BIOS Update could prevent Merom upgrade

Last night, I got back to school (yeah, I have summer classes, and yeah, it sucks) and hooked up to the internet. I had noticed they had a BIOS update for my M90, so I decided to update, just to be up-to-date. Just a few minutes ago, I was looking around NBF and noticed a thread talking about Merom requiring a BIOS update. A few pages into the thread, they began talking about the new BIOS update for the M90/M1710 (A01), and how it appeared that they had made it impossible to use an unsupported CPU. See this link.

So far, this has only been tested in one machine, and the Merom T7200 did not work with A01 BIOS (it has been proven to work on A00). This could be a possible CPU problem, but if this proves that the new BIOS update for the M90/M1710 removes support for Merom, I am going to be VERY upset. I know many people have discussed Merom upgrading on here and bought Core Duo machines specifically for that reason. My whole reason for buying now was because I knew the only benefit of waiting till winter would be getting a Merom with the computer (no DX10/Vista by December), but I knew that the Merom worked in the M90, so I bought now. If this means that I will no longer be able to upgrade, I think I am going to send my computer back.

This is absolutely ridiculous. To think that Dell would cripple their two flagship machines and limit their lifespan to only a few months is mindboggling. Apparently, using a Merom requires that you have the A01 BIOS on the 9400/E1705 (otherwise it downclocks to 1GHz). I have a hard time stomaching the fact that Dell would support Merom in the Inspiron, but not the XPS M1710/Precision M90. I'm going to wait and see if anyone gets a Merom working in an M90 with the new BIOS, but if this proves to be true, I'm going to have to give Dell a call and give them a good piece of my mind.

Here is the thread on NBF.

 

you really think Dell would prevent M90 users the benefit of upgrading to Merom? **EDIT: i understand why they would, warranty issues, future products, etc... so maybe this point is invalid, sorry.**...even while their good buddies at Intel are releasing the 1st-gen Meroms so that Socket M people can have a chance at Merom? That's the whole reason behind the "Napa Refresh" campaign. To 'refresh' Napa with the better Merom chips before Socket P/Santa Rosa is released next year.
i understand how you can be upset, i would be too, but just wait it out, i'm sure you'll be able to upgrade to Merom either through a new bios update from dell or a known workaround with the A00 and A01 bios.

also, can you not just flash the rom and reflash with the older bios like you can with a desktop rig? am i missing something?

 

Dell probably did that, if it is true, for two main reasons:
A: Mainstream companies don't like when people alter the insides of their machines (excluding RAM/HDD). Making it impossible to upgrade eliminates that.

B: You have to buy a new Dell to get a Merom.

Of course, you need to be careful of the information in that thread too. I didn't see any concrete evidence of whether it would work or not in the M90. You are best off waiting as posted..

 

I've heard that you can reflash to the older BIOS, but requires a lot of messing around. I just want Dell to fix this without me having to possibly harming my computer by trying to flash back to the original BIOS.

 

Its not really dell's problem to fix though (IMO). The truth is that Merom isn't supported yet by Dell, so any user that wants to put Merom in their system is going to have to assume full responbility for their actions.

I have to agree with Chaz. Dell is already kind of relucant on any kind of CPU change and states that if a user upgrades the CPU, then dell will not support or fix that laptop. Honestly, I think they are trying to make it where you can't upgrade to Merom until it is officially supported by dell.

I know there are alot of experiments going on at NBF, but that is all they are. Merom is not even officially released yet to the public (I don't think at least), so I question how users are even getting Merom.

 

I didn't know flashing a notebook's BIOS was more complicated, have never dealt with that.

Also, maybe Dell will release another BIOS to support the Socket M Merom's because they will use the same M90 (and other notebooks) when they start using the Merom's next month (or maybe september unfortunately). So you could just use the "A02" bios when it comes out then.

If both of these options fail, I'm glad I know now and will wait to get my M90 until Dell uses the Meroms.
Hope everything works out for you notebook_ftw.

 

It isn't hard to flash to a newer version of BIOS... it is going backwards that can cause problems.

