*HP EliteBook 8740w Owners Lounge - PART 2*

It seems HP has released BIOS F.09 to the public ( LINK).

CAUTION: IF YOU HAVE THE NVIDIA QUADRO FX5000M GRAPHICS CARD, DON'T FLASH THIS VERSION, AS IT MAY BE INCOMPATIBLE WITH THIS CARD AND LEAVE YOUR SYSTEM UNUSABLE.
This has been confirmed by my technician and other people in this forum.

Either HP has fixed the incompatibility issue described before or it's a very big mistake

 

I just ran a bunch of updates in Win7, and it looks like the new Firepro driver allows Aero to be run under 10-bit color!

 

You must not have been keeping-up with your reading in this thread...

 

Why so serious?

Why would it be incompatible with the FX5000M?
BIOS updates usually just add enhancements and/or fixes from previous iterations. Like Service Packs.
For example, when you install SP3, you're getting everything from the previous SPs, in addition to the new updates.
Since FX5000M compatibility has already been addressed with F.08, why wouldn't it present on BIOS F.09?

Unless of course, they inadvertently created a new problem on the latest BIOS, like a bug that affects compatibility, then that's a different story.

 

Hello folks,

This is my first post ever and I stumbled upon this thread while researching several mobile workstations in order to begin working with 3D Studio Max, Maya, Zbrush... etc. and of course some gaming I am about to begin my University studies in 3D Animation, Modeling & CG this Spring 2011 so I decided to purchase a mobile workstation this Thanksgiving for two reasons: 1) To get an early start working on 3D 2) To possibly take advantage of any holiday discounts if any. At first I kept going to the Dell website and customizing several versions of the Dell Precision M6500 to find a reasonable price that matched my specifications. I read most of the posts in this thread and I believe it was the DC2 that won me over to HP. I'm looking for a good configuration of the 8740w and so far I have this:

Intel Core i7-840QM
17.0-inch diagonal LED-backlit DreamColor® WUXGA WVA anti-glare (1920 x 1200) with camera
ATI Firepro M7820 or Nvidia Quadro FX 2800M (debating)
2 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 SDRAM
250GB 7200RPM Hard Drive

So far this is what I have going and if any of you have any suggestion please feel free to do so. I'm still debating between the ATI M7820 and the Nvidia 2800. I've read several posts on this here and elsewhere. It seems most 8740w owners on this thread prefer the M7820, however I can't recall if the 2D issue has been repaired. I believe I read something along the lines of using drivers from the 5870 to help with this issue? Please correct me if I am wrong. Has the M7820 received any additional driver support lately?

Anyways I'm still on the fence about this but I'm pretty sure I will go with HP, it all depends if I can catch a good deal with them. Have you guys encountered many issues with your 8740w? I know some of this might be repetitive for you guys but any help is appreciated.

 

It's a long one, for sure. I just did a search, and I noticed you had a few posts on it. I guess the verdict is that 10-bit is being used internally by the graphics card, but it's still being truncated/rounded to 8-bit when it gets to Aero?

 

As a student I highly recommend that you save your cash and go for the ATI card. I have the FX5000M and 2D scores are even lower than the ATI. Also, when you need to use these highly demanding programs in school, you will be given access to much faster workstations in the computer labs. The differences you get in moving from ATI to Nvidia (assuming the program can use CUDA) are really only justifiable on a cost basis if you are processing things constantly on the laptop. If you have a project that large, you will just take it to the computer lab. Then again, maybe money isn't an issue, in which case you do whatever you want.

Finally, send me an email. My rep has been good at hooking people up with 28% discounts (for CTO orders). [insert my user name]@yahoo.com

 

If you choose this machine, you'll be joining a group of very happy people around here. Some suggestions:

Configure the pc online, but then call the 800 # for a sales rep. By doing so, many of us have negotiated a 28% discount on the price. The rep can capture your online configuration so you'll get it the way you want it.

You mention only 2 GIG of RAM. I assume you'll be adding additional RAM after receiving the pc. I have 8 GIG and my base memory usage with no stress hovers around 25%-30%.

