GTX1080M Release date?

Saw this article today, and got excited. Anyone know the release date for the 1080 in the alienware line?

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/08/nvidia-pascal-laptop-specs-gtx-1080/
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3107...d-1060-for-laptops-break-the-mobile-mold.html

 

Sometime in September is when you can expect to see Alienware models refreshed.

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ies-graphics-set-to-debut-at-pax-west.795016/

 

I hopefully placed the order for AW 15 r2 completely maxed out(except RAM) from India. Now the question is, will my order be canceled since Pascal GPUs are on the way? Will Dell provide the same offer as earlier i.e. Free upgrade to Skylake from Haswell, if its purchased within a specific date?

 

You should notify them that you will want to cancel the order if Pascal units are incoming.

 

I think I'll order it now, since there are pending works and judging by the specs of Pascal cards, AW needs re-designed coolers and more massive battery to get battery life as advertised on current line-ups(15 r2,17 r3). I'm hoping to see, how their first revision's reception would be, aside from GPU performance i.e. Thermal throttling, overheating etc.

 

The Alienware Pascal laptop announcement is 2 weeks away, likely with immediate availability.

Now is the worst time to order last generation laptops, unless you are getting a *huge* discount

 

I was waiting for next line-up's TBA since a month. No I'm not getting a discount. Probably, it'll be delivered in 2-3 days. Also, I hope AW's Chief comes with a similar offer that offers haswell -> Skylake free upgrade.

 

If you are hoping for that offer, why waste your/alienware's time/effort getting it 2 weeks before the new models are available?

We've all been waiting weeks, months, and longer...

 

I don't want to test/buy bleeding edge products, I prefer stability and mature hardware that can guarantee stable operation even without continuous driver updates to get better performance.

 

Sorry, removed double post.

 

That doesn't describe Alienware. You should be looking at Clevo or Sager.

 

Sadly, there isn't Clevo or Sager here in India. What I meant was, enthusiast who know more about gaming Pcs and their internal workings. I don't have much experience in Gaming PCs that's the reason I joined NBR to get more insights. Issues like Thermal throttling can't be detected unless you push it to its limits.

 

My alienware yet to has expirience a single crash. In my opinion the clevos are laptops you often have to tinker with. Thermal throttling is by the way not an issuewith current alienwares.

 

Been using an Alienware m14x R1 for a long time in India. Had to turn off processor dynamic scaling since that was screwing with the GPU (The m14x R1 and R2 had a common heatsink for the GPU and CPU which i don't think the 15s and 17s have) but that problem was there at nearly all ambient temps. After that, as long as you clean the fans using a compressed air can, you should be fine (including the +40C temps in the summer). Also, Dell has tech support here unlike Clevo/Sager. Now if only the Alienware 15 with the 1070 (I doubt they will fit the 1080 into this one) would come out soon, i can replace the m14x with this.

 

If that is the case then I assure you that a 15 R2 / 17 R3 is NOT what you want. My 17 R3 is absolutely horrible: went through 3 motherboards and now I'm sending back the refurbished unit they sent me as an exchange.

 

No, don't say that! I'm awaiting shipment of AW 15 R2.

 

@Mr. Fox msi is making trading program, look http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...acebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer#post-10326272

 

Hi... happy Friday.

Yes, I saw that. I have posted in a couple of companion threads. Not sure why they need so many. I had to hold back what I wanted to say because that would have violated forum rules. Look here: http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/official-questions-for-the-msi-rep-2.795226/page-4#post-10326391 -and here- https://www.techinferno.com/index.p...ks-coming-soon/&do=findComment&comment=148680

I have never seen such a program that was equitable, generally offering pennies on the dollar and doing nothing but screw the program participant. I believe they are throwing that out to try to soften the perception of how corrupt they are. What they should be doing is getting their heads together with NVIDIA and Clevo to figure out how to fix the horrible mess their conspiracy has created. They have literally screwed every MXM notebook owner that owns a pre-Pascal notebook.

Here are the steps that all three of those filthy shysters need to take right now:

1. go back to drawing board, shake their Etch-A-Sketch and start over with making 10X0 series into standard dimension MXM 3.0b modules
2. make a commitment to all of us to assure us that this idiotic nonsense doesn’t happen again with Volta and beyond
3. design a new MXM laptop spec for 150W-200W modules so all laptop manufacturers everywhere can follow same spec/standard like they have for over 10 years with MXM 3.0a/b
4. and, most critical of all going forward... consult with users BEFORE they make arbitrary changes

I am pretty sure that I am done with laptops at this point. I won't put up with any of this crap. Seems like every OEM has gone to hell in a handbasket, determined to find new and creative ways of shafting their customers.

