The M15x throttle? The final solution!

Perhaps don't try running render test ever again. I never do. I simply play the game once I have flicked stealth on and off.

I believe the next 20nm cards will be back to 100W TDP. The 780M was simply there to push kepler to it's limits. It is a great architecture and NVidia wanted to squeeze every drop out of it before moving on.

 

After further extended FC3 sessions I had one driver crash and one case of hard M15x switch off. I think it is safe to say that the M15x can't quite handle even 1.05V! Down to 1.025V...
Tis a shame yesterday I played for nearly 3 hours and had no issues. Today after about an hour each time those issues occurred.

edit: I believe it might be the PSU tripping! VERY hot to the touch. At the extreme OC I have set on the cpu and high GPU OC the laptop might at times easily comsume over 210W. As it runs hot the PSU trips...
will try elevating and cooling it passively somehow.

 

Please don't cause your M15x to explode. My 210w PSU does not get all that hot but I haven't tried running extreme OCs like you.

Do you have HDAO turned on on FC3? SSAA x4?

 

HDAO yes. Looks very nice!

I did try SSAA x4 some time back and the game works smoothly but there were some graphical defects on screen. I don:t bother with it now.

I wonder if the m15x can handle 1.05V + if I used 330W adaptor rofl! Then again 1.05V already pushes the cooling to the max

 

I'm really struggling without my CM U3! Had to leave it at home :-(
Playing FC3 even with those gel feet stuck to bottom, temps soon reach 81! That is at stock gpu too.

My ultra-low profile heatsinks from modDIY have arrived though so I will mod heatsinks soon! Don't want to lose any portability from any mod though.

Also consistently got 3d clocks by unplugging 210w PSU before booting, pluginf it back in so alienhead head lights up, then booting, then doing stealth toggle. Let's hope it lasts.

 

Hey that might work. I have the habit of always unplugging my PSU whenever I shut the machine off. I then replug and switch on when I next use it. I think this could be the reason it always works for me

As for the PSU I am going to get my hands on a 330W PSU, yank out the center pin and see how things are. I think the 210W is being stretched to it's limit when I game. Considering games will only become more cpu taxing in the future I think I have to test this out. When I run Prime 95 at 24x across all cores (3.2ghz) power draw already hits about 220W. In game it won't consume quite as much however the consumption will still spike at times during intensive fights etc. Add the GPU to that at 100% load and power draw is easily over 250W.

I wonder if people simply can't find the limit of the 7970M and other high end GPU' so far due to the fact we haven't yet tested a reliable power supply that can supply 300W + without overheating. Even the 240W adaptor might overload I reckon. M18x owners (imsoldstate) himself did a 330W PSU mod and still managed to trip it at 440W. Take one GPU away and that still means at least 300-330W of power consumption in a machine with a far more efficient modern CPU than the 920/40XM.

Giving our beast a satisfactory source of power is a necessity and something that will help preserve it. Not enough power is bad. More than enough is harmless.

 

I'd be extremely interested to see if a 330w PSU without centre works the same as the 210w adapter as far as eliminating throttling. Coupled with a nice cooling mod, hopefully we can handle top next gen cards.

I actually think new games will start using more threads so our hyperthreaded quad cores will continue to perform well but will need heavy overclocking. I managed to get 170w power consumption (150w PSU max) just from running prime95. You might be totally right about needing more power!

 

Agreed! Also with a decent cooling employed. Mine suffices especially if used with powerful fans we also could hard volt mod the CPU. I am thinking 75-100mv extra(the M17x R2 offers 50-75mv increase in bios). This would help us get the chip up to speed in game. Not prime 95 stable but in game load would never be sustained at 100% load anways. For this the 330W PSU would be needed.

Something like 27x across 4 cores and 30x on 1 core would be nice! I can handle 24x but 25x throws errors up halting one core before temps even get that high. This means even in summer my cooling has headroom but the chip just hasn't enough juice to run the multi. If the 330W PSU works I will look to this mod. No soldering is needed even.

