Asus transformer book and taichi

This is so hot. But can't be cheap.

ASUS announces line of Transformer Books, laptops with detchable touchscreens -- Engadget

ASUS reveals TAICHI convertible notebook / tablet with dual 11.6-inch and 13.3-inch displays (update: hands-on photos and video) -- Engadget

Transformer book video added
http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/4/3062261/asus-transformer-book-windows-8-covertible-notebook

Taichi video added
http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/4/3062240/asus-taichi-computex-announcement-pictures/in/2826334

Dual os Aio
http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/4/30...r-aio-is-equal-parts-pc-and-tablet/in/2826334

 

I am really liking the creativity the manufacturers are coming out with for these Windows 8 ultrabook tablets, first Lenovo with the Yoga and now this. Can't wait to see what is next.

 

Blue screens of death, viruses, 4-5 hours battery life on use, and a Microsoft tax?

Just noting that the Transformer Prime, with the nvidia tegra 3 setup, has 12-14 hours of battery while playing h.264 encoded 720p video. If you want something like that out of a "full blown x86" setup, you need to know magic and sorcery.

 

Maybe they'll offer dual boot, win 8 and android. If not I'm sure someone from xda will figure it out.

 

Would have been much better if Win8/Winmo had an ARM fork, like some Microsoft teams were working on back in the long-long ago.

Guess the funding for that dried up when they realized they would have to stop using the codebase foundation, and instead try to produce usable cross-platform..ish code from their production suites.

 

Personally I've been looking forward to Transformer Book since the eee slate was announced.

It's everything I want. If it's got at least a 5 hour battery life in tablet form I'm buying one asap. If not, then I'll get the 810 which is the same thing minus the Ivy Bridge and Nvidia GPU. A usb on the tablet would be nice too (so I could play GTA or something on a plane without the keyboard) but I can live without it.

There's mention of possibly putting an optical drive on the dock, which I guess is good, but I don't really understand why optical drives are still as common as they are.

When was the last time anyone used a CD?

And for the record, I haven't had a BSOD in maybe 8/9 years? And thanks to Avast! only 1 virus in 4 years (even after the freaky sites), which just happened like a month ago.

And I'm not sure what a Microsoft tax is, but I'll be honest, I'm not MS's biggest fan. I am, however, a fan of compatibility and since most businesses, schools, and games use Windows it's Windows for me.

 

As common as the cold, as someone said.

No, I mean, you can get GTA on a tablet right now. Tegra 3/2, tegra-zone, etc. Usb input/gamepad on bluetooth. Other devices. Fuse, some networking. Emulation gaming, semi-officially via the android marketplace. More interesting things as well, including a linux land for ARM - that's been growing a bit with Maemo and Meego, and so on. There are limitations and lack of software right now, sure. But it can be used to stream netflix, any web app, that kind of thing. So - all the real uses you would have for a pad - with 15 hours of battery. Or "just" 11 on the pad without the dock. You know.. It's a good product. You should buy it. And Asus and Nvidia should want to sell it.

Thing is that there's nothing really beneficial for us as customers for clinging on to x86 in every possible device.

There is, however, a nominal amount of money to be saved in the short term by someone who wants to use their existing code-base. And therefore, we are stuck with x86. And, hilariously, 32bit compatibility layers with 64 bit OSes. Because we wouldn't want to have software developers make good programs (or pay them to make them) surely. Obviously that would be a waste of money.

Since: customers buy the crappy stuff anyway.

But hey, whatever, right?

 

Okay lets go through this step by step. 1. I don't get BSOD's on Windows unless I do something that breaks it (always my fault), 2. Viruses? You really get those? 3. Battery life is unknown, but expect more like 8 hours. 4. Microsoft tax? OEM's get Windows for $15.

Edit: And it's ULV Ivy Bridge, it's a full blown ultrabook in a tablet. You can't even begin to compare it to a Transformer Prime. This thing will eat it for breakfast, Tegra 3 isn't very fast when you compare it to a real CPU.

 

2. Viruses? You really get those?[/quote]
Sure. We don't get the funny ones anymore, like the Blaster worm with the "Bill Gates allow this to happen to your computer - update it now" string in the code. But more like the "haha, did you know that Acrobat reader with the browser integration allows monitor execution of any script the explorer can parse?" stuff. But yeah, there's viruses.

Why is that? I expect a smaller battery because of the smaller size, with a motherboard construction that still will have "laptop-class" power consumption.

And then you buy it as a consumer for how many Hamiltons..?

Fast for what kind of tasks?

