901 XP skips, stutters when playing music or videos

Videos are completely unwatchale and music almost so. I've updated the drivers, flashed the bios, dropped hardware acceleration, changed the powersaving options, checked for spyware, checked for viruses, nothing.

This is extremely aggrivating. Nothing in the Task Manager shows a huge CPU/RAM spike.

 

Run this benchmark:

http://release.crystaldew.info/CrystalDiskMark

Hit "All" up at the top to run all 3 tests, then post the results. My initial inclination is that it's a hard drive problem.

 

It doesn't need to be a spike - anytime your media files start skipping/stuttering, or playing slow, it's an indication that your available RAM amount has dropped to critical levels. Other indicators are typing problems (you can type faster than characters appear on the screen) mouse jumps on the screen, and program freezes for a few seconds or more. Of course it can always be something else, but when it's both music and video, or that and a combination of the other things I mentioned, that's the most common cause. The other typical cause is an A/V program, set to scan files on a real-time basis, coupled with a RAM issue.

It makes no difference if you've got lot of physical RAM or don't run that many background processes either - before upgrading my HDX to 8gb from 4gb of DDR2, I'd have it happen occasionally to my system as well, typically after coming out of hibernation for a few hours. Note that your physical amount of RAM isn't an issue - it's the amount of RAM that's AVAILABLE for a program or process to run that's the issue.

A certain amount of RAM is allocated to each program and process by the system as each one starts. However, when those programs/processes stop or are shut down by the user, the amount of RAM allocated for the program or process use isn't given back to the system in the same amount. The system always gives less RAM back than it allocates for any given task.

Over time, if you don't reboot your system, those levels can drop to critical, so that the amount of available RAM for new programs & processes to run may not be enough for everything to run smoothly. When that happens, the system switches to the primary hard drive, and begins using it as a Virtual RAM source. The constant accessing of the drive to keep up the media file stream is what causes the skipping, as the file stream is faster than the drive can be accessed. Media files and their playback programs are typically RAM intensive, so if the available amount of RAM is low to begin with, and there are other programs running, combined with background processes running it can send it into a critical level state.

There are a few ways to check this:

1. Vista logs Exhaustive Resources - when resources drive RAM to a critical level, it notifies the Event Log.
2. CPU/RAM meter gadget - it's real obvious if you've got one on your desktop, as your CPU is constantly running at a high level and your available RAM is near maximum levels.
3. Memory Boost - Memory Boost is a RAM reclamation utility. It monitors your amount of available RAM, and then if it gets to a certain level that you can set, it flags you that your available RAM is reaching critical levels. When that happens, you have an option call QuickBoost, in which MB will attempt to reclaim the RAM that's not being used and is not available to the system anymore (the RAM that was used previously but not given back to the system for reutilization). You can set the target amount of RAM if you wish, or let it try to reclaim as much used RAM as possible. I've used it for years, especially on my older systems that I run RAM intensive programs on but only have a total of 2gb of physical RAM.
Memory Boost also allows you to see which programs and processes are the RAM hogs of your system (like the processes manager in your Task Manager) but unlike the Process Manager, MB will tell you which program a given process belongs to so you know if it's okay to shut it down or not to free up resources.

MB is available as a full version 1 month trial download - Memory Boost

It's only problem is that it hasn't yet been updated for 64 bit systems. But there are other RAM resource management utilities out there.

Realistically though, it's easy to determine if you've got too much running in the background. All you need to do is to open up your Reliability and Performance Monitor to see the amount of RAM those processes are using up compared to your amount of physical RAM.

You can also see any Resource Management problems in your Performance Monitor:

1. Control Panel, Performance Information, Advanced Tools.
2. The Advanced Tools Window will list any problem processes at the top, marked with a yellow exclamation. icon.
3. ReadyBoost - On the list of items on the Advanced Tools window is Vista's ReadyBoost feature, which lets you use a Flash Drive
as an additional RAM source of up to 4gb. I use an 8gb SanDisk FD.
4. Open Reliability and Performance Monitor - the R&P Monitor shows you graphically how well your system is doing in each critical
resource area - Network, CPU performance, Used RAM amounts, and Disk performance. The Green indicator shows you how much is being
used.
5. Event Logs - on the Advanced Tools window at the top of the list is View Performance Details in the Event Log. Clicking on this will open the
Event Viewer, showing the Performance Diagnostics for your system. Any process impacting performance will be logged here.
Scroll down to the Resource Exhaustion Detector, open out the folder and click on Operational. This will show you the logs and events for each
time your system's resources have reached critical levels.

 

I had an ASUS 900A that was unusable in XP due to SSD stuttering, so I'd start with making sure it's not that.

 

How do I check for SSD stuttering? Will the above program do it? And how do I fix it? Will I have to swap out the 8 gig drive?

