Carbon fiber?

When I browse through product specs on some websites and read through some reviews, I commonly see Asus laptops being described as having a carbon fiber chassis. At first I always just assumed that this was true since Asus laptops are known for their quality, but upon further inspection I'm not so sure that it is always true.

If you browse the Asus website it does not say that the chassis for its laptops are made out of carbon fiber, in fact it doesn't say what their made of at all. I find this a little strange since Sony and Acer use carbon fiber lids as a major marketing point for their laptops that have them. I figured that Asus would want to brag about carbon fiber chassis as well especially since they are expensive and do increase the overall price for the laptop significantly.

How are people differentiating between high grade ABS plastic and carbon fiber? The only ways that I know of to separate the two are if you can actually see the carbon fiber weave in the plastic or if it explicitly says somewhere in the specs that its carbon fiber.

 

I'm guessing you could try setting it on fire. Carbon burns a lot better than plastic (and doesn't smell as bad).

Not sure if carbon fiber behaves the same way though.....

 

Most of it is carbon fibre composite which is a blend, as pure carbon fibre would be too costly.

 

ProPortable is gonna leave a post here I suspect since he's pretty knowledgeable on this front but, from what I've heard, Asus doesn't use the carbon-fiber you see on cars and things like that. Instead they use a composite plastic/carbon-fiber to reduce weight to allow for a thinner, lighter chassis with just as much strength.

~ Brett

 

Will plain carbon fiber is just carbon fibers weaved into a sort of cloth-like pattern. TIt has good tensile strength (kinda like the amount of force you can pull on a string before it breaks) but compressive strength is relatively unchanged which doesn't make it a good material for a chasis. When people use the term 'carbon fiber' with respect to laptop materials they mean (whether they know it or not) carbon fiber reinforced plastic.

What I'm asking is how do you know its carbon fiber reinforced plastic and not just high grade ABS plastic?

 

The correct term for most of the ASUS products that offer it is Carbon Fiber Alloy...emphasis on the Alloy...a blended high grade ABS plastic with Carbon Fiber.

On certain of the W2 models you can actually see the Carbon Fiber weave, but that is not really an Alloy...rather it is a true Carbon Fiber layer.

When it is advertised as Carbon Fiber Alloy I am not sure you can tell visually. So you will have to either rely on the advertiser's credibility, or contact ASUS directly for confirmation.

 

I hate to bust up the know it all about carbon fiber party.... but all carbon fiber parts are a "composite" ... It's like saying there's a difference between fiberglass and fiberglass composite. CF can be use for a visual effect, but in industrial use, it's used for it's structural properties. Asus doesn't brag about it anymore because there's an easy way to tell what systems are an aren't and neither in themselves are important to Asus. Structurally the visual aspect of certain CF weaves is not important at all, so the lightest weight and cheapest bonding materials are used... such as abs plastic..... which is grey. Typcially in an attempt to do something as you except, a clear resin would be used instead.

quality of build
thickness
weight

Just because it's made from carbon fiber doesn't mean all of those points are going to immediately become relevant. It's the other way around, the quality, thickness, and weight are a result of being able to use those techniques and that shows itself where simply saying the chassis is carbon fiber doesn't. For example, a model like the G1 which is heavy for a 15.4"... and thick... as well as average quality is all plastic.... If that were carbon fiber, the system wouldn't HAVE to be lighter or thinner or build better, but making use of CF allows things to be different and therefore would explain thinner profiles, lighter weights, and better structure - it just doesn't have to be... So in other words, the systems speak for themselves and Asus' carbon fiber systems would not be what they are if they weren't made that way.

 

i simply differentiate by product code.

plastic models: Axx, Zxxx (post-2006), Fxx, Gxx, VBI models (i.e. S96)

high-end models which are bound to use the best materials: Vxx, Wxx, Sxx (S6, S7 etc), Zxxx (pre-2006)

as with all generalizations, there are exceptions, like the Z71 and Z61 from before 2006, both of which look to be plastic.

