Unusual HDD Noise

So, it's the AW 17 R3 again, with the HGST 7200rpm 1tb HDD (no SSDs), and it's making this sound (which is accompanied by the more familiar head thrashing sounds of an HDD) https://clyp.it/pqoid0ha

is this whizzing/whirring normal for this model and/or 7200rpm HDDs or is it yet another piece of hardware i should get dell to replace?? (i'm only just under 2 months into the warranty)

 

Have you check the smart data for any errors, if not use the app below.

http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalDiskInfo/index-e.html

John.

 

It is most likely the power saving induced either by Windows or by the firmware, seek and park head - sleep - wakeup - seek - read for access.

You can reduce / stop it by going into the Power Plan advanced options, and set the spin down time to 0 = Never, and then go into the device manager and select the disk and disable power saving, and go to the interface controller and disable power saving.

To quiet the HDD firmware you can download an app from the vendor to disable power saving in the firmware - if there isn't such an app available you can use QuietHDD to configure disable it from Windows.

quiethdd
https://sites.google.com/site/quiethdd/

I haven't used it for a while, I had a copy of a configured quiethdd.ini I used to post... basically go through the options in the systray app (after starting the app) and disable it all - you will figure it out

There is no batch script to start it with Windows each time, so you will need to write it yourself or manually start it.

Disabling the power save mode in HDD's this way also stops the lag in games when accessing content after the drive has already gone to sleep / parked it's head - induced by the delay in starting back up before an access can be completed.

 

Sounds like strange noise from the fan(s) than from the hard disk.

 

I have crystal disk installed since i got the pc, the values didn't change since i got it, will post a pic later.

 

No, this one is definitely the hard disk, i ****tuple checked.

 

I disabled power saving from intel rapid storage, from advanced power plan, and from device manager some time ago, they made no change

Also this sound is when i'm running a game not when idling, so that is long after the heads have been unparked.

 

After actually listening to the audio clip, I would agree, unless your mic isn't picking up the sounds well, it sounds like a bad blade / plastic noise. It's very faint.

It might still be worth trying items from my post, I do it for all HDD installations as a matter of set up.

But, if the noise doesn't go away, check out the fans - if they are easy to pull and eyeball the fan blades and tracks - it might also be a tag from a wire getting clipped occasionally.

 

During a game is when it gets most frustrating, if that is the problem, during the game the heads park because the content is loaded, it isn't until later when you change a level and new textures or content get loaded and the drive has to wake up and position the heads for action again.

I don't have quiethdd images handy, nor an HDD installed to set it up, but I am sure you can figure it out

Remember the drive has it's own timeout for idling and parking the heads independent from the Windows / device power saving. That's what quiethdd does, it lets you adjust the settings (to 255 as I recall) to disable the "feature" - there are 2 features to set to 255.

It's worth a try. Otherwise see my other post, it might be fan blade clipping against sides or wire/label. It's very faint.

If you can feel vibration induced from HDD in time with the noise in case area just over the HDD, that might help isolate the sound to the HDD vs the Fan area.

 

That's the thing thoguh, this sound is always present when i'm playing a game.

Also this sound wasn't present when i first got the laptop

Edit: this sound also stays the same whether the fans are running on max or very low, so it's unlikely a fan hitting anything.

 

It's sounding more and more like a fan induced noise.

Do you carry the laptop around, taking it in and out of a backpack / stachel?

If there is something loose in there it might have moved to impinge the fan some how, or be in the air flow path and clicking against something in the case - outside the fan path.

 

I use it as a desktop replacement and i keep my station very clean so it's highly unlikely to be something with the fan, i am 99% sure the sound is coming from the HDD, i checked multiple times.

Note: i was editing my previous post after you replied.

 

It's such a faint noise, and it doesn't sound "bad", it could be the seek distance on the disk has increased, as you fill up the disk installing apps.

Try using a program like Raxco PerfectDisk Pro, they have a 30 day free trial, and configure to use the realtime optimizations and boot optimizations - then run SmartPlacement on the HDD.

http://www.raxco.com/home/products/perfectdisk-pro

If things have gotten fragmented, it will cause many more seeks / accesses compared to unfragmented and able to such it all up on 1 pass. That would bump up the noise from the HDD compared to fresh out of the box.

 

I'll try some of the suggested optimizations, i do like to think i keep my HDD is great condition, always defragging and error checking and cleaning up junk and registry, but this is the first time EVER that i've heard a hard drive make such a noise (which isn't the only noise, sometime it makes a screeching sound), but i've never owned or heard a 7200rpm 1tb HDD before, that's why i'm so unsure whether that's normal or something is wrong.

