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    7.6watts w/x200s

    Discussion in 'Lenovo' started by Thaenatos, Mar 14, 2011.

  1. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Yeah not even done tweaking and I have no special programs or voltage altering. I was web surfing with 2 SSH sessions running and the calculator. Seems I average between 7.6 and 8.6. Loving this x200s more and more!
     

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  2. graycolor

    graycolor Notebook Evangelist

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    No need to show off :( I'm getting about 16 watts average.
     
  3. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Have you tried tweaking the power manager settings to see if you can get lower usage? I would assume the i series t series could get a lower wattage drain then that. But then again I have been wrong.
     
  4. v_310

    v_310 Notebook Consultant

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    wow!

    @sphinx - a slightly OT question. Please feel free to answer here or via PM.

    I'm thinking of switching over to linux as my mainstream desktop. How easy (or difficult) is it to migrate from a version of linux to the next? Are the user preferences and data taken care of? Any pointers would be of great help!
     
  5. vēer

    vēer Notebook Deity

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    Wow, I have 14-25 wats on my T410 all the time.
    Lucky you :D!
     
  6. menos

    menos Notebook Evangelist NBR Reviewer

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    The same x200s with Vista 32 & 4GB & SSD & Brightness 6:
    • 9W when browsing via ethernet
    • 13W when streaming a flash video in the active tab (10-11W if in the background)
    I like mine too :wink:
     
  7. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    I made the switch really easily. I don't game anymore and if I have to run a windows application I can run my windows 7 virtual machine and it does it just fine. Heck my t400 worked well on battery with the VM up. Really the switch comes down to what software you rely on. If you play games then keeping windows will probably be better. But if you're like me and only use slingbox and netflix on windows then you can easily switch. The flow and use of linux, IMHO, is just as good as windows 7.

    As far as migrating over you'll have to start from scratch with settings. But that is the fun of it as linux has such applications as compiz where you can creat a desktop cube. Data you can copy over as long as you have applications that can use it and it works on the file system.

    Again easy and fun switch, just depends on your needs.

    Seems to be the norm with the I series chips.

    Yeah id love to get an ssd and see how that changes things. Id love to get in the 6w range while actually using the computer. But 7-8 ain't bad for actually working.
     
  8. lead_org

    lead_org Purveyor of Truth

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    Your reincarnation into an Thinkpad enthusiast is complete, welcome to the Thinkpadder club...

    So are you going to get a DIY Vidock or something?
     
  9. vēer

    vēer Notebook Deity

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    True, but still quite disappointingly given that Core 2 Duo were cooler and consumed less power. I have no idea how NBR achieved such stellar battery life numbers with parameters and testing scenarious they had.

    I was thinking about X200s myself, but realised that with WXGA+ its out of my price-performance range, SL CPU series arent powerful enough for what I need my laptop.
    Then I was considering X201s somewhere in the nearest future, but again, way too pricey for WXGA+, also WXGA+ is very rare and probably wont be available brand new when I could afford it. Otherwise i7 LM CPU in X201s seems like good CPU for such ultraportable with great battey life.

    I do hope that Sandy Bridge will turn out to be great performer with excellent battery life and cool running temp's, unline overhyped Arrandale :D
     
  10. zhaos

    zhaos Notebook Consultant

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    I can get down to 8 with wifi on and brightness 5 on the T510, and it averages 12-13 say with light webbrowsing. Arrandale likes to jump up to high teens for wattage, which penryn does not do, but still, I think getting something like 14-25 watts on a T410 is high.
     
  11. ThinkRob

    ThinkRob Notebook Deity

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    7.5 W with the X200s is... well... you can do better.

    5.7 W is the lowest I've seen.
     
  12. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    LoL Yeah took me a while to come to my senses but I finally off loaded the vostro last night and Im waiting a day or 2 to see if my cousin is buying my XPS or if I have to sell it here or ebay. As for the vidock well Im a linux only user atm and I dont game so now my concern will to work on a dual monitor setup at home and get 2 cubes running. Not sure though since the t400 will be running a true server os.

    The x200s is originally what I wanted when I got my t400 but it was WAY out of my price range. Had to wait 2+ years to be able to afford one, and I got lucky as they are still going for 1500-2000 new. Mine may be "used" but there was no wear, came in the original box (the ultrabase was brand new), and even had the new thinkpad smell. :) All in all I couldnt be happier with the x200s it does everything I need and want it to do and is small and light as a feather even with the 9 cell.