The ATI is a great card for both power and value, and with the latest drivers has eliminated what appeared to be the 2D problems. If you need CUDA now for specific reasons, then you would have to go with Nvidia, but keep in mind that ATI was an original member of the OpenCL group and is stepping up its functionality in its latest drivers. We have heard from another member that HP and ATI are working on a newer dedicated driver for this machine (and the 8540w).

As a long term customer, I checked out Dell as well. But the Elitebooks just blew me away, especially since my first priority after a quality build is what the screen looks like. And this screen just looks like WOW.

Hope I've been some help, and hopefully you'll be reporting back to us soon as a happy new user.

 

Yep, me too. I am getting closer to being ready to make the plunge (although for budgetary reasons it will probably have to wait until after January 1, which is killing me!). And that is one of the big things that is still up in the air for me.

I plan on using it mostly for photo processing (and a little bit for gaming - although really only FIFA and PES).

But the primary reason I'm buying it is for photography. Actually, at the moment I've just been using Lightroom mostly, but do plan on getting Photoshop in the near future. But I am no engineer, so I'll never need CAD or anything like that. So getting the DC2 is an easy choice, but I'm just not sure about which graphics card. Hmm, am I talking myself into the 7820? It sure would be nice to save the $$. Decisions...decisions...

 

The point is you're not only saving money with the 7820, you're getting better graphics performance. See e.g here for rough benchmarks:

Mobile Graphics Cards - Benchmark List - Notebookcheck.net Tech

So unless you have a specific need for an nVidia gpu, the ATI card is sort of a non-brainer.

 

If you don't mind me asking, what was your reasoning for choosing the FX5000M? I don't plan on doing any heavy rendering on the laptop, for that I would use a desktop for quicker rendering as you stated.

Done.

 

I didn't choose FX5000M, it chose me. You'd need to go back to the old thread to get the whole story. In short, I ordered [720qm, M7820, 4GB(2D), non-DC]. It didn't work right, they sent me [820qm, M7820, 8GB(4D), non-DC] for trade to study my laptop. The one they sent had the same problem. Fast forward 3 months and now I have [740qm, FX5000M, 8GB(2D), DC].

 

Thanks for the advice.

Yes I do plan on obtaining additional RAM after receiving it. What's the base core temperature on the 8740w? Or does it vary? I'm not that familiar with core temps so I'll have to dig up some of the old posts here.

Yes you have helped tremendously! Thank you.

It's exactly what I'm looking for, something that is good quality in addition to having a spectacular screen.

You mentioned a new dedicated driver for this machine, any particular insight on that?

 

First to Dark Ritual, I think you're making the right choice. I also agree with Knight's recommendation of going with the ATI card and saving a bunch of money! I'm a commerical Web Designer/Developer, Graphics Artist, and Photographer and use Adobe Photoshop CS5, Lightroom 3, and many other graphics programs for my work. I'm convinced the ATI card will work fine for these applicatioins. And I'm sure it will work well when I want to play games too!

I placed my order for my 8740w 8-days ago and now I'm in the waiting process. I spent many months searching for the best laptop and I'm convinced the HP Elitebook 8740w is the best available (based on all of the end-user comments I've read over those many months).

You will also appreciate having so many professional, highly-intelligent, knowledgeable, and good-looking 8740w owners here in the Owners Lounge to help you if/when necessary.


Wizman

As for Knight's HP Sales rep (now my Sales rep too), she will likely give will you a 28% discount if you ask her for it. She's seems like a nice lady on the phone, but she also appears to be seriously lacking in her "follow up and follow through". Except for calling me back the day I placed my order, she has ignored and/or not responded to at least five e-mail requests from me...including my request to fix a problem with my order configuration. Maybe she just doesn't like using e-mail?

For example, after not receiving an order confirmation from HP for almost 5 days, I e-mailed her for help early one morning. After not hearing back from her for most of that day, I called her on the phone. She acknowledged receiving my e-mail, but didn't say why she hadn't responded. Then she mumbled something about my order and then said she would look into the order confirmation.

One hour later, I got an order confirmation from HP via e-mail showing that my order had just been placed that day...not when I ordered it 5 days previously. Maybe not a problem, but I bet I lost at least 5 days in the build process...and possibly an earlier ship date. Why wasn't my order placed immediately when I gave it to her 5 days previously? She won't say.