 

what are your plans now after selling p870dm

 

6950X and 1080 SLI desktop... assuming I can sell it. If not, well... then I'm screwed for a good while. If I can sell the P870DM-G I may also sell the P750ZM for extra build cash and just get a Chromebook or a $150 Inspiron turdbook for reading email and forum surfing in my recliner. Since my future is royally screwed on both machines by the Pascal design changes, neither one of them can be upgraded, so they fail to serve my purposes any more. I don't have any use for disposable feces unless it is in the price range of a low end Chromebook.

 

@Mr. Fox-> Are you sure those newer MXM based cards are specially made for NV and not for AMD, correct me, if I'm wrong? As I saw, those designs look like Sony Vaio's designs to make it difficult to take it apart and fix things.
You could try AMD gpus if they jump ships and prefer to keep their cards compatible with older and yet upgradeable MXM standards.

 

Ah yes MSI, Clevo, Alienware should all bend over backwards to find ways to support old technologies just so that Mr.Fox and his 5 other supporters can upgrade their 8 year old computers. Looks like nobody else gives a ****.

I'm sure you were complaining hand over fist when DDR4 ram modules wouldn't work in DDR3 slots (or 3 in 2, or 2 in 1). Or when PCI-E replaced PCI/AGP. Or when SATA replaced IDE. Or when NVMe replaced SATA. When Blu-rays replaced DVD etc etc etc.

But noooo not like MXM 3 came out 8-10 years ago, we should still continue to support it at the expense of everything else. Not like Pascal is a gigantic leap in performance and technology to where we're dumping full on desktop chips into laptop size cards. No it's more important we keep things limited so that Mr. Fox can continue to upgrade his laptop.

Better go back to 1995 with AGP, IDE, and PCI. I'll ask Nvidia to make a new 1090 card that supports AGP. Hell clearly we should have SSDs that operate over the IDE protocol too. I still have a desktop from 1995 that I would just love to upgrade if only it wasn't for those damn shysters stealing all my money and making it incompatible.

And lol "consult with users". You mean the 99.5% of people who buy gaming laptops and don't really give a **** about upgrading the GPUs? Because you know if you actually used your gaming laptops as a laptop and not permanently attach it to a desk you'd realize that after 3-4 years of heavy use (my laptop goes to work, school, home, everywhere with me) you might as well spend the $200-300 more and buy a whole new laptop instead of upgrading a GPU which for some reason costs 75% of the cost of a new laptop.

Ironically, I warned you this will happen 1 1/2 years ago when we had this exact same discussion. Technology changes, you had 8-10 years worth of using the same spec and I'd say that's been a pretty damn good run.

--

Now I will agree with you on the whole MSI thing since that's a separate issue where they did PROMISE that their laptops will be upgradable for at least 2 generations. Now while they probably are correct in saying that the new Pascal cards just won't fit, they also need to stand by the promise they made when selling the laptop.

 

We're talking about minor physical changes - unnecessary ones - that made the fitting of the new MXM cards not possible in the previous chassis mounting.

Not 8 year old chassis, close to 8 day old - from the time the P870DM was EOL'd till the P870DM2/DM3 were announced.

We aren't talking about magical MXM specs innovation here, everything can be made compatible, even the power extension can be matched with replacement pieces.

If there is a motherboard based power control function added, then a daughter board to map those features onto the old motherboards can be created.

This isn't a matter of a completely new plug-in interface leaping forward, it's a matter of making these new Pascal MXM GPU's non-compliant to kill off GPU upgrades *in brand new* recently sold laptops.

They aren't asking to plug these Pascal MXM GPU's into 8 year old laptops (some might be ), these are same week for sale existing brand laptop chassis.

That's why everyone is so upset, they got screwed out of Pascal GPU upgrades by purposefully making inconsequential changes to the form and function to make them incompatible with the previously upgradeable models.

 

So, this might get even more interesting. http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/anyone-else-disappointed.795318/page-10#post-10327766

 

Except its not minor physical changes. Go look at the new 1080 MXM cards, it's pretty ****ing crowded as it is and the Pascal cards are a whole different generation of cards compared to the previous generations. There has never been such a gigantic performance boost in the history of NVidia upgrades. A ****ing single 1080 is more powerful than SLI 980s, and that's unheard of until today. Think of the people who bought Titan cards for $1000-$1500 (depending on the spec / cooling) only to find them destroyed by a 1080 card costing half as much.