 

A windows tablet is more useful for my decades of programs, and it could use blue stack to run any android apps I would need. Any ideas on price? I assume availability in the fourth quarter of this year?

 

And for people who want a Tegra 3 setup (better battery life, lower cost, but can't run x86 software), there's the Asus Tablet 600 running Windows 8 RT. I'm going to buy one, not a shadow of doubt in my mind.

Asus announces Tablet 600: transforming Windows RT device with Tegra 3 and 2GB RAM (hands-on video) | The Verge

 

So that's where it ended up xD Windows RT.

 

Alright, i've had to do some cleanup in this thread, keep on topic and within the forum rules.

 

You're thinking of an ideal world where everyone can adapt in a relatively short amount of time to new applications, but for major corporations the amount of retraining needed to get people just to learn a new version Word due to a lack of interest is mind boggling.

Consider also the practicality of asking smaller niche programs, like LegalKEY which my company uses, to scrap everything they've built and supported in order to begin work on a brand new framework. You're talking about starting from absolute scratch on multiple fronts, entire businesses would have to not only continue as usual, but also find time to train, install and port an entire new framework, while hoping and praying that every program they use 1) also creates something for the new "more efficient" architecture, 2) knows it well enough to prevent any disastrous bugs, 3) can provide the support and implementation staff required to do so internationally, at a high pace, and in high demand and most importantly 4) without losing any of the data that's been 15 years in the making globally, and retaining a backup that's transferable and accessible just in case.

It's simply unfeasable.

As for GTA etc, it's only an example, but as more games are made there's always an increased focus on the technology used, and typically that means a Windows environment using gaming graphics.

Yes there are ways to emulate but adding more and more layers simply taxes the system unnecessarily.

As for what's beneficial to us as costumers? Simplicity of use due to not having to layer programs over OSs which leads to a direct lowering of resource use and better performance, as well as large scale compatibility with programs and systems that it would be unrealistic to expect to change.

Also, there is a dual boot sort of - the AiO has Windows 8 and Android, but it's an 18 inch monster. Might be good for around the house, but since it's a desktop-like dock for the tablet, it's probably not much good for general portability unless you have like 3-5 kids in the back seat who all want to watch a movie together on the way to grandma's or something.

edit:
Also it's not just about being cheaper, easier or lazier to not update, it's also about the investment on multiple fronts. Consider the sheer amount of customization that's already been put out there in order to get exactly what people want, from peripheral devices like the G15/Belkin Nostromo and Razer Naga epic, or some of the software like comicrack, and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzWWMhv71s0 that takes the end user experience to a new level.

New architecture means throwing half the stuff we already use away.

 

..I understand your concerns, and the reasons for them. But I am living in a world where development costs and development time tends to be shaved down as much as possible - and where a majority of the tasks will be performed on portable "web-based app" platforms anyway.

And it would have been a surmountable proposition to convert the backend for word/office/outlook to a new platform - if that had been a goal five years ago, and the systems had not been deliberately designed to break apart like a house of cards if you start to change things.

I mean, you know that the excessive use of xml-forms in Word came up because they did indeed scrap the entire foundation for Office a couple of years ago.

That is what your average Microsoft tech will tell you, yes. And I agree that if it really involves scrapping the entire framework, then you are obviously 100% correct.

The question typically is if it's possible to shift parts of the framework out to other types of interpreters that might not be platform dependent. Note that Microsoft as well as many firms producing MS based solutions, are using in many cases portable formats for more or less all of the tasks outside the database itself. If you start up an application on Live, Winmo, that kind of thing - odds are that the app you're running is not actually depending in any practical way on the actual windows core libraries.

That's.. usually why some of us dislike Windows. But.. the actual platform dependent code involved in a game is in 90% of the cases limited to:
1. GUI code, window management and interface with the hardware layer. Equivalents are available for other platforms - linux, mac, etc. Directx11 functionality also is not dependent on Directx in that sense. Directx simply allows "easy access" to the functions.
2. Hairy c++ involving memory management that no other OS than windows would allow. And which will, in 100% of the cases nowadays, be possible to rewrite without performance loss.

Outside that it's unnecessarily platform dependent OpenGL in the middle of function calls far down in the stack. These are more difficult, but also less common. Simply because the benefits of running that kind of code isn't there any more.

You actually have a relatively successful business right now working only on creating a launch layer for windows programs(primarily games) to run "natively" in Linux. Popcap uses them a lot.

When you also know that each of these programs - not necessarily games - also run their own versions of dynamic/shared libraries (MS still recommends you should pack your own files for compata--patapability purposes) - because MS's updated platform isn't actually compatible backwards -- then platform dependency becomes more of a severe inconvenience than any sort of bonus.

hehehehe. An inconvenience, because of this^

If you program something without thinking about standards, compatibility or reuse. Yes, obviously.

