Moving away from Alienware

I own two Alienware laptops, an M11x and an M14x R2. Both are still going strong and I take excellent care of them. The M11x hinge broke two years ago, out of warranty and living in East Asia at the time, Dell still sent out a tech to fix it for me at no charge. So awesome! My experience with Alienware to date has been excellent.

Now, I am ready to get a new machine. I'm looking at the Alienware 17 R2, but this throttling issue has me nervous enough to stop buying Alienware. It's too bad because I really like the idea of the graphics amplifier.

I'm not going to spend a lot of money (and buying the 17 is a big investment for me at this time) on a computer that can't even play to its full potential. From what I've been reading, Dell is not giving the 240W PSU out as an upgrade any longer either, not that this would even fix the problem.

Anyway, I just wanted to throw that out there. If anyone has any input on the throttling issue, I'd love to hear it. I really want to get the 17, but as it stands now, it is seeming more and more the bad choice and I'm ready to call it quits with Alienware.

 

As a new owner of an alienware 17 r2 I understand you. From the day1 I got this machine I'm trying to solve the throttling problem. This is probably my first and last alienware laptop. Getting the 240W PSU soon and if that solves the problem I would completely love this machine but throttling is a serious issue for a gaming laptop.

 

Would love to hear more from you orancanoren, I ordered the same laptop and it's on it's way now (can't wait ) and the throttling issue is scaring me a little.
If you could update us about your experience with the 240W that would help a lot !

Btw if you haven't already you may be interested in this thread : http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/official-alienware-17-r2-benchmark-thread.770320/page-26

In the middle of the page you'll see the post of bnosam that gathered a lot of tests / benchmarks on the same laptop model.

 

I will buy the 240W PSU and I'm going to get it shipped to me from China so I will be using 180W PSU for 2-3 weeks. I was worried about throttling too. I said maybe I won't have that problem and when I ran dying light I did check some monitoring programs in the background while I play and after a while I saw that the throttling took place. I checked the BIOS version and it was A04 so I decided to update it to A05 to see if something change and no I still have the throttling problem. One time I even saw 800 MHz. I tried using XTU but no luck. Then I started using throttlestop and that really helped. Today I managed to play some games with having only minor throttling. I think I played dying light for about 3 hours and the graphs sometimes showed CPU jumps to 2.6 GHz from 3.4 GHz but trust me I didn't even feel it. It stays throttled for short period of times that way. Intel XTU and Throttlestop reports TDP (power) throttling so I decided to get the 240W PSU and I really think that will be the solution but that's just a guess. I opened another thread in this forum and it seems you replied to it I saw many comparisions like this but these tests are probably done on machines using non-hybrid BIOS. I am on hybrid BIOS and I experience throttling. I don't know if that is normal or not.

 

Well since I too bought my AW recently it should come with the hybrid BIOS too. As soon as it arrives I'll post back here and maybe we can do similar tests to get a good comparison on similar BIOS!

I guess you are playing Dying light with all graphic options maxed out, when you say you felt Throttle what do you mean exactly ? (Trying to prepare myself) Is it FPS drops ? Lags ?

What I'm trying to understand is that for someone like me who doesen't Overclock/benchmark, and who currently has a Asus with a Gtx 630M (Don't laugh at me ! xD) I'm really expecting this investment to take me to another world if you know what I mean ^^

 

The tittle of this thread is misleading, you are actually asking for advice, you just sound mean :/

As for leaving Alienware well, I'd have a hard time finding another brand that delivers in the same way as they do, I'm talking about a very unique design and a very nice price, IMO only Aorus and Razer are on the same level aesthetics wise but the price of both brands is way too high plus their availability sucks big time. MSI (with a few exceptions), Sager, Eurocom, etc, they all make laptops that look from 2002.

 

Actually I don't experience any lags or fps drops. Well some times minor fps drops but I don't even feel that. Laptop still takes you to another world. I was a ps4 gamer until a few days ago. What bothers me is the $2200 spent on this laptop. When you spend that much of money you expect 0 problems, 100% performance but that's not what happened to me until now. 240W might change things, currently I'm waiting for that. Until PSU arrives I will be using throttlestop and undervolt the CPU by 50-60 mV's. That should work for you too. The laptop is great but that CPU thing is one major issue (besides fans etc but you can control those and I don't actualy mind the 10 seconds to set fans max speed).

 

I was actually going to pull the trigger on a Eurocom X8, but the Dell service (As advertised, haven't had the pleasure yet ) Seems like too good an opportunity to pass. Home service ? Come on who doesen't want that Plus the design is really nice.

