Deleting hidden partitions?

I recently purchased a Dell Inspiron 1520 with Vista preloaded onto it. I need this sucker to run a specific distribution of Linux for my lab, but it appears that the people over at Dell have already taken up all four available partitions! My lab has disk imaging software I've used to image the three partitions, should anything go wrong, but I was wondering if it's safe to just blast these partitions? Which ones, specifically, are okay to turn into unallocated space for a new partition?

I have the standard OS drive (C , a 10GB Recovery drive (D , and two drives with unassigned letters/names: a 2.50 GB primary partition and a 102 MB EISA config drive. I imagine the system can function without the Recovery drive... what about without the other two? Can I go ahead and get rid of them?

EDIT: For clarity, I want the system to dual boot between Vista and Linux. The specific distribution of Linux I'm using is based on Red Hat Enterprise and installs with the GRUB loader.

 

Easiest option is to mkfs.ext3 the 10GB recovery partition and install linux on it. This partition is supposed to restore the machine to factory settings with all the junk in it that came installed when you opened the box.

Other options include resizing the partitions e.g. reduce the C: to like 25GB and use the rest to create an extended partition where all your linux partitions (as logical partitions) can happily live. This will need a little work. There are multiple options like backup the C: using ghost, break it into two and restore.

You could just throw away everything. Re-partition the whole drive in leaving the first diagnostic partition alone. And re-install vista. And then install linux. Remember vista will overwrite MBR on the disk, so your lilo/grub will go into dumps if you install vista after installing linux.

 

Hi Devsk,

Thanks for the reply, but I'm not quite sure what you mean by mkfs.ext3? I have the three partitions imaged with the latest version of Acronis TrueImage, so I'm not too scared of losing it (my understanding is that recovery would be trivial). I'm planning on wiping the recovery drive and merging it with the C drive. Is this possible?

Currently in the disk management software, the drives appear in this order:
102MB diag tools, 10GB Recovery, 136GB OS, 2.5GB MediaDirect. I just want to blast the 10GB recovery and merge it with the OS. Is this possible?

 

Bump if I may, for the afternoon crowd.

 

don't touch the 102MB partition and yes, you can merge the 10GB with 136GB, there is nothing important in there. There are many tools which can do this for you.

never mind the mkfs.ext3. I assumed you were familiar with linux and hence wanted it on your lappy.

 

Haha, no, I'm only familiar with Linux enough to install it and program things in C++. I typically work within Windows, but the lab I've joined recently runs strictly on a Linux environment. I have installed the distribution before, just never on dual-boot with Vista (or on a laptop).

Can you link me to one of these tools? Or would you recommend simply using Vista's built-in disk management software?

 

If I wanted to install a new HD, I guess I would need to create a 2.5GB for MediaDirect?

 

yes, if you want to use the Media Direct feature. For this, the best is to use a linux livecd, boot into the livecd and use 'fdisk -l /dev/sda' to remember which cylinders the media direct partition is installed on (it would be the last partition). After you re-partition the drive (which you can do using fdisk itself), make sure there is a partition right towards the end of the disk with same cylinder offsets as u noted above and has same partition type. This way you can create a partition scheme of your choice and still retain the media direct partition and the data on it.

If you don't understand what I said above, don't try it. data has a very good habit of getting lost in the ether without u doing anything....

 

The question is do you want to retain the data that is present on the partitions that you want to combine?

If not, then put your vista cd in. Choose a new install option, and when it comes to partition list, edit your partition table to your hearts content by deleting and merging parititions. Once you have a reclaimed all junk space, create one 25gb partition for vista, install in it. Leave rest of the space unallocated. At this time you should have one 102mb, 25gb and rest unallocated partitions. Once done with setting up, activating and testing vista, put your linux cd in and let it install in the unallocated space.

If yes, then you need norton partition magic kind of tool to resize the existing C: and extend it over the 10GB partition.

If I were you, I would just recreate the partition table and reinstall both vista and linux afresh one after the other.

 

Do know how does Media Direct's boot work?
Because I wanted to use the 'Media Direct' power on button to load a Linux distro, but to do that I need to move the partition and extend it. Is it imperative for that partition to begin at a particular cylinder?

