XPS 16 with i7 620 or i7 820qm - HELP!

Which one is better, i7 620M or i7 820qm considerin the heat issues the XPS 16 has?

What would u suggest me?

 

Considering the heat issues of the XPS 16, the i7 620M is the better choice. As a dual core processor, it's supposedly neck-and-neck with the quad core processor i7-720QM, maybe even edging it out. Especially as quad core performance has not been fully tapped into yet in computer tasks (games, etc.). However, the 820qm edges out the i7 620M in performance. But in terms of heat the i7 620M would produce the least amount of heat while giving you comparable performance, so I suggest that one.

 

cheers mate so i go with the i7 620m.... considering heat and battery life.
thanks

 

despite what the other guy said, Many modern games now make use of the Quad Cores, thats why I went with 720QM

 

oh ok, so hows the temperatur on ur one? and how is it temperature wise between the 820qm and teh 720qm?

 

How long are you keeping the laptop and do you really play modern games or have a strong desire to play modern games on your computer in the future? Yes right now only a handful of games may take advantage of 4 cores but are you planning on keeping your laptop longer than one year? Im sure things could be a little different then. I for one am not a huge gamer so I would probably go with the i7 620m.

 

620M still gets pretty hot under load.

If heat/battery life is a priority, look to the 4XX/5XX. The 4XX run especially low and cool.

920XM > 820QM > 620M > 720QM

 

ok but 620m wouldnt get as hot as 720qm.... well im looking into long term use and gaming as well. what bothers me is the graphics card 4670 radeon. but i need to buy a laptop now :-(

820qm would be def too much for that xps right? heard so many issues....

 

I highly recommend going for 820qm. Best out of all mobile processors, Id take it over 920XM anyday(high watt usage). If you apply the your own thermal paste you wont have any problems with it. Ive posted a video guide you can search for it. Definitely worth it. Future proof your laptop!

 

920XM runs fine, but it isn't an option. You have to install it yourself. Under heavy load, 820QM hits 65W just like the 920XM.

With that being said, I'd either go with a 820QM or a 620M. It really comes down to what you do.

 

I feel offended xD Just got my 720 and I would take that over the 620 any day, its future viable seeing as it has quad core and most modern games utilize this e.g Bad Company 2 MW2 etc..

The heat difference is minimal but thats just my biased opinion

 

I have the laptop with the i7-820QM and the idle temperatures are around 50 degrees C. There doesn't seem to be much of a heat issue as long as you don't block the vents, however unless you are doing video encoding and stuff, it is probably unnecessary to get the 820QM.

 

I'm also a happy owner of 1645 with 820QM for about 1 month. Since I got 130W adapter everything is going fine. As fred told idle CPU temp. is around 50 C and under heavy load I've never seen it going hither then 75 C (by the way, I was playing MW2 and Dragon Age a lot and haven't yet seen GPU throttling, also I haven't changed a paste yet ). I bought this lappy in Germany, that time Dell proposed good deals (got 820QM, RGB, 128 gb SSD and 3 years warranty for 1500 euros ). So, I would recommend this CPU. If you will order at dell, you should definitely do it by phone, you'll get more options and better deal.

 

I had a choice with my replacement and was faced with the same dilemma. It was an easy choice for me though. I'd rather have a 32nm arrandale core over the 45nm clarksfield core any day. And I edit high def video on this thing in pro apps. The 620m runs at 3-3.33ghz for nearly everything. My turbo is almost always on..I rarely ever see it run at 2.66, from playing games to using creative apps etc. The 720 and 820s cant compete with that in my opinion. There base clock speeds are too slow. THey are being held back by their clocks and thermal evelope where as the 620m fits in perfectly. 2 cores and 4 threads @ 3+ghz..That makes way more sense to me for a laptop than 4 cores and 8 threads at up to maybe 1.7ghz.

The clarksfields were just nehalems scaled back in power and clocks. It used the first generation of this new "turbo" tech they use, (which is just simply clock gating). The arrandales use a more aggressive and updated version of the turbo boost, as well has having a smaller (32nm vs 45nm), newer core with added instructions (encryption stuff). I'd say the 620m if anything is more future proof.

The amount of cores doesn't determine 'future proofness', that's a silly metric to go by. Its the cores and the platform itself that determines future proofness. And programming things for 4 threads is just barely breaking through and isn't really mainstream yet. What makes you think solid support for 8 threads will come any sooner?