Speaking of ship date, I sent my HP Sales rep several e-mail requests to confirm my " Estimated Ship Date" and still have not received any response from her. I called her today on the phone and left a message...and haven't heard back from her. I don't consider this good customer sales support.

Forgive me if I sound like I'm complaining, but I expected my 8740w order process to go a bit smoother then it has. I guess the moral of my story is... you'll get the 28% discount if you ask for it and make sure you carefully check your order configuration after she e-mails a confirming copy back to you. That e-mail shows the final configuration that will be submitted to the factory to build. I'm sure glad I carefully checked it and got her to make the necessary corrections before my laptop was built.

And thanks again to Knight for providing me his HP Sales rep contact information. Good or bad, she got my 8740w order submitted and the 28% discount is much appreciated! I assume sooner or later, I will receive an "Estimated Ship Date"?

 

I quoted the F.09 bios a few days ago.

we have 3 machines running 5000m's running it, but it seems to be stable.

If you are concerned, then i would wait yes. I am only on it because the server updated my machine with SSM.

 

Are you experiencing the same system crash and battery issues that knight is having with his machine?

Did F.09 fix the battery issue?

 

ok;

I see you're into animation/3d/graphics like a few of us here.

I have the 2800M in my machine. For 3DS Max/autocad, the nvidia drivers also support the acceleration, however ATI are working to get the same functionality.

i hate to say it, but max and maya, run better on the 2800/3800/ ATI than on the 5000M. this is due to drivers at the moment, but i get faster FPS and speed on the older nvid cards and the ati machine one of the guys has. for the 400 bucks difference, do the ATI.

if you are into mental ray rendering, i would do a search on IRAY (it is a GPU renderer for nvidia cards) that does GPU rendering. It's pretty quick!

for graphics / video editing, i have 16GB of ram (32 at the end of december!) and i can actually max that out in photoshop and after effects. 3ds max uses up to about 11GB, and Maya tops out at about 9GB. cheaper to buy outside of your order because of price.

As for the dedicated driver from ATI.

The hp guys here in hongkong claim its going to be like the nvidia 'maximise' driver. it is installed alongside the firepro driver, and will give GPU enhancements to autodesk and adobe products. they used to do this a long time ago (back when i had my NW8440) but support lessened a bit. it is likely to be able to give 12-30% better performance than with just the ordinary driver. (source HP HK Tech)

I will be posting a long list of specifications later today, i am just waiting on the final battery tests for our 5000M machine.

 

The battery issue is fixed. but the dead screen issues are still about.

we get it maybe once every 2-3 reboots now.

HP HK claim its the issue i talked about a while ago, with a slight incompatibility with the 5000M and the DC2.

The 5000M on the TN panel now has no problems at all.

we have about 12 8740w's here, with varying config.

 

Bummer. I ordered my original machine through one rep (I think I got him from Aikimox). But he got promoted and passed me onto another guy right after confirming my order. Both of them gave me awesome support, answering all my questions thoroughly and promptly via email. I started giving out the second guy's info to NBR members, but he got promoted too. I asked him for a new rep which is how I got "her" info. I haven't had much actual contact with her, I just wanted someone willing to keep that 28% discount alive for other NBR members.

 

on a side note, i now have my 230W power supply - was £44 but will be free when i send my other one back to HP. I've scrounged some CPU paste off a mate, and am now back on the 920XM! I've now also readded my expresscard SSD, and my SDXC card back into my machine as well as the UN2420 WWAN card. i can finally be happy

No random shutdowns so far.

 

Cool. Thanks

BTW I noticed on your signature you have
"SQL-04 HP Sandy Bridge March 2011"

Has Sandy Bridge been confirmed for March 2011?
I've heard 2011 before but with no specific month.

Also, typically the new CPUs first come out on desktops and then a few months later, we get the mobile versions.

Do you have any insight as to when the mobile Sandy Bridge chips will in fact be available?
I'm curious to find out when the mobile Sandy Bridge upgrade will occur and how long before HP starts using it.

I thought all laptops with DC2 and FX3800M/FX5000M by default came with the 230W PS.
Are they being shipped with the 200W PS?