And sure it may be 8 days old but if you bought one of those older laptops knowing FULL ****ING WELL that the new 1080 cards were coming out in summer this year, that's your own damn fault. It's not like NVidia surprised everyone and was like SUP GUYS HERES SOME NEW GPUs FOR YOU. We've known since at least march that they're going to release 1080 cards for laptops in the summer.

MSI have no reason to screw over their customers by making their old laptops un-upgradeble. They make a ****ing killing from selling the MXM GPUs unless you really believe that them selling you a GPU for $900-$1500 is not making them a substantial profit. The actual laptop sales don't give them as much of a profit margin as the upgradable GPUs. But yes like I mentioned in my post that since MSI specifically promised that their laptops would be upgradable for 2 generations they NEED to stick with that promise. If that means buying brand new laptops with 1080 cards and similar other specs (so top of the line CPU, ram, ssds etc) for people who bought their top tier laptops, then that should be it. As far as I know Clevo never promised any such upgrades so your recourse (legal or not) with them isn't really viable.

I mean looking at the cost of their new GT73 laptop:

GT73 1070 : 2100
GT73 1080 : 3100.

So you're telling me that choosing a 1080 GPU is throwing in $1500 (price difference + cost of the original 1070 since that's factored into the 2100 price) over the cost of the laptop? There's no way in hell its costing them $1500 to build a ****ing 1080 MXM card. Like absolutely no way in hell, at best its costing them $700 making the rest pure profit. The amount of profit they would have made selling those as the old MXM spec would have been insane. So for them to give that up means there had to be a good reason for doing so.

 

Yeah, the prices are absolutely sinful. There is no way in hell that those prices can be viewed as anything except exorbitant. And, to think we used to complain that 980M was too expensive (priced similar to desktop GPU) seems laughable in retrospect. Considering that a notebook 1080 GPU is almost as much as two 1080 desktop GPUs shows how little honor they have, and how low their opinion is regarding the intelligence of their customers. Clearly, their perception is that we are all stupid.

 

The 980 the 1080 is replacing was also large, how can you miss that?

We aren't talking about 1080's replacing 980m's, they would get 1070's, again close enough in size and power / heat transfer demands that a compatible GPU could have been, and still can be made.

There is no reason that the P870DM 980's couldn't be offered an option to upgrade to a single 1080, and the PM870DM single and SLI 980m's offered 1070 upgrades.

 

Even more so when you consider that the 1080 laptop cards are essentially the same chip as the desktop cards. So if MSI can make a desktop 1080 for $600, they can damn well make a laptop 1080 for <$700. $1500 is ****ing ridiculous.

 

Those can't be the MSRP's, those are the grey market super jacked up pricing - during the early days when none are available people can set any price they want.

It doesn't necessarily follow that they are going to sell any at that price.

You'd have to be a pretty desperate sucker to do that

 

Well, personally, I don't give a rat's ass about 1070, single or SLI. Second rate GPUs are boring crap for gamer-boys that can't or don't want to pay for 1080, and 1060 is for the gamer-boy wannabe that can't or won't pay for the best. All of the Pascal prices are jacked up.

The 180W 980 would still physically fit because it was not too wide. It was longer, but that would still work for many notebooks.

I saw a post the other day where a person fit an Alienware 17 R1 with a Clevo 180W 980. They found an auxillary power source for it and it appears to work like a champ. And, modding the heat sinks is not that difficult because the differences are very minor. (I've been there, done that.) http://alienware-forum.de/index.php/Thread/8042-AW17-R1-3D-120Hz-GTX-980-N16E-GXX/

 

That pricing is looking at their laptop prices.

The GT73 with a 1070 card: $2100
The GT73 with a 1080 card: $3100

Rest of the specs, identical. Now lets assume the 1070 costs $500 (making the rest of the laptop $1600). That means the 1080 upgrade will cost you $1500 ($1600 for the rest of the laptop, $1500 for the 1080 = $3100).

Now they may sell the 1080 cards for cheaper but then what's stopping someone buying the GT73 with the 1070 and upgrading it to the 1080 for less than just buying the 1080 laptop itself?

Edit: slight mistake with my calculations. The 1070 model comes with a 128GB ssd, whereas the 3100 one comes with a 512. So subtract $180 from that making the 1080 upgrade: $1320.

Still retarded.

 

When you are talking of the jump from 1070 to 1080 in the same frame, it's got to include better cooling and better power delivery - a larger PSU at least, so $200+ of that $1000 is for upgraded components to support the 1080 over the 1070 requirements.

