what isn't causing my crashing

Not sure where to put this...mods move if necessary.

I've ordered a new laptop because my old one is literally falling apart at the seams. The top is starting to seperate from the bottom and its held together by a spring clip.

When I pick it up when its running, it will sometimes BSOD and sometimes just freeze so that I have to reboot.
If I leave it on the desk at all times it works fine. So my question is, can I be sure what is NOT going bad and causing this crashing? I'd really like to use the hard drive in the new laptop if I can be pretty sure its not at fault.

 

How old is the drive? You can use some programs to check the drive health but if it's already 3-4 years old you may be asking for trouble.


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I can't afford a new drive.

I ran a S.M.A.R.T. test and SDT Short-Drive_Test with Seatools and both checked out OK. I honestly don't think I have an intrinsic hardware problem, because it only crashes when I move the computer and as I said, its literally falling apart. But I'm no computer tech. It seems though that moving it is just causing strain/pressure at the wrong spot. Whether its causing the DD drive to stop spinning or some other kind of short/problem is what I don't know. I just know it doesn't happen when its stationary.

 

Unlikely to be HDD. More likely that flexing of the motherboard is causing disconnects on the numerous connectors inside the laptop. Flexing of the motherboard could also be causing disconnects on BGA' chips, which is more serious but equally likely. Assuming the motherboard is solid, another option is to look at simply replacing the case with a new/lightly used on from ebay. etc. If you are handy, this could be the easiest and lowest cost solution.

 

That's reassuring, thanks. I just ran a long test on the drive and it checks out OK too.

I didn't even know you can replace the case. But the new-to-me laptop is already on the way, and I'm probably not quite handy enough to do a total organ transplant from one laptop to another.

 

I was going to mention this as well. But if it is BSOD when moving the laptop though, there's no way to know for certain that it's the case and OP would be out the money for the case + cost of the new laptop if it didn't work. I'd say the drive is fine if it passes chkdsk /s.

 

Even if the drive is fine NOW, what's the MTBF for that model? At four or five years old, you may be gambling. Transfer the data to the new computer the old fashioned way, don't try and transplant the drive.


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Can appreciate that the budget may not be ready for a new drive, but I think the actual question is; can you survive possibly losing all your data and use of your system though?

BSOD'ing only while moving it seems to indicate a short (pinching a wire/etc.) inside.

It can also be the HDD's heads having become weaker and touching the platters too...

One of my basic rules of computing: if I can't trust a system to be reliable and dependable for how I need to use it; it is replaced. If replacing the entire system isn't possible; replace parts until it is stable again.

Good luck.

 

@Wayne99 try running Linux from a flash drive and moving the notebook, maybe even flexing it a bit. If no problems occur, the problem is likely the OS, not hardware, and you just need a clean install.

 

Huh. That's interesting. All I had on hand was a Puppy CD, but that worked fine no matter how much I flexed the machine. I don't understand how flexing the machine can kill the OS. .

 

@wayne then, the problem is most likely not your hardware, but your OS install. Clean install the OS, and repaste the machine just to be on the safe side - and the problems will be gone. If your machine has dGPU, also try disabling it in BIOS.

 

Well...hehe...there is still a hardware problem of sorts. The laptop is still falling apart. Maybe I'll just make this my personal Linux machine until it falls to pieces and leave the Thinkpad for work stuff that requires Windows.

 

@Wayne99 or you can get the replacement parts and/or fix it and sell it - getting valuable experience along the way. (= Whatever your choice will be, BSODs are usually caused by software problems, not hardware - and thus easy to deal with. Even some hardware problems are easy to solve, e.g. failing HDD or failing dGPU on Optimus-enabled machine.

 

Ok just for giggles, how hard is it to replace a bottom case? I'm guessing its a bit more than I want to take on. I'm not even sure that would cure all its ills, since one hinge has popped out completely

 

@Wayne99 I'd say, if you have a service manual and don't need to disassemble display module, it is OK even if you didn't do it before. Get a sheet of paper and sticky tape; when disassembling, on each step write down where did you get the screws from and attach them near the writing, it really helps when disassembling something for a first time.

However, before disassembling, you should first make sure the problem is software; once you're sure, disassemble it to determine which parts are causing aesthetic problems. Also, it would be wiser to wait till new laptop arrives before disassembling old one; reinstalling OS is fine, doesn't take too long, sooner you do it the better.

Bottom line, laptops (and many other devices, for that matter) ain't rocket science. (=

 

I still don't grasp how flexing of the computer causes software problems though. And I only get BSOD about half the time. The other half the screen just freezes or the computer reboots itself. And I never get a BSOD when the laptop isn't moved or flexed.

