17R4 Hybrid Cooling - might worth look for tripod heatsink alternative

Was browsing 17R4 heatsink modification solution today and found something interesting, thought I'd better share here in case this is of someone's interests as well.

As majority of the time my 17R4 will be on mobile for heavy-duty Unreal Engine development & demostration, therefore I'm currently evaluating the option and assessing the risk before commit the procurement. Should later I end up with that, there will be a follow up post re temperature, performance etc.

For browsing experience I have resized all to 1600px in width, should you are looking for higher resolution, please refer to the origin here: https://forum.51nb.com/thread-1825459-1-1.html

1. Cooling plate (early prototype).

This is where I found particularly interesting. Note this is CNC-ed from an integral copper plate and see the non-spring approach of addressing the tripod - which I believe might be the best approach for now due to contacting pressure (discussion welcomed) and effectively the area are getting 4-point parallelogram support (though one screw is shared).

Two arrow below is referring to the liquid route and the upper one refers to heatsink for bridges.



2. With lid. Concerns me a bit as image doesn't show how to address water ingress, might be something need to check with seller. Also if there's any contacts for PCMs shown in (1). (Update: the two plates will be welded together by silver compound, provides full air tightness under 6PSI).



3. After installation. Worth mention is the reference model is a 6700HQ + 1070, therefore the heatsink you are seeing here is the one with thinner heat pipes. I'll check with seller if they can do 1080 version.



4. Pipe port. Need to get rid of one slot of fins on one side (near AC cord).



5. Connecting pipe. Pretty standard rubber interface for water cooling.




6. Black finishes (as original color).



7. Performance

Thought I would save everyone from reading Chinese - according statistics from seller:

AIDA64 FPU Only

• Water-cooled: 55°C. It doesn't mention if this is actually referring to hybrid cooling (i.e. fan and water cooling working together) but my assumption is yes, unless fan can be switched off individually.
  
• Fan-only: 77°C.

AIDA64 FPU + GPU Stress

• Water-cooled: 57°C (CPU) 42°(GPU)
• Fan-only: 75°C (CPU) 71°C (GPU)

Based on the seller's location, I would assume the ambient temperature would be ~25°C in cases above.

8. Misc

• The standalone heatsink is marked at ~£135 where as the set (incl. pump & radiator) is marked at ~£200. For me as this is still within the acceptable range, I'll probably get the heatsink first, at least it highly likely going to resolve the core diff issue.
  
  
• The module needs to be served from an customized Zalman Reserator XT (EOL, have no idea why supplying the 10-years-old model), which means standard XT won't work properly for water-cooling scenario.

 

Damn this heatsink with air only would look pretty good.

I have no interest in water cooling a laptop. But a well machines heatsink in this style would help eliminate the uneven core temps that some have and create a bit more pressure for optimum cooling.

I would gladly pay about 100 euro's for a heatsink in this style without the water channels.

 

Same thought here, imo balancing core diff is priority. Going to ask if they can CNC a non-water plate based on 1080 heatpipes, should be fairly straight forward.

 

That would be the dream! If and when he does send you a model suitable for the 1080 version, let us know what your temps are

 

Need!!!!!
Air-cooling only!
There is a release date ?

 

Yes - it is available for purchase from March.

I have also ordered 17R5, if later turns out Dell's still using the tripod structure I'll swap the heatsink for both of them.

 

i would be happy to slap a watercooling setup within my AW. i already was researching watercooling a mx18 sli. if this comes available for the old for AW 17 r4 then count me in !

 

Where can you order this?

 

I wonder if he can design a bracket that goes on top of the current mount and pushes the heatsink down and screws in at the same posts as the current 3 arms.

 

Well with the prices for the 15 R4 being as extortionate as they are (at least a £1000 more for a near identical system with only the CPU upgrade) I am leaning towards a R3 and take my chances on the heat issues.

Would be very interested in an improved air cooling solution for the 15.

 

Nobody have a link to purchase this news heatsink ?

 

ive got the same temperatures at the moment on my alienware 15 r3 gtx1070 with fujjypolly thermal pads and metal liquid.im happy with that.
but i have to say water cooled looks cools as hell.

 

I've found a version for the 15 R3 on taobao if anyone wants to take a leap:
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?sp...Lh4YdJ&id=561090173185&ns=1&abbucket=5#detail

160 USD for a heatsink isn't cheap though.

 

I would if it didnt came with that stupid liquid cooling system.

 

but the liquid cooling thing is optional

 

From what i see the heatsink always comes with those water in/outlets on the back and the water channels machined within the heatsink. The only choice is if you want it with the reservoir and pump. At least thats what i get when i google translate it.