 

Well, run Crystal DiskMark first and post a screenshot of the results. You may be able to run a driver-level tweak to fix it, if it's even the drive in the first place. It could be limited CPU/RAM power as well like others have mentioned.

 

4k random read/write;

1.148 read, 0.019 write.

That can't be right

How do I fix this?

 

Yeah, definitely a serious drive issue. I was going to copy over what I was watching only for it to say it would take over an hour for a 300 meg file.

How can I fix this?

1.505 read for the first test, 1.339 write. I'm doing the second one ow. This is nuts though.

 

You're getting hit with what's now infamously known as drive stutter. 1.148 4K read is OK; it's still faster than even a 10,000k WD Velociraptor, and is not the source of stutter. It's the 0.019 4K write that's killing you. Long story short, what happens is that while your system is waiting to finish that abysmally slow 4K write (Could freeze half a second, a second, etc), it can't read or write anything else on the drive. Hence the perceived stuttering.

There is a highly experimental XP driver available to alleviate these problems, and you can read about it here:

http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54467

It works on all SSDs, but has the biggest help on netbooks. Be sure you understand how to install/uninstall it, uninstalling especially in case it doesn't work. Requires a reboot after installation to take effect.

After installing the FlashPoint driver, but before rebooting, make sure Windows Write Caching is disabled. They conflict with each other and my system wouldn't boot with both enabled. I had to go into safe mode and disable Windows Write Caching in order to get my system to boot.

 

Tried that already, those results are with it on. Maybe wait for version 3?

I had no idea that if I bought this thing it probably wouldn't work.

What else can I do? Replace the drive? How much does that cost?

Second test is reading 1.355 and writing 0.873

I'm running the 4k test again and the read is at 0.087...

 

You already tried FlashPoint, or have Windows Write Caching enabled? The Windows implementation is pretty bad, FlashPoint works much, much better. They re-released FlashPoint Beta 3, so give that one a try and see if it has any effect. Also, disable "Indexing Service" in Windows XP.

For reference, here's a normal benchmark from my 7200 RPM desktop drive. Despite the low 4K performance, it is fast enough that the drive will not stutter:



If you can get 4K writes up over about 1 or 1.5, you'll be fine and have no stuttering.

 

I tried FLashpoint Beta 3, no difference.

The C drive gets Read of about 5 on the 4k test and of 1.4 on write. It seems the problem lies mostly with the D drive itself.

Indexing service is turned off.

Is the drive screwed?

Can't find anything about the Write Caching in services, where else do I find it?

 

Which is your OS on, C or D? What's the SSD? Same drive, different partitions?

FlashPoint only works on the C:\ currently from what I understand.

 

OS is on C. I copied the video onto the C drive, and it played fine. It took ages to copy over though.

The problem is with the D drive. Do I just have to wait until it supports the D drive? That sucks balls.

 

You know, I'm usually pretty cool and fair in my treatment of people here, unless I see something so far out in left field that as a Professional I can't sit by and just say nothing.

I don't say this often around here, but Jlb, you are full of it. You DO know what SSD stands for, right?

What ignorant idiots around the 'net call "SSD Stutter" isn't stuttering of the drive. Only mechanical drives actually "stutter", as in the read/write heads themselves. With an SSD, it's a failure of the drive to keep up with Read/Write instructions from the system, OR - the system itself is being used as a RAM device because the system's resources are being taxed to the point that the CPU and RAM aren't able to keep up with system demands. Part of the SSD starts being used as RAM, which leaves less area of the drive to be used as actual storage.

What's really stupid is that you've posted what's happening, but you're ignorantly believing that the drive is the problem, without considering that it's the system that's overloading it and it's failing to keep up. That tells me that information didn't come from you to begin with - if it did, you'd understand what it means. But most people who don't follow any logical troubleshooting method would come to a conclusion like that because they're of the incorrect belief that when a problem occurs it must be hardware related. Most problems are due to software; hardware failures only occur when it's either a bad design to begin with, or the most common reason - the user doesn't know how to use or maintain it properly. I've been making a living off that very fact for many years, and I'm sure I'll be doing so for the next 30 or so.

I've been dealing with SSD's since we first designed and used them for the Hubble in the Space Program (Solid State Recorder). The reason we designed them and started using them in Space on orbital satellites and deep space probes is because they have no moving parts and they DON'T FAIL. Before that we used to use reel tapes.

Any hard drive will cause FILE STUTTERING if the system's resources are overloaded. Mechanical drives, when overloaded, can actually have a mechanical stutter as well. When systems start using drives for a RAM resource, they'll typically use either a secondary drive if there are 2 internals,
or the primary if it's only one.

Like most BDt's, you've focused on the wrong component, and have gotten this poor person off on some BS tangent that's completely unrelated to the real problem because your own technical incompetence has led you to BS conclusions and solutions on your own systems, or read what other idiots have incorrectly assumed as well.