 

@Wayne99 you said that flexing the computer didn't cause problems under Linux. In Windows, it may be coinscidence, or HDD active protection software failure, or God knows what. Clean installing OS is obvious first step, it is much easier than anything - trying to fix existing old and bloated OS installation included.

 

Well it doesn't make any sense to me but I'm clearly over my head lol. I ran another distro from usb and nothing I did could cause it to burp let alone croak...

 

Well it sounds like HDD failure then, because you're not getting any BSODs when running off USB & CD while moving your laptop.

 

That makes more sense to me. But it would be wrong to suggest I have any concrete sense of what goes on inside a computer, or any other electronic device for that matter.

 

I'd copy your important data off it ASAP to an external solution (like a USB stick or USB hard drive). When you get a new laptop (think you said you were), then you can just copy over those important data files to your new laptop. You mentioned re-using your HDD in the new laptop - obviously I wouldn't do that because it looks like your HDD is on the way out by looks of it!

 

Well that part I'm not sure about. The computer has NO problems whatsoever when it is stationary, only when it's flexing. That suggests to me that its shorting, or getting disconnected, or triggering some self-protective measures because its unstable rather than an intrinsic problem with the drive. But again that's not based on any actual knowledge, just speculation and I could be entirely wrong. I've already backed up my important data though, just in case. My T410 arrives today, so once I get that set up I can do some more testing. I think I'll install Linux to a partition on the hard drive first and see how that works. If I still have the problem at least I will have eliminated Windows as the SOLE source of the problem.

 

Well, if you've backed up your data, then you've got nothing to lose but your own time - you're now free to try some different stuff out without consequence.

 

I would guess the above logic is wrong. Even if Linux is installed and working 100% (even while moving and flexing the computer) that doesn't rule out the HDD.

With an Linux install, different parts of the HDD's platters are accessed and this may be avoiding the damaged areas so it won't be a good indicator if the drive is bad or not.

Your best approach here is to put in a new HDD (new or known good used drive...) and do a clean install of the O/S.

But the time spent to do that vs. the future benefits of a platform that has been falling apart for a while is not what I would put in the productive category. Unless all you want to do is learn (and not have another working system).

Good luck.

 

Ok, but humor me. I'm not trying to argue because as I've said I know next to nothing about how computers work. But I'm trying to overcome my own il(logic) here which goes something like this:

Computer worked fine before it started falling apart and flexing

Computer only malfunctions when extremely frail, falling apart case is flexed when moved.

Computer works when running live usb, which could be(?) is dependent on different parts of that shaky case or leaving the hard drive entirely unused. This evidence is inconclusive

All hard drive tests pass with flying colors

based on all this, what reason is there to believe the drive won't work just fine when placed in a new, rigid T410 body?

keep in mind I don't need this laptop after my new one arrives. I'm not trying to save the laptop. I just would like to save the hard drive to use in the new laptop. And I realize there is some risk there.

OK, nevermind. The T410 just arrived (and boy is it nice!) and ended my dilemma. It has a 320 GB HDD not the 250 it was advertised as so I won't even need to put a larger drive in it for at least a year or more. Heck I'm only using 140 GB of this 500 now. So my decision is easy, I'll just keep this old clunker as a backup and probably install Linux on it just to see what happens.

 

I see you already made your decision, but just to clarify; nobody is arguing here. Just sharing some info.

The HDD passing some artificial tests doesn't mean HDD is working at 100% (the only 'test' or 'bench' that ever matters is the exact one you use the platform for...).

It may be the HDD, the O/S install or the pinching (or disconnecting) of a wire when the system is physically moved... and it can all be somehow related to the HHD as it doesn't do this when running on a USB 'live drive'. This is why I suggested doing a clean install on a new/or uses, but known-good HDD to see if the issue persisted (then you would have saved yourself the trouble of having to re-install everything if it still had the same BSOD'ing symptoms).

If it didn't; then the clean O/S + driver install may be the reason - or, the new HDD may be the reason. At that point, it would be your call if you wanted continue troubleshooting the old setup to see if it was just an O/S and/or driver issue or if it was actually a hardware issue (a short/or disconnection happening on the M/B or the actual HDD).

The very last thing I would do is to completely format the old HDD and do a clean install on it (I would also be tempted to do a FULL Format vs. a Quick Format of the drive before doing so...).

With your decision to not continue using the old platform now that you have the new one, the above is probably moot. But as I mentioned in my very first answer here; if a component that is as important as a HDD to the dependable operation of a system is even suspect? Time to throw it away and get something new.

I would suggest you get an SSD asap for your new system (2.5" SATAIII, ~500GB or larger) and forget about using mechanical storage on a mobile system for good. Seems you are a little rough with your mobile platforms?