Exciting times...M15x forever!

 

If you run everything at stock though (including CPU & GPU) and no overclock at all, is it stable at 240W psu? What's the max power draw from your systems when you guys run everything at stock with no overclock at all and what are the temps? ^_^

 

At stock clocks on GPU at 0.975V undervolt the 7970M stays very cool. Probably shaves 25-30W off the load and decreases temps roughly 10C over stock 1.05V. As for the 920xm at stock clocks the chip is a bit of a slouch noone should leave it at stock lol.

Anyways all stock with undervolt on GPU you are probably looking at 170-180W max power draw in a taxing game. If you disable the middle pin on the 240W adaptor you should be good for up to 300W if you keep the thing cool so I wouldn't worry about keeping things stock unless your temps demand you to do so.

 

Haha sweet! Yeah I was just wondering cause I was scared that if things got a bit too hot and drew too much power it would blow up my power supply or something xD. Also I see you have a bigfoot 1103 in your sig, I currently have a intel 5300 (not the ultimate) will I be able to replace it with the bigfoot 1103? And is it a good wireless card?

 

It;s ok. I replaced my 5300 with it. Gave 5300 to wife. Wifi card is located under the keyboard.

Dont worry PSU won:t blow up! At worst it will simply cut out and shut the laptop off as a result. This isn:t desirable though so always better to have bigger than you need like with desktops.

 

Just for anyone else having difficulties getting 3d clocks, here is what I've found.

Boot using 210w adapter, when windows loads toggle stealth mode twice. Check clocks using render tool on gpu-z.

If you can't get 3d clocks it's easier to reboot and try again rather than switching PSUs and toggling around. Just repeat steps above after a reboot. 2nd time usually works if first time was a no go.

 

Don't forget to unplug the PSU when you switch off. If you leave it in then you are likely still stuck in 2D. I always unplug at switch off. I simply plug in, boot up, toggle stealth mode once when at desktop and then play game.

Try that fatboyslimerr and see if you have success every time. I kind of feel that the render tool is bad luck. I haven't touched it since I found this perfect 100% reliable fix for me.

I have also found that at 24x across all cores my PSU doesn't cause a driver crash or cut out. 25x it always does after an hour of playing very hot to the touch. Must be pushing it right to the limit...definitely time for the 330W!
For now set 24/25/26/27. With new PSU I will push CPU up to 25/25/26/27 again and then get the thermaltake fans and push the GPU to 1.1V and 1ghz/1.5ghz. I think this combined with a cpu voltmod (try 27/28/29/30) could potentially use nearly 400W haha

The good thing is, with winter coming I won't need to heat my living room where I play in the evenings

 

Installed 13.9 drivers. Great stability with these. I also find my gpu usage is now up near 100% at all times when I game making for incredibly smooth gameplay!

Really recommend them. Temps are unchanged: idle still around 35C and load temps 78C.

 

Enabling the Intel Speed Step from bios seems to fix the throttle problem for me. I may be rushing though

 

I don't think that makes a difference most have that enabled. Pretty sure anyway.

The real cause of throttling is that the middle pin on the 150W and 240W adaptors hold them back at around 180-200W. Removal and or disable this pin and you get all the power the brick is able to give.

 

I have a gtx 260m and had throttling problems, it's been 3 days now, and the enable of the Intel Speed Step seems to have resolved the problem for me. For a more power needy system though, I don't think this is enough.
If you remove your middle pin, does your battery still charge properly? On a HP pavilion dv5 laptop, i had a problem with the missing middle pin on the charger and it ended screwing the battery (original battery dead, and new battery just would not charge unless the laptop was restarted and battery replugged).

 

Battery won't be charged if you remove the center pin.

 

Get chunky brick for power and a 150W slim or 120W brick for charging. Perhaps even a 90W one would suffice.

 

Has anyone confirmed, other than upsi, that removing centre pin or adding a switch works with 7970M?
I have a feeling it might not, might just be tweaked 680M working well?