The only bad thing I'd say is that the die space for the gpu is a waste in our cases because it's not being used to its fullest since the graphics portion isnt being used. The pci-express lanes and memory controller are located on that part of the chip, so it does get its used a little..but still a waste if you ask me. I'd love to use hybrid or switchable graphics on this if I could. Dell dropped the ball on that one..

 

Well, you have to remember a hyperthreaded thread isn't on par with a true core thread. Your 2-core "4-thread" chip isn't the same as a true quad core chip. Much better than the old school P4's with their hyperthreading (Remembering my P4-3.2ghz Extreme Edition ah....), but still not the same and in some situations it can actually hurt your performance.

You also have things going on in the background. encoding/decoding and assigning 2+ cores (real cores) while also being able to game is just awesome. I remember the days where you'd set your computer to encode/decode then basically go do something else or use a secondary system. One reason I stepped up to the FX line of AMD chips back in '04 was for the ability to finally have CPU intense tasks run while also still being able to use my 'puter. It's the same thing now just on Barry Bonds grade 'roids.

I do agree that the bulk of applications are most likely not even using more than a few threads, but anyone who does anything processor intense and is multithreaded will definitely see a boost in performance. It is just properly ascertaining your needs and purchasing a chip that meets said needs.

And the 620M is a beautiful chip. I'd take it over a 720QM which is the Q9000 of the i7's Quad Cores (neutered cache and overall a smidge slower) unless I had apps that really used 4 threads or greater. I would take a 820QM or (obviously) a 920XM over a 620M.

 

Yes I know all about hyperthreading vs true cores. The point is it can handle 4 threads at higher speeds than the clarksfields, and thats whats important. My t9800 was able to do anything I threw at it, including heaving multi-tasking. That was 2 cores with no HT. I now have 2 better cores with HT, so I am very confindent I chose the right cpu for my workload. Sure 4 real cores would benice in my scenarios, but not at 1.7ghz and on a laptop.

I personally would only take the 920XM over the 620m. I think the 820 and 720 are garbage to put it nicely. I was awaiting the arrival of Clarksfield and Capella for waaaaay too long. It was artificially delayed because of the poor economy and excessive stockpile of core2duos and centrino2 platforms at major OEMs like Dell and was really late in coming out. When it finally came out I was really dissapointed to see they just took a nehalem and cut its power envelope and clock speeds basically in half and called it a laptop chip.

Arrandale was designed for laptops from the ground up. Nehelam was designed around being a server cpu first. Clarksfield reminds me of the whole p4-m scenario all over again, sticking neutered desktop chips in a laptop and calling it a day..I feel the arrandale design is just overall better from a laptop perspective.

If we were talking desktops then my views would be completely different..

 

Are u for real? that cheap? how long ago and how much ram? i paid 1950 euros, 820qm, 6gb ram, rgb led, 500gb 7200, 2 years plus accidental warranty, 130w, wireless n

 

where can you buy the 620 at anyway?

 

On 10th of march with standard 4gb RAM, Dell Wireless 1520 mini card. Also I've had 5% of coupon .

And the other thing, tenknics told that only a few games use hyperthreading nowadays. That is not the all truth. I've read some review (there was a link to it on this forum, but I can't find it at the moment) that now about 23% of modern games really use the benefits of quardcore CPUs. And each year their number on the market is incising exponentially. With other types of programs I agree with tenknics. So it really depends on your purposes, for what stuff you'll use laptop... But if you are looking for desktop replacement, I would recommend 820qm

 

23% isn't a very big number and I said quad core support, not hyperthreading support. The point remains the same, for every 10 games that come out, about 2 support quad cores..Yes that number will go up, but it still falls under the category of support for 4 threads, not 8, which will take even longer..

And why you all use gaming as a metric for quad cores? I find it funny when they justify the quadcore, they refer to gaming before any other app and ESPECIALLY for the 1640.. Is that the only thing quad cores is useful for? I don't understand, the studio xps 16s have a weak gpu, a 4670. You can't game on it regardless of what CPU you get.. Do you really think you will be hitting a CPU bottleneck before a GPU one?

And for those who don't understand. Your system will slow down because of the weak GPU, ie a bottleneck, before it slows from because of the CPU when gaming. Having 2 or 4 cores is a moot point when you're GPU can't even handle the game.

