Comparison among T400 and R400

I'm close to choose a second hand laptop among these models:

- T400
- T410
- R400

The first two are obvious more expensive and I'd like if there are many (And, if, concrete) differences among these models.

Furthermore I'd like which is the best configuration to choose for T400/R400 (Among Pxxxx and Txxxx cpus) and for T410 (I5 cpu) repectively, considering the important aspects of performance, system cooling/noise and battery life.

Thanks, Stefano.

 

A simple model name doesn't tell much. Provide relevant details per machine.

 

Dude we could write up an essay for the differences between all those models. T410 has option Intel HD graphics or NVS 3100M GPU, 1440x900 LCD. T400 has Radeon 3470M switchable graphics or X4500 same as R400. R400 is alot thicker than a T series, and typically is considered a budget laptop. T410 has crap battery life, even with 9 cell, Arrandale CPU's not great on battery.

 

Under this aspect is it better the older core 2 duo PXXXX or TXXXX obtained with T400 ?

I was thinnking that R and T serie were different also about chassis material and overall build quality.

 

T series is the last to feature the roll cage. R series did not have the full roll cage as I understand it. Build quality isn't worse on the R series, it's still a ThinkPad. It's not like T series is ThinkPad build quality and R series is Lenovo Essential build quality, R series just have less options than T series as it was Lenovo's budget laptops.

Arrandale CPU's are higher performance than Core 2's but the load wattage is awful. Idle is comprarable to Penryn CPU's, but unless you use idle wattage all the time, you are in for a shocker for battery life. Even now gone X201 with an i5-560M and a 93 WHr battery on idle was ~8 hours but on load could not get more than 4.5 hours with a dimmed screen.

 

I believe and it's been a while so I could be wrong, that the T400 and R400 were virtually the same with the R400 being slightly heavier and thicker, but it'd be difficult to tell them apart right next to them. In the US the R400 did not get the option of WWAN, which had been offered on previous R series models, and the dedicated GPUs were not an option. It was my understanding the 3470 GPUs were offered on Euro based R series models that were not sold in the US. The 15" models diverged more. The R500 did not have the screen roll cage like the T500 and used ABS plastic for lid, but the R500 did have the sub frame in the lower case. The R500 was more hefty than the T500, but the T400 and R400 were very close in weight.

 

I found the build quality on some R Series notebooks to be just as good as the T Series, saying it's alike to the consumer Essential notebook range is a bit harsh in my view. I had a 15.4" R61 thrown to a ditch from a car crash (truck ploughed into me at 50 mph!) with nothing more than just a minor chip on the corner. Everything from the screen to the hard drive worked fine to my amazement. I would even admit that the R61 I had feels a lot more sturdy than my current T420!

 

No I was pointing out that R series is not that much different if it were any different from T series (drawing a comparison between let's say ThinkPad vs Lenovo's Essential line).

 

There were some "weird duck" configurations within R400/500 series, take a look at this:


ThinkPad R400 (2784-R1U)
T9400(2.53GHz), 2GB RAM, 250GB 5400rpm HD, 14.1in 1440x900 LCD, 256MB nVidia GeForce 9300M, CDRW/DVDRW, Intel 802.11agn wireless, Bluetooth, Modem, 1Gb Ether, Ultranav, Sec Chip, FPR, Camera, 6c Li-Ion, WinVista Home Premium 32

or

ThinkPad R500 (2731-20U)
T9400(2.53GHz), 2GB RAM, 160GB 5400rpm HD, 15.4in 1680x1050 LCD, 128MB ATI Radeon HD3470, CDRW/DVDRW, Intel 802.11agn wireless, Bluetooth, Modem, 1Gb Ether, UltraNav, Sec Chip, FPR, Camera, 6c Li-Ion, WinVista Business 32

Good luck finding either of these, though...

Generally, I like R*00 series (apart from units with WXGA panels...nauseating) and find them to be quite comparable to T*00 series.

 

Given how cheap T400's are right now, should an R400 even be considered? I always though of the R series as a fat T series with less features, some models don't even have touchpads. :|

 

A *huge* plus in my book...

I'm pretty sure that all R*00 units do have touchpads, though...

 

Yes, a touchpadless ThinkPad is much more aesthetically pleasing.

 

At this moment in my are R400 is no more available and T410 is a little too expensive for me.
So the choice is now restricted to T400 and... 2530P.
Both can be bought for roughly the same price (Starting from 280 euro for T400 with P8400 and finishing to 340 euro for HP2530P and T400 with P8600)

What tho choose now ?

 

The versions equipped with I5 (T410) are too expensive for now.

The only choice that I have to do is among PXXXX, TXXXX and I3 of first generation.

All considered (Performance, cooling, power consumption) which is the best choice.

Among P8400, P8600, P8700 and T9400 are there concrete differences or them can be placed on the same level ?

I'm really about to choose.