I really hope that when it (finally..) arrives, i'll unbox, be amazed, turn it on, be amazed again, install The Witcher 3 (And some of my old games) and feel like my 630M belongs in a Museum, and be super amazed.

 

Thank you so much for your answer orancanoren. I am optimistic again hehe !

On the other hand I totally understand what you mean, the amount of money spent on this laptop entitles us to have " powerful desktop performance without sacrificing mobility" as advertised. We should have access to the full potential of our laptops.

Really hope that the 240W will make a difference and solve the problem, although we'll have to go back to BIOS A00 I think.

Edit : Learned how to quote, so I did

 

Did you notice your CPU hitting mid-high 80's on any BIOS other than A00? I sure did.

 

Sorry Raidriar I did not recieve my Alienware yet so I cannot give you any info on that, i'll be sure to update when it does arrive.

However I did buy this cooler : http://www.amazon.fr/dp/B00482XM7E/ref=pe_386181_51767671_TE_dp_1

So hopefully it will not affect my gaming experience. However I do understand what you mean, Dell seriously needs to add decent Fan control with their new BIOS...

 

The new BIOS after A00 WILL BURN UP YOUR COMPUTER. If/when you get it, flash to A00 immediately. I could not believe how hot it was getting. The external cooler will never be as efficient or effective as the stock cooling fans when they operate properly

 

Ah well I had no idea ! Thanks so much for that !

@orancanoren I tag you here because I know you are running A05, perhaps you should keep an eye on your temps !

 

I bought refurbished AW 17 R2 three weeks ago from dell, I was worring about throttling too. When i received the laptop, the GPU was DOA . After two weeks of calls and wait they finally send an engineer with replacement motherboard to fix it. Luckily there is no throttling problem on my machine even when I use 180W. Also the temperature are quite reasonable compare to some of the user here, 50-60 degrees Celsius idle, in games I normally run 75-78 degrees Celsius with an occasional rise to 81-83 degrees. It still way hotter than my previous clevo 770m laptop. I've try GTAV, batman, witcher 3 and Dying light. It run average 40~ish with max setting.

So far I'm pretty satisfy with the laptop. But one thing concern me most is the laptop maintenance. It's really quick and easy for me to clean my previous laptop. But this new model alienware it's very very difficult to clean the fans, basically you need to disassemble the whole laptop in order to access the fan Sorry for my broken english, hope this might help you.

 

Getting good feedback really helps with the anxiety of waiting for mine, so thank you very much for sharing !

Any of you guys have experience with disassembling and cleaning the fans ? Personally I have the same problem with my Asus, I need to take off the bottom, then unscrew everything and take the keyboard off to get to the fan. Is it the same with AW ?

 

I use A05 with 180w, Its rare to reach 80 even is under load, after I downvolted it never reach 80. I will try to test A00 once my 240w psu arrived.

 

Guys going off topic here but just out of curiosity, when I do get mine is that all I have to do ?

Step 1 : Run Alienrespawn and save to USB

Step 2 : Install all windows update

Step 3 : Install latest Nvidia driver

Step 4 : Flash back to A00 (Even if I haven't gotten the 240W PSU yet ?)

Step 5 : Install games and play ?

 

You should check this topic out, it's very informative and helps me a lot.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/alienware-17-r2-2015-thoughts-and-impressions.778857/

Yea, you need to unscrew everything and take the motherboard and keyboard off in order to access the fans

 

No. You will need the "hybrid bios" to power your system because the 180W PSU is inadequate. When you get your 240W PSU, then you can flash to A00

 

I will check that out right now thanks for the link and the picture, too bad it's bothersome to open, but still, it seems contrary to my Asus you don't have to disconnect the keyboard / touchpad to open it, it's like opening a lid it seems from the picture which is nice I think. Still takes a lot of time.

Will wait on the 240W PSU for the Bios update then, thanks a lot !

 

Thanks for tagging and yes the computer really runs hot even when I override fans via HWiNFO. I sometimes see 97 degrees C!

Very good to hear you don't have problems. What GPU are you using? I am guessing 970m sine you don't experience throttling on 180W adapter.

 

OP,
Then what laptops are you considering?

I only ask because (IMO) there are very few that stack up well against an Alienware without being grossly oversized or extremely cheap feeling.

Here are some that I've owned more recently: MSI GS60 Ghost 3k (970m, 3k display), AW18 (770m SLI), AW15 (970m), Razer Blade 14 (970m, QHD) and now the AW13 (960m).