    The i series is great on performance, but I wasnt a fan of the heat an power efficiency when I switched to my XPS. Sure I could power through anything, but my wrists were warm when using the XPS at its limit and I couldnt get much battery life out of it. But then again it was a workstation. 3.5-4.5 hours out of a discrete gpu + quad core cpu and all the other options isnt bad, but its far from what I wanted and needed. I really hope 2012 brings the i series past the c2d series on battery life and they run as cool or cooler. ::crosses fingers::

    Thats pretty nice! I would think the turbo feature on i series chips would be a big drain on the battery. I must admit I still prefer fixed clock speeds and cores.
     
  13. hp79

    hp79 Notebook Evangelist

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    Wow, 7-9 watt is a really nice low watt number for internet surfing.
    My x120e which is a zacate platform uses 7 - 8 watt on idle. 10 - 15 watt when surfing internet.

    How about watching a mp4 movie? 640*480 resolution movie uses 12.24 watt. With a 32 wh battery, I only get about 2.5 hours movie time.
     
  14. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Like I said I havent done any tweaking, still using a cyclical HDD, and no voltage reductions. Now is that 5.7w with actual use and not just a browser open either. When I got my 7.6w I was actively browsing, writing scripts in an ssh session and managing files and copying scripts in another ssh session on top of calc open etc. I could probably do alot better if I wasnt doing anything.
     
  15. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Havent tested with my new x200s, but when I get the t400 server up and running Ill test it out.
     
  16. not.sure

    not.sure Notebook Evangelist

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    Slightly OT:
    * what's the fan activity on those things when they are <10W?
    * are there any Thinpads (X-series I guess) without a fan?
     
  17. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Both of my thinkpads are dead silent. I'm assuming low or off, but then again I wouldn't even know if my fan failed they run so quiet.
     
  18. ThinkRob

    ThinkRob Notebook Deity

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    I could regularly stay around 6W whilst doing a good bit of work in a couple of SSH sessions, but I wasn't pushing the CPU. I also had an SSD and the ULV processor, which helped.
     
  19. KnightZero

    KnightZero Notebook Consultant

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    You got me curious, so I tested my X201 in Ubuntu. With screen brightness turned to the lowest, WLAN radios off, I average 12.5, with an occasional dip to 11.9 watts. Running the way I normally use it, 3/4ths brightness, wlan on, multiple programs running, I'm seeing about 13-15 watts. That's still enough for close to 7 hours of battery life on the 9 cell, so I can't complain much.
     
  20. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Well I found out my battery is at 66% and Im still getting 7-8 hours or more. Little upset, but thats what you get with used computers. Adding 9 cell to my list of todo's for this machine.

    Yeah the ULV and SSD make a good bit of difference vs my setup. I love the LV chip though as its the perfect balance between power and battery time.

    Not bad. I still think the turbo function kills the battery.
     
  21. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Stock specs and settings in ubuntu I average 11w while watching a movie with my browse still open (oops!). I dip into the 10s here and there as well.
     

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  22. thinkpadboy

    thinkpadboy Notebook Enthusiast

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    I don't know if it matters or not, but what is the res on this? Is it the stock 1280 x 800 or the 1440 x 900?
     
  23. aznguyphan

    aznguyphan Notebook Evangelist

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    Res is 1440x900 based on the screenshot.

    What wireless cards are you guys using? My Intel 5100 lights itself on fire when I used Ubuntu 10.04 and 10.10 on my x200s. Powertop did not fix the problem. Any advice?
     
  24. Jayayess1190

    Jayayess1190 Waiting on Intel Cannonlake

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    The X200s is only available with 1440x900.
     
  25. aznguyphan

    aznguyphan Notebook Evangelist

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    My x200s has a 1280x800 screen (and webcam)
     
  26. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Like the others said its a WXGA+ 1440x900 screen. Its an amazingly bright and pwer efficient screen and the resolution helped me transition from my t400 VERY easily.

    Im on the intel 5100 too and the only time the computer even gets close to room temperature is when I have it on the dock and working it pretty hard at work. Other then that it runs cool. Right now running 10.10 and working pretty hard the fan isnt even on in my x200s. I would say you may have a bad card as the 5100 in my t400 runs cool as well under linux.

    The x200s WXGA+ was an option, not standard.

    I wish mine had a webcam, but when I really think about it I dont skype anymore so not a deal breaker for me. Im just glad I got the WXGA+ option, but then again that would have been a deal breaker either.
     