Typically jumping from a 1070 model to a 1080 model involves MSI packing in more goodies, like more memory, more storage, and a better display. Are you sure there are no differences - I guess I could look.

If you look at the last generation, I would imagine there is a $1000 price difference between the 980m and 980 MSI models too.

 

The upgrade path's made available would be up to the vendor, but I agree even if you had a single 980m or 980m SLI a single 1080 should be supported.

It's also possible a P870DM could be retro-fitted with the parts to make it a P870DM3 and support 1080 SLI.

Seeing as how the P870DM2/DM3 have "slight" physical layout changes, including the motherboard MXM connector placement and power breakouts for the MXM cards, it will now require a motherboard swap too.

All of that might have been avoided with consideration to providing upgrades for the previous generation laptops as well.

 

No you're right there is a difference in the SSD size that comes with the laptop. 128 vs 512.

As far as I can tell the cooling system is identical. But you're right about the PSU I missed that as well, the 1070 uses 230W whereas the 1080 one uses 330W.

The display is identical. And the motherboard, knowing how OEMs work, is going to be 100% identical.

So the 1500 difference includes a larger SSD, 1080 card, and a 330W PSU. So take all that into account you're looking at $1000-$1100 for the 1080 card. Which is still just a bit less than buying 2x desktop 1080s. And that pricing is absurd.

I understand how powerful these cards are but charging almost double of what the desktop cards cost when they're so ****ing similar is ****ing ridiculous.

 

You showed it was a $1000 difference:

"That pricing is looking at their laptop prices.

The GT73 with a 1070 card: $2100
The GT73 with a 1080 card: $3100"

That reduces the $1000-$1100 estimate back down to $500-600, which sounds about right...

I haven't looked up the details for the 1080 model, but for the 980 models in the previous generation the cooling was heavily upgraded. I would expect that to hold true for the 1070 to 1080 models now.

 

You're forgetting that the $2100 is including the 1070 card. So the price difference is $1000 yes but take into account that when you buy the 1080 laptop you aren't getting a 1070 card with it haha.

So let's assume that the 1070 card is $500, seems about right for what these laptop cards cost....means the rest of the laptop costs $1500.

Now throw in the SSD upgrade and the larger PSU, and the rest of the laptop costs $1900. They sell the 1080 model for $3100 so:

$3100 - $1900 = $1200 for the 1080 card by itself. This is what I expect they will charge for the MXM 1080 cards when they're released, if not you'll be better off buying the 1070 laptop and then purchase the 1080 MXM card + larger PSU by itself. Sell the 1070 or SLI it if they ever make that possible in the future and you'll be significantly ahead in value.

 

Indeed. Therein lies the problem. Clevo, MSI and NVIDIA conspired and burned all of their calories dreaming up creative ways to screw their customers, and what kind of lies it might take to sell it, rather than supporting us.

 

$1200 still seems too high for the 1080 cost portion of the laptop, but I would go for $900-$1000 for the GPU alone. That seems about right.

Then you have to pay for all the upgraded components from the 1070 to support the 1080, which gives you the whole cost of $1200 for a 1080 in that laptop.

Which works out to $500-$600 to upgrade from 1070 to 1080 in that same frame.

 

Fair enough but even you will agree that $900-$1000 is still too much for an MXM card. We aren't talking about separate chips anymore like the 980 vs. 980M. That kindoff price gouging has go to stop.

 

Well, since the design / layout has pretty much killed backward compatibility, it hardly matters what they charge for a 1080, it won't fit in anything but the models it shipped in...

 

Well MSI better honor their 2 generation promise or upgrade everyone who bought one of their laptops with that promise.

 

Yeah, Clevo and MSI both

Did you file a ticket asking about your GT72/GT80 laptop Pascal MXM Upgrade? Or post a question for the MSI Rep's. Or send in your trade-in form?

 

I don't have a MSI laptop and I may not care about upgrading my laptops but I still believe that they need to honor their promises whether or not the user is going to use it.

 

Awesome, thanks for the support

I was hoping your enthusiasm would help get MSI to respond to owners like you

 

Of course, we may have different beliefs on how to use/upgrade our laptops but at the end of the day a commitment is a commitment.

 

$1200 i would pay for it, for a golden cpu but when it comes ti graphics i really dont see that much value in it lol.

 

"Damn the CPU man, full GPU's ahead!!" - some geek somewhere, probably.

 

whats with u bro, do u not like watching everything u do fly? i like watching my zip/rar file extra even if its 3-5 sec faster

 

More like .003-.005 seconds faster - for a CPU upgrade - most of the clock time is waiting on IO