Be a lot of wasted cash if it doesn't work. Are you volunteering King? Price of 240w and 330w are fairly similar here in UK. Around £50-55!

 

But you can try it with your own system fatboyslimerr. Just push the power connector in only half, so that the center pin is not connected. I tested my system with this method.

 

So in the end, what exactly causes the throttling? Is it just a link between the cpu usage and gpu, or pure power problem? I have a i7 740QM cpu and 260m video card and it was still throttling and stuck a 2d clocks. I don't think power is an issue in my case...

 

After removing the center pin and removing the battery (it was advised on previous pages) everything works perfect for me. I dont switch chargers or toggle stealth mode anymore. I just turn the laptop on as usual and everything works perfect, no throttling. When battery is plugged in sometimes have 2d clocks but without the battery it is always 3d clocks.

 

I have finally moved house !! Anyways looked at the 330W adaptor on ebay and it costs 64 pounds including shipping! Is it worth it!!

I find the 210W to be inadequate at times so I may just throw money at it!

 

I bought it. UK auction as it seems the stuff surprisingly is cheaper there!! Might take some time before I get it. Should be fun! Next on the shopping list is a new SSD!

 

Samsung evo 840?

 

I don't think so. I am thinking Intel 520 or wait until the next gen. I intend to upgrade to a 2TB drive for my ODD too. However as it doesn't exist yet perhaps I will wait until a 2TB 9.5-12.7mm drive exists before buying both together.

By that time I am sure I will upgrade the GPU lol.

 

It would be so awesome we could upgrade the ODD Sata-I interface to Sata-II but I wouldn't even know where to start.

I'm sure there is a better use of the expresscard slot also, other than a couple of usb 3.0 ports.

Undertaking my cooling mod this weekend!!!

 

Nice! .

 

Well, hello mates, i am already here with my all-upgraded m15x after all
First and foremost, say thanks to all people here who is improving and optimizing our elder m15x with their investigation

Now, let´s to my questions XD
Well, i would like to ask to people that have the 240w psu (with pin removed),
and a 100w card (like my 680m), if they have noticed when the laptop
is running under heavy load, the power buttom (alien face) starts to flicker??

When i say heavy load, i mean cpu/gpu oced running 3d mark or a game,
and the colour of my power buttom flickers between my usual colour and "on battery colour" (red/yellow in my case).
Even when i have the battery removed. In fact, i´ve always removed because i have read here
This seems to me that a energy issue is happening with the bigger psu?
Is a Flextronix one, btw. The guy who sold it to me, had a m17x i think.

The max stable oc, before 3dmark crashes, is: 26/25/24/24 for cpu, and 970/2200mhz in GPU. Its absolutely
stable for games playing hours (well, i dont play more than 1 hour or so), and i don´t
reach very high temps (cpu: 75º and gpu 80º, only with Metro last light). Thanks to IC diamond and HWInfo, i suppose.

So my only problem is about that flickering that i am not sure if it is normal, and the fact that,
i think i could go beyond this level of OC if were not for this psu, because the temps are very good :/
(anyway, i would be very satisfied with this oc, if you tell me that all is normal. I am aware about the mobo energy limitations)

Btw, the ammeter shows the max 201-203 watts when i´m runninng
the last 3dmark benchmark´s test ( the "combined test")
Would you think, this mark is low for the 240W psu, or is normal that i can´t go
further with this oc?? (i have seen higher oc´s with this configuration in the m15x)

Sorry for this giant post haha, and of course for my no native english.

Cheers

 

Hi Antonio,

I will Check if the power button is flickering. Your temps are great! With what clock do you get the 80C in metro?

Greetings

 

Helloo Upsi777, thanks for answering me, mate, i have just remember that you were a 680m owner

Well, Metro is very gpu dependent, so, when i play this game at 970mhz on core and 2188mhz for memory (i like that number because that way i have 140 gb/s bandwich, lol),
the gpu temps stay at 83º celsius all the time ( sometimes reachs 84 but just for a second ). On the other hand, the cpu oced (24x4 and 70/62 tdp/tdc), remain at 71º-72º C.
This is my max configuration for this game, otherwise it cut out (laptop shuts down). Btw, the ammetter shows only 180-185 watts...
And the power button light, of course, its flickering during the game.