I can go on forever...I can write a book about why the 620m is better than 720/820.

 

In general, does the 820qm has more heat output than 720qm? or is it engineered it a better quality?

 

Its the SAME EXACT chip with 2mb less of lvl 3 cache and a lower binned speed.

 

I really want a cooler laptop I can't get my i7 720qm to go below 50C and because of it my video card is at a constant 55C. My former i5 540 idled at 35C and the GPU at 44C which is a drastic change in heat. I applied MX3 paste and even AS5 and still no big changes in temps. Is there something I can do besides buying a cooler?

tenknics the higher clocks and more cache won't increase the heat at all between the 820/720?

 

Of course it will/may because more watts are needed to power the higher clocks and more cache.. but he was asking if the chips were engineered differently and thats what I was responding to. I can go into depth about wafers and binning etc, but lets say the 720qm/820qm/920XM all go in as the same chips before they are "baked"..Based on the results, how fast the chip can go and how much power is needed to go that fast, they "bin" a speed grade. Not all chips come out perfectly the same. Some have all the cache working, some dont...some can go to certain mhz, some cant. And thats why intel is successful because it can take parts that don't function to the fullest and still sell it in a lower segment. For example the 720qm you have could have been a 920xm if it came out perfect, but it didn't so it got binned a 720qm..Make sense?

AMD does the same thing. This is how their tri-core parts came out. Those are basically quad-cores where all 4 core couldn't function at a certain mhz level or needed too much power to do so, so they disabled one core and were still able to sell them. Binning is a CPU company's best friend.

And as far as cooler laptop, this is why I avoided clarksfield and went with arrandale. I idle in the 30s and and max at 58-60.

 

Sorry dude but are you serious?!? You say the 4670 cant process modern games? I can play MW2 Multiplayer on medium-high, fallout 3 high, wow high, crysis medium


all these at a decent fps of 35-70 ... my cpu is the 720QM and its great, quad core over dual any day. its modern proof.

 

I have to agree with tenknics to a certain extent. The 4670 card is possibly the weakest component in the Studio XPS 16 when talking about gaming. Not to say it's bad, it's just a last generation card.

Also, your point about running current games at medium-high quality is valid. However, you also claim that the 720QM is modern proof. Even when more games are optimized to run on quad-cores (and most are currently not), the 4670 is going to struggle to run those games of the future and will most likely be the bottleneck in the system.

I'd prefer a Arrandale system myself simply because I don't do as much rendering, encrypting or other CPU intensive activities and don't require the 4-cores. It's all about what you need now with what is available now.

Oh, and one more thing, I wouldn't call any processor future proof It's just that way technology is. What I think you need to say is WHY the 720QM is better than a Arrandale processor. More cores doesn't necessarily mean that it's better.

Back to the OP, as his primary concern is heat, there really is no question that the 620m will produce less heat than the 720QM.

 

Its responses like these that make me not want to post to the lengths that I do. I guess you really didn't read my post..I said nothing about it not being able to process modern games..I said it would be the bottleneck before the CPU, ie the point of 4 vs 2 cores is moot when the GPU is the bottleneck...sigh..And I can guarantee you aren't playing all those games at the full 1920x1080p with AA and AAF on...Quad over dual any day? Great logic. My dual can beat your quad in 90% of benchmarks...spare me..

At least someone is paying attention..Ive been saying this the entire time

 

How much heat is it really producing guys, is it bearable? I mean does it get too hot so u have to shut down ur laptop or it shuts down itself? What are ur room temperatures, in celcius?

And is it only getting REAL hot when playing games?

Basically I need my Laptop to be future proof for the next 2-4 years. Im also getting into photography and want to be able to play games with medium to high quality from time to time.

My thoughts were, Id rather get a great screen and good support, than getting a acer with great specs and a bad screen.

And in case my dell does break in 2 years coz of heat issues, dell would definitely replace or swap it for a better one.

Am I right?

 

Ok, so we've identified what you want to use the laptop for. Since you're getting into photography, I assume heavy use of Adobe Photoshop. So for applications, have a look at the benchmarks in this review from Anandtech.

Notice how the difference in performance between the core i5-540 and core i7-920XM isn't really that much in programs that don't really need a whole lot of processing power? I'd say that there would not be much difference between a quad-core or dual-core for Adobe Photoshop.