Except for T400 and 2530P the only remaining option is an older 2510P (U7600, har disk 80Gb) that can bought for just 150 euro.

Waiting for your appreciated considerations.

Thks, Stefano.

 

Yeah I've just re-read your message and I stand corrected. Note to self, don't reply when you're half awake at 2:30am in the morning.

This, depreciation on both models should make them quite affordable now. As a mainstream seller there should be plenty of used T400 on the market making accessories and spare parts easier to find. I would only consider a T400 if it has a LED screen, otherwise even the Intel GPU T61 models would also be good enough if graphical performance is not a priority.

 

Do You really think that T61 coulb be a batter deal than T400 if graphical perf. is not a priority ?

For which motivations ?

In my area a T61 can be bought at a price much less inferior than a T400 and so...

 

Well here's my analysis:

Performance

* Both T61 and T400 can handle Penryn Core 2 Duo processors but the T61 needs to have a BIOS mod before it can run it without errors. I have a Core 2 Duo T9300 2.5GHz processor in my T61 and it runs great, much cooler than the standard Merom processors (T7xxx) on the same clock speed.

* The T400 runs DDR3 memory which is affordable these days should you want to upgrade, the T61 on the other hand requires DDR2 memory which is getting rarer and more expensive. Technically both systems can run at the maximum RAM capacity of 8GB though it will cost a lot more with a DDR2 system than that of a DDR3.

* The T400 have native SATA technology for both hard drive and the Ultrabay, the T61 only have such technology for the hard drive. The Ultrabay on the T61 uses the older PATA technology and will require a special caddy (SATA-PATA) should you want a second hard drive.

* For basic tasks like browsing and office work both systems should handle the workloads with ease, though the basic spec T400 would be able to handle HD videos less strenuously compared to a similar T61 model. The NVIDIA version of the T61 unfortunately uses the faulty G86 chips which are prone to fail making it a risk buy. The switchable graphics on the T400 can be a bit buggy on modern Windows OS' too.

Build Quality

* Both systems share the same chassis so theoretically you can swap the bezels, batteries, keyboards, (TFT) screens etc. with each other. Build quality is generally excellent though some owners do notice the odd creak in some areas and the LCD hinge is prone to wobble after extensive usage. For its size it does feel a little heavy too.

* Be wary of some early generation T400 models where it doesn't have keyboard frame in the chassis, since the T400 keyboard adopts a non-solid backplate design it can flex and feel mushy to type on which is not expected of a ThinkPad. The T61 keyboards however are excellent due to the solid backplate design giving it a nice tactile feel when you type, a popular modification by T400 owners is to obtain a T61 keyboard which is backwards compatible and cures most flexing problems.

Which One To Buy

* The most desirable model would be a LED panel version of the T400 which is not found on the T61 and is not backwards compatible, these screens are much brighter than the CRT equivalent but they can be hard to find.

* The T61 can be great value for money if you don't plan to do strenuous tasks, but will require some modifications to get the most out of the machine. Look for models which have been upgraded (4GB RAM or more) to save costs on the RAM. Since most of these machines will come with a Merom processor (T7xxx) factor in the costs of a cheap Penryn CPU (like a T8100) to see if it's worth it. Don't pay over the odds for one since...

* ... the T400 had depreciated to a level where the T61 doesn't have that much of a price advantage, 2 years ago the T61 was a better buy but not so much now. Upgrades should be cheap on the T400, especially with the costs of DDR3 RAM to DDR2. Look out for some models with WXGA+ panels 1440x900 for increased real estate.

Recommended buy: T400 with WXGA+ screen, though consider a T61 only if it's really cheap to buy and upgrade.

 

T61 could have a potential ticking Nvidia time bomb, while all T400's won't have any GPU issues. Also T400 has DDR3 RAM which is dirt cheap, while T61 has DDR2, which to get 8 GB, you'll need to spend a small fortune ~180 dollars. Also T400's are only slightly more expensive than a T61 these days, and you are guaranteed to get a Penryn chip with a T400, vs possible Merom chips in a T61.

Hah well if my X220 tablet had a touchpad delete option, I might have kept it. I'm used to my touchpadless X61t and on my now sold X200t.

 

Thanks for your really useful considerations.

The T400 and T61 comes at a very similar price if considering this configuration for T400(270 euro) :

- P8400
- GMA 4500HD
- 1440x900
- 3 Gb of ram
- Win 7 pro

and this the configuration for T61(260 euro):

- T8300
- GMA X3100
- 1440 x 900
- 4 GB of ram
- 160 Gb hd
- Win 7 pro

 

I don't see a HDD size for T400 listed, but that would be my choice between the two at the prices quoted...

 

Hd has the same size.

And however, also in different configurations, the price for the two models is very similar (Never more 40 euro).

This considered is the T400 effectively a better choice ?

 

Between the two that you've listed, T400 would definitely be my pick.

 

Ok.
And now the sole alternative to T400 remains 2530P...