 

There is a model for AW17 7820Hk + 1080??

 

for alienware 17R4

 

The original purpose of this post is more with introducing the interesting approach of addressing tripod structure and I was trying to not promoting it directly. But there you are.

I think this is highly case-by-case and it is not designed for everyone. From observation I found most people are happy with re-paste either with high thermal conductivity compound or LM, but for me as my personal preference I would rather have the tripod issue solved once and for all. Really have no time to deal with Dell.

It can be purchased standalone (£136), or as a bundle with ext. pump unit (£204).

I am currently on mobile and checking with seller is still on my radar. From my impression a 1080 version might not be compatible with water cooling, due to the dimension of 1080's heatpipe (aka diameter), there's very little space for internal pipe. But meantime I think if water-cooling is not essential, in this case might be a good implementation of fan-only cooling plate.

 

if you could get a 1080 heatsink for round around the same price, i'll pull the trigger and play the guinea pig. i'm happy with my temps now, i can oc to 4.5 ghz without my cpu reaching 80c ( 176f ). my gpu also stays nice and chilly, and i'm not really worried about LM anymore. But the plate looks zo nice, and how more heat is in contact with the heatsink, the more heat it can draw away. i really think that even without OCing, the heatplate can give a boost to the cooling capabilities of the 1080 heatsink. it's capable enough already @iunlock and various other people proved it already, it's just that the tripod (why why why) design throws salt in the mix, making it go south.

 

But the srandalone version still has the liquid cooling couplings and holes that stick out of the back.

This design without the water channeling would be perfect.

 

I agree with you. Water cooling is not necessary. Air cooling is enough.
But there is a model for 7820HK and 1080 in April ? No watercooling ?

 

If Dell actually sold this it would be the main draw for me personally...

 

Anyone order this heat sink yet? Definitely curious about the water cooling myself as I'm considering dumping my desktop when it comes time to move to a new place.

 

As long if they offer it with the watercooling channel i wont be buying it.

 

Anything yet for the 7820HK and the 1080 ? i've been dying to try this heatsink out. especially the watercooling.

 

Ho ree fuc! This looks awsome. Count me in!!!

 

If you get it, please make a video about it. Would love some english comments on it as well as some footage of it.

 

I may have to

 

Why don't any American users measure and spec and CAD up a design to be machined or made locally? Could prototype with 3D printer at least to get the fit correct then send it out to your favorite machinist/CNC shop to be made from aluminum or copper. Has anyone confirmed whether the two halves are low temp soldered or silver brazed?

 

Because, we are to busy being Americans, ya know drinking whiskey, chaising tail and fragging Nazi zombies on our rigs. Or it might be because the Chinese have done it, so now we can sit back and just buy their stuff.... Sound familiar?

 

Apologies to all. As promised I have discussed few things today with seller, here's the memo;

1. Water-cooling heatsink

Unfortunately the design referred by my initial post have been discontinued. Instead there's a new design revision which claimed better than previous revision (image available at: https://imgur.com/a/N4wlMaK). I also have discussed the possibility of re-manufacture the discontinued design w/ or w/o water channels based on 1080 heatpipes (thicker), matter which seller needs to confirm with other parties.

If you are interested in the water-cooling option, the heatsink can be purchased with RMB1200 (~£140) for standalone, or RMB600 (~£70) to exchange with your current heatsink. Pump will be sold separately. Note in this scenario, without water-cooling there won't be any performance improvements comparing to original 17R4 heatsink (and probably worse performance with air cooling only).

2. Port 17R5 heatsink onto 17R4

According to the conversation also with manufacturing feasibility in mind, I have proposed to the seller if modify 17R5's heatsink onto 17R4 could be an optimal solution (stronger arm, with vacuum chamber, lighter fan blade). One issue being is that the 17R5 seems still suffers from unbalanced tripod heatsink, but symptom wise it got less obvious comparing what happened to 17R4.

This won't be the perfect option which provides both better cooling and tripod balancing, but with installed correctly this MIGHT help a bit, or a lot which at the moment we don't know. I have asked the seller to further explore this and first step would be testing 17R5 heatsink on a 17R4, to examine if there's any difference. Once results are available I will update accordingly.

 

Still interested in an AW15R3 1070GTX heatsink. hoepfully a verisonw ithout waterchannels would bring the costs down.

 

Re 15R3 - I think that might not happen due to the difficulty. But still the water-cooling version heatsink (based on reference design) can be exchanged with an extra of RMB1000 (~£120) here: https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=561090173185

 

That sucks. the great part of the originaldesign was the heatsink design without flexible arms but one solid plate that can be tightened with spring loaded screws. that would increase the pressure on the CPU die and improve thermals. But the watercooling version, even if you dont use it still forces the user to mod the back cover a bit for thsoe 2 watercooling nozzles.