With Battlefield 3 multiplayer, you know, all is different. Cpu reachs 80º overall, and gpu stays at 79-80ºC too.

I have to say, before then i had the dcm 7 and the 1mm 7wk thermal pad for the gpu´s memory chips, this OC i am telling you, was 4-5º higher.
I found this change awesome just for a different paste and thermal pad (and 34º-35º at idle)
Southern Spain is warm though hehe

I have set the fans with HWinfo, a little bit faster than the m15x standards too.


Edit: i have been playing more time to Metro, and that oc IS NOT stable for him haha. Down to 920mhz & 2050mhz, and no
energy problems during one hour and a half. ^^U

 

Hi,

I tried BF3 SP and there's no flickering on the power button for me. GPU 900/2000 getting 78C max with my cooling mod.

 

Well, i suppose i have a bad psu then... Maybe this Flextronics one is not very compatible.
I am not sure about that flickering could damage the mobo or anything, so, i'll back to the original 150w ( and stock gpu clocks...), and i'll think if i look for a new charge (Delta this time).

Thanks, mate

 

I would also consider a 330w PSU so do report back your experience.

 

I am also using a 240W Flextronics and don't have any issues. Maybe you got a faulty one.
But you can check it with your original 150Wpsu if the problem is really the Flextronics.
Push the 150Wpsu connector in, in that way that the center pin is not connected, OC your GPU and run 3d mark or any game and check if the power button is still flickering. The 150W PSU can deliver more than the 180W so for a short test it should be OK.

Has anyone tested the 330W PSU so far and can confirm that it works?

 

I have test differents configurations and connector pushings, and what i can say is next: if i full push the connector in (original 150W psu with pin), i have no flickering and i can play Metro with cpu oc, but not gpu oc ( or slight). With 3dmark running benchmarks, i can oc the gpu till 940/2100, and no problem ( the ammeter shows 200W!).
Otherwise, i can say that it doesn´t works if i only push at the middle. Only when is fully connected, works.
Add to this, my original 150w, doesnt lights (the ring light) ever, since a time ago (i dont know why). It might not work full pushed, cause that?

In summary, I would say i have bad luck with the chargers in my life XD

If someone says that 330w psu rocks, i´ll go straight to purchase it

 

Hi,

What do you mean when you say it doesn't work when you push it in in middle position?
Is it flickering again or is the PSU not connected and you are on battery?
In the second case you need to find the correct "middle position". Push it in, in that way, that if you open the bios the PSU is recognized as unknown.
Weird is that you get out 200W when it's fully pushed in (max for me is about 180w). Maybe you can check in the bios if its really recognized as the 150w PSU.
Maybe there is a problem with your 150w to!? or just the light isn't working.

 

You must yank out the middle pin or introduce a switch to disable it. No wonder you have no luck unlocking the PSU.

 

Thanks for helping me guys ^^
Well, i'll explain the circumstances:
Upsi, what you have said about the "unknown" psu state, at Bios, was very usefull. I have checked the 240w psu, with pin removed, and yes , it appears unknown.
(I know the only problem with this psu is the flickering and the 215w limit that it has, even without pin)

BUT, the problem is finding the proper "middle position" for the 150w psu, and get the "unknown state" in Bios. Just remind for a few seconds and, then, recognize the "psu state" or the "on battery state".
Trust me, i have no idea why is so "tricky" in my case

I would have to remove the pin to make sure is unlocked, but i dont want do it because is my "last" psu with pin to charge the battery :/

Could i put anything into the connector, that works as a switch? As is saying KOI?
Well, i will look for something else...

Thank you again
Cheers

 

I know it's tricky to find the correct mid position, for me it's working. When I found that position it stays at Unknown PSU state.
One thing you can do is to solder a switch into the data line. I have done that with my 240W PSU.
Maybe you can built a power cord without a data line.