For gaming, as I said earlier, it's a moot point. The ATI 4670 card will be a bottleneck way before the processor will. It really doesn't matter what processor you get. In this other Anandtech review, they clearly say that the ATI 5870 is a limiting factor where the processor is an i720QM!

And yes, I do like Anandtech

I'm not too sure about the heat issues so I'll leave that for someone else to comment on.

 

Thing is, that I got the 820qm for the same price as I would have for the 620m....

This is my configuration:

Studio XPS 16 : Intel Core i7 Prozessor 820QM(1,73GHz,8MB Cache)
Bildschirm : 16Zoll RGBLED Black Leather Edge to Edge Full HD1080p mit TrueLife
Camera : Integrated Camera with Facial Recognition Software
Memory : 6144MB (1x2048 + 1x4096) 1333MHz DDR3 Dual Channel
Hard Drive : 500GB Free Fall Sensor (7200RPM)
Optisches Laufwerk : Blu-ray ROM (Blu-ray, DVD und CD lesen & schreiben) Kombilaufwerk Automatischer Einzug
Power Supply : XPS 130W AC Adapter
Power Cord : European 250V
Akku : Primär 9-Zellen 85Wh LI-ION 1
Graphics : 1GB ATI Radeon HD 4670 graphics card
Wireless : Europa Dell Bluetooth 370 Karte
Wireless : Dell Wireless 1520 (802.11n) Minikarte halbe Höhe
Keyboard : Internal German Qwertz Keyboard
Advanced Service - 2 year Collect & Return Service within 6 days + 2 years Accidental Damage Support
2 years Accidental Damage Support
Computrace LoJack for Laptops, 1yr license - included with your PC
Software : Computrace LoJack for Laptops, 1yr license - included with your PC

Gesamt Brutto: €1.950,00


A i7 620m would have cost me 30 euros less, thats it...

 

Finally I got my Laptop but thinks got screw up again rather then get the Intel Core i5 520M I got the Intel Core i5 430M at first I was pretty P-off but then I start to think I paid less for it and if I want I can upgrade to a faster processor myself. I got a chance to grab a i7 820M for a really good price at e-Bay from the U.S. but do I need it? this dual core so far it's proof to perform pretty decent I'm not worry for the temperature hell I had two alienware MX17 and both were running at 52-57 C at all time that is idling with the i7 920. What I'm really super happy getting this machine it's the screen RGB led it's amazing just like the MX17 r2 with a $2000.00 less price tag.

 

Ok, well that doesnt really answer any of the issues being asked here? Check my config. I got the 820qm for only 30 euros more than a i7 620m....

 

For 30 euros I don't think you could go wrong either way. Enjoy your new computer! Let us know how it performs.

 

I didnt recieve it yet, but will report for sure....

 

Yea good luck with the system Riccardo83, it really is a joy to use when everything is running well. Do let us know how it performs.

Ok, I completely understand and agree with what tenknics has been saying about the 4670 being the bottleneck in this system long before the processor, but I just wanted to add a little something. I was able to run MW2 maxed (Everything on, AA/AF on, and Texture-Extra) at 1080p, with an average just over 30fps. I was pleasantly surprised myself, that the 4670 could pull those frames. Turn off AA and it's much smoother (and better recommended IMO), but AA was still playable.

If you separate the graphics cards into tiers (which is def. not the most original way of thinking of it ), with first tier being the best, I would probably place the 4670 around the top of the second tier (closer to the middle). It's not a bad card at all, but it's still not good enough to not be the first bottleneck in the system, in the future. I do know that MW2 is actually a pretty well optimized game, but I just wanted to clarify that it can be run maxed at 1080p on the 4670, since that's the one game sptimmeh mentioned that I've tried .

 

I know the 4670 is the bottleneck of the system I get that your rtrying to stenknics but it can still process all the latest modern games 30-50fps all settings turned on, full resolution. because before on page 2 you said it will fail at processing modern games, but I understand what your saying

 

Again, I never said it would fail at processing modern games, can you please quote me where I said that? Because I can't seem to find it?

Also, you're hard to understand, can you try spell checking before you post?

 

I totally agree with you. I just used games as an example. But as far as I can see developers starts to use "new" technologies, such as hyperthreading, usually in games. And only later it appears in other kinds of software. And I really hope that "hyperthreading era" in general software is not so far ))

About heat. I was also as you guys a beet disappointed with 50C idle temps. But from the other side, do you really want to do heavy computing on your laps, or you'll just watch some video and surf in the net? If so, your notebook will newer be uncomfortably hot. For more serious tasks the best way is to use it on a table...IMHO)

 

Just throwing this out there... my house is hot all year round, which means the CPU stays hot all year round, I need something cooler. Would anyone be interested in swapping a 620m i7 for my 720qm i7?