  27. ThinkRob

    ThinkRob Notebook Deity

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    Have you run through the suggestions that powertop offers? If not, you can probably drop a watt or so off of that. Also, have you enabled WLAN power saving? If not, you might want to, as it will produce a noticeable reduction in power usage.

    Odd. I've got a couple machines with the 5100 running Debian stable, and they don't have any heat problems at all.

    You might want to double check that power saving is on for your card though -- powertop won't suggest it for the newer cards IIRC, so you'd have to do it yourself.
     
  28. thinkpadboy

    thinkpadboy Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thanks guys for the confirmation.

    Sphinx, you say it made your transition FROM t400 very easy..... Did you not find the 1440 x 900 to be too small on the 12.1 from the 14.1 1400 x 900 on the t400?

    Boy that's a mouthful :)


    Thanks!
     
  29. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Nope. the difference in size isnt huge and I have good eyesight still. Things are obviously smaller, but not too small that I have to squint or anything. Sad as 1440x900 is near perfect for this size. Maybe one day they will put 1600x900 in the x series laptops.
     
  30. thinkpadboy

    thinkpadboy Notebook Enthusiast

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    Boy, I wish. Though they seem to be going the wrong way.. The x220 they are coming out with is only 1366 x 768! Someone over at Lenovo needs to be slapped!

    Seems if you want a higher res, you have to keep going back to the older models. It's a shame.

    Since you seem to be a higher res guy. Would you say you prefer 1400 x 1050 4:3 12.1 screen or the 1440x900 16:10 12.1 screen?

    I guess it may also depend on what kind of work you do....... I prefer the former because I"m a web developer / programmer, and like the higher vertical res.

    But I'm curious which one do you find more comfortable to work with? This is provided you have used a 1400 x 1050 screen in the past.

    Thanks!
     
  31. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    I haven't worked on that resolution in years, but given the choice it would depend on the keyboard. If nothing else changed I would take as much vertical resolution as I can get as I too develop a bit here and there, as well as I write scripts. Vertical resolution is the highest commodity to computer users like us and seems like every few years they stick it to us to favor the fewer that only watch movies on their laptops.

    The reason I said it would matter on the keyboard is that 4:3 12in laptops have a squished or compact keyboard when compared to 16:10 laptops. While 4:3 resolutions were higher, getting an x series meant dealing with a smaller then normal keyboard which is tied for the most important feature for computing professionals. The keyboard in my x200s is the exact same as my t400 and thus perfect for all day computing without adjustment to and from a larger thinkpad. But again if all else stayed the same yes I would take as much top to bottom pixels I can get. :) Hence why I went from a 2010 XPS to a 2008 x200s. Much much smaller computer but pretty close to the vertical resolution I had in the XPS.
     
  32. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Oh and BTW I was writing a very basic process script and surfing and got down to 7.3w without adjustments. For some reason I had to edit this one in gimp to upload. Sorry if its too small.
     

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  33. thinkpadboy

    thinkpadboy Notebook Enthusiast

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    Point about the keyboard is well taken! You are absolutely right. With the 4:3 layout, you don't get the full keyboard. That's a nice to have.

    I'm glad you agree that 4:3 layout makes more sense. And yes, it's a frekin' laptop not a dvd player... For the love of thinkpads!!! :)

    This really helps though Sphinx. I'll be scouring ebay for an x200s with 1440x900. Or an x61 with 1400 x 1050. I think I'll be happy with either.

    Am going to hold off on the x220. Maybe they'll get IPS screens for the t series and come out with a nice 14 inch 1440 x 900 or 1600 x 900 for a t4xx <insert drooling image here!>

    :)
     
  34. thinkpadboy

    thinkpadboy Notebook Enthusiast

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    7.3!! Jeez!

    Talk about sipping!! So, that batt must last you like 8+ hours? Essentially you are going a full day on one charge?
     
  35. User Retired 2

    User Retired 2 Notebook Nobel Laureate NBR Reviewer

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    Comparative: Win7 maximized battery life on SL9400-1.86 2530P per sig

    My DC profile is as follows:

    1. brightness set to 3 bars
    2. wifi 'power transmit' set to 5. Highest. Ad-Hoc 5100AGN power management set to "maximum savings"
    3. Run [email protected] undervolted with Throttlestop by use "DCExitTime/ExitTime" so TS exists once it's set this up to reduce monitoring load.
    4. Set 4500MHD graphics to "maximum power savings"
    5. BIOS has LAN disabled
    6. Intel RST drivers for Win7 - uses AHCI Link Power State Management to improve battery life.