@Knight, which one did you get?

 

HP hk told me the mobile versions will be orderable from the beginning of Q2 2011. still semi unofficial.

I don't have a 3800m/5000m / dc2 setup. but i have a lot of other things inside my machine.

And yes, all 6 of our 3800m/5000M dc2 machines came with a 200W PSU. you need to make sure they give you the RIGHT psu!!!

 

Sounds like you like your laptop maxed out.
So you have an expresscard SSD attached to the left of the laptop?
That's quite a lot of stage. Why not an SSD RAID setup?

BTW, do you know if that extra mini PCI slot (next to the 6300 Ult-N card) can be used to add one of those mini SSD cards.
It looks like something could be added, but I'm not sure what is available.

 

I got the 200W PSU. i asked my tech about it and here is what he said.

Also, my crashes have never happened when stressing the system. They seem to be random. So I'm thinking it is NOT from tripping the PSU.

Also, I had my 4th crash tonight. That's 4 since approximately Nov 1...about once every 3 days so far. At least it's better than my previous two machines.

 

the extra slot is whitelisted for the UN2420 WWAN cards only.

I tried one already and no dice.

 

I see.

I seem to recall some info in the user manual that said if you have 920xm/3800m/DC2 that it required the 230W PS.

I thought it was still valid for systems with 3800m/5000m + DC2.

 

I see.
So you can only use the UN2420 WWAN provided by HP then?
You tried a 3rd party card?

 

The tech you are talking to is speaking out of his backside. the draw can go over 200W on our 940XM/5000M/DC2. I got one delivered to me from the UK, because the techs there were concerned about draw when i put the 920XM in my 2800M machine. I got the PSU on warranty as well. because the 200W is not designed for the xm cpus.

 

I tried the Dell one, the toshiba one. but in the end only the HP one worked.

I have no idea how to adjust the whitelist for it.

Maybe if we ask enough to them they'll let us have the SSD cards in that slot.

 

If you CTO, here is what is says under Adapter:

But my model does not have an extreme cpu, so for now HP doesn't think it is necessary.

Is there an easy way for me to prove I am tripping the PSU? Or at least a way to tell much I am actually drawing?

 

That's my theory/belief based on the post I linked to.

 

Got it.
I wonder if the 230W PS is an option you have to pay for or if it's just a matter of clicking it so it gets added to the order.

You could try using a Kill-a-watt to monitor usage.

 

Hi,

been trying to run ubuntu on this machine.. but it seems like it just wont boot correctly... anyhelp?

 

I don't know how accurate it is, but the HP power utility that comes with the notebook shows current power consumption. (With an i7 820 and a Firepro 7820, I was only able to get mine up to around 150W by running some cpu and gpu intensive aps at max screen brightness simultaneously.)

 

Any thoughts on the merits of paying extra for the nVidia high end cards over the ATI card? I am a CAD/CAE user (Pro/E, Inventor, Solidworks, CFDesign, ANSYS Workbench, etc.) as opposed to a gamer, and was under the inpression that the nVidia FX 2800M/3800M/5000M cards were best for these applications. Also, I would like to learn the differences/advantages of the GDDR3 vs. GDDR5 memory of the two card types.

I currently have a HP/Compaq nw9440 that I have been very happy with, and am looking forard to getting my new 8740w. Based on the many iformative posts, I plan to go with a DC2 display, Quad Core CPU, and non-backlit KB.

 

I had tried looking there, but there is an error message. It told me the draw varied from 175-225W under light load (max screen). See below.




I just tried it while running a gpu bench and cpu bench. I think it might be a little bit off.

Note how the needle has spun all the way around!

 

Two thoughts...

1) To know power draw/utilization of the power brick for sure, I recommend connecting to a UPS that has an LCD display and is capable of showing multiple statistics, one of them being power utilization of whatever's plugged into it. Plug just the laptop in, viola. I've got a Geek Squad UPS that has this capability and I've found many uses for it.