The MSI was probably the one I wish I spent more time with now that I've used so many others, I think it had the best cooling efficiency for its size but I really disliked the 3k screen. Scaling was problematic and most of the games I played would tax the 970m at native resolution. The build quality was about an 8 out of 10.

The AW18 was awesome when I was using it but it was gigantic and I always looked for an excuse not to bring it anywhere. Using the keyboard was awkward since the chassis was so thick. Otherwise, it was what a gaming laptop should be and operated very well. Build quality was also about an 8.

The AW15 was nice but it only had the 970m and looking at its size, knowing that there were similarly spec'd laptops our there half as thick started to drive me nuts. It performed very well with no thermal throttling but if I were to do it again I'd want the 980m. The size wasn't too bad but it was still thicker than what I wanted in a gamig laptop. Build quality was a 7 (I didn't like seeing multiple m.2 slots on the board that weren't accessible).

The Razer Blade was aesthetically pleasing, looked sleek and very similar to my 15" macbook. This thing felt amazing BUT it would get so unbelievably hot, even when I used a proper cooling pad under it. The screen was nice but the higher resolution put me right back at the GS60 where it would struggle at native resolution with most of my games. Build quality was a 8, the lower case cover was not a very clean fit and I really didn't care for the heat pipe cooling directly against the cpu/gpu.

Now with the AW13, it's the least powerful of the bunch but has been working well to provide me with good 1080P gaming performance in a smaller form factor without roasting my fingers. While it's certainly not a performer in comparison to the previous laptops it does meet most of my personal requirements (though doesn't exceed) versus others that would exceed in some areas and fall unimpressive in others. The build quality on AW laptops is still great (IMHO) even if it's not what they use to be and I keep finding myself turning to them after trying to venture away.

 

^ which CPU do you have with the AW13, and is it having throttling issues ?

 

I5-5200U

No throttling issues with Hardline/Crysis 3/Titanfall.

 

The 960m does surprisingly well, it's no 970m but it's getting the job done.

(This is coming from a guy that games on a 14c, sli Titan-X desktop with an ROG Swift).

 

Thank you for sharing your opinions or all those laptops, I'm sure they will come in handy to anyone browsing for reviews that are straighforward.

 

You're welcome.

I wish there were a 'do it all' laptop out there (razed blade with a 980m and great cooling comes to mind).

These days we have to make sacrifices in some areas so that we can get more from others (slim:hot, powerful:big, small:under-powered) but I foresee technology making more out of this as we go on. Until then, choose your tolerances wisely.

 

Personally If I could have waited, I would have. I am really curious about the 2016-17 model of Alienware. If I understand correctly, the 2015 model was a "let's try something new" model no ?

I'd like to see if they are going to learn from their mistake(s) and try and really achieve the "Best gaming laptops worldwide" or if on the contrary they (<= Dell) are just going to continue profiting off the Alienware brand name and recycle everything with a slightly different design and upgraded hardware.

Everything is getting smaller the more technology is advancing, they did it with the m.2 SSD's, I wonder how long before GPU's get that small and still as/ more powerful.. Which would give more space for heat dissipation, and even thinner laptops... It's sure that the future holds excitement, can't wait to get older .

 

I've said it in other places on here - but I have seen 0 throttling issues on my copy of the AW 17r2. That being said, I am also seeing extremely great results with my 4710HQ in XTU benchmarking, currently holding the 3rd Place spot for an XTU score with this CPU ( http://hwbot.org/benchmark/xtu/rankings?hardwareTypeId=processor_3620&cores=4#start=0#interval=20) - so they are not all bad, and they do not all throttle. I keep mine OC'd 100% of the time, with a slight undervolt - I have yet to overheat. The only time I witnessed a frame rate drop / crash to 800 MHz was when I was tinkering with an overclock on battery, and trying to run witcher 3 at ultra. This overtaxed on battery, and caused an issue.

There are a lot of issues out there. I do not fully believe the answer is simply on the fan profiles, since thermal throttling is an issue even on A00 for folks. It seems that it truly is the luck of your chip. If you have a good solid chipset, it will do well. If not, it's going to potentially be rough. Running a 980m and 4710HQ my 3dMark11 is around 12,800 and my Firestrike hits 9151 with stock vbios.

Having said that, I was able to hit 4.2ghz with my 4710HQ while using the graphics amplifier for the graphics processor. I uploaded a screenshot of this in the benchmark thread I believe.

 

I agree but I don't think folks would be surprised if they didn't do anything to remedy the current faults. It's just like Razer saying the extreme temps their notebook produces are 'normal'.

I like the m.2 form factor but I hate that it's limited right now to 512GB (correct me if I'm wrong), I don't think people were/are burdened by SATA 6 SSD speeds. I'd hate to see them shrink GPU's like that and have there be some new limitation.