I mean, I'm not going to insist that it's a good idea to transfer all your Office applications to ARM. I'm saying that certain tasks and programs can run on "embedded" systems with ridiculously much better performance for all kinds of different purposes. Imagine a customer database app that is instantly available to you on standby on a small tablet. That you can whip up a presentation via hdmi from your phone (without the phone melting at the last slide). That kind of thing.. It's possible right now.

 

Ahh, see that's the difference, you're a "glass half full" kind of guy.

I'm a firm believer the glass is half empty. Because it's cracked, and filled with highly corrosive and volitile acid that is slowly eating through the table and ready to explode, and that someone is just itching to hit it with a baseball bat to see what would happen.

The acid is also sentient and hates me and my entire family and needs to destroy us to survive.


edit:
I don't ever see a smooth, thought out, planned transition, is what I'm saying.

 

rofl. Never been called that before.

No, practically speaking, the acid tends to be explosive, and it's toxic when it eats through the table, and then it poisons you to death while you try to put out the fire on your feet, and so on.

But maybe the containers could be made better one day..

 

Has anyone seen full specs for the Transformer book?

 

How you can sure it's more than 8 hours? Packing those high-performance CPU & GPU will need much power, and you can't put bigger battery on a tablet since batteries are heavy. The new iPad has laptop-class battery though.

I think Tegra 3 is in the Atom level, not far from it.

So far: 1080p 11"/13"/14" screen, i3/i5/i7 CPU, NVIDIA GPU, 4GB of RAM, USB 3.0, and docking keyboard like other Tranformers.
And this is my assumption:
CPU: Since it will be called Ultrabook (that's why it's TF Book), I think it's the ULV Ivy Bridge.
GPU: To be more power efficient, I think it will be Kepler, expect no less than 620M. Hoping it's 640M though
RAM: I hope it's upgradeable

Well, for my ideal system, check my dream on the signature below.

 

No.. it's -- pure linear synthetic benchmarking put it in the range of an intel core2duo running at 1.8Ghz or something like that. This is on typical out of order execution, where ARM processors haven't really been very strong before.

On everything else, though -- with four independent cores on the same bus, and a bit of trickery, and you have something like this:
NVIDIA quad-core Tegra 3 "Kal-El" quad-core processor demo blows us away - YouTube

Basically.. "on chip" decoding of 1080p@60fps video, and coding... encode.. of a h.264 target in 1080p. We're also talking about parallel operation in terms of graphics and 3d with advanced mathematical functions, which is something the most modern graphics cards still struggle with, since they're really designed for cost-efficiency, and not for an as advanced instruction set stack as possible..

So.. yeah.. a phone streaming 1080p movies to your TV? You got it. Right now.

In that respect, the part of the market Windows RT is going to target is older and simpler phone tool tasks, being capable of basically running android web-app programs unmodified.

The value of that.. might be there, for all I know. I mean, Microsoft are good at selling things, and I didn't really understand what they were doing with Winmo anyway, or how in the world it at all survived. Still don't know how it did that, so...

But the point being that the two devices target completely different users. The Tegra 3 and 4(or Wayne and so on), will be geared towards 1. multimedia and 2. background tasks on low power. Meaning that it's a perfect fit for a tablet used intermittently for streaming or watching film, browsing the web, and for phone, talk, skype, mail, IM, etc.

Windows RT devices will be put out there for a customer who requires an intel 64/32bit stack, but who will typically have no need for it. Like ^ up there said, it's perhaps great for presentations and such, and might be a very useful device that combines web-app lands with normal OS/office-functionality. At .. the cost of battery life, size and so on.

Not that there's no use for it, of course. Because we won't see a full development suite working on a quad-core tegra just yet, for example. It might turn up eventually. Like a java compiler we had for UIQ3 a while back. It's not impossible to do, and it's certainly a very enticing prospect, to be able to run examples and compile java-code and run it on your phone. While, for example, putting the output on a projector, and so on. While having the input in an ide of some kind via an external keyboard. All that is possible, but the demand is.. small, of course.

But still.. not too far away, that that might happen. That we really don't need a "full blown computer" any more. But can make do with a small thing you can keep in your pocket instead.

...of course, that was also not too far off in 2000. And then iPhone basically shot everything smartphone related to death, and re-aligned it as a bunch of web-app based crap where you would pay for each button-press.

But hey, one can dream. Of Intel's demise as a company, basically..