 

When Merom is released, will Dell sell models that can either have Core Duo or Core 2 Duo, because I want to wait until the Core Duo chips will drop in price before the release of Core 2 Duo but not wait so late that I will be forced to buy a Core 2 Duo instead? if this helps any in my question, i'm planning on buying the d820

 

None of us really know what they are planning on doing. Since they just updated all of their laptops to Core Duo, they will probably just update them to have Merom. We won't know until August or so.

 

According to another thread, blocked by our Websense (##@$!!), a 1705 and an M90 (same basic machines) have been upgraded with a Merom with the A01. Sorry I can't supply the links at notebookforum.com

These dell laptops, at least the 1505 - 1705 formats, beg to be upgraded, most items are very easy to get too and replace with instructions on the Dell site and the owners manual.

I agree 100%: Southerngirl wrote "I know there are alot of experiments going on at NBF, but that is all they are. Merom is not even officially released yet to the public (I don't think at least), so I question how users are even getting Merom."

 

If the merom processors fit in the same socket as the core duo processors, I think dell would release the bios update. I believe the e1505 came out this year and it would be a while until they release a new laptop with the new processor. So they would have to create a bios update so they can install the processors into the computers. They did the same thing for the new graphics card option so it can be supported. I'm crossing my fingers if they will hopefully do it because I ordered the e1505.

 

The E1705 and the M90 are not the same base computer. The M90 is the same as the XPS M1710. The E1705 requires the A01 BIOS to use a merom correctly, but it appears for the moment that the M1710/M90 A01 BIOS (same basic BIOS) has locked out Merom support.

And the guys over at NBF that are testing the Merom are either engineering developers using Intel provided dev chips (from what I gather) or they are just wealthy enthusiasts who buy the chips from developers on eBay or personally.

 

I'm looking at a picture of the M90 and 1705 motherboards and other case parts. Other than supported Ram and GPU where is the difference? I asked Dell "Banctec" guy, who replaced my motherboard the same question.

I'm not trying to get into an argument but as a tech please point me to a site that has this info.

BTW if the M90 and 1710 are the same, please check this site out! http://www.anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.aspx?i=2766

Thx.

 

To me, the E1705 and M1710 are the exact same - just more whistles and few different hardware components. Not sure where the M90 falls in - never saw one in person.

 

There's no doubt that hardware is nearly the same. What computers aren't? They have Intel processors, nVidia GPUs, RAM, HDD, similar mobos, everything. That's what computers are, and similar configurations are gonna be pretty similar across the board, even with different brands. It's not like Dell makes their own parts. The difference is in the construction and the software/firmware. M1710 and M90 both use magnesium alloy casing, steel hinges, etc. They are both much better built than the E1705.

For the part that matters is the firmware/software and support. The XPS and the M90 use ALL the same components in every hardware option (even GPU, 1500M=7900GS, 2500M=7900GTX). Since the XPS and M90 have options for higher specs such as bigger hard drives and higher graphics cards, they require different attention than the Inspiron. I'm not claiming to know how Dell does business, but I would assume that since the XPS and the Precision have better service and are considerably more expensive than the Inspiron they also have different development techniques for those models. The fact that the M90/XPS BIOS was released over a month after the Inspiron BIOS (and on the same day) is evidence to this fact. The XPS/M90 are obviously in a different development cycle than the Inspiron. Take a look at the website yourself. The BIOS for the XPS and the M90 are exactly the same, and are not the same as the Inspiron BIOS.

I'm not trying to argue or be a jerk either. But the XPS and the M90 ARE different than the E1705, no matter how big or small the difference may be. After all, we may be talking about only a few lines of code here. But that's enough to make a HUGE difference.

 

I can verify that the A01 bios on the M1710 does have an error at boot when a merom is installed, but that it functions normally when installed. The A00 bios did not have an error on boot.

 

So does this mean that the Merom workes in the M1710, it just throws a trouble code?

 

Yeah, it works fine even with the A01 bios.

 

any news on the m1210 and a merom upgrade?

 

Well, that's good to know. A big load off. I'm not totally sure I'll upgrade this computer, but it's nice to at least have the option.