I would like to see NVIDIA take some notes from AMD with their GPU memory placement, that should really help shrink notebook GPU's.

 

I totally agree it seems that any new technology is immediately considered as "better" and has absurd prices in the beginning, If i'm not wrong it was the case with the first SSD's.

I think that since every company looks to make a profit, as soon as they can produce something new that's stable they throw it in the market. So they managed to reduce the size of SSD's, but at the cost of storage space, put a high price tag on it and launch it, and then Laptop sellers try to force on their customers that want the latest models.

I guess we can only wait for them to go through the process and get them to an acceptable storage space, and of course, price. That is partially why I mentioned the 2017 AW model, because I hope, foolishly perhaps, that by the m.2 SSD technology will have had enough time to "mature" and be the best option, reducing size, heat and still be effective.

Same will go with GPU, should they find a way to reduce the size, it will at first be at the cost of raw power, and then will need a few years to become viable.

Imagine the future's phones can connect to 4k Screens/Gamepad/Mouse/Keyboard by Wifi/Bluetooth, still give an image quality equal to cable connection and pack a mini GPU strong as the Titan hahaha... Your laptop in your pocket .

Edit : Just thought of that, the phone will be waterproof so toss it in a bucket of ice for the heat !

 

@reptileexperts Thank you very much for writing this, i'm 3-4 days out from receiving my AW 17 (Gonna gauge my eyes out) and I've been known to be lucky with these kind of things You give me hope ! Anyway I'me sure i'll be pleased it truly looks like a beautiful machine !

 

Nice write-up on your previous laptops. I ordered a Sager NP9377-S. It seems to be a very powerful machine.

As orancanoren said, I do expect quality when I order a laptop that is as expensive as the Alienware laptops. I understand that it's impossible to have 0 problems, but it seems that Dell is not responding to the obvious problems that exist and have existed in their builds. That is driving me away.

oranccanoren, I hope that 240W adapter will fix up your problems and get you back to gaming with no throttling.

 

Thank you, my psu will come in a month or so. Until then I was able to fix throttling by using throttlestop. I undervolted the CPU. Now every once in a while CPU throttles down to 3.2 GHz from 3.45 GHz which I find ok.

 

So I finally got my Alienware, here is the results of 3dMark right after installing WIndows Updates and Nvidia driver :

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/8094370

Other than an Audio bug that makes a weird sound (Same sound you get when you slowly unplug/plug an external audio device, a sort of cringe) from time to time, I have found no other problem with the machine. I have to admit I may have set my expectations too high, but still I am no feeling as if I am getting 3000Euro's worth of enjoyment.

After careful thinking, I am going to give the Desktop Area 51 a try. I don't have the time to build my own rig and then should a problem occur have to troubleshoot everything piece by piece, Dell's home support is still useful there. It's only a 500 Euros investment on top of this one once returned so in the long term it's not significant.

I will keep updating in case in interests anyone ^^.

 

I'm sorry for your disappointment although you should also consider you are using a laptop, not a desktop. You shouldn't think like if you had spent 3000 euros on a desktop you would be getting a few times more performance. We paid for mobility (even right now I'm writing this message on my AW from somewhere other than my home). Your score is a bit over my score on Windows 8 but I think it should be more considering your 4980HQ. Have you checked your CPU clocks? Also what BIOS version are you using? You have the 180W PSU right? So many questions

 

Yeah I took the time to think about it calmly and I think that my only real problem with the laptop is the Matte screen that makes everything look dead, and of course the audio bug.

I'm on Windows 7 and I agree it should be more considering the 4980HQ but well I didn't touch the system really, also yes i'm on 180W PSU and Bios A05. Whenever i launch a game, the fans go at 100% immediately and are pretty loud (To cover the noise volume must be at 50%).

Anyway the main point is you are totally right, I was looking at my backpack and thinking should I get a call now, I can simply throw the AW in it and be on my way, with the desktop it would be a whole operation to move anything. I think that changing the screen to a Glossy one and getting the audio hardware checked will be what i'll do for now and see what happens.

 

That audio bug of yours is interesting. My only problem with the audio is that the volume is too low but I was able to solve that by enabling "loud" option in Recon3Di. Other than that at first I did regret getting the matte screen but right now I like it very much. I would probably get the glossy screen if I were to buy another AW but I don't really think it will be a major change since the brightness on matte screen is plenty for me. (BTW I'm coming from a Macbook Pro with a Retina display so I know how glossy screens look). Also the anti-glare thing really works. Today, for the first time I had to set up the laptop to some place where sunlight was coming to the display and I actually liked how light wasn't reflected so much. However I am not used to high performance machines so I cannot really comment on the display since I don't exactly know how it should be but I can say you this: when playing games I never thought that I should've got the glossy display.