 

Personally I would just go for a i5-540M rather than i7-620M as it seems to eat much less battery life and be just a tiny bit under in terms of performance. I'm just taking a guess here but I wouldn't be surprised if it produced less heat. Anyway I wouldn't feel comfortable with i7-820QM although it's a sweet deal, as I don't want my laptop to overheat and don't need the power of 4 cores.

As for gaming, it has been pointed that the 4670 will be the hindrance in the mid-term, so why bother. So i7-820QM for heavy multitask but possibly hot laptop, and i5-540M for more battery life and cooler temperatures but less power.

 

The i5-540m and i7-620m both have a TDP of 35w. So there should be no difference in terms of battery life.

 

For the majority of current games the 4670 is just fine. I'm starting to get annoyed with people acting like the laptop is just not game friendly.

I can handle starcraft 2 with 900p resolution no problem.

Badcompany 2? 900p resolution on medium settings.

This laptop is more than suitable for most games. I don't know what you're looking to play that makes the case for this not being a more than capable gaming machine.

Your first bottleneck for overall performance on this machine is usually going to be the harddrive. The next will be the ram unless you have >4GB. The next will be cpu if you running something like a p8300. The last will be the gpu in reference to normal everyday tasks.

In gaming your main bottleneck will almost always be GPU in ANY rig. Second will be CPU, and a good cpu can help bump up your overall frames. Usually most games use only around 1-2gb of ram, so that's rarely a bottleneck.

So will you see a big fps bump dependent upon CPU in games? No, we're probably talking a small difference of between 2-5 frames going from an i5 to a high i7. Will you see a difference in certain cpu intensive programs that can take advantage of multiple core rendering? Yes.

 

There is a significant difference according to real tests, even if the numbers say it has the same consumption.

 

I second that notion! Trust me, I understand the desire to run everything at max resolution with max settings, but not being able to do that in Crysis doesn't necessarily make something terrible when it comes to games.

 

I agree with your comment. Definitely a capable gaming card. I've been very pleased with it.

Sorry for going a bit off-topic OP . Now @Magicite, I also play BC2 (fun game, right?). Firstly, is your native resolution 1080p or 900p? If your native is 1080p, when you run at 900p resolution, do you notice black bars on the top and the bottom of the visible screen? You know, those type of black bars you see in movies and stuff (it might differ if your native is 900p, idk rlly? ). See...I run mine at 720p high settings (AA-1x, Shadows-Medium), but I use that resolution because those black bars don't appear at 720p. I see the black bars at every other resolution apart from 720p and my native 1080p and I find them annoying. A higher res would be cool to run at, but at my current settings I get a very good average of ~50fps, with lows not dipping below ~20fps in tasking areas. I was just wondering if you have/see the black bars too?

 

I dont agree, 4gb of ram would never be a bottleneck for normal everyday tasks, especially now the memory controller is integrated. Its the last bottleneck.

Also gaming at 900 (whats with the p? computer monitors are progressive by default, always have been. this isn't a tv I hate how the HD craze and TVs have changed computers for the worse but thats a story for another day ) is just not acceptable to me. If that's your screen's native resolution, that's cool I guess, but Ive been gaming at 1600x1200 since 2004, and now 1920x1200 (1920x1080 if Im using the laptop's screen). For me running games at 900 or anything less than my screens native resolution (1080) is unacceptable and a huge step backwards. Why pay for a 1080 screen when you have to game at 720? It just sounds silly to me..

 

I didn't know that. Thanks for the info, btw, do you have any references for comparisons for heat and/or power consumption for the i7-620m and i5-540m?

 

I just got my 820qm 6gb xps 1645 rgbled.... temps are quite high especially underneath the laptop. weird thing is that the very left bottom is very cool and the middle so hot....

bad temp management.

i think idle temps were about 55 degrees in everest for cpu...

what do u guys suggest, send it back and tell dell to get a 1647 i7620m?

Or wait so long it overheats and gets replaced with a new upcoming xps 16 in the future?

I heared the new ATI 57xxx series will reduce heat as well?