 

This seems to be a market ripe for invention. Think of all the enthusiasts that would love to buy aftermarket cooling plates that would increase performance. There is virtually nothing on the market for this. Not a thing. Its either stock or go home and cry.

 

if something could be cooked up for a 7820HK and a 1080, i would like to play a ginea pig

 

I’m all for better heatsink for air cooling. Not interested in water cooling a laptop..

 

Well it would allow people to actually overclock these unlocked mobile cpus without these high af temps that come with it. Hell stock clocks could use water cooling to extend the life of our laptops. The design looks pretty plug and play so besides making sure the tubes empty properly this looks convenient for desktop replacement gaming the unplugging and taking it mobile but idk.

 

If you want something stationary i think a desktop is a much better investment. Watercooling is totally a risk when moving a laptop, it takes time to fully drain a liquid cooling loop and a few drops inside while moving the laptop without tubes attached can ruin your system quickly.

 

the loop is intergrated within the heatsink, so there should no problem if the water enters the heatsink (from the back) makes a loop within the heatsink, then goes out again. Also it could be made a closed loop very easily.

https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/Mini-Micro-Submersible-Motor-Pump-Water-Pumps-DC-3-4-5V-100L-H-Low-Noise-for/32764503414.html?src=google&albslr=200607564&isdl=y&aff_short_key=UneMJZVf&source={ifdyn:dyn}{ifplala}{ifdbmBM&albch=DID}&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=494-037-6276&isdl=y&albcp=664365076&albag=32654332494&slnk=&trgt=57344828050&plac=&crea=nl32764503414&netw=g&device=c&mtctp=&aff_platform=google&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1cnoisnm2gIVRp3VCh2UPgPIEAQYASABEgKBT_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

if you would 3d print an enclosure for the pump, the only thing it needs is a USB port, or a black and red cable for the power. if there would be a small enclosure, just big enough for the pump, and a way to attach it to the back with a magnet or something like that) you could have an closed looped watercooling system. The AW mx18 was also watercooled by asetek, and the results where pretty impressive. and it had a closed loop system.

 

this will be the best solution for me)

 

I feel like everyone forgot about peltier cooling technology. It's thin, but requires a massive amount of amperage. Plus if you let it run wild( no voltage bucking unit or way to duty cycle power) you will encounter frost. And, consequently, condensation. But if someone could figure out the right cycles per minute to maintain a small window of temperature output, they could, in theory, create a fixed temperature on the cold side of the peltier device.

The issue I see, is reliability. Those cooling plates are about as durable cows walking through a mine field. It's truelly hit or miss.

 

I have waterxooled desktops. I have notebooks to use them as notebooks.

 

Yes I already own a desktop though it is just a CLC water cooler

Your personal use case isn’t everybody’s. I personally own both 15R3 and 17R4 with the 7820hk. I do also own a desktop but I have been preferring to stick to my r4 and relegate my desktop to a Plex server and my 15r3 as a living steam console in a sense. Regardless of mobile use these processors can use liquid cooling to extend life and to actually make them useful. Overclocking these chips even on liquid metal is worthless with the kind of temps that come with it. The 7820hk is only just slightly faster or at time equal to my old af 4690k with a 4.4 OC.

 

Hmm you should get decent temps with liquid metal. At least sub 85c which is well within spec. What are your temps?

 

Yes that’s why I said would be interested in a aircooled aftermarket solution. Make both for all I care. But I would personally be interested in air cooled option just as you are interested in the water cooled option. If your laptop is dedicated as a desktop and you never plan to travel with it so be it. The majority buy laptops for portability select few enthusiast still spend money on stationary notebooks.

 

A quick question. Have you thought about asking about separating the 17 R4 heatsink. So a separate cpu heatsink and a separate gpu heatsink. Would like to see how it would perform when the heatsinks are separate. Could you get some info on that maybe ?

 

The only thing that the current heatsink needs is a more stiff CPU arm so that it gives more pressure to the heatsink and thus pressed the heatplate more closely to the CPU die. Someone with the right skills should be able to fix that I think.

Or some kind of bracket that goes on top of the current assembly and pushes everything down and is mounted on top of the existing arms.

 

[QUOTE = "Novezeil, 게시물 : 10705361, 회원 : 701558"] 예 - 3 월부터 구매할 수 있습니다.

나는 또한 17R5를 주문했는데, 나중에 델이 삼각대 구조를 사용하고 있다는 사실이 밝혀지면 나는 두 제품의 방열판을 교체 할 것이다. [/ QUOTE]

This is innovative !!
Where can I buy it?