 

215W limit? Must be a faulty PSU! The 240W should be capable of supplying up to around 300W reliably. My 210W chunky thing draws nearly that amount before causing a driver crash or cutting out completely. Tis the reason Iam getting the 330W. I am afraid not even a fully functioning 240W PSU will give the 920xm + 7970M/680M OCed enough breathing space.

 

There is also no 215W limit for me. Highest I have seen was 228W. I think the 240w PSU would be fine, even with an OC of 900/2000. Maybe with an OV and heavy benching a 330W would be needed.

 

Hi everybody, i am here again, with news, hehe

I finally got the "unknown-mid-position" ( i call this thing with a different name each time Xd), and it works with a small oc except with damn Metro.
I don´t know why, but it crashes after the logo opening. I suppose is extremelly energy demanding. I only can play with cpu oc (but i could do that without the mid position method).

Upsi, have you ever try a higher oc?. Just for benchs hehe.
When i used the 240w "flickering" psu, I could get 970/2188 mhz without issues at 3dmark 11, benchmark . And 26/25/24724 for Cpu. ( About a 7500 score i got with that oc)
And, as i´ve said before, the ammeter shows 215w as maximum.
(i remind you this psu has the pin removed).
I can play Metro too, with 900/2100 perfectly stable (and 81-82º max)

KOI, do you think this 330w psu will work with our M15x? ( i am not saying i am going to purchase it, just for asking haha):

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/NEW-Original-330W-AC-Power-Adapter-Charger-For-Dell-Alienware-M18x-R1-R2-X51-DA330PM111-ADP/1276177555.html

 

900/2000 was my max for 3d mark 11. I'm not such a "benching freak" . This setting is also fine for me in every game (getting max 83c in crysis3 and max 78c in bf3)
I can't try higher at the moment, with win 8.1 3d mark 11 has some issues for me. I need to investigate to find a solution.

 

With cpu at 24/25/26/27 and gpu at 950mhz at 1.05V and vram at 1450mhz (2900mhz) The M15x can already pull around 300W. It all depends on the game. If the cpu is pushed hard then power consumption gets high! Yes with an OV on the cpu the 330W is definitely a necessity!

I have found that Crysis 2 with all settings to max seems to stress the the cpu/gpu more than FC3. The rig pulls more power basically. I get driver instability pretty fast. The 210W just doesn't cut the mustard.

I can't see a reason why the 330W shouldn't work with the data pin removed.

 

Hello my friends, i´m back with my 240W´s issue, solved ( i hope ^^U)

I have no shutdowns, nor crashes now. The only thing i have done is to clean the connector´s inside, because i got the feeling i got a static shock when i touched it.
In fact, i found the paper i used to clean it, a little dirty. Maybe that was the reason of my issue, right?
I also opened the psu, but i didn´t dare to change anyhing there.

But whatever happens, now i can play with oc, with temps as my only limitation hehe ( well, no limits at stock voltage bios, of course )

Anyway, i am here with something concerning to my "power button flickering light issue".
If you remember, i had that flickering when i was playing something under heavy gpu load, right?
Now, i think i have found a possible answer to that: Alien FX controller XD
I have set that the power button light, turns yellow when the laptop works on battery. And maybe, our m15x´s failing to recognise other native psu, makes that colour change for some reason in extreme situations.
Maybe, you guys, have set the same light when the laptop is using the psu and, on battery state, and that is why you dont detect that flickering, under heavy load and oc? (if i choose the same colour for both states, effectively, nothing does flicker there)

So i would like to invite you, if you dont mind, to check all this assumption i am saying, and choose two different colours for the power button

Cheers!

 

When my 240W went faulty my alien FX used to flicker all over when I gamed. Keyboard, screen, power button.. everything.

I changed PSU and the flicker went away.

 

Just got one 240W PSU, and cut green wire. No any issues with GPU clocks.