 

Ahhh, you didn't mention the screeching sounds before, maybe do a complete backup using Macrium Reflect Free so you can restore a bootable copy onto your next HDD should this one die - do it quickly as when the screeching starts, the dieing follows soon thereafter...

 

Yea, i always backup. (Once or twice a month)
When i say screeching i don't mean loud screeching, it's still only a bit louder than the drive heads moving sound

 

A rough sound, screetch, can start low and work up into the human awareness, usually by then it is close to dieing. You are more sensitive to out of the ordinary sounds, so you might be catching it earlier than most.

Hopefully it is just hyper active seeking due to fragmentation. But, if not it could be the harbinger of a failing drive.

It's about the right time for failure, you have only been using it a few weeks, and infant mortality hits about then for new laptops HDD's.

The drives are cheap these days, I wouldn't RMA for it, no sense sending in a perfectly good laptop just for a $50 drive replacement - they might muck up something else

It might be a good time to consider an SSD replacement, plenty on sale after the holiday here cheap, IDK what pricing is like where you are.

 

Well what i plan is keep the laptop till the end of its warranty, if it proves to be problematic i might sell it, if there aren't any decent alternatives in the market by then (which there usually aren't) i'll keep it and extend the warranty.

As for the SSD, the prices are always over the top, and i don't even know what type i need or how to migrate OS to it, but i'll definitely consider it.

Fun note: i have a sony vaio (6years old now) with a HDD that gets its heads stuck (needs hard restart) and makes screetching noises (audible ones) for about a year now, still working like a charm

 

Another question, i use crystal disk to monitor S.M.A.R.T and there are 2 columns labeled "current and "worst", but there's no "normal" column, how am i supposed to determine when something is out of the ordinary besides when the status indicator (blue circle) for one of the rows tells me otherwise??, is there a standard value for smart?

 

Yes, mechaincal drives are fun.

There was a time when Apple shipped HDD's that over time had their bearing grease "harden".

If a workstation sat idle for a while the bearings would be too mucked up - seized - for the motor torque at power on to break through the grease and move the spindle.

When someone would complain that their new Mac wouldn't boot, I would pull out the drive, slam the drive on the table upside down, and then power on and boot that Mac.

Shock, Wonder, and Amazement was observed from their smiling faces

This also worked for Sun and SGI hardware around the same time.

You should get familer with the storage options on your laptop, check the specs page, and then use a tool like hwinfo64 to expore the hardware internal info.

A 2.5" SSD, to replace the HDD, can be very cheap now - up to 512GB - 1TB's are still kinda expensive - don't buy the off brand cheapies - stick with Samsung, Crucial, Micron, etc.

Using Macrium Reflect Free, you can create an image file to put on an external USB 3.0 drive, and then boot on a USB recovery flash drive that Macrium Reflect Free will build for you - and it will restore the image from your HDD to your SSD - that should work - and you can resize the partitions.

Macrium will do it automatically if you like - so you can fit the 1TB image onto even a 128GB SSD - if your data set size is under 128GB.

 

Brilliant, gonna look into it before warranty expires, another question:

 

Yeah, the SMART info doesn't seem very smart does it?

You kinda have to delve deep into the published vendor SMART details, the published SMART generic info, and then use some common sense to figure it all out, and even then the exceptions are exasperating - the devil is often in the details in the RAW data.

Using SMART reading apps - I use multiple ones to verify errors if they pop up - you can wait for their top level alerts before worrying about it.

The common sense part is if it is now green, and the Current is X and the threshold is 50, then Worst better be below X+50 - unless it isn't, 1 off errors are common - see my images as samples below where Threshold is 0 yet there is a 1 off difference between Current and Worst.

What do you do if Current and Worst are over 100 to the tune of > Threshold? - it should already be alerting / red / etc.

Read up on the details if you like, I have blissfully swapped out most of it over time, and am happy

When I really got into it was when I was programming filters for wading through 10k's of log files, looking for actual errors vs BS alerts from software running on Linux, Solaris, AIX, etc etc, as I had to make sure that if it made it through my filter to the NetCool (or proprietary) paging system, it was real and actionable.

Fun stuff

Spoiler

 

so let me see if i got this straight.
i have to check for my specific HDD's SMART values, then add the threshold value to each parameter to get the maximum allowed value for the parameter??, so if for instance my read error rate design value is 80, and current:100 and worst:100 with threshold:62, then i should start worrying when current/worst becomes 142+?

 

Sure, why not?

It's something you need to dig into for each make/model of drive. Look up the hardware name/model and find the PDF of deeper technical specs for the line/model that has the SMART defaults + specific info on how the maker uses that value.

That's to *really* find out.