(Also, after a thorough backup) I would like to:

• keep the dignostic partition,
• smite Vista and use its partition for XP Pro,
• move the content of the recovery partiton into a logical partition and use the third primary partion for the Linux install (instead of Media Direct).

Plus, having a bunch of partitions for windows and linux progs and data (and maybe another linux installed in the extended partition).
Everything loaded by Grub, and possibly by the Media Direct button.

Am I utterly insane?

 

Well, I don't really want to delete and reabsorb the recovery partition. Rather, I want to delete the 10GB partition, take another 15 gigs off the C: into unallocated space, and create a 25GB partition for my Linux distro. Is this not possible with the built in disk management tools?

 

Even if it was possible to resize a partition in disk management, you won't be able to resize the partition where you are booted from (in this case C). So, you are still left with external tools. If you learn more about linux and how partitioning is done using linux livecd, you can do it for free. There is another free tool called gparted, which boots into linux livecd and let's you resize partitions without losing data. Otherwise, use vista dvd's DISKPART shrink function to shrink C drive (google "DISKPART vista resize"). If none of these work for you, get partition magic for 80$ and let that do it for you. Its a typical time vs. cost free dilemma!

Do you really want to save the data in that C: partition? Why don't you want to reinstall vista?

 

I would not mind resinstalling Vista at all, except the Dell computer did not come with a Vista install disk, and I do not wish to purchase one. I would be rather screwed if I uninstalled the OEM installation, I think.

Disk management in Vista does indeed allow me to shrink the OS drive into unallocated space, though all the primary partitions, etc. are in use so I cannot make a new volume out of it. Are you saying it won't suffice for me to use this functionality?

 

you won't be able to use MD button to boot linux because its hardcoded to boot from the last primary partition of a particular type. If you fiddle around with your partition table and move the partition somewhere else, and press that button when not booted, it will make the MD partition as your first primary partition (although its cylinder offset will still be pointing to the end of the disk), mark it bootable and start to install. i.e. it will completely mess up the partition table. (Media Direct partition is just a cut down linux distro running proprietary software).

Only way to avoid this disaster is to completely get rid of media direct partition and its data or just live with MD and install everything in order by following media direct guides found on this website.

Typically, partition manually using a livecd. 102MB diag partition, leave it alone, and delete all other partitions (MEANS COMPLETE DATA LOSS). create a primary for vista of 25gb. create an extended partition of the rest of the space minus 2.6GB for media direct. you will create logical partitions in this extended partition for linux when you install linux. leave last 2.6GB unallocated i.e. do not create a partition out of it. Install MD, vista, linux in that order, using their respective CDs/DVDs.

 

I don't think you can resize an in-use partition, and when you are booted, C drive is in-use. If vista can do it, I will be darn amazed! So, after you did shrink, it created an unallocated space to the left of the C drive? What happens if you reboot at this time and try to reclaim that space as another volume? does that work?

Why haven't you sent an email or called CS for a vista reinstall DVD? They will ship it to you for free. They are required to.

 

It created an unallocated space to the right of the C drive. The problem is, when I try to make another volume, it tells me there is not enough space on the disk. Googling the precise terminology, I find that this is the error it gives when you've used up all your 4 primary partitions, etc. That's why I'm so interested in deleting one of the others.

I was unaware of this! I'll get right on it.

 

you are stuck at this point. It has created unallocated space to the right. The 10GB is to the left. You won't be able to delete 10GB and merge. IOW, you are left with 'the other' methods that I pointed out.

I would say get that reinstall DVD from dell, reinstall everything to get a custom partition table and fresh start.

 

Damn! I knew it was too good to be true that Windows actually made something easy.

Thanks, I'll call Dell and get an install CD.

Blegh...

EDIT: BLEGH! Wait. As convoluted as this may seem, can I blast the 10GB recovery, extend C into it (can you extend from right-to-left in adjacent partitions?), and then carve out a block from the now, much larger, C on the right?

 

another question I am not sure about whether vista allows or not. Logically speaking this should be allowed if shrink is allowed. Definitely worth a try.

 

I just tried shrinking the recovery partition, creating some unallocated space between Recovery and C, hoping C could absorb it. I was wrong. It looks like extension only works in the left-to-right fashion. *sigh*.

 

if Windows made life easy for people, then MS won't be MS...

 

BTW, another option: why not install linux in that 10GB partition? A decent linux distro can install in less than 5GB easy.