2) I wonder if the boot to black problems are due to low or dirty voltage to the power supply? I live out on a 'sort-of' island off the north shore of LI (island connected by a sand-bar). There's just one road in and out. And just one power feed serving the hundreds of homes. I only get 110-115v to my outlets at many times of the day. That's considered "low" by many standards. I haven't put my oscilloscope on it in a long time but when I did years ago, there was noticeable noise too. I'm wondering if everyone else that has the boot to black experience has low or dirty voltage in their location?

[EDIT] I'd like to add... many following the past two 8740w threads may recall I've never, never once, been able to click "Reboot" via a warm restart and successfully have the machine re-start; I've always had to shut-down, and cold start. That's also out in my main home in LI. We keep a pied-a-terre in NYC too as the 4+ hour commute both ways was too much for my wife, who has to work in NYC 3 or 4 days a week. Well I'm in NYC now. And for the 1st time ever, I've successfully warm re-booted. I'll have to do it a few times to make sure I see consistent success; and re-boot plugged-in on LI to make sure it still fails. So I'll get back to you on that. (It makes me wonder, have I ever tried to warm boot on battery? I don't think I have. So I'll have to try that. Of course, location should not matter in that case; if it does, that could lead to the Wireless-N networking being a problem on boot as it's the only difference in the two locations. We'll see.)

[REEDIT] I immediately did a re-boot after adding this above. I was welcomed with a Bluescreen right when I got the 4 windows boot tones at the time the screen would re-start, attributable to atikmdag.sys ... but it successfully warm re-booted automatically instead of booting to black as it would out on LI. Ok, so this computer still has some f-ed-up-ness to it... but I still think power has something to do with it as it still successfully warm re-booted after that.

 

I get that error message too, but the power reading does seem to reflect my actual power usage.

Just a little. Does make you wonder if that happens when you go over 270W power consumption --- maybe add applications bit by bit and see if you get close to 270W before the needle swings round (or use more reliable software to measure power consumption, of course...)

That notebook should definitely keep you warm on those cold winter nights though --- my power consumption (ATI 7820, i7 820, DC2 screen) is typically something like 50 - 90W under normal usage.

Not me, and I'm pretty sure I've had the "boot to black" happen on battery power as well. I don't get it consistently on rebooting, like you though, just occasionally as for cold starts.

I actually sent my 8740w in to HP to get this issue fixed (get it back Monday) and I'll let you know what happens.

After I checked that you can run external displays off the notebook even though its screen is black/off (and it's a lot easier to shut down using an external monitor when you're not doing it blind) the HP support tech concluded it must be display problem (which I don't believe it is---at least, not a defective display or a loose power connection). So I'm giving them 50% odds for tinkering with or replacing the display and not fixing the problem, but we'll see.

 

I got my replacement keyboard; the non-BL keyboard is definitely better. It is sturdier, the keys have a nicer tactile feel, it's quieter, and there is less flex in the upper left. I also think it is a bit quieter.

The keys also have a different surface coating on them; it is more "grippy" and feels of higher quality.

Overall it is still not the best keyboard I have used though I am satisfied and have no problems using it.

----

Oh and regarding the restart issues -- I noticed with mine that when I click Shut Down, sometimes it restarts. I believe I fixed the problem by unplugging my external mouse every time I shut down.

 

I watched it turn all the way around, I saw readings of 300-500W (buried the needle) before getting it up over 600W.

 

Just the response I was hoping to get! And thanks for the link. ATI it is!

 

I'm curious...when buying the 8740w via CTO, why not buy the 230W PS instead of the standard 200W...even if you don't need the extra power initially? Certainly seems to be worth the extra $10 (here in the U.S.) when ordering. That's what I did. Seems like a no brainer...unless the 230W PS weights an extra pound or two compared to the standard 200W PS.

On a different topic, can someone please tell me how long it took you to get an Estimated Ship Date from HP after placing your 8740w order? I just need a reality check. Thanks.

 

I didn't even know whether it was automatically included on the fully loaded machines or if it was option you had to pay for.
I was under the impression that if you configured your laptop to the max. (in which case even HP says you need it) then HP would automatically include it.

I'm guessing the $10 you're quoting is the upgrade price and not the price of a separate 230W PS. (i.e. they'll replace the regular 200W PS with the 230W.)
If you have to buy it separately, I'm sure it would be considerably more than that. Probably more like $60-$80.