Otherwise, as a rule of thumb, you got it just right.

 

cool, thanks a lot for the help m8 , you've been awesome

extras: My HDD Model is the HGST HTS7k1000, and the SMART values shown by HDtune and Crystal Disk are attached, in case you ever wanted to check for the model.

 

help me of Great Scott, i was doing a backup on my external hard drive and i restarted after finishing but forgot to remove the external HDD, and during loading the OS this sound came out of the USB PORT!!!! https://clyp.it/1mgsxf0l
This happens with this particular USB port and the one next to it, but the third one on the other side of the laptop doesn't do that, and i've made sure this is coming from the USB port and not the speakers (i disabled speakers and tested) and i even turned powershare from the BIOS in case it was something related, but it's still there.

It does this sound when i first plug the HDD, when i click "safely remove", and when i open crystal disk / HD Tune

Please tell me this isn't something short circuiting in the mobo D;

 

That's a new one, if the sound is really coming out of the USB port/card

Try turning off Windows Sound's, which I always do to stop the "action" noises like this.

In the Sound Control panel, select "No Sounds" and it changes the setting in the current theme. You need to do this whenever you change the desktop Theme.

 

That is fan -- not the hard disk.

How the hell would you be knowing if it is hard disk or the fan? I deal with this stuff all my life and I do not understand if it is the fan or the hard disk making the sounds inside a laptop. Take a screwdriver, and shove it among the fan blades to stop them. Hold it there. Then you can see if the sound is coming from the hard disk or not. You would need to do that for both fans apparently.

Instead of spending your life with this crap, go buy a $50 SSD.

 

help me of Great Scott, i was doing a backup on my external hard drive and i restarted after finishing but forgot to remove the external HDD, and during loading the OS this sound came out of the USB PORT!!!! https://clyp.it/1mgsxf0l
This happens with this particular USB port and the one next to it, but the third one on the other side of the laptop doesn't do that, and i've made sure this is coming from the USB port and not the speakers (i disabled speakers and tested) and i even turned powershare from the BIOS in case it was something related, but it's still there.

It does this sound when i first plug the HDD, when i click "safely remove", and when i open crystal disk / HD Tune

ok this one is really weird

here's the sequence of events:
1- I was backing up stuff, but the transfer rate was so slow, so i canceled the copying and opened device manager, changed the external HDD policy from "Quick Removal" to "Better Performance" and ticked both checkboxes.

2- It prompts me to restart the pc so changes can take effect, so i do whole the external HDD is still plugged in.

3- Laptop restarts and during the OS loading that sound happened.

4- Now whenever i plug in or safely remove the HDD or run HD Tune or Crystal disk (only for a few secs after i double click).

5- I get worried and i change policies back to "quick removal" and restart.

6- Sound still exists after i changed back, and i tried restarting a few times, and i even tried that with the laptop running on AC and on Battery.

7- I give up for the night and post a new reply of the problem here.

8- Next morning i turn on the laptop, plug in the HDD, no sound.

9- Try that a few times, no sound whatsoever.

10- Idk what to think anymore

11-???????????

12- Profit???

note: The sound seems to have been in tandem with something moving inside the external HDD, 95% sure it's the heads not the disc spin.

 

That is really bad practice man, fans are very sensitive to foreign objects, and jamming a screwdriver in there for whatever reason can only lead to worse things than you're trying to fix.

 

Use common sense. You are supposed to do it when the machine is off. You are not going to dive headfirst with a screwdriver to a running fan!

The only side effect is denting the grill and that could be eliminated with a thin screwdriver.

It does not appear that you know what you are doing. So just buy a $50 SSD and get over with all these issues.

 

Unplugging the fan power cable header would be a safer more direct test. Not a bad idea if you know what you are doing, and are careful to watch the temps when testing to see if that fixed the noise problem.

There are some systems that will error and not boot if the fan is detected to have failed - like when the power header is disconnected.

If you do try unplugging the fan power cable header to see if the noise goes away, be sure and don't run long that way, and watch the CPU/GPU temperature with hwinfo64 sensors only during the test.

Whether the noise is due to the fan or the HDD, replacing the HDD with an SSD is a great performance boost, the rest of your hardware deserve it.

 

Such aggression...
I know i'm not supposed to jam something into a running fan, but jamming it into a fan that is trying to rotate isn't exactly a good idea either.

 

I forgot to plug the gpu power on my old alienware once, and the machine just crashed, wouldn't post, and mobo beeps ensued, so i'm not gonna risk doing that with this unit.

Plus like i said before, i'm 99% sure it's the hard drive, and i say that after i have done many many checks.

 

Did you try quietHDD yet?

 

Not yet