Backup Solutions VSS, R&R

Hi Guys,

After a terrible run with technology (stolen laptop, dying hard drive on new Thinkpad etc) I'm trying to come up with a back up solution that will not only cover faulty hardware, viruses and laptop theft. Theres the storage hardware I currently have: 80GB HD in the Thinkpad, 80GB external HD, 120 GB external HD. Keep in mind that I'm a uni student and I'm trying to save money where I can. Here are my questions.

1) How valuable are products like True Image, Ghost, Retrospect etc when you already have R&R on your computer? In terms of HD failure or virus infection when I just need to re-image from a backup, will the paid solutions offer any advantages?

1)a) What about in the case of laptop theft. In the event that I decide to NOT get a Thinkpad again (GASP!!), will R&R be able to restore on a non Thinkpad computer? Will the paid solution be more useful in this case?

2) How valuable is VSS. If I back up regularly and already have another copy of files on hand.This also relates to budget and space constraints. VSS is already duplicating files on my computer. If I back up the whole drive including VSS, there is a triplicate and seems very inefficient. Should I just disable VSS or at least reduce the size?

3) How are you guys currently backing up? What software do you use? What do you think is best for me given my requirements?

Thanks in advance,
Jeremy

 

Are you running Vista or XP?

 

Windows Vista Business
Good point, I'll add that to my sig to make it clearer in future.

Cheers
Jeremy

 

Fine Jeremy,

You have everything you need to do very nice backups with Vista's Complete PC backup to DVDs or any blank external drive. In order to restore you are going to need to distribution dvd. Anyone who has one should be able to make you a copy. They are all the same. Make sure you an boot it.

 

Nope. I run a business and I have 5 years experience from T40->T43->X60->X60T->T61, and I did a lot of backup/RnR/restart everything. I used to do all these grandfather/father/son levels of backup....before I finetune to these steps (100% working)

a) Get an external drive (borrow one), clone the hidden partition in your thinkpad using a download the 15 days trial of Acronis. This is to enable you to re-clone back to the harddisk if b) and c) fails

b) Download the latest RnR4.1, create a recovery media BUT to the USB harddisk, NOT to any CDR/DVD because the latter is NOT reliable unless you burn it and try it at least once. A USB harddisk is more reliable

c) Do not delete the hidden partition if you don't need the space, press the blue button to restore your system to factory setting if virus attack/crash etc.

d) If harddisk crash, you still have the clone in a) You can again download the trial acronis, get a new harddisk, clone the copy back to the new harddisk, put harddisk in laptop, press blue button

Backup discipline
----------------
a) Put all your MOST important critical files in /MyDocument

b) Get a free 2GB backup space at mozy, sync your /Mydocument there, all your stuff are automatically backup everytime you go online.

c) when you have mozy setup, delete RnR, you don't need it.

d) for additional space get omnidrive, myspace, gmail (ie gspace) and all those free stuff. Store your secondary important stuff there.

And you are set, forget about burning CDRW/DVD, RnR and all that waste of time stuff. No need any paid software....

PS: The mozy link is a referral link, new signup gets extra 256MB and I get 256MB, if you don't want to benefit from the refer, just goto www.mozy.com and create a new account.

 

Have you used Complete PC Backup?

I have. It recovers the primary partition and the recovery partition if it is still there and the recovery partition.

Personally, I'm not interested in the recovery partition because I spend a lot of time removing much of the software Lenovo puts on like the Office Trial and PC doctor.

What I do with Vista, is to elimate what I don't want and get a good system disk as I want it. I may either leave the recovery partition or delete it. After I am sure I have a good backup, I delete it and back it up again.

I do this on dual layered DVD, requiring two which is much cheaper than an external hard drive.

Recovery is accomplished using the Vista Installation disk.

You see, I keep my data on other partitions. I don't use "my documents" and you'll find that few professionals do.

"d) If harddisk crash, you still have the clone in a) You can again download the trial acronis"

No you won't. Your hard disk has crashed.

What I am describing is self-contained. You don't have to squirrel personal documents away all over the internet and rip off companies.

 

Ideasmiths, why are you not using imaging programs and why prefer the online back ups instead? In the event of a system crash, would it not be useful to just re-image and have all the settings and files there already?

Renee, don't you need an anytime upgrade CD to use the Vista imaging program? The scheme is not available in Australia so it would be a pain to get it. R&R seems a lot more powerful than the Vista imaging program.

Does anyone know if R&R works on non Lenovo laptop in case of theft?

 

In the beginning, I used imaging programs and spend a lot of time doing weekly backup, making sure my data history is correct and so on. Till one day I got so sick and tired of the time wasted.

So the simplest solution I found is to
a) Have the system back up and going in the shortest time possible, which RnR can do it very effectively (and it's free too for lenovo users). If you search for my writings on use the Base software Administrator (from lenovo), you can write a manifest file into the hidden partition which can install the minimal software needed from factory restore.

b) Protect the most critical data you need. Have the discipline not to put it all over the hard disk, external disc or on any CD/DVD because you might not know which is the latest. Just put it into ONE location so that this way you know that any data that is outside this ONE location is non-critical. /MyDocument seem logical, if someone don't like it, it could be C:/ReneeBackup for all I care.

Mozy is a 448 keys encrypted and FREE location that minimize the time you spend backing up and double checking all your backups. 448 keys is a pretty strong encryption which I don't think most hackers can crack. It does it job well enough that you don't have to think about backing up. If you use RnR or other imagining softare, you are doing the same backup, but you need to spend time administrating it. RnR is equal to other ghost/acronis/ so why waste money?

if you want a quick backup, just drag the whole folder /Mydocument into an external harddisk. This 'thinking' is very important because you will have peace of mind knowing that having a good discipline means your data is central located and backup.

