on this forum for the T and the X tablet, February for the traditional X.

I decided not to wait, but I might pop in a Core 2 later if I can justify it.

 

You think they will hold off and release the C2D with the widescreen T series?

 

I sincerely hope that never materializes, because it's a sign that widescreens are taking over the Thinkpads. There's no other reason to have both the Z and a widescreen T.

 

Next thing you know, we'll also lose the matte screen as well That was my gripe with the Dell D820 (glossy widescreen).

I've been reading a lot about the widescreen T60's but still not quite convinced... Maybe they will offer a single widescreen model like a T61w or something like that.

 

I talked to rep while discussing a possible purchase and said tenatively they're thinking around the end of october but if I really wanted one that I would have possibly wait a little longer because of the demand...not to mention that Lenovo all ready has a reputation to make a whiel to ships things. I'm probably going to wait until December or January to order my T60. Atleast now I have more time to save money for more features I suppose if that's really a consolation.

 

If your going to wait till December for Core 2 Duo, you might as well wait for Santa Rosa in Q2 2007 .

 

Got a new confirmation from Lenovo/IBM sales team, the ETA for C2D on Thinkpads going to be around X-mas. They're taking another 2-3 month of testing and fine tuning. I trust their judgement, and their reputation is unbeatable. If you are in desperate need for a laptop now, Core Duo will do it (and I'm sure prices will drop even more soon). But, if you are like me where I get new Thinkpad every 2/2.5 years and no fixed budget, wait for C2D which might be wrapped in a more Vista-friendly laptop configuration

... that Q2 '07 for Santa Rosa could easily turn into Q3 or Q4

 

As long as you're not doing high-end encoding/gaming, C2D is not that big of an improvement, only 2 to 6% better in application benchmarks, which is insignificant to most people. I'd wait until C2D comes out, and get great deals on "old" C1D.

For C1D vs. C2D Benchmarks, go here:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2808

 

Something to note, lenovo has just anounced that the n100 get's a merom update, so maybe this is a sign......

 

For me it will be a big improvement since my T42 has 1.7M Dothan (FSB 400MHz, 2MB L2 cache). So, going to 2.16M C2D Merom (FSB 667MHz, 4MB L2 cache) is a BIG deal for me

 

I want a Core 2 Duo as well. I roll my eyes when people talk about online gaming on a T series Thinkpad.

 

If deal=price/performance, then current C1D is even a bigger deal for you and almost everybody else, since first C2D = current C1D.

 

Wait, how could C2D=C1D when the L2 cache is doubled and there is close to 10% performance improvement? Their price is IDENTICAL, so it should not affect the overall price of the laptop.

I don't use my laptop for gaming, but rather for some heavy-cpu-duty music production which runs virtual instruments. But, one thing that I found, a lot of latest music sequencers utilize too much of graphic resources, so a dedicated video card with 128MB of RAM is a must. I assume even with C2D configuration, x1400 will continue to be used?

 

I'd assume so, unless there's a new graphics chip from ATI that is part of the wait before a refresh. Thinkpads traditionally have long life cycles, so it wouldn't be surprising if there's something beyond the c2d around the corner.

 

I'm not sure which benchmarks show 10% improvement, but application/business benchmarks shown only 3-6% improvement, which is insignificant. Checkout the Anandtech bechmarks in my 2nd previous post for the benchmarks that relevant to your notebook use. Although the prices for the CPUs will be the same, "older" notebooks will still be cheaper because 2 is always better than 1.

 

OK, so I should have said "up to 10%" performance increase based on different laptop configuration and applications which I have seen on the net; and I'm rounding off numbers. I do agree that original C1D Yonah was a big step-up from its predecessor, and Merom doesn't follow the exact same footsteps. But, just alone the support for a true 64-bit architecture (another huge plus for me where the new audio software moving forward to take advantage of 64-bit processing) and an improved processing speed (based on Pi calculations) will give a boost to audio rendering. I also forgot to mention that laptop price is not a limiting factor for me and my reasonable budget is around $2,500. At the same time, I would not go crazy to get the top speed processor and overpay $300 for something that will be insignificant in terms of performance. Therefore, I'm thinking either 2GHz or 2.16GHz.

I think this is straight forward: if you are on a budget and still want the latest powerful processor, get C1D especially when C2D is out and prices on C1D-equipped laptop will start dropping to clear out the stock. If you already have C1D, it makes no sense to upgrade to C2D due to a relative small improvement margin. And, if you are in the market to buy a new laptop to replace your older machine and not on a strict budget, C2D is the next logical step!!!

 

It is probably too early to see good comparisons. I ended up getting a 2.33Ghz C1D because it was on sale. I too would have normally just got a 2Ghz or something along those lines. I wonder how a 2.33Ghz C1D compares to a 2 or 2.16Ghz C2D? The difference in this case seems pretty negligible probably. However, the L2 cache is better and there is 64 bit. I suppose in a year or so when 64 bit is a bit more mainstream, there may be even faster C2D chips out and I can upgrade then.

 

C2D is more of an evolutionary step rather than revolutionary like going from the pentium M to C1D. it is mainly designed to prepare for the 64bit. if you're upgrading from a pentium M or lower, it makes sense to go for the C2D as you will see a huge gain, but if you already have a C1D, the benefits are very marginal as you will not notice a performance gain in real life, unless you're the type that likes to run benchmarks all day just to satisfy your ego. as you may have noticed, the hardware aspect is waaaaaay ahead of the software part. Currently, most software out there aren't even being made to fully utilize C1D let alone C2D. I'm happy with my T2500, but hopefully, the software industry is playing catchup right now.

 

How about Win Vista 64 bit compatibility with C1D? Of course, x1400 probably will not be able to even handle fully featured Vista, but still a native 64-bit support is a good investment as well. Another good point brought up above, C1D could be upgraded with C2D through a swap and a bios upgrade. I assume that Thinkpad motherboard has it socketed so there is no problem with it, right?

C2D would be a big step up if it would have 1MHz FSB like the desktop Core Duo. I'm sure than it would not be swapable due to a different bus architecture of the motherboard...

 

Yep i dont think you can swap the FSB. On some thinkpads you cant even upgrade the processor (and if you do you void the warranty).

As for a good investment? I think nope. If you wait 6-9 months to buy that C2D vista T61 after it comes out, you may pay half as much for it (at least that's been my experience like with my X60).

 

An x1400 will more then be able to fully handle running Vista with Aero. You can run Vista on Intel's integrated graphics even though it won't perform that great with Aero. If you want a Thinkpad with a C2D then i would wait and order one with it. They shouldn't cost much more if any then the current Core Duo Thinkpads and you won't void your warranty in the process. C2D is a definite improvement over Core Duo. There is as much as a 10-20% difference in certain CPU intensive applications, especially with the T7200 4MB L2 model. The 4MB L2 C2D processor was tested against a 2MB L2 C2D processor clocked at the same speed on Anandtech and the extra cache showed as much as a 10% improvement. And that's C2D vs C2D. That's not C2D vs Core Duo where the difference would be even greater. Core 2 Duo also offers better battery life over Core Duo. Then C2D also supports the new SSE4 instruction set and EM64T for 64-bit.

 

Um, what? By all reports the GMA950 will be able to run Vista Aero. The idea that MS is going to release an OS that is more taxing on a system than recent games is hilarious to me. It would be the biggest mistake they ever made.

Chris

 

And boy is that saying a lot!

couldn't resist