BTW I just noticed that we have been communicating on a thread which is irrelevant to our discussion so I hope OP isn't mad

 

Just noticed the topic too, but when you think about it perhaps our the experience of 2 new Alienware owners can give OP some information, and bring him back to Alienware .

To tell you the truth, the day I received my AW I just got out of getting all 4 of my wisdom teeth pulled out and was still under the effect of whatever drug they gave me to sleep ^^'. Today took a good long look at it and frankly, I love this machine. I put its screen side by side with my old glossy screen, and now I can't believe how annoying I found looking at it and seing the reflection of what is behind me, myself and any light source that is not optimaly positioned. Also the colors may be "darker" but they don't feel washed out, I grew to love this screen quite frankly.

Now, concerning the Fans, I have 1 other remark. When I boot up my computer, nearly 2-3 minutes after boot up, (without running any demanding program, just opening Firefox) the left fan speeds up to 100% then suddenly stops, and then the right fan does the same thing. When this occurs, my system lags (Mouse can't be moved, no Keyboard input etc.) but it's only for 2 seconds then everything is back to normal, haven't experienced it in game. Did you ever experience something like that ?

Also having bought a Samsung EVO 840 SSD for my old laptop (the one the AW is replacing), I can say that our SSD isn't the best in the business, and I think had I known I would have bought it without SSD and installed one myself. (Mine takes 45seconds to boot, the other 25-30Sec) but it's not much to worry about. I didn't compare writing speeds because.. I'm not that interested in it .

The keyboard does heat up, but I think that will be more like something I have to get used to, like these Macro keys on the left and top right ! I can't seem to find the "Esc" button any more .
But with the option to change between 3 settings that's 27 more keys to the keyboard so it's really something to learn !

I mentioned heating, but after 1 hour of gaming, temperatures are all under 65°C, which is likely thanks to the fans going at 100% all the time but still, it's good.

I have to admit I the laptop did everything I asked him for. He runs every game at max settings, and my gaming experience has been flawless. Well TW3 was about 35-45 FPS even with Hairworks off, but I imagine if I tweak some other options on High rather than Ultra, i'll get my 60.

My final choice for this laptop is that I am going to pay for the 3 year warranty tomorrow, but I am keeping it, and I love it !

 

hi.. just to help you out.. the burst of the fan on start up is caused by dell support assist and dell support agent.. i uninstalled it and my start up is very fast now.. and if ever i need to diagnose my laptop with dell support assist i can use the support assist from dell website or just download and install it again. but i have never used it. just to make sure we have the same problem that i have encountered does the fan burst to max speed on each side like 1 by 1. if it is.. its the dell bloatware.. as of the heat issue try to test it more.. try playing dota 2(if ever u play) for 2hrs or more and check the temps. hehe.. hope this helps..

 

Hey ! Yeah that's exactly what the fan issue is ! I will try uninstalling and will update, thanks mate ! I imagine after 2 hours of Dota 2 your fingers must be crispy Good thing it's always cold and rainy in Belgium .

 

@0lok Thank you so much man, i've uninstalled the dell support agent and no more fan issue at startup !

 

Thanks for the suggestion, i will give it a go, i have never used the support agent and the other thing, i was really annoyed by the fans spinning after booting up without anything forcing them to do so. it has been a terrible experience, i always wanted to have an AW, it was in my to do list before i die. Now that i finally have it i regret it and i even considered going back to my MSI gt70, is the most reliable laptop i've had, on the other hand AW has the inadequate psu, the annoyance of the fans (hopefully about to be solved), the inconsistent bluetooth performance, the throttling, i'm getting tired of it, next laptop will be MSI definitely, thanks again for the suggestion

 

good to know i was able to help.. hehe ^_^

for the heating issue best solution of that for now is by using bios a00. i have tried bios a02 and a05, its burning my hands. and if you use bios a00 you must have a 240w PSU if you have a 980m GPU, for 970m GPU 180PSU is good enough. and make sure on power option you need to disable sleep mode so that you wont have a throttling issue. as of the moment im using a00 with 180w PSU because i got a 970m GPU. max temp on playing dota 2 for 2hrs was 82 celcius. idle is 40+ to 50. ohh 1 more thing. if you downgrade from a05 to a00 you must downgrade first from a05 to a02 then a00. thats what the dell tech agent told me. hope that helps.