So KR, if you want to continue believing this BS, then by all means, pull your hair out. I'm sure the next thing he'll tell you is that you need a new SSD. But before you start believing fantasies about your SSD being bad to begin with or failing, do yourself a favor and monitor your system resources when your problem starts happening. Focus on the cause of the problem and not the symptoms.

I apologize for being so rude, but I really get fed up when I see good people looking for help being given BS answers and "solutions". Of course most people who answer don't care, because in the end if the user follows that BS and winds up with even more problems or has to spend money, the person giving the "solution" isn't liable and isn't spending the money. And most times the person will wind up with the same issue because the original problem was never addressed.

As the saying goes, "Caveat Emptor".

As a Professional, online, I despise people like Jlb who give crap for solutions, but in real life? Gotta love 'em. People like that get computer users so screwed up that in the end, they bring their systems to people like me to fix. So on the one hand I say you're way off, but on the other I say "thanks for giving the industry another client".

 

I'm going to brush off the majority of those completed unnecessary insults and narrow it down to the core issue.

Netbooks with mechanical hard drives, with all other hardware held constant, do not stutter.

All your long rant fails to take this single critical fact into account. I'm not going to question your knowledge or background, just that you're completely wrong on this particular scenario. The OP's computer may work fine and not need a new SSD, maybe RAM will do the trick, but you're still wrong on your assessment.

 

Cybervisions, if the system as a whole is the problem then why is it only the D drive that's stuttering, and not the C?

 

So no help? It's just dead?

 

I don't know, there are a lot of other users in the forum who may have suggestions.

 

;_; ;_; ;_; ;_; ;_;

 

Is it possible to do a reformat and reinstall of XP? It would be worth a try I think before buying replacement hardware. I have a 901 as well, but I don't have any issues like that...

 

I don't know if it'd make much difference since the skipping is on the D drive and not the C drive. I could probably format the D drive and then put everything straight back on it if I can find my USB key. Don't know if that'll help though.

 

Kittie Rose,

I had this issue happen in my Eee PC 701 4G. I tried everything I could think of, and the only fix was to start fresh and reinstall XP. Seemed to work for me. If you get that desperate, try doing a system restore (I think it's F9 or ALT+F9 during POST, check your manual).

I'm coming to Jlbrightbill's defense, and I'm going to call you out on your insulting post. "Stutter" is the most common word used to describe what many low end SSDs experience when their controllers are overloaded with lots of small writes. I think Jlbrightbill deserves an apology.

 

This sucks, I don't even know how to reinstall XP on these. System restore might be the best bet.

 

So that's it there's no solution short of a reinstall?

 

Hi Kittie,
Do be aware that the C: and D: drives are on physically different SSD drives in your 901 and that the D: drive is slower. However, both should be fast enough when reading, but both can be really slow when writing. That's a characteristic of SSD drives in general and these drives in particular.

Another characteristic is that when they start to get full or after a certain amount of use, they can get slower. Early in their life, there are always blank parts ready to write to. Later in their life, previously used sectors have to be erased before they can be written, slowing down write operations even further.

If something is writing to your D: drive while playing the movie, I could imagine that could cause the delays by interfering with the reads. (I'm not sure if that's the situation, but seems like a possible scenario.)

I can't really offer any suggestions other than to suggest playing movies from an SD card or USB stick. At least with those you can be more certain that nothing else will be writing to them during play. Another option might be to try a different movie player as some might perform more buffering and could compensate for momentary interruptions in disk I/O. For that matter, it is not very expensive to bump RAM up to 2GB. I think that XP will use the extra memory to buffer disk I/O and that might help.

HTH,
hank

 

Hank, would the money for new RAM may be be better spent on a faster HD? I can get a SuperTalent HD for $54 that has the same write speed as the runcore(read is a tad slower but not by much, it is cheaper after all).

 

I do not know.

But one thing seems certain to me. If you buy RAM today, the only difference you will see down the road is that the same RAM might be less expensive. There seems to be zero chance that the 901 will be able to use more or faster RAM because those things are determined by the chip set Asus chose. OTOH, the SSDs available are likely to be bigger, faster and cheaper down the road.

I can't even confirm that the disk speed is the culprit. It could be that something in the background is writing to D: and causing problems with reads. If that is the case, a little speed improvement may make no difference. Since you mentioned stuttering with audio files which have much lower data rate requirements than video, I suspect a slight improvement will not make a difference. (And I could be wrong and disk speed may have nothing to do with this.)

I'm not sure what you mean by cheaper. Cheaper than what? I have ordered a 2GB RAM stick from Newegg for $24 (with shipping.) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231153&Tpk=N82E16820231153. This is actually not the least expensive, but it will be slightly faster (CAS Latency 4.) You can get quality RAM (Geil, Crucial) for as little as $20, shipping included.

best,
hank

 

The audio doesn't stutter as much as video. Read/write speeds are messed up too; I did the test.

 

I just don't know what to do at all.