Macbooks perform slower on AC power only

http://www.engadget.com/2008/11/22/macbook-and-macbookpro-suffer-performance-anxiety-once-the-batt/

Only Apple could get away with this.

 

This has been known for a while and occurs on all Intel Mac notebooks. If I'm not mistaken, Apple's not the only one that throttles the CPU when the battery is removed. I thought Lenovo does the same.

I believe the reasoning is that if the notebook is completely maxed out (CPU/GPU/many external peripherals attached, etc.) then it possible that the AC adapter can't supply enough power or the adapter's power wouldn't be clean enough since it's nearing max. In such a situation the battery is needed to provide voltage support.

Lenovo throttling:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=192745

 

That's really stupid. Apple needs to forget about making the adapter look cool and provide one that can handle the power requirements. Does this mean that if you game a lot and max out the laptops performance, that it will start to drain the battery? Either that or the power brick explodes or something? Pretty big design flaw in my opinion.

 

Actually, no Lenovo (Thinkpad), Dell, HP, and others get away with it as well.

 

yeah this is really old news... february of 2006. its now november 2008.

 

I'm kinda afraid of damaging my battery since I have to subject it to high temperatures when I'm gaming. On the other hand though, I cannot possibly imagine using it with the battery out, as the magnetic charger disconnects so easily! I recall there were times I would accidently push the magnetic charger out while trying to take out my battery.

 

I have yet to see a single HP or Dell that throttles while just on AC power. In fact, my Inspiron 1420, the Latitiude D630 close by, the HP tx2500, the Dell Latitude XT.


And looking at my cousing's HP dv5z.....

And lets see if anyone has a T61 around here..... Yup, but it runs just fine without the battery. Maybe it is just an exception rather than the norm.

Nope. Anyone have any confirmation on ANY models?

 

That is an extremely poor reason to throttle the hardware. It's almost like Apple were too cheap to give you guys proper AC adapters so they cut costs here of all places.

As said before, what happens when the battery dies? Presumably if you're playing a game for a few hours straight with you laptop cooler on etc etc, the battery will slowly be used up if this logic was to hold. Does that mean you need to charge up your batteries again so you can play at the framerates you paid good money for?

 

I was really hoping NBR would know better...

There is a reason why its called a CHARGER, not a POWER SUPPLY. It is not meant to supply a laptop continuously under load. Otherwise, the AC adapter would have to be much larger and heavier to account for spikes of power use. However, laptops have batteries. Why not use them to cover these energy spikes? MANY notebook manufacturers do this (such as the ASUS I had, the GPU would throttle way down w/o a battery on AC power). It only makes sense. We are talking about a notebook here! Its suppose to have a battery and the battery is supposed to back the AC adapter. I don't want to have to have to lug around a heavy AC adapter on the go as that defeats the purpose of portability, especially when I do not need to make this compromise. On top of that, since Apple notebooks have magsafe AC adapters, it is completely idiotic to remove the battery. The power plug is meant to detach very easily as is.

fixed.

No, logic tells us that typically, a laptop isn't on 100% load thus the AC adapter is perfectly adequate 95% of the time. Think of the battery as a backup power source when you are using the AC adapter. I've gamed for hours on my MBP and my battery has never dropped below 95%. Also how the charger works, it will allow the battery to drain ~4%, then then charger will attempt to fully charge the battery (and this cycle repeats). So really, you are never really running directly off of the power adapter (unless you remove that battery).


... end of rant.

 

Old news. There has got to be something better to complain about besides this picky little issue. I first noticed this on a CD MB, and assume its the same up until now.

That battery doesnt get that hot to remove constantly. Your insane if you always do that.

 

The point of removing the battery is so
a) you can keep the battery cooler
b) you can keep it at a roughly 40% charge when you know you won't need it. (fewer recharge cycles and 40% is ideal for batteries
This all helps keeping the battery alive for longer which is GOOD thing

So what this is is that to eke out a decent performance off your MBP, you need to make the battery continuously charge and discharge, killing the battery for no good reason. If the notebook seems to only have a few spikes here and there as what I gather from your comment, then Apple should have either a) fixed the hardware to account for such spikes in power or b) given that tiny bit more AC adapter to account for the spikes (which surely can't be that great).

Lots of laptops don't have this problem. My gaming G50V certainly doesn't. Why can't Apple do something about it?

 

doesn't seem to be a life or death issue. but it does seem like a design flaw, if it wasn't intentional (to sell more batteries) i guess i would let it slide. if it was intentional, id be pissed (if i owned a mac).

 

It's the cost of using small adapters. The same thing happens to Dell if you use the small travel adapter.

 

This is a big thing for some companies and home users. This may not be a large concern for some people, but many others it is a deal breaker.

 

The Dell travel adapter is an option you chose =/
not the default behavior. (Even though the end result is the same, it seems worse)

1. mac - your performance is crippled unless you also have battery plugged in or buy a higher wattage and heavier adapter (do they have those? if so do they solve the issue?).
vs
2. dell - you can choose to buy a lighter travel adapter however unless the battery is also plugged in your performance will be crippled

Again, its not one of the seven deadly sins but you gotta admit someone somewhere went about this the wrong way.

 

The HP's don't. I have 2 of em and have run them both without the battery... This would also explain why the Batteries in these things seem to fail so much more often than other manufacturers considering they're basically using the same batteries mot other notebook manufacturers use.