 

Haha, normally, I would, but the Linux distribution I use was tailored for developing particle physics simulations and thus comes with craptons of high energy physics libraries. We're talking about a 7-8GB installation.

Which wouldn't be so bad, typically, except I don't have a partition to turn into a media/file storage partition to share between Windows and Linux. Like I said, I think I'm going to call Dell, get my Vista install CD, wipe everything, then set it up with 10 gigs for Vista, 10 gigs for Linux, and an NTFS media directory using that utility mentioned earlier.

 

vista won't install in 10GB. With 2GB ram, it will just take ~5GB away for hibernation and page file. And the install itself is huge. So, 25GB is recommended if you want install some useful programs in it like photoshop, vmware etc.

If your physics libraries don't need access to real hardware (And I am sure they won't), you can actually install linux inside vmware. With virtualization in hardware itself (enable VT in BIOS), and using a 64-bit linux distribution, you can get decent maths performance inside a virtual machine.

While you wait for the DVD, you can try this option. I think it will work out. Get free vmware-server, install it, create a couple of large virtual disks (may be 10GB for install, 2GB for swap) and install linux on them and see if it works for you. The best thing is that these VMs are portable. Back them up on this machine (just save the whole VM folder) and restored them on another and they will just run, irrespective of what OS is running the new machine!

 

FYI, I blasted every partition with killdisk. Even the partition that xp doesn't see I wiped. That way when I installed Vista, the first OS installed on "partition 1" instead of "partition 2" when I first tried to reinstall Vista it kept telling me it was on partition 2, with no other partitions visible. When I inserted killdisk, I saw an "unknown partition" and did a binary wipe. Now Vista is on partition 1 and xp on partition 2.

 

typically, its not recommended to wipe the DIAG partition because Dell will ask you to run it and report stuff before they can ship you new components like replacement for failed hard drive etc. Its just 102MB anyway.

 

this is a quick read but should outline what you need to do with the MD button not mine but this took some digging and found this somewere else


My main power button boots Windows (and presents me with the menu to choose between Vista and XP). My Media Direct button boots Ubuntu. It is very easy to set up. First ensure that grub is loaded into the Linux partition's bootsector (rather than just the drive mbr). Then run the rmbr utility from the Media Direct 2 CD. For example, if your main Windows partition is partition 2 and your Linux partition is partition 3, just type:
rmbr DELL 2 3
You will now boot to Windows with your power button and grub with the Media Direct button. You should probably set the grub menu timeout to 0 when this is working.
Note: doing this the other way around (ie having Windows boot from the Media Direct key and Ubuntu from the power button) could cause problems due to drive letter changes, although I have not tried it myself. The same problem applies to a Vista/XP dual boot with two separate buttons. However, you can get around it by doing this (assuming that you have already deleted the media direct partition):
1. Install one version of Windows to the active partition (eg partition 2)
2. Hide this partition and make one of the other partitions active (eg partition 3)
3. Install the other version of Windows to this partition.
4. Unhide the hidden partition.
5. Run the rmbr command as above.

I believe that this will give you one power button for each version of Windows, but I have only tried the Linux/Windows combination myself and so there may be unforeseen problems with a Windows/Windows combination.

 

very useful information. Thanks! I didn't know about the rmbr utility. What exactly is rmbr doing? Do you know? Is it just to create a mapping for buttons to just throw us into the right boot sector after POST depending upon which button is pressed?

If you can post the output of 'rmbr --help', that will be great!

 

here is some more information for you and your journey

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=1797967&postcount=9
http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?t=198374

 

Devsk: Do you have any instant messaging software I could use to communicate with you? It would be easier than using this forum.

Also: In regards to VMWare. My lab has licenses for "VMWare Workstation 6.0", which I can install. Does this have the same functionality as "VMWare-Server"?

Thanks.

 

Oh yeah! Workstation 6.0 will be even faster, and better with all that USB2 goodness, in case you need to access that fast USB2 external hard drive from within the linux virtual machine.... About the only thing you lose using Workstation instead of vmware-server is the ability to remote login into your VM from any console, which I think is not a big loss given that you are running this on a laptop. So, you are good!

 

Whohoo!!!
Thanks a heap, TechIsCool!

"It... could... work!!!"
Dr. Fronkensteen in "Young Frankenstein"