If you want 'settings', well, you can do the factory restore, install all your software and data when you are happy and then image it. 6 months down the road if you had a crash, is the data on your image the latest? Which CD/DVD is it in? What happens if you restore half way and it refuse to run?

Using RnR (for the clean system restore) and mozy (your latest critical data), is a simple, time savings strategy (as far as backing up is concerned). so basically its your choice, you want to spend 2 hours each week to do imagining and CD/DVD storage/sorting or you want to spend zero hours and let mozy do it automatically for you. It's a choice

 

I guess your reply was targeted to hurt me? Is it necessary? It's just a forum. Even if you disagreed with my methods, you could question it nicely. But what the heck, let me share with you some additional information so that you don't do this to the next contributor.

I guess you haven't looked at lenovo ThinkVantage software called the Base system Administrator. The guide to use it is found here. This would eliminate all the useless software and restore the leanest and meanest lenovo factory settings in the shortest time using RnR.

Using one partition has many advantage over many other partitions, see Disktrix Ultimatedefrag. Few professionals like me who handles all of my clients information use /MyDocuments, I am sure I'm a rarity compared to the more common practice of leaving it on the desktop. It's just a personal choice where you want to put your data, nothing professional or unprofessional about it.

I bought a 5400 RPM 3.5" 20GB for US$5, 40GB goes for USD$10, it don't have to be large or the fastest, just USB would do. I have longed bought thinkpads without CDRW/DVDRW drives because they are white elephants and heavy, so I guess $149 lenovo slim bay multiburner DVD writer cost less than obsolete HDD?

If and ever my harddisk crash, I guess using a DVD drive would miraclely revivie the harddisk. My method is to get a new harddisk, change my bios to boot from external HDD, start the recovery from the rescue media I stored there and everything is back.

If that rescue media didn't start, I just need to borrow a desktop or laptop from my friends (you do have friend right?), download acronis, re-clone my hidden partition to the new harddisk and go. Of course we all know that recuse media is different from hidden partition right?

I have of course experienced incidents of the CDROM/DVD ROM disc which was burned wrongly or stored in a warm place till it is warp and screaming and pulling my hair out when it won't restore my image. Of course this type of bad things only happens to me, I am sure if you search any lenovo forums, you won't find people asking why their self burned recovery disc doesn't work.

Remember, it's just a forum, we are trying to help, not lock horns on whose ideas is ultimate. So pease stop making fun of other contributors ideas

 

Both methods work and I think I may combine the two. I think I just feel comfortable a whole image backup in R&R or vista complete back up. However the idea of Mozy as a continuous data backup solution is also VERY appealing. Having Mozy would mean that maybe image backups will not need to be nearly as frequent which would save time and space.

But I still have a question as to whether R&R images can be loaded on non Thinkpad computers. Will Ghost or True Image (or even Drive Image XML) be useful here?

 

No, it's not not just a matter of personal preference. My personal files have very little turnover. They are software projects and are a library. Once I get system disk set up, it too is very static.

A couple of weeks ago, my system downloaded a couple of patches and the system rebooted. WHen it rebooted vista was inactivated due to a bug. "Reduced functionality mode" would only allow me to purchase a vista licence which I already had. I called Lenovo support and they said I would have to call Microsoft's Electronic keys Office. The trouble was, it was Friday night and my system would be dead for three days. I simply got out my Vista distribution and replaced the system and did not lose a single byte of data. The system backup was about two months old. The relevant data was on other partitions. I had everything I needed right here. If was laptop was my only system, I would not have been able to download anything.

But your advice, to store data all over the net and sometimes very personal data is not good advice. You recommend down loading trialware something that would not have been possible. I find that the system disk is the most vulnerable of disks. I've lost lots of system disks, but have never lost any data using multiple partitions.

No I don't use the Lenovo stuff. Why should I? Vista has everything I need. As a matter of fact, the first two things I do when I get a Lenovo system is to remove a lot of uneeded software and the recovery partition because I don't want it or need it.

I don't agree with your advice. It's full of highly fallable events.


"Will Ghost or True Image (or even Drive Image XML) be useful here?"


Vista business and Ultimate eliminate the need for these systems with Complete PC backup which is a Microsoft imaging system.

 

For vista backup, what is the CD that I need? Is it the one I can create in R&R or do I need a vista CD?

 

Huanker,

As I mentioned earlier, I've never used Lenovo r&r so I can't answer any questions about that.

Vista (Ultimate and Business) backup is done via The Backup and Restore Center. When you need to do a restore, you definitely need a bootable Vista DVD. The restore is done under repair and is a menu option. I find it to be a very professionally done utility.

There is one thing that is counter-intuitive about. If your backup has more than one DVD and it is llikely to, you start the backup with the last DVD in the set rather than first. There is one message that's less than clear. When it's finshed with a DVD, it will tell you that you have the wrong disk. This just means remove the disk and to put the next one in.

So the sequence you will see is:

You begin with the last disk. It will look at that disk for a while and make some calculations and then it will announce that you have the wrong disk.

At that point put in the first disk and it will copy and verify... and then announce you have the wrong disk.... Then you put the final next one in and will copy and verify until you have finished the restoration.

All Vista distribution DVDs are the same no matter what you buy. WHat is loaded depends on your product key. There is nothing wrong with copying a friends DVD since the it's the product key that does it all.