 

"Apple's reason for forcing a drop in processor speed doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Apple justifies the speed reduction by explaining that it "prevents the computer from shutting down if it demands more power than the A/C adapter alone can provide." "

Odd that makes perfect sense to me. Don't desk tops shut down if they don't have enough power? Apple is saving you from loser your data and people are getting mad.
You can't be mad at Apple when they have that documented on there site. It's not like there hiding it.

I'd rather have a small adapter then the brick I had with my dell.

 

They did with my M1530... it doesn't bother me one bit. When it comes to getting power, function is much more important than form; an extra pound is worth it if it means your laptop will work like it is supposed to.

I was considering a Mac at one point, but because of this "minor" issue I probably won't, unless they fix it. I do some gaming and don't want my battery draining because of it.

 

It is working like it's suppose to, Apple designed it to do that. Just keep the battery in the notebook like they were designed for.
"I do some gaming and don't want my battery draining because of it"
What? How will gaming drain your battery?

 

Many businesses have notebooks for everyone. On the weekends or when they are out of town is the only time they are issues batteries from IT. This way the notebook batteries last MUCH longer. The PC's data is always backed up already on the network.

This is just one of the things Apple needs to change if they want to break into the corporate world with more then a few places.

 

Much ado about nothing. You battery will not be "draining" during normal usage. In fact Apple has been draining and charging the battery from 95%-100% when plugged in for a while now - the reason is that it makes the battery last longer.

That means you are already actively using the battery when plugged in. Why not let it cover (rare) power spikes as well. Apple usually errs on the side of caution when it comes to power use - as they well should given that these are premium products.

BTW I don't see the point of lugging a giant power adapter just because 1 in 1000 is going to use all the firewire and USB ports while playing 3D games and backing up their hard drive in the background. Nope. I'd rather have a small and light power adapter.

I am 100% sure it's not going to drain the battery when playing games. That would be a pretty unacceptable design flaw.

 

Huh? Is it a corporate requirement that people be able to play games on their company laptops? That's the only time where you'd even notice the performance drop. You are not going to notice it typing your weekly report in Word or checking your emails.

IT Dept: "We can't buy Apple notebooks because when we give them to people over the weekend sans battery, their frame rate in WoW drops 15%."

Riiiight.....

 

Actually, desktops come with power supplies that are powerful enough to power the computer. Imagine that!!!!!!

 

Nothing to do about games. I work IT and having slow downs is not acceptable for these people. I have people who want duel monitors so they don't have to switch tabs between 2 browser windows. You bet your butt where I work they are not allowed. It does slow it down when they are trying to watch a video and use their other programs as well. When you have 5+ memory intensive programs running a slower CPU is not helpful.

Again that is only 1 reason I don't see corporate switching over to allow macs anytime soon.

 

How many company's actually issue out batteries?

 

Depends on the company. Most companies do not, but it is becoming more popular as more people are learning how the lithium and poly lithium batteries function.

The main reason macs aren't issued is because the software is windows based.

 

It is not not only a battery draining issue.
You are missing the important point here.

Let's assume it is true that only 1 in 1000 will exceed the power capability of the AC adapter so the problem will arise only in that case.
The problem is that all 1000 users will experience 37% lower performance (when you don't use the battery) because of this scenario.Apple made this decision and you don't have a choice!

 

I believe the MacBooks have 65W power adapters where as the MBP gets a 85W power adapter. If Apple supplied the MacBooks with a 85W or 90W power adapters, then the CPU throttle would not be necessary.

It is cheaper to ship thin and small 65W adapters than thin and small 90W adapters though. This was a cost cutting decision by Apple.

And not everyone uses 3D graphics for games. Ever hear of CAD and other work-related 3D rendering programs?

 

Supposedly both the Macbook and the MBP have the throttling issue though... But it's probably true that this was a cost-cutting measure by Apple.

CAD work is a relative minority but rest assured we include them when we mean gaming. I mean, how many CAD professionals are going to let their uber-expensive/high end laptops go *ahem* to waste.

 

I believe this is just a design flaw and for the most part no one wants to take the time to take the battery out. The macs require a coin etc to take them out to begin with, and then Apple's market is the environmental and artsy people, who usually don't work in an office with a hundred networked computers. Until their market share changes more to business I don't see it happening. They have several things that need to be done before they can break into mainstream corporate America.


ETA: As stated before, it's not a big deal for most users.

 

They do? Are you sure about that?

 

have u checked ur power settings and controls in preferences.

 

they require a coin or some tool to use it. And don't say to use a fingernail etc because women with fake nails or nicely cared for nails will not wreck them to take out or install a stupid battery. They are not paid to do that and injuring themselves in not part of their contract with their POEs.

Again. The difference between consumer line of notebooks and the business world

 

Uhh, where is the coin here?

The previous MBP's never needed a coin, i guess it was just the macbooks?

 

Are you talking about the current Macbooks? Specify which Macbook you're talking about.

 

Passive101 is talking about the WhiteBooks. They are the plastic MacBooks that require the coin to get to the battery, RAM, and HDD.

 

^ Going by what he just said, he made it sound like all Macbooks require a coin just to open the battery slot.

 

Nope just some of them.