 

Yes, carbon fiber is always a composite since carbon fibers by themselves really don't have any remarkable properties so they are always put into some sort of substrate like plastic. Also I understand that you don't necesarily have to be able to see the fibers in carbon fiber and that a lot of times it'll just look like regular plastic.

What I don't really understand is what you said about thickness quality and weight. A lot of owners of high end laptops like to go around saying their chassis are made of carbon fiber but how can you really be sure? Are you saying that you can assume that all laptops that are lightweight but still sturdy are made of carbon fiber?

What I'm really looking for is someone who maybe has talked to an Asus sales rep or found in some Asus manual or spec sheet that specifically confirms that certain laptop chassis are made of carbon fiber. If just by saying a laptop chassis is made out of carbon fiber doesn't mean that its lightweight, has good build quality, and is thin, then why is it listed as a 'special feature' on your website. I think you figured, just as I did, that mentioning the fact that a chassis is made from carbon fiber would be a good selling point and would make consumers feel like what their buying is of higher quality. So are the Asus sales guys too naive to realise that or are they affraid to make the claim for fear of backlash from customers (such as with sony's premium sz laptops).

 

The ABS Plastic/Carbon Fiber composites Asus is using don't look any different from regular ABS on the outside. The carbon fiber is being used an an engineering material throughout the laptop. There is no reason to make a big deal out of it.

The expense and price increase depend on how the carbon fiber is being used. 10% carbon fiber with an ABS polymer matrix material is not all that expensive and allows for significantly thinner panels then an all plastic system. 90% carbon fiber and 10% epoxy resin (like to see on 'tuner' car hoods) is extremely expensive, but also very brittle and easy susceptible to damage in the out-of-plane direction, so you don't see such systems used on laptops...

What model do you want to know about? Or who are you accusing of lying?

The body panels on my Z33 are labeled '10% CF' on the inside of the panels...

 

The bottom line is that it doesn't matter. The thickness of the chassis pieces seperately is really the only way you can really see what's going on. Plastic pieces are almost 1/8" thick..... while those same pieces in carbon fiber can be less than 1/16" and provide the same structure. That might not sound like a lot, but when you have a bottom and top case and a bezel and lid, that's nearly a total of 1/4" just in the thickness of the system...... That actually is a lot, again, even if it doesn't seem it. It also helps the weight, but it's not going to cut the weight of the system in half, just because the chassis is half the thickness, but it will cut close to half the weight off those pieces themselves, which might come out to close to 1/2 pound when it's all said and done.

When it comes to the systems themselves, Asus was the first to use carbon fiber chassis' and the thing is it was a big deal until they mastered the use of it. They initially got into composites with the M3, where they used fiberglass.... the structural properties simply didn't really allow them to make the systems smaller, just a bit stronger. When they made the M6, they moved to carbon fiber and didn't really master it in my mind until at least 20 months ago with models like the V6...... The thing is that NOW, it's really not what's in the system, because certain things are only possible with the use of different materials....... The V6 for instance would not be the V6 in plastic... it could not come close. So, in their eyes, a system is a system........ a thin system is a thin system and THAT is what consumers should be looking for.

For us, certain models are plastic - A/F/Z series...... the W/V/S/R series are carbon fiber....... but then in terms of visual things, some models have a brushed aluminum lid... some have a magnesium lid... some are carbon fiber like the chassis'.... so that varies too. Also though, the use of carbon fiber by Asus is a plus because in every system they've used it in, it's made attachment points where the hinges go a lot stronger...... it's also allowed for designs that make room for larger and better hinge designs..... so the material itself isn't important because the system is what it is, but it is that way because of the material - if that makes sense.

Asus has also stopped printing carbon fiber as such in the public view because they don't feel it's something they need to know... They'll mention exterior, visual things... like a brushed aluminum lid........ and they want to keep from confusing anyone when they make certain models with exposed carbon fiber..... Basically the structure is just how they make systems and reviews back up the fact that they make solid, lightweight machines......... beyond that it just doesn't matter.