    With this DC profile my system idles at 5.0W (!!) wifi on three bars but idle. This is very impressive. My 52Whr 6-cell is lasting 7:43hrs as confirmed by batterybar. If I had a 93Whr 9-cell battery then I'd be getting 13:50 of real battery life.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I find Ubuntu doesn't idle as low as WIn7 though I've seen it in the mid 6W without doing any optimizations.
     
  36. vēer

    vēer Notebook Deity

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    Wow, thanks for sharing!
    Didnt know that such impressive results can be achieved with more tweaking!
    You dont find such threads with info how to extend battery life here except for Power Manager settings and BIOS port and feature tweaks.


    BTW, that driver link doesnt work - 404.
     
  37. User Retired 2

    User Retired 2 Notebook Nobel Laureate NBR Reviewer

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    Works fine for me:

    [​IMG]
     
  38. aznguyphan

    aznguyphan Notebook Evangelist

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    3 bars out of how many? What all is running when you take the measurement?

    Also what is the minimum you guys are getting on Ubuntu with the x200s then.

    We should be doing 0 brightness, 0 activity, wi-fi on but idle to really be able to compare across OS's shouldn't we
     
  39. zhaos

    zhaos Notebook Consultant

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    So I was using my T510, reading a PDF document on google chrome (a really light workload), and saw a minimum wattage of 7.8 or so. This was at brightness 5. So it should be possible to reach even lower with a T410 or with a low voltage x201 series.

    Webbrowsing can really eat up your battery life; flash websites are killer. Once I go onto more flash heavy sites, the battery life remaining drops dramatically.
     
  40. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Yeah either will work well. Even if you use one of the hefty IDEs like VS or eclipse they will run well. Me Im a vi/vim guy when it comes to scripts and such. So if youre like me then either will work VERY well.

    Yeah its pretty abused as the last person probably let the laptop sit on a dock and used external peripherals all day as the laptop looks brand new yet the battery is at 66% capacity. Still get 8+ hours though and will definitely be getting a new battery and SSD for it this year.
     
  41. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    My x200s is stock no tweaks at all. If I let it idle Im sure it would dip into the 6w area, but who cares about idle usage? 7.3w while actually working with ZERO tweaks isnt bad. When I find time Ill do some tweaks and undervolting and see what I can get before I switch to an SSD. Im confident I can shave alot more off, but again 7.3w stock with the standard power settings ain't bad.

    Idle measurements are useless IMHO. I want to see how low I can get doing actual work and see what kind of useful battery life I can get.

    Thats pretty impressive for a 15in laptop! What kind of tweaks do you have done? I cant wait to start tweaking power settings and get an SSD to see how low I can go.
     
  42. aznguyphan

    aznguyphan Notebook Evangelist

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    They're not practical, but there's really no way to compare power management tests with out a common baseline. Everyone considers 'work' different. I've never done any of the work you've been describing so I have no idea how intense what you're doing is.

    Although I do remember the lowest I could get my x200s under Ubuntu was around 8W and that was dead idle. Right now in W7, with a single browser tab and Word open, 9/15 brightness, I'm at 6W.
     
  43. User Retired 2

    User Retired 2 Notebook Nobel Laureate NBR Reviewer

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    A small update to my previous post. I originally found the Intel Rapid Storage Drivers lowered my Win7 idle power by 0.6-0.8W. However, this was accompanied by startup BSOD 0x7B so was not a solution.

    After some trial-and-error I found I could get the same power savings with the standard Microsoft driver by setting "Attribute=1" in the following Balanced Power registry keys. This then revealed AHCI Link Power Management in Power-> [Plan]->Advanced->Harddisks. I set these options to HIPM+HIDM and 100ms respectively.
    Code:
    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet\Control\Power\PowerSettings\0012ee47-9041-4b5d-9b77-535fba8b1442\0b2d69d7-a2a1-449c-9680-f91c70521c60
    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet\Control\Power\PowerSettings\0012ee47-9041-4b5d-9b77-535fba8b1442\dab60367-53fe-4fbc-825e-521d069d2456
    [​IMG]
     
  44. Thaenatos

    Thaenatos Zero Cool

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    Good point.
     
  45. Apal

    Apal Newbie

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    That seems interesting!
    Could you tell me if both of your X200s are dead silent in light web browsing (no Flash) scenario? And are they getting noisy once playing a Flash movie?
    Or when playing a HD 1080p vid?

    I've read that fan management didn't used to work very well under Linux with these Laptops resulting in a noisy fan spinning constantly, so I want to know if it's still the case with actual GNU/Linux distros!