If you know for a fact that you will be upgrading your laptop to the max. in the future, I would certainly agree that for $10, it's worth getting the bigger PS.
Otherwise, for those who are more conscious about the weight or size of their laptops, the bigger PS may not be worth upgrading to.
Note: I don't know what the size/weight difference is between the two PS. But it's probably safe to say the 230W is in fact bigger.

For me, the size and weight of a laptop or PS are not deciding factors.
So if I were to do a CTO, then I would probably go for the 230W PS.

 

The larger 230W PS is NOT automatically included with fully loaded machines when CTO configured. You have to watch for the blue or red highlighed text warnings that HP wants you to select a particular optional item. It may not be an oversight that HP didn't make these selections automatic for you during CTO. I think they want you to know that some options are needed, but cost extra money (i.e. no surprises that way). I assume the required options are included with HP pre-configured machines.

Yes, the $10 is the cost of upgrading from the standard 200W PS to the 230W PS during CTO. Even without any warnings from HP during the CTO configuration process, I figured it was worth the $10 upgrade while I was ordering (just in case I ever decide to overclock the i7-940QM Extreme I ordered...or add something big and nasty in the future).

I haven't check the price of the 230W PS, but I bet it is considerably more then $60-80$ (i.e. $100-$150?). By the way, can I order parts for my 8740W through my HP Sales rep and get a discount or is my only option going through HP's "PartSurfer"...and pay full price?

I can't wait to see the size/weight of the new HP "kilowatt" PS in some future 87x0w.

I totally agree...which is why I ordered the 230W PS.

 

Don't know.
But there's one easy way to find out.
While you're at it, ask if he/she can apply the 28% discount (or something close) to additional hardware purchases.

 

When I ordered my machines and received the original 28% discount, that was only on the pc(s) themselves, other items (extra power supply, etc.) were only discounted at 8.4%. This may be their limit. But after the 8740w delivery and misconfigured 8540W problems when they gave me the additional 10% discount on the pc(s), the rep also extended that 10% to my next (non-pc) order. Maybe 10% is the top? YMMV Good Luck.

 

ok,

@knight

check to see if 'power data monitor' is enabled in the bios. will stop those crazy readings.

Our 5000m machine does trip out my 200w power supply ON BOOT which i have NO explanation for in the slightest, but does result in a black screen. i used my 200w one to power it up yesterday, and pop, the thing tripped. I am now getting the feeling it's drawing high on post. (when i did the draw test via our ups on startup - 204w) this is enough to blackscreen on the 200w supply.

@psu questions:
The 230w PSU can be exchanged on warranty - i did mine. you need to buy it first then ship back your old one for a refund. it costs about $60.

@m8o

Yes, some of the EARLIER power supply models gave out dirty voltages on the ground line to the laptop within the first 10 seconds of power on. it's what killed my first 8740w. i would get stop 0x124 errors on boot on my 2800M which is a PCIE hardware problem. I found out later, the gpu was not liking the power sent to it so it halted.

Something to speak to the rep about.

I've been away to shanghai. hence why i didn't reply earlier.

I will post up my long list of benches, and will invite you all to add your own.

(it will be in a new thread)

Sio

 

Because this machine cost me a LOT OF MONEY, and I had to sacrifice other things in order to afford it. Maybe this machine would cost for you under 3K, since you're an american user, but europeans have to pay a very high price for these custom-made models. That being said, the backlit keyboard quality is unbearable for a "Rolls Royce" computer like this. And on top of that, I don't have my computer at this moment as I'm waiting for a replacement due to quality issues (ETA is about 3-4 weeks). I have sense of humour, of course, but this is not a joke for me.

My technician confirmed this. I said the truth. So do it at your own risk, if you wish.

 

@ HiddenUser:

We've just rolled back all our 5000M machines to F.08. No Idea why, but the guy who maintains the SSM server was told to do this. As we are a corporate environment, this is proof enough the F.09 bios is not recommended, even though it appears stable.

I apoligise for my brash comment regarding your techie, seems i was in the wrong.

Bench thread is up, Please comment in here, not in that thread please!!

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hp-business-class-notebooks/533278-8740w-benching-specs-thread.html